How can ONE group of people be so WRONG!!!

[healthmyths]

How many times can you possibly post the same shit over and over and over again that continues to be debunked and you continue to ignore.

Are you telling me THESE links are BUNK???
10 million are not citizens : Income, Poverty and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2009 - Income & Wealth - Newsroom - U.S. Census Bureau
GEEZ the Census says 10 million are not CITIZENS!

14 million eligible are like 2 people I KNOW that are eligible for MEDICAID but just haven't REGISTERED!!! http://coverageforall.org/pdf/BC-BS_Uninsured-America.pdf
AND I know 2 people that can attest they are uninsured YET they are eligible for MEDICAID... they just have registered!
If I know 2 you know 2 thousands of people know at least 2 that are legally able to be covered by Medicaid... they just have registered!
SO what the f..k is ACA doing THAT CMS shouldn't have done already under EXISTING LAWS!!!

18 million under 34 making over $50,000 don't want their employers' plans..!! don't want:CRISIS OF THE UNINSURED: 2009
42 million is what that adds up to but not 46 million for sure!


About 13.7 million uninsured adults and children live in households earning less than $25,000 annually.
Many in this group already qualify for Medicaid or S-CHIP; for instance,
past research by the BlueCross BlueShield Association estimated that up to 14 million uninsured individuals qualify for public coverage but have not enrolled.

Indeed, three million to six million people identified as uninsured may already be covered by Medicaid or S-CHIP but erroneously told Census Bureau they were uninsured because they do not associate Medicaid with insurance coverage; this is referred to as the "Medicaid undercount."

Nearly 18 million of the uninsured lived in households with annual incomes above $50,000 -- over half of them (9.7 million) in households with incomes that exceed $75,000 annually.

AND YOU still haven't debunked THESE STATISTICS:

 

[Listening]

What’s sad and telling is how the right considers any number of Americans without access to affordable healthcare somehow ‘acceptable.’

What is more sad that you somehow think this pipe dream can be made to happen.

Not having a car to get the to the doctors office (or someone to watch your cat while you are away) could also be considered access limiting.

Many people with insurance don't take out preventative measures.

And access to insurance is not access to health care.

In fact, as has been pointed out, this is going to potentially create doctor shortages....now how is that not limiting healthcare ?

Answer: it is.

 

[healthmyths]

THE facts are
The census says 10 million of Obama's 46 million are not CITIZENS!

This might be correct but I've only seen it on rightwing websites - and it's never juxtaposed with a detailed itemization of Obama's numbers. [Frankly, I don't trust Obama's numbers or your numbers - you're both too politically invested in the outcome to be objective or honest. And I'm certain that census takers have no idea how flawed their model is. There could be more illegals counted than even you suspect. But you're not in this to find out the truth; you're in this to say what ever is necessary to kill ObamaCare]

But I feel you. After Reagan passed the largest Amnesty Bill in this nation's history, many Southwestern cities became sanctuary cities, with illegals streaming in to be with their families, friends and fellow freedom seekers. Reagan created a magnet. And business loved all the cheap labor because cheap labor = higher profits.

The point of global capitalism was to give our capitalists unobstructed access to the world's cheapest labor and raw materials - it was to soften borders so that capital could be deployed to any spot on the globe offering higher returns. This is why capitalism is so revolutionary: it is monomaniacal and ruthlessly efficient in its pursuit of profits; that is, it doesn't let boarders stand in the way. If investors can make more money using illegal labor, than capitalism will find a way to get that labor. This is why Marx had so much respect (and fear) for it. Reagan was soft on illegals partly because he wanted to break the union stranglehold that Labor had on Southern California's menial labor markets. Even better: illegal labor pays dividends to your propaganda system because it allows Limbaugh and Savage to scare illiterate nationalists into the voting booths by using a narrative about how demons are secretly taking over the country and destroying our culture. Win win.

EVERY thing you wrote is bull crap!
FOLLOW THE LINKS DUMMY!!!

