I don't understand why republicans reject both a minimum wage hike and welfare for the poor

[Marxist]

The republicans can care less about the working people, both parties can care less, although one party is throwing out scraps..

 

[RKMBrown]

The republicans can care less about the working people, both parties can care less, although one party is throwing out scraps..

What a moron. The republicans are working people ya dumb ass.

 

[paulitician]

The Big Government vs. Small Government debate is dead. We're gonna be Big Government. Both the Neocons and Communists/Progressives want it. Big Government is only getting bigger. So now the only battle is over who will be the beneficiaries of the massive spending. A war over the scraps.

So there's no point engaging in a debate that no longer even exists. My Libertarian/Conservative warrior friends have lost. Sadly, it's time to accept that.

Voting over the warden isn't being free and frankly it's pretty pointless. And no, just beause you love government and want lots of it doesn't mean I have to accept that.

A great book you should read is Harry Browne, How I found Freedom in an Unfree World. I don't agree with everything he says, but it's a great way to look at it. You go ahead and vote for the warden you want though.

BTW, Harry Browne is a libertarian, don't want to shock you or anything since you've invested your manhood in your government slave master

I truly respect people like Ron Paul. He's an honorable Libertarian/Conservative warrior. But it's over. The war is lost. He's engaging in a debate that no longer even exists. There is no more Big Government vs. Small Government debate. It's been settled. We are and always will be Big Government.

Too many depend on Big Brother for survival. The only argument and conflict left, is over who or what will get the cash. Because the cash is gonna be spent. That's for sure. So who or what is gonna get it, is the only question now. A bitter squabble over Big Brother's scraps. And that's that.

So now you've decided to root for it? What a terrible solution. I guess you just want to be on the winning side.

Personally I just think you're another hack authoritarian leftists and this has nothing to do with it. You want the minimum wage higher which only serves to harm people and take away their freedom to work for whoever they want, that isn't accepting big government, that's embracing it

Rooting or not rooting for it is irrelevant. There is no more Big Government vs. Small Government debate. Ron Paul and others are engaging in a debate that doesn't even exist anymore. We are and always will be Big Government. It's time to accept that. I have. Now it's just a matter of who or what is gonna get the cash. That's what all the future squabbles will be about.

You like endlessly repeating the same point, don't you? I'm not interested in accepting my destruction as you do whether it is inevitable or not. And I'm certainly not going to embrace it as you do

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government. In fact, it's gonna get much bigger. There is no going back. I'm not embracing it, i'm just accepting reality.

 

[kaz]

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government

Oxymoron

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government. In fact, it's gonna get much bigger. There is no going back. I'm not embracing it, i'm just accepting reality.

You are fighting for it, that is embracing it

 

[paulitician]

The Big Government vs. Small Government debate is dead. We're gonna be Big Government. Both the Neocons and Communists/Progressives want it. Big Government is only getting bigger. So now the only battle is over who will be the beneficiaries of the massive spending. A war over the scraps.

So there's no point engaging in a debate that no longer even exists. My Libertarian/Conservative warrior friends have lost. Sadly, it's time to accept that.

Voting over the warden isn't being free and frankly it's pretty pointless. And no, just beause you love government and want lots of it doesn't mean I have to accept that.

A great book you should read is Harry Browne, How I found Freedom in an Unfree World. I don't agree with everything he says, but it's a great way to look at it. You go ahead and vote for the warden you want though.

BTW, Harry Browne is a libertarian, don't want to shock you or anything since you've invested your manhood in your government slave master

I truly respect people like Ron Paul. He's an honorable Libertarian/Conservative warrior. But it's over. The war is lost. He's engaging in a debate that no longer even exists. There is no more Big Government vs. Small Government debate. It's been settled. We are and always will be Big Government.

Too many depend on Big Brother for survival. The only argument and conflict left, is over who or what will get the cash. Because the cash is gonna be spent. That's for sure. So who or what is gonna get it, is the only question now. A bitter squabble over Big Brother's scraps. And that's that.

