Gunman at DC Navy Yard shoots at least 7

[jon_berzerk]

Navy Yard Shooting: Marines 'had weapons... but no ammunition'

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7xQQ6m7Vzo&feature=youtu.be]Navy Yard Shooting: Marines 'had weapons... but no ammunition' - YouTube[/ame]

 

[westwall]

I guess you are right 4.7 is not too bad

Especially when Japan is 0.4, Canada is 1.6, England is 1.2, Italy is 0.9, France is 1.1

We should be glad. We have our second amendment, we have 300 million guns and only 4.7 per 100,000 get murdered

I can live with it as long as we have our second amendment

Is that rate higher, or lower than it was 50 years ago, Herr Goebbels?

Does it matter when we have a murder rate three times that which we consider the "civilized" world?

Funny how you ignore the fact that the majority of those crimes are committed by people who AREN'T from the civilized world. Most violent crimes are committed by blacks and hispanics. Part of it is socio economics but the majority is culture. They simply don't value life as much as we do.

It was popular to compare Seattle with Vancouver once upon a time because Vancouver had five murders to however many it was in Seattle. The problem arose when demographics was looked at. The five murders in Vancouver were white. There were five murders committed by whites in Seattle....all the rest were committed by blacks and Hispanics.

There is a cost to being the melting pot. Send them all home and our violent crime rate plummets.

 

[testarosa]

The Something Else Entirely part should be focused on.

That could do some good.

Instead, it's the same old same old same old battle of dredged up schtick.

 

[testarosa]

Is that rate higher, or lower than it was 50 years ago, Herr Goebbels?

Does it matter when we have a murder rate three times that which we consider the "civilized" world?

Funny how you ignore the fact that the majority of those crimes are committed by people who AREN'T from the civilized world. Most violent crimes are committed by blacks and hispanics. Part of it is socio economics but the majority is culture. They simply don't value life as much as we do.

It was popular to compare Seattle with Vancouver once upon a time because Vancouver had five murders to however many it was in Seattle. The problem arose when demographics was looked at. The five murders in Vancouver were white. There were five murders committed by whites in Seattle....all the rest were committed by blacks and Hispanics.

There is a cost to being the melting pot. Send them all home and our violent crime rate plummets.

Absolutely.

And now we are reaching critical mass on "civilized" in our very own country, so rather than fixing the civilized (ha ha) we're going to blame the tool.

I'm not buying.

 

[westwall]

Does it matter when we have a murder rate three times that which we consider the "civilized" world?

Funny how you ignore the fact that the majority of those crimes are committed by people who AREN'T from the civilized world. Most violent crimes are committed by blacks and hispanics. Part of it is socio economics but the majority is culture. They simply don't value life as much as we do.

It was popular to compare Seattle with Vancouver once upon a time because Vancouver had five murders to however many it was in Seattle. The problem arose when demographics was looked at. The five murders in Vancouver were white. There were five murders committed by whites in Seattle....all the rest were committed by blacks and Hispanics.

There is a cost to being the melting pot. Send them all home and our violent crime rate plummets.

Absolutely.

And now we are reaching critical mass on "civilized" in our very own country, so rather than fixing the civilized (ha ha) we're going to blame the tool.

I'm not buying.

No thinking person is!

 

[jon_berzerk]

Navy Yard: Swat team 'stood down' at mass shooting scene

One of the first teams of heavily armed police to respond to Monday's shooting in Washington DC was ordered to stand down by superiors, the BBC can reveal.
A tactical response team of the Capitol Police, a force that guards the US Capitol complex, was told to leave the scene by a supervisor instead of aiding municipal officers.

The Capitol Police department said senior officials were investigating.

...

"I don't think it's a far stretch to say that some lives may have been saved if we were allowed to intervene," a Capitol Police source familiar with the incident told the BBC.
BBC News - Navy Yard: Swat team 'stood down' at mass shooting scene

 

[Geaux4it]

I guess you are right 4.7 is not too bad

Especially when Japan is 0.4, Canada is 1.6, England is 1.2, Italy is 0.9, France is 1.1

We should be glad. We have our second amendment, we have 300 million guns and only 4.7 per 100,000 get murdered

I can live with it as long as we have our second amendment

Is that rate higher, or lower than it was 50 years ago, Herr Goebbels?

Does it matter when we have a murder rate three times that which we consider the "civilized" world?

You are 30% less likely to be murdered in the USA than in rest of the world. You are 12x more likely to die outside the borders of the USA

-Geaux

 

[jon_berzerk]

Does it matter when we have a murder rate three times that which we consider the "civilized" world?