10 million are not citizens :Income, Poverty and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2009 - Income & Wealth - Newsroom - U.S. Census Bureau
14 million eligible are like 2 people I KNOW that are eligible for MEDICAID but just haven't REGISTERED!!! http://coverageforall.org/pdf/BC-BS_Uninsured-America.pdf
18 million under 34 making over $50,000 don't want their employers' plans..!! don't want:CRISIS OF THE UNINSURED: 2009
42 million is what that adds up to but not 46 million for sure!

FOLLOW THE LINKS!! I didn't make these numbers UP!!

10 million not citizens!
14 million simply because they are at poverty level ARE QUALIFIED for MEDICAID !!! DO YOU UNDERSTAND?? THINK... if Obama's OWN CMS that manages Medicare and Medicaid
can't convince 14 million people in poverty level to register with MEDICAID... WHY THE fu...K was ACA Necessary and more importantly WORK BETTER???

Finally why are you so anxious to have 18 million people that DON"T WANT! Don't NEED! Spend a lot less then employers' health plans cost.. WHY is it necessary for them to buy?

Naive idiots who don't have the f..king IDEA probably like you say "well we have to increase the pool with healthy younger people" ... IDIOT!!!
INCREASE WHAT POOL???
Do you understand??? 46 million is NOT the number of legitimately UNINSURED! subtract:
10 million illegals!
14 million that only need to have CMS do it's job and register them!
18 million that don't want or need!
42 million is what that adds up to... NOT 46 million
The truth is there are less then 4 million people THAT WANT and NEED health insurance! NOT 46 million!

SO again WHY is this so hard to comprehend???

 

[healthmyths]

See the below links to prove the fact less then 4 million truly uninsured!

10 million illegals: Income, Poverty and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2009 - Income & Wealth - Newsroom - U.S. Census Bureau
14 million eligible http://coverageforall.org/pdf/BC-BS_Uninsured-America.pdf
18 million don't want:CRISIS OF THE UNINSURED: 2009

What happens to an illegal alien when they get sick now? Where do they go?

Since they cannot be denied service in an ER I'll give you three guesses.

Since they cannot pay their bill I'll give you three more guesses who ends up paying.

OK, skip the illegal aliens.

When an uninsured U.S. citizen gets sick where do they go?

Since they cannot be denied service in an ER I'll give you three guesses.

Since they cannot pay their bill I'll give you three more guesses who ends up paying.

Do I hear an echo?

YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY Correct! EMTALA states this:
1986 EMTALA...Enacted by the federal government in 1986, requires that hospital emergency departments treat emergency conditions of all patients regardless of their ability to pay and is considered a critical element in the "safety net" for the uninsured, but established no direct payment mechanism for such care. Indirect payments and reimbursements through federal and state government programs have never fully compensated public and private hospitals for the full cost of care mandated by EMTALA. Health care in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

AND SO Medicare looks the other way when AS this CEO states:
"How do hospitals deal with the cost of the uninsured? Like any business, we pass it on to the paying customers.”
From PAGE 1 of this document: http://www.ncmedicaljournal.com/wp-content/uploads/NCMJ/mar-apr-05/Yarbrough.pdf

THE FACTS!!!
Hospitals PAD AND Pass on to the payers.. I.E. Medicare/insurance companies these expenses!

SOLUTION!!!
A) $500 million a year in cancer claims are paid that are caused by tanning salons... So ACA has a 10% tax... OK sounds reasonable doesn't???
B) $850 BILLION ... BILLION... is spent according to doctors WASTEFULLY! Who pays? Medicare/insurance! Who causes this waste? Lawyers!
Defensive medicine is the practice of duplicating tests, doing referrals ALL out of FEAR of lawsuits brought on by lawyers who make annually $270 billion a year!
SO using tanning tax solution TAX lawyers 10% and use that to pay the premiums for EACH of the 4 million truly needy uninsured!
SOLVED... Hospitals CAN"T pad and pass any more as the Uninsured has insurance!
Lawyers can either scale back lawsuits which in turn reduces that $850 billion lawsuit protection COSTS.. i.e. defensive medicine!

 

[healthmyths]

Healthmyths,

Here is my larger point about foreign labor (-and both parties are guilty here, especially Clinton).

