How many posters here are smarter than all the world's scientists?

[CrusaderFrank]

Anyway, the walls will certainly radiate no matter the temperature ... the mistake in your logic is that you assume that average temperature over 602,300,000,000,000,000,000,000 molecules per mole represents the exact temperature of each individual molecule ... nothing could be further from the truth ... any individual molecule above 70º will radiate photons until it gets back down to 70º ... barring getting smacked by another photon ...

again, the argument is that they don't radiate hotter than they are. not that they don't.

Are you denying that you support the idea that matter does not radiate towards warmer matter? If so, I can probably bring up the posts. As to the actual question, I'd say you need a course in statistical thermodynamics, but I'm pretty sure its dramatically over your head. But go ahead and look it up. You might still get the picture.

A comet flying into the Sun is "matter traveling to warmer"

 

[Grumblenuts]

Climate and Earth’s Energy Budget

Earth’s temperature depends on how much sunlight the land, oceans, and atmosphere absorb, and how much heat the planet radiates back to space. This fact sheet describes the net flow of energy through different parts of the Earth system, and explains how the planetary energy budget stays in balance.

earthobservatory.nasa.gov

 

[ReinyDays]

Generally speaking, "matter" doesn't radiate anything anywhere in particular.

Matter sure as hell does ... all Light Matter interacts with electromagnetic radiation ... you may be confusing this with the mythological substance called Dark Matter, which doesn't interact with electromagnetic radiation, which is why it's dark ... all atoms can absorb photons, thus all atoms can radiate photons ... why else would the Sun shine? ...

400PPM absorbs 100% IR? Are you insane?

The mean free path for IR in Earth's lower atmosphere is around 27 m ... almost 100 feet ... that's the average distance an IR photon will travel near Earth's surface ... maximum absorption for solar IR is above 99% of the atmosphere, and it's all gone by the time the solar IR passes through the top 18% of the atmosphere ... only visual light and radio waves can pass through the atmosphere unencumbered ... this is why IR telescopes have to be in orbit above the Earth's atmosphere, they'd get nothing (or fogged out by back radiation) from the Earth's surface, even atop Mt Everest ...

The main culprit here is water vapor ... carbon dioxide only reacts to IR in a few narrow bands where water doesn't, notably around 15 µm ... so, yeah, even 180 ppm is enough to keep almost all the IR photons from Earth's surface from directly reaching outer space ... which is why the Earth's surface is 30-40ºC warmer than expected without an atmosphere ...

 

[daveman]

Only GHGs in the lower half of the atmosphere are raising temperatures ... the GHGs in the upper half of the atmosphere work to keep solar longwave off Earth's surface, reducing temperatures ... this fact mitigates much of the man-made global warming due to carbon dioxide ...

Are you suggesting that the Earth and the Sun have similar radiative spectrums? It seems to me that there's a pretty significant temperature difference between the two and thus a pretty significant difference in their spectrums. While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere, including reflective and opaque clouds. CO2 in the Stratosphere is not mitigating ANY significant amount of global warming

400PPM absorbs 100% IR? Are you insane?

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

Obviously, to save us all from global warming climate change the horrors of American coal and SUVs, we need to turn all the CO2 molecules upside down.

That, and world socialism, of course.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Only GHGs in the lower half of the atmosphere are raising temperatures ... the GHGs in the upper half of the atmosphere work to keep solar longwave off Earth's surface, reducing temperatures ... this fact mitigates much of the man-made global warming due to carbon dioxide ...

Are you suggesting that the Earth and the Sun have similar radiative spectrums? It seems to me that there's a pretty significant temperature difference between the two and thus a pretty significant difference in their spectrums. While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere, including reflective and opaque clouds. CO2 in the Stratosphere is not mitigating ANY significant amount of global warming

400PPM absorbs 100% IR? Are you insane?

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

Obviously, to save us all from global warming climate change the horrors of American coal and SUVs, we need to turn all the CO2 molecules upside down.

That, and world socialism, of course.

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

I don't think you did.

 

[jc456]

Anyway, the walls will certainly radiate no matter the temperature ... the mistake in your logic is that you assume that average temperature over 602,300,000,000,000,000,000,000 molecules per mole represents the exact temperature of each individual molecule ... nothing could be further from the truth ... any individual molecule above 70º will radiate photons until it gets back down to 70º ... barring getting smacked by another photon ...

again, the argument is that they don't radiate hotter than they are. not that they don't.

Are you denying that you support the idea that matter does not radiate towards warmer matter? If so, I can probably bring up the posts. As to the actual question, I'd say you need a course in statistical thermodynamics, but I'm pretty sure its dramatically over your head. But go ahead and look it up. You might still get the picture.

Yep, matter emits. It’s how much does it emit! Mostly hot matter radiates to cold.

 

[daveman]

Only GHGs in the lower half of the atmosphere are raising temperatures ... the GHGs in the upper half of the atmosphere work to keep solar longwave off Earth's surface, reducing temperatures ... this fact mitigates much of the man-made global warming due to carbon dioxide ...