Funny how you ignore the fact that the majority of those crimes are committed by people who AREN'T from the civilized world. Most violent crimes are committed by blacks and hispanics. Part of it is socio economics but the majority is culture. They simply don't value life as much as we do.

It was popular to compare Seattle with Vancouver once upon a time because Vancouver had five murders to however many it was in Seattle. The problem arose when demographics was looked at. The five murders in Vancouver were white. There were five murders committed by whites in Seattle....all the rest were committed by blacks and Hispanics.

There is a cost to being the melting pot. Send them all home and our violent crime rate plummets.

Absolutely.

And now we are reaching critical mass on "civilized" in our very own country, so rather than fixing the civilized (ha ha) we're going to blame the tool.

I'm not buying.

it is becoming so much more obvious everyday

that the false narrative the lefty media pushes

is failing

ask the two dem senators from Colorado that got booted last week

for pushing and passing the anti freedom gun control laws

how that is working out for them

 

[testarosa]

I can list out 1,000 ways our society is breaking down and what I witness in this generation and on social media. The dinosaurs of Modern US Society need to catch up so something can actually be done to fix it.

The gun battle is a diversion.

Until that ever happens <yeah right> I'm going to keep up the fight to try to salvage something for my daughter and her kids so step off me.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Funny how you ignore the fact that the majority of those crimes are committed by people who AREN'T from the civilized world. Most violent crimes are committed by blacks and hispanics. Part of it is socio economics but the majority is culture. They simply don't value life as much as we do.

It was popular to compare Seattle with Vancouver once upon a time because Vancouver had five murders to however many it was in Seattle. The problem arose when demographics was looked at. The five murders in Vancouver were white. There were five murders committed by whites in Seattle....all the rest were committed by blacks and Hispanics.

There is a cost to being the melting pot. Send them all home and our violent crime rate plummets.

Absolutely.

And now we are reaching critical mass on "civilized" in our very own country, so rather than fixing the civilized (ha ha) we're going to blame the tool.

I'm not buying.

No thinking person is!

less are everyday

 

[jon_berzerk]

I can list out 1,000 ways our society is breaking down and what I witness in this generation and on social media. The dinosaurs of Modern US Society need to catch up so something can actually be done to fix it.

The gun battle is a diversion.

Until that ever happens <yeah right> I'm going to keep up the fight to try to salvage something for my daughter and her kids so step off me.

they blame the gun because

they dare not blame the bad policies and ideas

 

[testarosa]

Yep.

And so we will go around in a circle chasing our tails.

 

[jon_berzerk]

no not this time

 

[jon_berzerk]

dont let the libs brainwash your children

go read the text books they teach your children

sit in on the classes once and a while

ask your children what they are teaching them

 

[Geaux4it]

 

[Spoonman]

I agree

It is about our society. We have 300 million guns for 300 million people. Suffer from depression? A gun is handy. Pissed off at your wife? A gun is handy. Fighting with your neighbor? A gun is handy. Want to rob, rape or murder? A gun is handy

This is the United States. We love our guns and are not going to give them up. We have a second amendment and a strong lobby to protect it

We have to suffer a murder rate three times that of other countries? It is worth it. We suffer an occasional massacre? We can live with it

We are the United States and we love our guns

Oh Hi!

I don't believe that for a second.

It is ALL about our society. A gun is something to pin it on.

So...guns have nothing to do with it

Our society is evil while that of Japan, England, France, Germany and Canada are morally superior

Guns are everywhere and make a handy "tool" to act out your aggression

yes guns have nothing to do with it. when those countries had guns their rates were still low.

 

[rightwinger]

The gun arguments aren't even from this decade or the last one.

Mark my words.

And yepper.

I'm keeping my guns, thank you very much.

Of course you will keep your guns
We love our second amendment and nobody will interfere with your enjoyment of guns
We may have to put up with three times the murder rate, assassinations and massacres but damn it.......nobody fucks with our guns

 

[testarosa]

The gun arguments aren't even from this decade or the last one.

Mark my words.

And yepper.

I'm keeping my guns, thank you very much.

Of course you will keep your guns
We love our second amendment and nobody will interfere with your enjoyment of guns
We may have to put up with three times the murder rate, assassinations and massacres but damn it.......nobody fucks with our guns

Got that right.

 

[testarosa]

Missed Point Ballpark.

And around and around we go.

