Hillary Rodham Clinton Speaks Out for Gay Marriage

[Nosmo King]

I was not aware that the Bible was intended to be used as an instrument of hated, fear and exclusion. My impression has been that God is love. Odd how some of the folks who consider themselves the most religious can utilize an instrument proclaiming God's love as a blunt club to justify their fears.

And God's laws are not necessarily the laws of the land. If the United States adhered to God's laws and exclusively God's laws, we would be a theocracy, much like the type of state the Taliban wants to impose on the greater Muslim world.

And even if the United States was exclusively under God's laws, we would need a more extensive judicial branch to properly interpret them. Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, Muslims, Taoists, Coptics, Eastern Orthodox, American Indians and Secular Humanists would all have to be seated on some Byzantine council to make sure God's laws and justice was meted out equally among what had been considered the free people of the United States.

 

[Redfish]

I was not aware that the Bible was intended to be used as an instrument of hated, fear and exclusion. My impression has been that God is love. Odd how some of the folks who consider themselves the most religious can utilize an instrument proclaiming God's love as a blunt club to justify their fears.

And God's laws are not necessarily the laws of the land. If the United States adhered to God's laws and exclusively God's laws, we would be a theocracy, much like the type of state the Taliban wants to impose on the greater Muslim world.

And even if the United States was exclusively under God's laws, we would need a more extensive judicial branch to properly interpret them. Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, Muslims, Taoists, Coptics, Eastern Orthodox, American Indians and Secular Humanists would all have to be seated on some Byzantine council to make sure God's laws and justice was meted out equally among what had been considered the free people of the United States.

you totally missed the point of the discussion

 

[Nosmo King]

I was not aware that the Bible was intended to be used as an instrument of hated, fear and exclusion. My impression has been that God is love. Odd how some of the folks who consider themselves the most religious can utilize an instrument proclaiming God's love as a blunt club to justify their fears.

And God's laws are not necessarily the laws of the land. If the United States adhered to God's laws and exclusively God's laws, we would be a theocracy, much like the type of state the Taliban wants to impose on the greater Muslim world.

And even if the United States was exclusively under God's laws, we would need a more extensive judicial branch to properly interpret them. Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, Muslims, Taoists, Coptics, Eastern Orthodox, American Indians and Secular Humanists would all have to be seated on some Byzantine council to make sure God's laws and justice was meted out equally among what had been considered the free people of the United States.

you totally missed the point of the discussion

I didn't quote or reference any previous discussion. I'm just incredulous that some folks can find a hiding place within the pages of the Bible.

 

[Redfish]

I was not aware that the Bible was intended to be used as an instrument of hated, fear and exclusion. My impression has been that God is love. Odd how some of the folks who consider themselves the most religious can utilize an instrument proclaiming God's love as a blunt club to justify their fears.

And God's laws are not necessarily the laws of the land. If the United States adhered to God's laws and exclusively God's laws, we would be a theocracy, much like the type of state the Taliban wants to impose on the greater Muslim world.

And even if the United States was exclusively under God's laws, we would need a more extensive judicial branch to properly interpret them. Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, Muslims, Taoists, Coptics, Eastern Orthodox, American Indians and Secular Humanists would all have to be seated on some Byzantine council to make sure God's laws and justice was meted out equally among what had been considered the free people of the United States.

you totally missed the point of the discussion

I didn't quote or reference any previous discussion. I'm just incredulous that some folks can find a hiding place within the pages of the Bible.

"a hiding place" ? how about a place of comfort and stability? No one is advocating a theocracy for the USA, but it is an undenieable truth that the founders based the constitution of judeo/christian principles while insisting on freedom of religion and banning the establishment of a national religion.

what you miss is that freedom OF religion is not the same as freedom FROM religion.

"endowned by their creator" does not take us to any specific religion, but it does acknowlege the existence and power of God, and that our human rights come from God and not other men.

 

[Nosmo King]

you totally missed the point of the discussion

I didn't quote or reference any previous discussion. I'm just incredulous that some folks can find a hiding place within the pages of the Bible.

"a hiding place" ? how about a place of comfort and stability? No one is advocating a theocracy for the USA, but it is an undenieable truth that the founders based the constitution of judeo/christian principles while insisting on freedom of religion and banning the establishment of a national religion.

what you miss is that freedom OF religion is not the same as freedom FROM religion.

"endowned by their creator" does not take us to any specific religion, but it does acknowlege the existence and power of God, and that our human rights come from God and not other men.

Confederates used the Bible to justify slavery. Today homophobes are using the Bible to justify their fears and hatreds. Twas ever thus. When cherry picking morality helps, those with weak arguments will always opt for cherry picking.