Our largest employer - Walmart - gets over 50% of its goods made in places like Communist China, Taiwan etc. You can see this first hand by going into any Walmart. Read the labels on the T-shirts, Toasters, Coffee Makers, TVs, Towels, Blankets, Tools, Sneakers, Backpacks. It will blow your mind when you see the list of freedom hating nations that our largest retailer (and one of the biggest GOP donors) does business with.

But it gets worse. Your party has a massive message system which feeds guys like you with propaganda, so that you dutifully clog the public debate with half truths and distortions (in order to protect the corporations and wealthy people who fund elections and, in so doing, staff government). Your party - which is an appendage of the corporate take over democracy - provides major incentives to anyone who will manufacture data for their information war (so that they can convert government into a dynamic advocate of special interests -health care monopolies being chief among them).

Where do you think your party's large bullshit machine gets the funds to provide you with an endless stream of manufactured data? Answer: companies like Walmart have massive amounts of extra cash because of their partnership with places like Communist China who manufacturers their goods with workers who get $5/day and live in hovels. Your ability to spin these tales about how much you care about the American population - and its sanctity - is funded by special interests who are waging war against the American population by using those illegals or partnering with their host nation to undercut American labor. [It's a fucking Orwellian hoax and everybody knows it]

The story of post-Carter Capitalism is the story of how the American Private Sector took over Washington and waged war against the American worker. Your job is to defend those capitalists against Big Government. But you never, ever mention the partnerships that those capitalists and your party (by extension) has formed with freedom hating nations in order to destroy the American worker. Meaning: you and your party have used those illegals as a tool to impoverish a generation of Americans . . . all so the Waltons can realize dynastic wealth . . . as the country dies. It's a hoax.

STICK TO THE POINT!!!

There are NOT 46 million uninsured! This was the number used to convince by just 7 YES votes the mechanism THAT Is destroying health insurance!
Are you willing to pay more in Federal/state/local and property taxes??? That will happen when the 1,300 insurance companies close their doors and NO LONGER pay annually
$100 billion a year employing 400,000 people! And idiots who supported Obamacare WANT single payer???

As far as your above non-sense... how in the hell has the USA over the last 60 years accumulated as of
A) USA Household Assets in 2012
Assets: $78.2 Trillion,
liabilities : $13.5 Trillion;
Net Worth: $64.8 Trillion

US Household Assets: $78.2 Trillion, Liablilties: $13.5 Trillion; Net Worth: $64.8 Trillion | Zero Hedge

Please explain how such accumulation of $64 TRILLION NET worth by the 100 million household could have happened any where else in the world???

 

[Zoom-boing]

See the below links to prove the fact less then 4 million truly uninsured!

10 million illegals: Income, Poverty and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2009 - Income & Wealth - Newsroom - U.S. Census Bureau
14 million eligible http://coverageforall.org/pdf/BC-BS_Uninsured-America.pdf
18 million don't want:CRISIS OF THE UNINSURED: 2009

What happens to an illegal alien when they get sick now? Where do they go?

Since they cannot be denied service in an ER I'll give you three guesses.

Since they cannot pay their bill I'll give you three more guesses who ends up paying.

OK, skip the illegal aliens.

When an uninsured U.S. citizen gets sick where do they go?

Since they cannot be denied service in an ER I'll give you three guesses.

Since they cannot pay their bill I'll give you three more guesses who ends up paying.

Do I hear an echo?

So when those illegals and uninsured (yes, both will continue to exist) still go to the ER, we will still be paying for them, along with allll those other millions who bought insurance through the (un)aca website and whom we are now subsidizing. So in the end, we are still paying for them except now a huge layer of bureaucracy, including all the waste that goes along with it, has been added by the fed, who has no business in the insurance business to begin with <--- ended with a preposition, so sue me. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[healthmyths]

I've asked this so many times but NOT one person that supports ACA has yet refuted the biggest LIE that was told and continues to be told regarding how
many people are truly uninsured!

THE facts are
The census says 10 million of Obama's 46 million are not CITIZENS! So do you supporters of ACA want illegal aliens to be covered?
The Census says 14 million people living at a poverty level said they were uninsured.. MEDICAID covers them... they just don't know it!!!
Finally since when is it a valid inclusion of people in the UNINSURED category that don't WANT insurance! They don't NEED it even though they can afford it!