So now you've decided to root for it? What a terrible solution. I guess you just want to be on the winning side.

Personally I just think you're another hack authoritarian leftists and this has nothing to do with it. You want the minimum wage higher which only serves to harm people and take away their freedom to work for whoever they want, that isn't accepting big government, that's embracing it

Rooting or not rooting for it is irrelevant. There is no more Big Government vs. Small Government debate. Ron Paul and others are engaging in a debate that doesn't even exist anymore. We are and always will be Big Government. It's time to accept that. I have. Now it's just a matter of who or what is gonna get the cash. That's what all the future squabbles will be about.

I appreciate your candor. But know this: you're the problem. It's you, and people who think like you, who are pissing away what's left of our soul as a nation.

People like me fought for less Government for many years. And trust me, we took plenty of hateful shit from both Neocons and Communists/Progressives. But at some point, you have to realize the War is lost. The Big Government vs. Small Government debate is dead. The Big Government mob won. It's been settled. We're not gonna suddenly go back and become Small Government. That's just not gonna happen. Because in the end, both parties love the power and control. Neither will relinquish it.

But i'm not giving up. I didn't mean to give that impression. I'm just accepting the reality. So i'm no longer gonna engage in Big Government vs. Small Government debate. It's a tiresome 'I wish the old days would come back' waste of time. The old days are never coming back. So now it's time to get involved with how and who gets the massive spending. And for me, i'm ok with struggling Workers getting a piece. Why not?

 

[kaz]

Voting over the warden isn't being free and frankly it's pretty pointless. And no, just beause you love government and want lots of it doesn't mean I have to accept that.

A great book you should read is Harry Browne, How I found Freedom in an Unfree World. I don't agree with everything he says, but it's a great way to look at it. You go ahead and vote for the warden you want though.

BTW, Harry Browne is a libertarian, don't want to shock you or anything since you've invested your manhood in your government slave master

I truly respect people like Ron Paul. He's an honorable Libertarian/Conservative warrior. But it's over. The war is lost. He's engaging in a debate that no longer even exists. There is no more Big Government vs. Small Government debate. It's been settled. We are and always will be Big Government.

Too many depend on Big Brother for survival. The only argument and conflict left, is over who or what will get the cash. Because the cash is gonna be spent. That's for sure. So who or what is gonna get it, is the only question now. A bitter squabble over Big Brother's scraps. And that's that.

So now you've decided to root for it? What a terrible solution. I guess you just want to be on the winning side.

Personally I just think you're another hack authoritarian leftists and this has nothing to do with it. You want the minimum wage higher which only serves to harm people and take away their freedom to work for whoever they want, that isn't accepting big government, that's embracing it

Rooting or not rooting for it is irrelevant. There is no more Big Government vs. Small Government debate. Ron Paul and others are engaging in a debate that doesn't even exist anymore. We are and always will be Big Government. It's time to accept that. I have. Now it's just a matter of who or what is gonna get the cash. That's what all the future squabbles will be about.

I appreciate your candor. But know this: you're the problem. It's you, and people who think like you, who are pissing away what's left of our soul as a nation.

People like me fought for less Government and for many years. And trust me, we took plenty of hateful shit from both Neocons and Communists/Progressives. But at some point, you have to realize the War is lost. The Big Government vs. Small Government debate is dead. The Big Government mob won. It's been settled. We're not gonna suddenly go back and become Small Government. That's just not gonna happen. Because in the end, both parties love the power and control. Neither will relinquish it.

But i'm not giving up. I'm just accepting the reality. So i'm no longer gonna engage in Big Government vs. Small Government debate. It's a tiresome 'I wish the old days would come back' waste of time. The old days are never coming back. So now it's time to get involved with how and who gets the massive spending. And for me, i'm ok with struggling Workers getting a piece. Why not?