 

[ima]

Here......Just click on any state.........
http://www.gaychurch.org/find_a_church/united_states/united_states.htm

Also....I said God has given up on certain PEOPLE and let them have their way. There's a lot of people here in the US that he's given up on. I didn't say we were all going to die off or that any other civilization has.

Ok, then....so how do we know when your god has 'given up on' someone?

I think the point is that throughout history civilizations have crumbled when the people lost their moral compass, whether you think God had a hand in it is dependent on your religious beliefs.

But look at the Romans, Greeks, Egyptians, Mayans, Axtecs----all once great civilizations who did great things and built great monuments. But when the people began to vote benefits for themselves or the rulers became corrupt, they collapsed.

We see the beginnings of that today in the USA. Everything is OK if it feels good, the govt will take care of you, the leaders ignore the basic precepts of the constitution. Religion is ridiculed, playing by the rules is deemed stupid. Our athletes and entertainers are considered the most valuable people in society based on what we pay them.

History will repeat itself if we allow it.

Total crap. Those civilizations didn't collapse because of amorality you dumbass.

Or can you prove it?

 

[Redfish]

I didn't quote or reference any previous discussion. I'm just incredulous that some folks can find a hiding place within the pages of the Bible.

"a hiding place" ? how about a place of comfort and stability? No one is advocating a theocracy for the USA, but it is an undenieable truth that the founders based the constitution of judeo/christian principles while insisting on freedom of religion and banning the establishment of a national religion.

what you miss is that freedom OF religion is not the same as freedom FROM religion.

"endowned by their creator" does not take us to any specific religion, but it does acknowlege the existence and power of God, and that our human rights come from God and not other men.

Confederates used the Bible to justify slavery. Today homophobes are using the Bible to justify their fears and hatreds. Twas ever thus. When cherry picking morality helps, those with weak arguments will always opt for cherry picking.

nowhere in the Bible is slavery advocated. However homosexuality is condemned as unnatural.

again, our society's rules and morals are determined by a vote of the citizens, what the majority want is how we decide to live.

it always amazes me that some people want to return to a system where a minority decide the rules for the majority.

 

[Redfish]

Ok, then....so how do we know when your god has 'given up on' someone?

I think the point is that throughout history civilizations have crumbled when the people lost their moral compass, whether you think God had a hand in it is dependent on your religious beliefs.

But look at the Romans, Greeks, Egyptians, Mayans, Axtecs----all once great civilizations who did great things and built great monuments. But when the people began to vote benefits for themselves or the rulers became corrupt, they collapsed.

We see the beginnings of that today in the USA. Everything is OK if it feels good, the govt will take care of you, the leaders ignore the basic precepts of the constitution. Religion is ridiculed, playing by the rules is deemed stupid. Our athletes and entertainers are considered the most valuable people in society based on what we pay them.

History will repeat itself if we allow it.

Total crap. Those civilizations didn't collapse because of amorality you dumbass.

Or can you prove it?

actually history says that they did. But its not my job to educate you. maybe a world history 101 class at your local junior college is in order for you.

 

[ima]

I think the point is that throughout history civilizations have crumbled when the people lost their moral compass, whether you think God had a hand in it is dependent on your religious beliefs.

But look at the Romans, Greeks, Egyptians, Mayans, Axtecs----all once great civilizations who did great things and built great monuments. But when the people began to vote benefits for themselves or the rulers became corrupt, they collapsed.

We see the beginnings of that today in the USA. Everything is OK if it feels good, the govt will take care of you, the leaders ignore the basic precepts of the constitution. Religion is ridiculed, playing by the rules is deemed stupid. Our athletes and entertainers are considered the most valuable people in society based on what we pay them.

History will repeat itself if we allow it.

Total crap. Those civilizations didn't collapse because of amorality you dumbass.

Or can you prove it?

actually history says that they did. But its not my job to educate you. maybe a world history 101 class at your local junior college is in order for you.

Maybe bible class, but that's it.

So what was amoral about the incas that brought them down?

 

[Caroljo]

Ok, then....so how do we know when your god has 'given up on' someone?

I think the point is that throughout history civilizations have crumbled when the people lost their moral compass, whether you think God had a hand in it is dependent on your religious beliefs.

But look at the Romans, Greeks, Egyptians, Mayans, Axtecs----all once great civilizations who did great things and built great monuments. But when the people began to vote benefits for themselves or the rulers became corrupt, they collapsed.

We see the beginnings of that today in the USA. Everything is OK if it feels good, the govt will take care of you, the leaders ignore the basic precepts of the constitution. Religion is ridiculed, playing by the rules is deemed stupid. Our athletes and entertainers are considered the most valuable people in society based on what we pay them.

