Hydroxychloroquine (Plaquenil) Thread

If every person in the country, who hasn't been tested, was tested this week the backhoe sales at Kubota would soar due to fear digging as a result of the 'infected" positives

That is an interesting point, in that the Dec flu that went around, I got in early Jan.
And it was the worst flu ever, with the exact same lung symptoms of COVID-19.
So I am very suspicious about what a good universal test would show?

I had to keep it to myself until NOW as a "conspiracy theory", but I was talking to friends/colleagues in Cali in December that were suffering for 3 or 4 weeks with a "flu from hell"... Several of them elderly.. I don't think this a conspiracy anymore since the "miraculous success" in Cali in containing it didn't involve any genius measures that weren't taken elsewhere.. Pretty sure Cali could NOT have escaped it and would have the likely "earliest" cases...
 
I had to keep it to myself until NOW as a "conspiracy theory", but I was talking to friends/colleagues in Cali in December that were suffering for 3 or 4 weeks with a "flu from hell"... Several of them elderly.. I don't think this a conspiracy anymore since the "miraculous success" in Cali in containing it didn't involve any genius measures that weren't taken elsewhere.. Pretty sure Cali could NOT have escaped it and would have the likely "earliest" cases...

Following that conspiracy theory:

* Assume a measly 5 cases in mid-December.

* Assume a (fairly low) rate of doubling (without mitigation) every 4 days.

From mid-December to mid-March, when widespread mitigation started, that's 90 days.

At the doubling rate assumed above, that doubling would happen about 22 times.

5 * 2²² = ?

I'll tell you: That would be 21 million infected. At least 10% of these hospitalized (2 million), and at least 1% dying (200k): Where and when did that happen, and how and where did they hide them?
 
So you think every single one is lying.
Not one of the options I listed was "lying". So i can say I don't think any of them are lying at all, and my response still stands, in its entirety. Goddamn, you're like a child. This is pointless.

If you won't put on your big boy pants for me, put them on for yourself and read this:

So aside from 100s of testimonials? Again if your loved one was very ill with the COVID-19 would you ask the MD to use it. Yes or no? I 100% would.

No, the indications are that hydroxychloroquine will make it easier for COVID-19 to start an infection if you do not already have one. In fact, hydroxychloroquine is only good if you already have pneumonia, and your immune system is attacking your lungs.
So only a doctor can tell if it will be helpful or harmful in each case.
Ummm, no. Chloroquine inhibits the virus’ ability to replicate itself.

No, that is not true. That is a guess based on using hydroxychloroquine as a transport mechanism to carry zine or other things into cells, to make them more akaline or otherwise less conducive to virus replication. Nothing totally stops virus replication, and anything interfering with virus replication also is harmful to the human cells as well.
Didn’t say it totally stops it. It disrupts and inhibits it.

The main thing that hydroxychloroquine does that is helpful, has nothing to do with the COVID-19 virus. After a person has pneumonia from COVID-19, then the immune systems starts to kill the perons by attacking the compromised lungs. So then hydroxychloroquine saves lives by suppressing the immune system. When it does this, it saves lives without any effect on the COVID-19 virus at all.
The secondary way hydroxychloroquine does slightly harm COVID-19 virus directly is to help transport drugs and zinc into individual cells, where virus reproduction can then be inhibited. But that is very risky, since anything that inhibits virus reproduction, will also be harming human cells to some degree.
Antimalarial medications are extremely safe and do not overtly suppress the immune system. Patients taking hydroxychloroquine and chloroquineshould be monitored by an ophthalmologist to screen for a very rare eye side effect called antimalarial retinopathy.


Like I said before chloroquine is an ionophore which transports zinc intercellularly where the zinc inhibits the rna replicase of the virus.

what you are arguing is incorrect.
 
I heard an interview with the beautiful governor of South Dakota on Glenn Beck today. She's starting tests today with hydroxychloroquine. 'bout time!

 
I heard an interview with the beautiful governor of South Dakota on Glenn Beck today. She's starting tests today with hydroxychloroquine. 'bout time!

Too bad for her, it doesn’t work
 
I heard an interview with the beautiful governor of South Dakota on Glenn Beck today. She's starting tests today with hydroxychloroquine. 'bout time!

Too bad for her, it doesn’t work
Too bad for you you're hostile to facts
 

Hydroxychloroquine, the 65-year-old malaria drug that President Donald Trump has praised, appeared not to help patients get rid of the pathogen in a small study.

The pill didn’t help patients clear the virus better than standard care and was much more likely to cause side effects, according to a study of 150 hospitalized patients by doctors at 16 centers in China
 
I had to keep it to myself until NOW as a "conspiracy theory", but I was talking to friends/colleagues in Cali in December that were suffering for 3 or 4 weeks with a "flu from hell"... Several of them elderly.. I don't think this a conspiracy anymore since the "miraculous success" in Cali in containing it didn't involve any genius measures that weren't taken elsewhere.. Pretty sure Cali could NOT have escaped it and would have the likely "earliest" cases...