This thread is about you embracing it. You want to screw poor people in the name of big government. You want a bunch of people fired because government says so for zero benefit for anyone. It doesn't get any more embracing than that

 

[paulitician]

The battle for small Government is over. It's not just a losing battle, it's a battle that no longer even exists. Big Government is only getting bigger. So i don't even bother engaging in that debate anymore. Everyone's got their hand out. So why not struggling American Workers? In this Big Government mess, everyone's just gonna have to try and get theirs. That's what it's all about now. It is what it is.

You don't engage in that debate anymore because you are an authoritarian leftist like the rest of the idiot Democrats who don't want to take care of their own problems

The Big Government vs. Small Government debate is dead. We're gonna be Big Government. Both the Neocons and Communists/Progressives want it. Big Government is only getting bigger. So now the only battle is over who will be the beneficiaries of the massive spending. A war over the scraps.

So there's no point engaging in a debate that no longer even exists. My Libertarian/Conservative warrior friends have lost. Sadly, it's time to accept that.

Voting over the warden isn't being free and frankly it's pretty pointless. And no, just beause you love government and want lots of it doesn't mean I have to accept that.

A great book you should read is Harry Browne, How I found Freedom in an Unfree World. I don't agree with everything he says, but it's a great way to look at it. You go ahead and vote for the warden you want though.

BTW, Harry Browne is a libertarian, don't want to shock you or anything since you've invested your manhood in your government slave master

I truly respect people like Ron Paul. He's an honorable Libertarian/Conservative warrior. But it's over. The war is lost. He's engaging in a debate that no longer even exists. There is no more Big Government vs. Small Government debate. It's been settled. We are and always will be Big Government.

Too many depend on Big Brother for survival. The only argument and conflict left, is over who or what will get the cash. Because the cash is gonna be spent. That's for sure. So who or what is gonna get it, is the only question now. A bitter squabble over Big Brother's scraps. And that's that.

You're a moron. Nothing is over.

Debating Big Government vs. Small Government is like debating whether or not the old days will ever come back. Well, guess what? The old days are never coming back and Big Government is here to stay. Now it's time to get more involved with who and what gets the massive spending. That's where i'm going now. And i'm ok on this one. I enjoy seeing struggling American Workers catching a break. It sure doesn't happen very often. I'm good with them getting their piece.

 

[paulitician]

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government

Oxymoron

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government. In fact, it's gonna get much bigger. There is no going back. I'm not embracing it, i'm just accepting reality.

You are fighting for it, that is embracing it

I'm gonna fight for those i think really need the help. Because the money's gonna get spent. That's for sure. You should just to accept that and get past it. So, struggling Workers getting their piece? Sure, why not?

 

[dblack]

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government

Oxymoron

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government. In fact, it's gonna get much bigger. There is no going back. I'm not embracing it, i'm just accepting reality.

You are fighting for it, that is embracing it

I'm gonna fight for those i think really need the help. Because the money's gonna get spent. That's for sure. You should just to accept that and get past it. So, struggling Workers getting their piece? Sure, why not?

I understand what you're saying and, while I might not agree, I could at least have sympathy for your view if minimum wage laws actually did help people. Many other welfare state policies do help people, even if they may be bad for society as a whole, and I can see standing up for those in the face of all the other state corruption going on. I also agree that there's nothing more repulsive than the judgmental view of many conservatives that poor people "deserve" whatever suffering they experience.

But minimum wage laws are pablum - phony crap to sucker the dummies. They don't help workers, they simply make low wage jobs illegal.

 

[Marxist]

The republicans can care less about the working people, both parties can care less, although one party is throwing out scraps..

What a moron. The republicans are working people ya dumb ass.

Yeah, they're definitely the labor..

 

[kaz]

You're a moron. Nothing is over.

Debating Big Government vs. Small Government is like debating whether or not the old days will ever come back. Well, guess what? The old days are never coming back and Big Government is here to stay. Now it's time to get more involved with who and what gets the massive spending. That's where i'm going now. And i'm ok on this one. I enjoy seeing struggling American Workers catching a break. It sure doesn't happen very often. I'm good with them getting their piece.

