Hawking Says Universe Created Itself

[K9Buck]

Very likely..Based on the laws of chemistry and physics it most certainly did.

If you don't believe this then i ask who or what created god? It is so much more simple to explain things with laws of science compared to figuring out how a super being developed out of nothing.

Laws of science = billions or even tens of billions of years for such processes to slowly come together.

God popped out of nothing! =

You idiot. God wasn't created. He has always existed. And the universe creating itself violates the LAW of cause and effect.

Always existed, yet no law of cause and effect needed for God....You contradict yourself..

Either one believes that a creator created the universe and the life that inhabits it or one believes, like Stephen Hawking apparently does, that the universe created itself and then that life created itself too. I presume you're advocating for the latter as well. The concept that the creator could and has always existed is something that we cannot wrap our minds around but, the scientific evidence that we have certainly indicates that someone NOT bound to the laws of this universe, someone outside of this universe, got it started.

And this super powerful all knowing being that was created in a book wants us all to bow down and worship him?? Adorate and think of him all the live long day....Sounds rather cultic..

Now you're deflecting. Go ahead and believe that the universe created itself and that life created itself. It's ok with me.

 

[Moonglow]

Very likely..Based on the laws of chemistry and physics it most certainly did.

If you don't believe this then i ask who or what created god? It is so much more simple to explain things with laws of science compared to figuring out how a super being developed out of nothing.

Laws of science = billions or even tens of billions of years for such processes to slowly come together.

God popped out of nothing! =

You idiot. God wasn't created. He has always existed. And the universe creating itself violates the LAW of cause and effect.

Always existed, yet no law of cause and effect needed for God....You contradict yourself..

Either one believes that a creator created the universe and the life that inhabits it or one believes, like Stephen Hawking apparently does, that the universe created itself and then that life created itself too. I presume you're advocating for the latter as well. The concept that the creator could and has always existed is something that we cannot wrap our minds around but, the scientific evidence that we have certainly indicates that someone NOT bound to the laws of this universe, someone outside of this universe, got it started.

And this super powerful all knowing being that was created in a book wants us all to bow down and worship him?? Adorate and think of him all the live long day....Sounds rather cultic..

Now you're deflecting. Go ahead and believe that the universe created itself and that life created itself. It's ok with me.

I'm kewl with the all powerful thing yet I don't think adoration is the name of the beings game, I think that is the religion created to help control humans and have a revenue stream from tithes...

 

[Windparadox]

My faith is based on what I have observed combined with rational thought, NOT what religious organizations or the bible say. You declined to comment on any of the points that I made. I have the impression that you are committed to your atheism regardless of any scientific or non-scientific evidence.

`
You are welcome to your personal beliefs. Unfortunately, they don't interest me. Sorry.

 

[Mac1958]

We don't know yet. It's a fun and fascinating mystery. Maybe we'll get there one day.

Anyone who claims they know for sure isn't being honest. Or they're brainwashed.

The only ones that know for sure are the arrogant, condescending, atheists that accuse believers of having an imaginary sky fairy to fill in the gaps. Meanwhile, they posit theories that the universe came out of nowhere and that life created itself. LOL.

Well, there's plenty of arrogance and condescension coming from both sides of this.

The side opposite yours certainly does enjoy the mockery and personal insults, I'll give you that.

Most atheists are saying "I see no empirical evidence. Provide it and I'll change my mind".
.

 

[Moonglow]

You are certainly free to kneel and bob all you like....

 

[Eloy]

It had no beginning.

Well, the Big Bang seems to indicate otherwise. Additionally, the universe IS a physical place that could not have created itself, regardless of what Hawking or anyone else says. To believe that existence can spontaneously appear out of non-existence is to defy all logic and common sense.

Logic and common sense dictate that there was no so-called big bang nor did the universe appear out of non-existence. Therefore, the universe always was, is, and will be.

ABG theory in action.

I gather you think that I would hold onto a theory that anything but God creating the universe has got to be the answer but this is not the case. I see no reason to believe that the universe had a beginning so I reject Hawking and the scientists who agree with him.

There are scientists and atheists that let their dogma get in the way of rational thought. Many of them are trying to debunk, without success, the Big Bang because it contradicts their ideological belief that there is no such thing as a creator. I suspect that you are one of them, hence the ABG remark.