History will repeat itself if we allow it.

Total crap. Those civilizations didn't collapse because of amorality you dumbass.

Or can you prove it?

Can you prove they didn't?

Hey....I just figured out what your name is short for....IMA Idiot....

 

[Redfish]

Total crap. Those civilizations didn't collapse because of amorality you dumbass.

Or can you prove it?

actually history says that they did. But its not my job to educate you. maybe a world history 101 class at your local junior college is in order for you.

Maybe bible class, but that's it.

So what was amoral about the incas that brought them down?

I didn't list the Incas but from what I know about them their civilization declined when they exhausted the land around their temples and refused to move to another place to grow their food. The high priests wanted complete control and that required having the people close together. You may want to do some research on this if you are really interested.

its not so much amoral, as those civilizations lost the work ethic and decided that the rulers should take care of them.

 

[Seawytch]

Once again for the cheap seats...religion has NOTHING to do with legal, civil marriage.

 

[Nosmo King]

"a hiding place" ? how about a place of comfort and stability? No one is advocating a theocracy for the USA, but it is an undenieable truth that the founders based the constitution of judeo/christian principles while insisting on freedom of religion and banning the establishment of a national religion.

what you miss is that freedom OF religion is not the same as freedom FROM religion.

"endowned by their creator" does not take us to any specific religion, but it does acknowlege the existence and power of God, and that our human rights come from God and not other men.

Confederates used the Bible to justify slavery. Today homophobes are using the Bible to justify their fears and hatreds. Twas ever thus. When cherry picking morality helps, those with weak arguments will always opt for cherry picking.

nowhere in the Bible is slavery advocated. However homosexuality is condemned as unnatural.

again, our society's rules and morals are determined by a vote of the citizens, what the majority want is how we decide to live.

it always amazes me that some people want to return to a system where a minority decide the rules for the majority.

Has there been a national vote on marriage equality?

 

[bodecea]

Ok, then....so how do we know when your god has 'given up on' someone?

I think the point is that throughout history civilizations have crumbled when the people lost their moral compass, whether you think God had a hand in it is dependent on your religious beliefs.

But look at the Romans, Greeks, Egyptians, Mayans, Axtecs----all once great civilizations who did great things and built great monuments. But when the people began to vote benefits for themselves or the rulers became corrupt, they collapsed.

We see the beginnings of that today in the USA. Everything is OK if it feels good, the govt will take care of you, the leaders ignore the basic precepts of the constitution. Religion is ridiculed, playing by the rules is deemed stupid. Our athletes and entertainers are considered the most valuable people in society based on what we pay them.

History will repeat itself if we allow it.

Total crap. Those civilizations didn't collapse because of amorality you dumbass.

Or can you prove it?

Romans....became Christian and conquered by PAGAN Celts and Germanic tribes

Greeks...conquered by PAGAN Romans

Egyptians...conquered by PAGAN Greeks (gay Alexander)...then conquered by PAGAN Romans.

Mayans, Aztecs, Incas...SLAUGHTERED by so called Christian Spanish conquistadors

you sure you want to hold those up?

 

[WorldWatcher]

Confederates used the Bible to justify slavery. Today homophobes are using the Bible to justify their fears and hatreds. Twas ever thus. When cherry picking morality helps, those with weak arguments will always opt for cherry picking.

nowhere in the Bible is slavery advocated. However homosexuality is condemned as unnatural.

again, our society's rules and morals are determined by a vote of the citizens, what the majority want is how we decide to live.

it always amazes me that some people want to return to a system where a minority decide the rules for the majority.

Has there been a national vote on marriage equality?

1. (S)he's still under the impressions that those that oppose Same-sex Civil Marriage are in the majority (on a national basis). The view is to look back to the early 2000's and the large victories and ignore the idea that society has and is changing.

2. "Let them vote" used to be a real popular theme in the early 2000's when it was a slam dunk for those opposed to same-sex - the whole "Majority Rule" thing. Now that Same-sex Civil Marriage began winning at the during General Elections, you don't hear it so much. As a matter for fact what we heard a decade ago ("Majority Rules") will be swapped with the idea that the majority should not have a vote if it impacts a minority - but in the future the minority will be those who oppose equal treatment for Same-sex Couples. (Well actually polling and current General Election ballots shows they already are, it will just take time to sink in.)



>>>>

 

[Freewill]

I wonder if hillary will ditch bill, and run as the first lesbian president.

If she thought that would get her a win, I wouldn't put it past the bitch.

If she dumps bill or not won't change the fact she would be the first. Not that there is anything wrong with that. (Seinfeld reference)