Getting everyone fired not worth an arbitrary salary is helping them "catch a break?" You mean because they don't have to work on welfare?

 

[kaz]

I'm gonna fight for those i think really need the help. Because the money's gonna get spent. That's for sure. You should just to accept that and get past it. So, struggling Workers getting their piece? Sure, why not?

Of course, workers are too stupid to know they shouldn't take a job that doesn't pay what you consider enough, so you are helping them by removing their choice because of course you know better than they do to how to run their own lives.

Your view that companies will pay the same workers more is just more of your government loving delusion. You're accepting reality my ass, you're just another run of the mill arrogant leftist who knows more than everyone about everything so you think government should force everyone to do it your way

 

[kaz]

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government

Oxymoron

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government. In fact, it's gonna get much bigger. There is no going back. I'm not embracing it, i'm just accepting reality.

You are fighting for it, that is embracing it

I'm gonna fight for those i think really need the help. Because the money's gonna get spent. That's for sure. You should just to accept that and get past it. So, struggling Workers getting their piece? Sure, why not?

I understand what you're saying and, while I might not agree, I could at least have sympathy for your view if minimum wage laws actually did help people. Many other welfare state policies do help people, even if they may be bad for society as a whole, and I can see standing up for those in the face of all the other state corruption going on. I also agree that there's nothing more repulsive than the judgmental view of many conservatives that poor people "deserve" whatever suffering they experience.

But minimum wage laws are pablum - phony crap to sucker the dummies. They don't help workers, they simply make low wage jobs illegal.

Well put. Libertarianism isn't about the strawman we don't want government to help people, it's about the reality that it doesn't. And as you said, even in narrow cases where it helps individuals, it does more overall harm than good

 

[paulitician]

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government

Oxymoron

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government. In fact, it's gonna get much bigger. There is no going back. I'm not embracing it, i'm just accepting reality.

You are fighting for it, that is embracing it

I'm gonna fight for those i think really need the help. Because the money's gonna get spent. That's for sure. You should just to accept that and get past it. So, struggling Workers getting their piece? Sure, why not?

I understand what you're saying and, while I might not agree, I could at least have sympathy for your view if minimum wage laws actually did help people. Many other welfare state policies do help people, even if they may be bad for society as a whole, and I can see standing up for those in the face of all the other state corruption going on. I also agree that there's nothing more repulsive than the judgmental view of many conservatives that poor people "deserve" whatever suffering they experience.

But minimum wage laws are pablum - phony crap to sucker the dummies. They don't help workers, they simply make low wage jobs illegal.

That's cool. You're entitled to your opinion. But someone currently making $7hr is gonna be very happy now making $9/$11hr. I assure you, they see it much differently than you do.

 

[paulitician]

You're a moron. Nothing is over.

Debating Big Government vs. Small Government is like debating whether or not the old days will ever come back. Well, guess what? The old days are never coming back and Big Government is here to stay. Now it's time to get more involved with who and what gets the massive spending. That's where i'm going now. And i'm ok on this one. I enjoy seeing struggling American Workers catching a break. It sure doesn't happen very often. I'm good with them getting their piece.

Getting everyone fired not worth an arbitrary salary is helping them "catch a break?" You mean because they don't have to work on welfare?

Nah, that's just greedy old fat ass 'Sky is Falling' Bullshite. 'Everyone' won't be fired. Trust me, it ain't gonna happen.

 

[paulitician]

I'm gonna fight for those i think really need the help. Because the money's gonna get spent. That's for sure. You should just to accept that and get past it. So, struggling Workers getting their piece? Sure, why not?

Of course, workers are too stupid to know they shouldn't take a job that doesn't pay what you consider enough, so you are helping them by removing their choice because of course you know better than they do to how to run their own lives.