I confess that I have no training in Natural Science so any physicist could wipe the floor with me in an argument on his terms, namely the laws of physics and such. It is also true that I am an atheist and so I reject the doctrines of theologians. This surely puts me in a small minority of people who are not persuaded by conventional science and religious dogma. Nevertheless, ir is simpler for me to believe that the universe always existed and had no beginning in a similar way as people who believe in a god are sure he always existed.

 

[Gracie]

My faith is based on what I have observed combined with rational thought, NOT what religious organizations or the bible say. You declined to comment on any of the points that I made. I have the impression that you are committed to your atheism regardless of any scientific or non-scientific evidence.

`
You are welcome to your personal beliefs. Unfortunately, they don't interest me. Sorry.

Again...ditto and right back attcha.

 

[K9Buck]

Well, the Big Bang seems to indicate otherwise. Additionally, the universe IS a physical place that could not have created itself, regardless of what Hawking or anyone else says. To believe that existence can spontaneously appear out of non-existence is to defy all logic and common sense.

Logic and common sense dictate that there was no so-called big bang nor did the universe appear out of non-existence. Therefore, the universe always was, is, and will be.

ABG theory in action.

I gather you think that I would hold onto a theory that anything but God creating the universe has got to be the answer but this is not the case. I see no reason to believe that the universe had a beginning so I reject Hawking and the scientists who agree with him.

There are scientists and atheists that let their dogma get in the way of rational thought. Many of them are trying to debunk, without success, the Big Bang because it contradicts their ideological belief that there is no such thing as a creator. I suspect that you are one of them, hence the ABG remark.

I confess that I have no training in Natural Science so any physicist could wipe the floor with me in an argument on his terms, namely the laws of physics and such. It is also true that I am an atheist and so I reject the doctrines of theologians. This surely puts me in a small minority of people who are not persuaded by conventional science and religious dogma. Nevertheless, ir is simpler for me to believe that the universe always existed and had no beginning in a similar way as people who believe in a god are sure he always existed.

Nor am I a physicist. Thank you for your honesty. It's refreshing to meet an atheist that is honest and open.

 

[Kosh]

The big bang in the sense of math breaks down at a certain point that can not be explained by any math.

Where is that?

You claim to know science therefore you are asking a question you should know the answer for.

But then again you are a far left drone that thinks the science is settled!

There is no one equation for the standard BB model of the universe.

It may be better to put it another way: while it is true that when building a theory on another theory, the conclusion of the first theory must be taken as an axiom in the second, but that shouldn't mislead one to be believe that that first theory isn't still a testable scientific theory with evidence of its own to back it up. In addition, the success of the new theory provides evidence to back up the theories its axioms are built from.

But the far left religion will never allow you to consider anything outside your religious dogma.

 

[K9Buck]

Most atheists are saying "I see no empirical evidence. Provide it and I'll change my mind".
.

I have repeatedly made very sound, logical arguments and every single atheist here has ignored them or deflected. Atheists demand proof and when given strong evidence, they run and hide. Then they accuse the presenter of believing in sky fairies, etc.

 

[Moonglow]

The big bang in the sense of math breaks down at a certain point that can not be explained by any math.

Where is that?

You claim to know science therefore you are asking a question you should know the answer for.

But then again you are a far left drone that thinks the science is settled!

There is no one equation for the standard BB model of the universe.

It may be better to put it another way: while it is true that when building a theory on another theory, the conclusion of the first theory must be taken as an axiom in the second, but that shouldn't mislead one to be believe that that first theory isn't still a testable scientific theory with evidence of its own to back it up. In addition, the success of the new theory provides evidence to back up the theories its axioms are built from.

But the far left religion will never allow you to consider anything outside your religious dogma.

Nice walk in a circle horseman...If you applied the same formula of babble to the Bible, you wouldn't kneel and beg...

 

[K9Buck]

You are certainly free to kneel and bob all you like....

See what I mean, Mac? Ignores reason and resorts to derision. Atheists don't want there to be a creator.

 

[Moonglow]

Most atheists are saying "I see no empirical evidence. Provide it and I'll change my mind".
.

I have repeatedly made very sound, logical arguments and every single atheist here has ignored them or deflected. Atheists demand proof and when given strong evidence, they run and hide. Then they accuse the presenter of believing in sky fairies, etc.