Following that conspiracy theory:

* Assume a measly 5 cases in mid-December.

* Assume a (fairly low) rate of doubling (without mitigation) every 4 days.

From mid-December to mid-March, when widespread mitigation started, that's 90 days.

At the doubling rate assumed above, that doubling would happen about 22 times.

5 * 2²² = ?

I'll tell you: That would be 21 million infected. At least 10% of these hospitalized (2 million), and at least 1% dying (200k): Where and when did that happen, and how and where did they hide them?

Your numbers are all wrong.
Any particular outbreak has some similarities to previous outbreaks, so some number of people will have a natural immunity.
So you can not easily calculate how many will be infected, how many will have such low grade that they will be asymptomatic, how many actually had it but thought it was flu or a cold, etc.
 

Hydroxychloroquine, the 65-year-old malaria drug that President Donald Trump has praised, appeared not to help patients get rid of the pathogen in a small study.

The pill didn’t help patients clear the virus better than standard care and was much more likely to cause side effects, according to a study of 150 hospitalized patients by doctors at 16 centers in China
Msn
MSN is not the source, ya lazy bum.
 
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So you think every single one is lying.
Not one of the options I listed was "lying". So i can say I don't think any of them are lying at all, and my response still stands, in its entirety. Goddamn, you're like a child. This is pointless.

If you won't put on your big boy pants for me, put them on for yourself and read this:

So aside from 100s of testimonials? Again if your loved one was very ill with the COVID-19 would you ask the MD to use it. Yes or no? I 100% would.

No, the indications are that hydroxychloroquine will make it easier for COVID-19 to start an infection if you do not already have one. In fact, hydroxychloroquine is only good if you already have pneumonia, and your immune system is attacking your lungs.
So only a doctor can tell if it will be helpful or harmful in each case.
Ummm, no. Chloroquine inhibits the virus’ ability to replicate itself.

No, that is not true. That is a guess based on using hydroxychloroquine as a transport mechanism to carry zine or other things into cells, to make them more akaline or otherwise less conducive to virus replication. Nothing totally stops virus replication, and anything interfering with virus replication also is harmful to the human cells as well.
Didn’t say it totally stops it. It disrupts and inhibits it.

The main thing that hydroxychloroquine does that is helpful, has nothing to do with the COVID-19 virus. After a person has pneumonia from COVID-19, then the immune systems starts to kill the perons by attacking the compromised lungs. So then hydroxychloroquine saves lives by suppressing the immune system. When it does this, it saves lives without any effect on the COVID-19 virus at all.
The secondary way hydroxychloroquine does slightly harm COVID-19 virus directly is to help transport drugs and zinc into individual cells, where virus reproduction can then be inhibited. But that is very risky, since anything that inhibits virus reproduction, will also be harming human cells to some degree.
Antimalarial medications are extremely safe and do not overtly suppress the immune system. Patients taking hydroxychloroquine and chloroquineshould be monitored by an ophthalmologist to screen for a very rare eye side effect called antimalarial retinopathy.


Like I said before chloroquine is an ionophore which transports zinc intercellularly where the zinc inhibits the rna replicase of the virus.

what you are arguing is incorrect.

No what you are saying is totally and completely incorrect.
The whole point of hydroxychloroquine is entirely to suppress an over active immune system.
That is ALWAYS what it is prescribed for and is only what it does.
That is why it is given to malaria patients, to bring down their fever.
That is why it is given to lupus patients, where the immune system is the culprit.
That is whey it is given to arthritic patients, where it is the immune system doing the damage.

There are lot of other better treatments to help get things like zinc through cell membranes, and hydroxychloroquine should not be used for that. That is because hydroxychloroquine will have the side effect of increasing a slight case of COVID-19.
This should be obvious to anyone because if zinc were to interfere with RNA replication inside a cell, then it would also interfere with all cellular RNA and DNA activities, such as the production of necessary enzymes, reproduction, etc.

As for malaria treatment, when hydroxychloroquine is used as an ionophore, it is to KILL the targeted cell. It is to pump zinc into invading parasitic infestation. It is not what you want to ever do to human cells, as it is fatal. It just so happens that malaria parasites are very susceptible to it. But human cells are not. So it should not be used on human cells, is WAY too dangerous, and ineffective.
 
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since the "miraculous success" in Cali in containing it didn't involve any genius measures that weren't taken elsewhere.
And in nearly all of those "elsewhere" places, the results have been about the same as cali. You're just kind of vomiting a stream of consciousness at this point.
 
Following that conspiracy theory:

* Assume a measly 5 cases in mid-December.

* Assume a (fairly low) rate of doubling (without mitigation) every 4 days.

From mid-December to mid-March, when widespread mitigation started, that's 90 days.

At the doubling rate assumed above, that doubling would happen about 22 times.

5 * 2²² = ?