SO why are these 42 million people still counted as the 46 million "uninsured"???

Because the LIE had to be told so single payer health insurance would come about!

BUT these same idiots that brought us the law piously included tanning salons as tanning causes skin cancer.. they tax 10%... YET
NOT ONE mention of the $850 billion that doctors say they bill insurance companies and Medicare BECAUSE THEY FEAR LAWSUITS!
NOT one mention of taxing 10% of lawyers $270 billion as a direct cause of the $850 billion! WHY???

Finally NOT ONE MENTION that hospitals 'pad and pass' on uninsured expenses sometimes billing the payers 6,000% markups over costs to absorb costs!
In other words all you people paying premiums to insurance companies ARE PAYING to eliminate FEAR of lawsuits!

So in one solution...
Take the $27 billion and pay the premiums for the 4 million truly means tested as not Medicaid but need insurance!
Then when hospital sees an UNINSURED... bill is sent to the insurance company managing the UNINSURED!

NO problems... lowering $850 billion "defensive medicine" and disallowing the 'pad and pass' of the uninsured.. REDUCES the companies/Medicare costs!

So AGAIN why can't you supporters do just simply math.. i.e. subtract 42 million from 46 million and USE the number 4 million as truly the UNINSURED!!!

If they are uninsured, they are uninsured regardless of the reason.

I'm not sure you understand.
The majority of the ACA "YES" voters thought they were helping 46 million "uninsured" because Obama said so!
The majority of the MSM parroted these numbers and even some very ignorant critic/conservatives still don't comprehend and they speak in terms of "30 million uninsured"
THERE 10 million that are not suppose to be insured as THEY ARE ILLEGALS meaning they're not suppose to be in this country in the first place... Deduct 10 million!
14 million people QUALIFY even before ACA for Medicaid ... CMS the same people that want to expand their mgmt. of health care can't seem to get these people enrolled
and as a result deduct 14 million! THEY NEED ONLY to REGISTER! Do you understand??

18 million people under 34 making over $50,000 DON"T WANT or NEED insurance!
SO why are they counted as part of the 46 million?

Is this concept so hard to comprehend that there never were 46 million people the number used to convince to pass ACA!
There are less then 4 million!
AND our health system is being destroyed for 4 million people?
NO one seems to want to tax the lawyers 10% like tanning salons and lawyers CAUSE $850 billion a year in "defensive medicine"!
Take the $27 billion of the $270 billion of lawyers income and PAY the $5,000 per uninsured person!
It is that simple!
If it was good enough to tax tanning salons..WHY not lawyers that COST health care companies/Medicare $850 billion a year in wasted duplicate tests,etc.

 

[eflatminor]

Perhaps if you used more exclamation points in your thread titles and posts, someone would respond.

How many times can you possibly post the same shit over and over and over again that continues to be debunked and you continue to ignore.

Now that's the kind of response we've come to expect from the Progressive Left. The specificity with which you refute the claim, the logic and reason used to support your position. All very impressive...

Cue the ad hominen attack, non sequitur, or straw man argument...or heck, just call everyone a racist and be done with it.

That's right... Be proud of your regressive ignorance.

Thank you for proving my point...

 

[healthmyths]

THAT CHART doesn't PROVE the eligibility to be insured!

Of those 47 million you show..
HOW MANY were illegal aliens... Per the CENSUS 10 million are not legal!
How many of those in the poverty level can go get Medicare is 14 million!
14 million eligible are like 2 people I KNOW that are eligible for MEDICAID but just haven't REGISTERED!!! http://coverageforall.org/pdf/BC-BS_Uninsured-America.pdf

I don't think you understand that number! 14 million people are like the two UNINSURED people I know.
They have NOT registered with Medicaid as they are not working and at the poverty level!
I help them financially but they don't help themselves to Medicaid and I can't go any further!

So 14 million of that chart CAN if they just get registered with Medicaid have health services paid!

Finally NOTE your chart FAMILY INCOME...
Federal poverty level for family of 4 is $23,000.. WE AGREE RIGHT???
10% of the 47 million or 4.7 million made an average of $112,000 per year !
14% of the 47 million or 6.6 million made an average of $70,840 per year.
37% of the 47 million or 17.3 million made an average of $23,000 per year!