Just saying that a God created the universe because of the dogma presented in a book written thousands of years ago is not proof that God does exist and neither does the best guess of a scholar physicist and his galaxy gang banging theory.....As far as I am concerned neither is probably the best answer...

 

[Mac1958]

Most atheists are saying "I see no empirical evidence. Provide it and I'll change my mind".

I have repeatedly made very sound, logical arguments and every single atheist here has ignored them or deflected. Atheists demand proof and when given strong evidence, they run and hide. Then they accuse the presenter of believing in sky fairies, etc.

I've spoken with many Christians who say the basis of their belief is "faith". It's a word we hear all the time. They tell me they realize God hasn't made himself obvious, but that they have "faith" that He's there. Faith is the bridge between Point A and Point B.

Okay, that's fine. But that's not empirical evidence.

All He has to do is show up and say howdy, and we'll have proof. Until then, this is based on "faith".
.

 

[Billy_Kinetta]

He may be brilliant, but he's dead wrong.

It is not unusual for the very brilliant to go mad at the end.

 

[Kosh]

The big bang in the sense of math breaks down at a certain point that can not be explained by any math.

Where is that?

You claim to know science therefore you are asking a question you should know the answer for.

But then again you are a far left drone that thinks the science is settled!

There is no one equation for the standard BB model of the universe.

It may be better to put it another way: while it is true that when building a theory on another theory, the conclusion of the first theory must be taken as an axiom in the second, but that shouldn't mislead one to be believe that that first theory isn't still a testable scientific theory with evidence of its own to back it up. In addition, the success of the new theory provides evidence to back up the theories its axioms are built from.

But the far left religion will never allow you to consider anything outside your religious dogma.

Nice walk in a circle horseman...If you applied the same formula of babble to the Bible, you wouldn't kneel and beg...

And another far left drone chimes in and proves my comments!

As they are wanting to be the top drone of the month!

 

[K9Buck]

We don't know yet. It's a fun and fascinating mystery. Maybe we'll get there one day.

Anyone who claims they know for sure isn't being honest. Or they're brainwashed.

The only ones that know for sure are the arrogant, condescending, atheists that accuse believers of having an imaginary sky fairy to fill in the gaps. Meanwhile, they posit theories that the universe came out of nowhere and that life created itself. LOL.

Well, there's plenty of arrogance and condescension coming from both sides of this.

The side opposite yours certainly does enjoy the mockery and personal insults, I'll give you that.

Most atheists are saying "I see no empirical evidence. Provide it and I'll change my mind".
.

I don't base my faith in a creator in religious dogma nor in the bible but, with all that's been said, I am reminded of something Jesus said in the bible. Don't cast your pearls to the swine. Discussing the concept of a creator with hardcore, militant atheists like we have here is the equivalent of casting pearls to the swine. I think my participation in this thread is about over.

 

[K9Buck]

Most atheists are saying "I see no empirical evidence. Provide it and I'll change my mind".
.

I have repeatedly made very sound, logical arguments and every single atheist here has ignored them or deflected. Atheists demand proof and when given strong evidence, they run and hide. Then they accuse the presenter of believing in sky fairies, etc.

Just saying that a God created the universe because of the dogma presented in a book written thousands of years ago is not proof that God does exist and neither does the best guess of a scholar physicist and his galaxy gang banging theory.....As far as I am concerned neither is probably the best answer...

You're apparently not reading anything I have shared here. Engaging with you on these sorts of topics appears to be a waste of everyone's time and effort. See ya in a non-religious thread.

 

[Windparadox]

They already know what's going to happen so who cares. It is written. Prophecized. And some even believe the end days are near but it's not pollution it's sin that's doing is in. Damn the science

`
Not all Christians believe in creationist concepts. That's the rub. Consider this, there are hundreds of different Christian sects (or calling themselves "Christian") who have hundreds of different beliefs in God and the bible. Many even have their own bibles. Then there are millions of different interpretations of that bible. Many believe that we are in the "end times" now. I don't even try to keep up with that. I simply let them believe what they want. I've no interest in their beliefs nor changing their minds. If someone does not like mine, fine by me.

 

[RWNJ]

`
The article, from a "creationist" web site, is commenting on Hawking's book, The Grand Design, in which Hawking postulates; "that invoking God is not necessary to explain the origins of the universe, and that the Big Bang is a consequence of the laws of physics alone.

So, where did those laws of physics come from? Hmmm?