Are you suggesting that the Earth and the Sun have similar radiative spectrums? It seems to me that there's a pretty significant temperature difference between the two and thus a pretty significant difference in their spectrums. While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere, including reflective and opaque clouds. CO2 in the Stratosphere is not mitigating ANY significant amount of global warming

400PPM absorbs 100% IR? Are you insane?

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

Obviously, to save us all from global warming climate change the horrors of American coal and SUVs, we need to turn all the CO2 molecules upside down.

That, and world socialism, of course.

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

I don't think you did.

That's what Crick said.

"While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere..."

 

[MisterBeale]

. . . because all scientists agree on everything.

That is how the religion of Scientism works!

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Only GHGs in the lower half of the atmosphere are raising temperatures ... the GHGs in the upper half of the atmosphere work to keep solar longwave off Earth's surface, reducing temperatures ... this fact mitigates much of the man-made global warming due to carbon dioxide ...

Are you suggesting that the Earth and the Sun have similar radiative spectrums? It seems to me that there's a pretty significant temperature difference between the two and thus a pretty significant difference in their spectrums. While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere, including reflective and opaque clouds. CO2 in the Stratosphere is not mitigating ANY significant amount of global warming

400PPM absorbs 100% IR? Are you insane?

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

Obviously, to save us all from global warming climate change the horrors of American coal and SUVs, we need to turn all the CO2 molecules upside down.

That, and world socialism, of course.

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

I don't think you did.

That's what Crick said.

"While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere..."

While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface,

All the outgoing radiation from the Earth's surface is IR.

22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun

The incoming radiation from the Sun includes more than IR.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Anyway, the walls will certainly radiate no matter the temperature ... the mistake in your logic is that you assume that average temperature over 602,300,000,000,000,000,000,000 molecules per mole represents the exact temperature of each individual molecule ... nothing could be further from the truth ... any individual molecule above 70º will radiate photons until it gets back down to 70º ... barring getting smacked by another photon ...

again, the argument is that they don't radiate hotter than they are. not that they don't.

Are you denying that you support the idea that matter does not radiate towards warmer matter? If so, I can probably bring up the posts. As to the actual question, I'd say you need a course in statistical thermodynamics, but I'm pretty sure its dramatically over your head. But go ahead and look it up. You might still get the picture.

Yep, matter emits. It’s how much does it emit! Mostly hot matter radiates to cold.

Mostly hot matter radiates to cold.

Sloppy.

Hot matter radiates more than cold matter radiates.

 

[jc456]

Anyway, the walls will certainly radiate no matter the temperature ... the mistake in your logic is that you assume that average temperature over 602,300,000,000,000,000,000,000 molecules per mole represents the exact temperature of each individual molecule ... nothing could be further from the truth ... any individual molecule above 70º will radiate photons until it gets back down to 70º ... barring getting smacked by another photon ...

again, the argument is that they don't radiate hotter than they are. not that they don't.

Are you denying that you support the idea that matter does not radiate towards warmer matter? If so, I can probably bring up the posts. As to the actual question, I'd say you need a course in statistical thermodynamics, but I'm pretty sure its dramatically over your head. But go ahead and look it up. You might still get the picture.

Yep, matter emits. It’s how much does it emit! Mostly hot matter radiates to cold.

Mostly hot matter radiates to cold.

Sloppy.

Hot matter radiates more than cold matter radiates.

Yep , I never said anything different. But hot matter radiates to colder matter more

 

[Grumblenuts]

Generally speaking, "matter" doesn't radiate anything anywhere in particular.

Matter sure as hell does ... all Light Matter interacts with electromagnetic radiation ... you may be confusing this with the mythological substance called Dark Matter, which doesn't interact with electromagnetic radiation, which is why it's dark ... all atoms can absorb photons, thus all atoms can radiate photons ... why else would the Sun shine? ...

Lol. Emphasis upon "in particular", sunshine. Appears you somehow utterly ignored that clear caveat in your hurried confusion. Matter tends to radiate (electromagnetic energy among other things) radially. Duh! Read the NASA link provided above for further edification^^^

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

But hot matter radiates to colder matter more

I hope SSDD doesn't see that.........

 

[Grumblenuts]

That's what Crick said.

"While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere..."

Ergo, "the IR radiated by the" Earth's surface (again, in all directions) amounts to precious little compared to even the tiny portion of the Sun's total IR radiation that manages to get through our atmosphere each day.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

That's what Crick said.

"While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere..."

Ergo, "the IR radiated by the" Earth's surface (again, in all directions) amounts to precious little compared to even the tiny portion of the Sun's total IR radiation that manages to get through our atmosphere each day.

"the IR radiated by the" Earth's surface (again, in all directions) amounts to precious little compared to even the tiny portion of the Sun's total IR radiation that manages to get through our atmosphere each day.

Are you sure?

 

[daveman]

Only GHGs in the lower half of the atmosphere are raising temperatures ... the GHGs in the upper half of the atmosphere work to keep solar longwave off Earth's surface, reducing temperatures ... this fact mitigates much of the man-made global warming due to carbon dioxide ...