Your view that companies will pay the same workers more is just more of your government loving delusion. You're accepting reality my ass, you're just another run of the mill arrogant leftist who knows more than everyone about everything so you think government should force everyone to do it your way

It has nothing to do with loving Government or not. You're still just living the fantasy that 'Small Government' is possible. One day you'll have to get past that. Big Government is here to stay.

So who or what will be the beneficiaries of the massive spending? That's the only question now. Personally, i'm good with American Workers getting a piece. Why not?

 

[paulitician]

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government

Oxymoron

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government. In fact, it's gonna get much bigger. There is no going back. I'm not embracing it, i'm just accepting reality.

You are fighting for it, that is embracing it

I'm gonna fight for those i think really need the help. Because the money's gonna get spent. That's for sure. You should just to accept that and get past it. So, struggling Workers getting their piece? Sure, why not?

I understand what you're saying and, while I might not agree, I could at least have sympathy for your view if minimum wage laws actually did help people. Many other welfare state policies do help people, even if they may be bad for society as a whole, and I can see standing up for those in the face of all the other state corruption going on. I also agree that there's nothing more repulsive than the judgmental view of many conservatives that poor people "deserve" whatever suffering they experience.

But minimum wage laws are pablum - phony crap to sucker the dummies. They don't help workers, they simply make low wage jobs illegal.

Well put. Libertarianism isn't about the strawman we don't want government to help people, it's about the reality that it doesn't. And as you said, even in narrow cases where it helps individuals, it does more overall harm than good

Libertarianism is a fantasy that will never be reality. You're just banging your head against a wall ranting about 'Small Government' Libertarianism. It just ain't gonna happen. Too many are dependent on Big Government. It is what it is.

 

[The Rabbi]

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government

Oxymoron

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government. In fact, it's gonna get much bigger. There is no going back. I'm not embracing it, i'm just accepting reality.

You are fighting for it, that is embracing it

I'm gonna fight for those i think really need the help. Because the money's gonna get spent. That's for sure. You should just to accept that and get past it. So, struggling Workers getting their piece? Sure, why not?

I understand what you're saying and, while I might not agree, I could at least have sympathy for your view if minimum wage laws actually did help people. Many other welfare state policies do help people, even if they may be bad for society as a whole, and I can see standing up for those in the face of all the other state corruption going on. I also agree that there's nothing more repulsive than the judgmental view of many conservatives that poor people "deserve" whatever suffering they experience.

But minimum wage laws are pablum - phony crap to sucker the dummies. They don't help workers, they simply make low wage jobs illegal.

That's cool. You're entitled to your opinion. But someone currently making $7hr is gonna be very happy now making $9/$11hr. I assure you, they see it much differently than you do.

How happy are they going to be when they're laid off?
Libs are bad at thought.

 

[dblack]

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government

Oxymoron

Never said you should accept 'destruction.' I said you should accept that we are and always will be Big Government. In fact, it's gonna get much bigger. There is no going back. I'm not embracing it, i'm just accepting reality.

You are fighting for it, that is embracing it

I'm gonna fight for those i think really need the help. Because the money's gonna get spent. That's for sure. You should just to accept that and get past it. So, struggling Workers getting their piece? Sure, why not?

I understand what you're saying and, while I might not agree, I could at least have sympathy for your view if minimum wage laws actually did help people. Many other welfare state policies do help people, even if they may be bad for society as a whole, and I can see standing up for those in the face of all the other state corruption going on. I also agree that there's nothing more repulsive than the judgmental view of many conservatives that poor people "deserve" whatever suffering they experience.

But minimum wage laws are pablum - phony crap to sucker the dummies. They don't help workers, they simply make low wage jobs illegal.

That's cool. You're entitled to your opinion. But someone currently making $7hr is gonna be very happy now making $9/$11hr. I assure you, they see it much differently than you do.

And someone who can't convince someone to pay them $9/$11hr, but could get work at $7hr, is going to be out of luck. And they will see it differently than you do.

 

[dblack]

Let me ask you this, paulitician. Do you think people should be allowed to volunteer? To work for free?