THAT ADDS UP per YOUR chart to 28.6 million of the 47 million that make more then $23,000 the Federal Poverty Level!
SO WHY then is the number 18 million of the 47 million that REFUSE insurance included? THEY can afford but don't WANT it!

DO YOU understand??? THEY CAN BUY BUT don't want or need to waste money on insurance!

THEN of that remaining 38% that meet the Federal poverty level that are UNINSURE QUALIFY FOR MEDICAID!!!
That is 17 million of the 47 million that all they need do is REGISTER FOR MEDICAID!!!

So once again..
10 million are not citizens!
14 million (See above qualify under Medicaid but like the two people I know JUST don't register !
18 million don't want, don't need..
That's 42 million that are bogusly and totally wrong to count as the "uninsured"!!!

 

[healthmyths]

The point of this thread is ACA/Obamacare people are really math and reading comprehension challenged!

Simply stated ACA was passed because people thought there really were 46 million that wanted, that were legally able and couldn't afford!

YET... That is a falsehood. A BIG LIE.. The reason we have this disaster known as OBAMACARE!

Taking care of 10 million illegals by DESTROYING all our health care is not a solution.. yet they are included.. subtract 10 million!
14 million are people like the two people I financially support BUT are out of work and qualify for Medicaid.. but they just won't register!

And finally including 18 million people that don't want as they are under 34 ... can afford make over $50,000 so why are they forced to
buy ACA???

This leaves just 4 million that truly need, can't afford and don't qualify... TAKE care of these 4 million doesn't require destroying ALL our health insurance!

 

[eflatminor]

See the below links to prove the fact less then 4 million truly uninsured!

10 million illegals: Income, Poverty and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2009 - Income & Wealth - Newsroom - U.S. Census Bureau
14 million eligible http://coverageforall.org/pdf/BC-BS_Uninsured-America.pdf
18 million don't want:CRISIS OF THE UNINSURED: 2009

What happens to an illegal alien when they get sick now? Where do they go?

Since they cannot be denied service in an ER I'll give you three guesses.

Since they cannot pay their bill I'll give you three more guesses who ends up paying.

OK, skip the illegal aliens.

When an uninsured U.S. citizen gets sick where do they go?

Since they cannot be denied service in an ER I'll give you three guesses.

Since they cannot pay their bill I'll give you three more guesses who ends up paying.

Do I hear an echo?

A perfect example of where you expect the failings of central planning (requiring private hospitals to take all comers for instance) to be fixed with more central planning (Obamacare).

Um, pass.

Now, before all this entitlement bullshit, where did they go? They went to charitable hospitals, they worked out payment plans with local doctors, they learned to deal with their own minor injuries and aliments. And we THRIVED under that system...until the central planners came along just sure they knew better. They did not and they do not.

 

[oreo]

I've asked this so many times but NOT one person that supports ACA has yet refuted the biggest LIE that was told and continues to be told regarding how
many people are truly uninsured!

THE facts are
The census says 10 million of Obama's 46 million are not CITIZENS! So do you supporters of ACA want illegal aliens to be covered?
The Census says 14 million people living at a poverty level said they were uninsured.. MEDICAID covers them... they just don't know it!!!
Finally since when is it a valid inclusion of people in the UNINSURED category that don't WANT insurance! They don't NEED it even though they can afford it!

SO why are these 42 million people still counted as the 46 million "uninsured"???

Because the LIE had to be told so single payer health insurance would come about!

BUT these same idiots that brought us the law piously included tanning salons as tanning causes skin cancer.. they tax 10%... YET
NOT ONE mention of the $850 billion that doctors say they bill insurance companies and Medicare BECAUSE THEY FEAR LAWSUITS!
NOT one mention of taxing 10% of lawyers $270 billion as a direct cause of the $850 billion! WHY???

Finally NOT ONE MENTION that hospitals 'pad and pass' on uninsured expenses sometimes billing the payers 6,000% markups over costs to absorb costs!
In other words all you people paying premiums to insurance companies ARE PAYING to eliminate FEAR of lawsuits!