I'll tell you: That would be 21 million infected. At least 10% of these hospitalized (2 million), and at least 1% dying (200k): Where and when did that happen, and how and where did they hide them?

Your numbers are all wrong.
Any particular outbreak has some similarities to previous outbreaks, so some number of people will have a natural immunity.
So you can not easily calculate how many will be infected, how many will have such low grade that they will be asymptomatic, how many actually had it but thought it was flu or a cold, etc.

Either you haven't understood what this sub-thread is about, or I didn't. I took Flac talking about "flu from hell" to mean early, undetected cases of Coronavirus. That's what I tried to model. Or, you still think some people had (a partial) immunity to Corona. This isn't the case. No one, before this outbreak, had immunity.

Anyway, what we've seen in this Corona-outbreak was a doubling of cases every 2.5 to three days. This staggering rate may have been caused by the spread, and ramped up testing on top of that. That's why I assumed a four-days doubling period.

Finally, of course my numbers are "wrong" since reality doesn't meticulously follow simplistic models, but that misses the point completely: The argument is, pretty much no matter the preliminary assumptions and the numbers going with them, if there were just a handful of cases of Corona in California last December, by now the number of infected would have to be so enormous as to boggle the mind. We don't however see any indication thereof. And that is why that particular conspiracy theory is complete bunk.
 
I had to keep it to myself until NOW as a "conspiracy theory", but I was talking to friends/colleagues in Cali in December that were suffering for 3 or 4 weeks with a "flu from hell"... Several of them elderly.. I don't think this a conspiracy anymore since the "miraculous success" in Cali in containing it didn't involve any genius measures that weren't taken elsewhere.. Pretty sure Cali could NOT have escaped it and would have the likely "earliest" cases...

Following that conspiracy theory:

* Assume a measly 5 cases in mid-December.

* Assume a (fairly low) rate of doubling (without mitigation) every 4 days.

From mid-December to mid-March, when widespread mitigation started, that's 90 days.

At the doubling rate assumed above, that doubling would happen about 22 times.

5 * 2²² = ?

I'll tell you: That would be 21 million infected. At least 10% of these hospitalized (2 million), and at least 1% dying (200k): Where and when did that happen, and how and where did they hide them?

Numbers will be available soon... Realize that the NORMAL flu season wound DOWN in just February -- so most of these case in Dec - Jan would have been misdiagnosed and HIDDEN under the "normal flu season" stats...

As I said -- I kept this to myself UNTIL the speculation was hitting the press.. Catch up here with a story in the LA Times from 11 April...


But Smith on Friday said data collected by the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, local health departments and others suggest it was “a lot longer than we first believed” — most likely since “back in December.”

“This wasn’t recognized because we were having a severe flu season,” Smith said in an interview. “Symptoms are very much like the flu. If you got a mild case of COVID, you didn’t really notice. You didn’t even go to the doctor. The doctor maybe didn’t even do it because they presumed it was the flu.”


You'll realize eventually that I dont make shit up out of thin air...
 
I heard an interview with the beautiful governor of South Dakota on Glenn Beck today. She's starting tests today with hydroxychloroquine. 'bout time!

Too bad for her, it doesn’t work

6200 doctors worldwide reported that it DID... I've posted that link about dozen times times now... 74% of doctors treating Covid in Spain reported they USED HCQ, More than 1/2 in France.. Rated it the MOST effective treatment that had to offer out of a choice of 12 drugs...

You're not gonna get absolute numbers out of this for a year or more... There's NO TIME to produce "blind studies" and IF THEY DID -- it would be immoral to use these desperate patients by NOT TELLING them if they were getting treatment or a placebo....
 
since the "miraculous success" in Cali in containing it didn't involve any genius measures that weren't taken elsewhere.
And in nearly all of those "elsewhere" places, the results have been about the same as cali. You're just kind of vomiting a stream of consciousness at this point.

Not at all... In fact -- you're WAAAAAY behind on this as well... Check my previous post from today... The LA TIMES is now "vomiting" my "conspiracy theory"... That FCT "intuition checker" is working just fine..

And CALI LARGELY DODGED the covid "spike" because it got it BURIED in the "normal flu season" reports and probably misdiagnosed in Dec and Jan... Goodly chance THEY were 1st to get hit... Not Wash state...
 
Fun stat for you trogldytes that still are pushing how DANGEROUS HCQuine is... Looked up the worldwide PRODUCTION numbers on the drug... Fun facts....

From the Wiki..

Hydroxychloroquine was approved for medical use in the United States in 1955.[2] It is on the

World Health Organization's List of Essential Medicines, the safest and most effective

medicines needed in a health system.[7] In 2017, it was the 128th most commonly prescribed

medication in the United States, with more than five million prescriptions.[8][9]



-times-capacity-to-meet-demand/story/400419.html

Key Highlights

Pharma companies to increase production capacity by 5-6 times to 70 MT per month

************************************

Means Hydroxycloroquine NORMAL production was 10 METRIC TONS per month....
 
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