Are you suggesting that the Earth and the Sun have similar radiative spectrums? It seems to me that there's a pretty significant temperature difference between the two and thus a pretty significant difference in their spectrums. While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere, including reflective and opaque clouds. CO2 in the Stratosphere is not mitigating ANY significant amount of global warming

400PPM absorbs 100% IR? Are you insane?

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

Obviously, to save us all from global warming climate change the horrors of American coal and SUVs, we need to turn all the CO2 molecules upside down.

That, and world socialism, of course.

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

I don't think you did.

That's what Crick said.

"While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere..."

While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface,

All the outgoing radiation from the Earth's surface is IR.

22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun

The incoming radiation from the Sun includes more than IR.

Then we're comparing how CO2 absorbs infrared to how the entire atmosphere absorbs all solar radiation.

Bad comparison is bad.

 

[Grumblenuts]

That's what Crick said.

"While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere..."

Ergo, "the IR radiated by the" Earth's surface (again, in all directions) amounts to precious little compared to even the tiny portion of the Sun's total IR radiation that manages to get through our atmosphere each day.

"the IR radiated by the" Earth's surface (again, in all directions) amounts to precious little compared to even the tiny portion of the Sun's total IR radiation that manages to get through our atmosphere each day.

Are you sure?

Yes. Just as "The incoming radiation from the Sun includes more than IR", radiated by the Earth's surface is not the same as radiated by the Earth's atmosphere. NASA.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Only GHGs in the lower half of the atmosphere are raising temperatures ... the GHGs in the upper half of the atmosphere work to keep solar longwave off Earth's surface, reducing temperatures ... this fact mitigates much of the man-made global warming due to carbon dioxide ...

Are you suggesting that the Earth and the Sun have similar radiative spectrums? It seems to me that there's a pretty significant temperature difference between the two and thus a pretty significant difference in their spectrums. While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere, including reflective and opaque clouds. CO2 in the Stratosphere is not mitigating ANY significant amount of global warming

400PPM absorbs 100% IR? Are you insane?

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

Obviously, to save us all from global warming climate change the horrors of American coal and SUVs, we need to turn all the CO2 molecules upside down.

That, and world socialism, of course.

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

I don't think you did.

That's what Crick said.

"While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere..."

While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface,

All the outgoing radiation from the Earth's surface is IR.

22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun

The incoming radiation from the Sun includes more than IR.

Then we're comparing how CO2 absorbs infrared to how the entire atmosphere absorbs all solar radiation.

Bad comparison is bad.

Then we're comparing how CO2 absorbs infrared to how the entire atmosphere absorbs all solar radiation.

We're not comparing anything. Just helping clarify what Crick posted.

 

[daveman]

Only GHGs in the lower half of the atmosphere are raising temperatures ... the GHGs in the upper half of the atmosphere work to keep solar longwave off Earth's surface, reducing temperatures ... this fact mitigates much of the man-made global warming due to carbon dioxide ...

Are you suggesting that the Earth and the Sun have similar radiative spectrums? It seems to me that there's a pretty significant temperature difference between the two and thus a pretty significant difference in their spectrums. While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere, including reflective and opaque clouds. CO2 in the Stratosphere is not mitigating ANY significant amount of global warming

400PPM absorbs 100% IR? Are you insane?

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

Obviously, to save us all from global warming climate change the horrors of American coal and SUVs, we need to turn all the CO2 molecules upside down.

That, and world socialism, of course.

Today I learned CO2 absorbs infrared completely in one direction, but only about 3/4 of it in the other direction.

I don't think you did.

That's what Crick said.

"While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere..."

While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface,

All the outgoing radiation from the Earth's surface is IR.

22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun

The incoming radiation from the Sun includes more than IR.

Then we're comparing how CO2 absorbs infrared to how the entire atmosphere absorbs all solar radiation.

Bad comparison is bad.

Then we're comparing how CO2 absorbs infrared to how the entire atmosphere absorbs all solar radiation.

We're not comparing anything. Just helping clarify what Crick posted.

Apples and oranges, all designed to elicit an emotional response. It's crap.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

That's what Crick said.

"While a few meters of CO2 at 400 ppm in our atmosphere is sufficient to absorb 100% of the IR radiated by the surface, while 22.5% of the incoming radiation from the Sun makes it through the complete thickness of our atmosphere..."

Ergo, "the IR radiated by the" Earth's surface (again, in all directions) amounts to precious little compared to even the tiny portion of the Sun's total IR radiation that manages to get through our atmosphere each day.

"the IR radiated by the" Earth's surface (again, in all directions) amounts to precious little compared to even the tiny portion of the Sun's total IR radiation that manages to get through our atmosphere each day.

Are you sure?

Yes. Just as "The incoming radiation from the Sun includes more than IR", radiated by the Earth's surface is not the same as radiated by the Earth's atmosphere. NASA.

Yes.

"the IR radiated by the" Earth's surface (again, in all directions) amounts to precious little compared to even the tiny portion of the Sun's total IR radiation that manages to get through our atmosphere each day.

Show me that the IR from the Earth's surface is "precious little" compared to the amount of solar IR that gets through our atmosphere.