So in one solution...
Take the $27 billion and pay the premiums for the 4 million truly means tested as not Medicaid but need insurance!
Then when hospital sees an UNINSURED... bill is sent to the insurance company managing the UNINSURED!

NO problems... lowering $850 billion "defensive medicine" and disallowing the 'pad and pass' of the uninsured.. REDUCES the companies/Medicare costs!

So AGAIN why can't you supporters do just simply math.. i.e. subtract 42 million from 46 million and USE the number 4 million as truly the UNINSURED!!!

I think this cartoon says it all--

Unfortunately--instead of MANDATING that the above go out and buy their own medical insurance policy--Obama and democrats wrote their own mandates within in Obamacare and tried to micro-manage 1/6 of our private sector economy--which resulted in:

Purpose of Obamacare: to insure the unisured. Effect of Obamacare: uninsuring the insured.

Our Federal Government at work--

 

[healthmyths]

I've asked this so many times but NOT one person that supports ACA has yet refuted the biggest LIE that was told and continues to be told regarding how
many people are truly uninsured!

THE facts are
The census says 10 million of Obama's 46 million are not CITIZENS! So do you supporters of ACA want illegal aliens to be covered?
The Census says 14 million people living at a poverty level said they were uninsured.. MEDICAID covers them... they just don't know it!!!
Finally since when is it a valid inclusion of people in the UNINSURED category that don't WANT insurance! They don't NEED it even though they can afford it!

SO why are these 42 million people still counted as the 46 million "uninsured"???

Because the LIE had to be told so single payer health insurance would come about!

BUT these same idiots that brought us the law piously included tanning salons as tanning causes skin cancer.. they tax 10%... YET
NOT ONE mention of the $850 billion that doctors say they bill insurance companies and Medicare BECAUSE THEY FEAR LAWSUITS!
NOT one mention of taxing 10% of lawyers $270 billion as a direct cause of the $850 billion! WHY???

Finally NOT ONE MENTION that hospitals 'pad and pass' on uninsured expenses sometimes billing the payers 6,000% markups over costs to absorb costs!
In other words all you people paying premiums to insurance companies ARE PAYING to eliminate FEAR of lawsuits!

So in one solution...
Take the $27 billion and pay the premiums for the 4 million truly means tested as not Medicaid but need insurance!
Then when hospital sees an UNINSURED... bill is sent to the insurance company managing the UNINSURED!

NO problems... lowering $850 billion "defensive medicine" and disallowing the 'pad and pass' of the uninsured.. REDUCES the companies/Medicare costs!

So AGAIN why can't you supporters do just simply math.. i.e. subtract 42 million from 46 million and USE the number 4 million as truly the UNINSURED!!!

I think this cartoon says it all--

Unfortunately--instead of MANDATING that the above go out and buy their own medical insurance policy--Obama and democrats wrote their own mandates within in Obamacare and tried to micro-manage 1/6 of our private sector economy--which resulted in:

Purpose of Obamacare: to insure the unisured. Effect of Obamacare: uninsuring the insured.

Our Federal Government at work--

I don't think there is a NEED to mandate ANYONE other then the hospitals and the Lawyers that have a direct link to the $850 billion a year
that doctors say they bill insurance and medicare ALL OUT of DEFENSIVE Medicine!

What is wrong with taxing 10% of lawyers $270 billion and using that to pay the premiums for each of those people that come into the Hospitals that claim they
are uninsured?
Require hospitals if they are seeing an uninsured to "Means test" the patient. If they don't qualify for Medicaid (14 million of uninsured DO qualify they just aren't
registered.. require hospitals to REGISTER with Medicaid then).. they would qualify for the Uninsured Health Insurance Co© policy!

The $27 billion lawyers are taxed would pay the premiums.

Hospitals then would audited to make sure they AREN'T Padding and passing (as my data shows sometimes hospitals markup to Medicare 6,000% above costs!

In two fell swoops... Reducing $850 billion defensive medicine reduces lawyers tax thus the cost of insurance goes down...
Lowers hospitals padding and passing on of exorbitant charges..i.e. sometimes 6,000% markups!

BUT this will never happen.. TOO simple for people that love complicated government interference and the biggest... 47% of Congress are LAWYERS as Obama!