 

[Brain357]

Easy:

1. Remove the legal, bureaucratic and other feel-good rules that impede people from effectively defending themselves against the crazies and thugs that couldn't give two shits about your rules. That means no more 'gun free zones', no more waiting periods, no more 'may issue' conceal carry permits, no more limiting the types of firearms, ammunition and accessories law abiding citizens can own. It means what the second amendment says: "Shall not be infringed".
2. Increasing sentencing for VIOLENT offenders. Make using a firearm in the commission of a crime all the more punishable, that's fine too. In order to free up prison space, I would also advocate we stop persecuting consensual activity between adults, which represents the 'crimes' of the vast majority of inmates...but that's another topic.
3. Put more cops on the streets. It's the one thing that that is proven to reduce violent crime.
4. Make it easier to detain individuals that have demonstrated mental instability. Admittedly, that one treads perilously close to stepping on civil liberties and you can be sure the ACLU would be all over it. Nevertheless, as we have seen from so many of the mass killing crazies, they provided amble evidence of mental imbalance well prior to murdering innocents.

1. The more guns option. Don't see this making much of a difference. Anyone who wants a gun already has 10.

There you go lying again. Nothing in my #1 point calls for more guns, only the removal of impediments that prevent people from defending themselves. Please, stop lying. It doesn't help your case.



And how'd that gun free zone thing work out? About the same as at the Colorado theater, Sandy Hook, Virginia Tech and all the other places where maniacs choose to murder innocents?

What you obtusely choose to overlook is that my first suggestion would have also meant that the people could have had the means to defend themselves rather than cowering in the corner waiting for a good guy with a gun to arrive and save their ass.



If business owners are forced to serve everyone and anyone that walks through their doors, even if that means violating the tenants of their religion, then you sure as shit can't make a case that a person should be refused service based on a right codified in the Bill of Rights.

You want to return to the days of strict private property rights? Then fine, I'm all for allowing businesses to define who and what can be brought on to their property. But you can't have it both ways.



Stop being obtuse. I CLEARLY stated that we should not imprison people for consensual activity between adults, which would free up the vast majority of jail space and resources. Further, we spend ungodly amounts of money on violent recidivist criminals, far more than if we would have locked them up long term instead of releasing them time and time again only to be recaptured, retried, re-sentenced and reincarnated. Stop the cycle and we'd save significant resources...and lives.

3. I like it, but can we afford it? Wonder how the number of cops we have compares to other countries?

You seem to have no problem with the cost of implementing vast bureaucracies to restrict second amendment rights. Now you have a fiscal issue? Please. The money could be easily found with common sense prioritization.

4. Sounds ok at first. Will non crazies find themselves locked up for political reasons? Seems ripe for abuse. Also infringes on a much more important right.

Like I said, that's not an easy one, but clearly, we need to reevaluate when a person's mental illness makes him a danger to others and worthy of detainment. You have no problem stamping all over second amendment rights, but other rights are sacrosanct? How about a little consistency?

1. You can call it what you want, but it's trying to get more guns out there. I'm lying about nothing. Are you keeping background checks? Why do you want people to have whatever guns they want? Studies show you only need 2-3 shots for defense and the type of gun really doesn't matter. The only people using hi cap magazines are mass shooters. You don't want require concealed carry permits. Will that lead to more accidents due to no training? In 2010 there were 600 unintentional injuries with firearms.

So the security guards couldn't stop them but your certain that a CC would? There was at least one armed person at the Tucson shooting, but he picked out the wrong person. The shooter was stopped when he tried to reload. Wouldn't lower capacity magazines be more of a help?

I'm more talking about company employees. Companies don't want armed employees. I doubt you can name a large company that allows employees to carry guns. I don't think you'd ever get them to be ok with it.

So how many people have concealed carry permits?
Texas : 1 per about every 44 people.
New York: 1 per 210 people.
Minnesota: 1 per 35 people.
California: 1 per 1000 people.

So if you work in a smaller office of say 30 people your plan is unlikely to have a CC owner. In CA it would have almost no effect. MN might help more than other places. What are your thoughts on those numbers? Would the gun carries try to stop the shooter or use it to help get themselves out of there? I'm quickly losing faith in the heroism of people.

2. Ok so let out the no victim criminals and keep more of the violent ones in for longer. I'm not a fan of locking people up for victimless crime. Can't hurt. But again we have a lot of people in jail already for violent crimes.

3. I looked around and many of the countries with lower homicide rates were at 300 police per capita while we are like 250. I agree with your proposal to add more.

4. I think the right to not be in jail is the most important one we have. You really have no freedom if your in jail. So yes I put that one up pretty high. My own plan is to take their guns and make it so they can't buy guns. Putting in jail is more effective I guess, but is very difficult and scary if abused. I don't disagree with it but would need to be discussed in great detail.

One thing you've not touched on that I think is important and you might agree with. I think it's important to shut down the borders. We need to deport any criminal type illegals and close down the border. Your thoughts?