If God doesn't exist...

[zaangalewa]

... Adam and Eve supposedly had two MALE children, Cain and Abel. How in the world did they make any babies? The whole concept of religion is for screwballs.

Specially because Cain murdered Abel so god made later a mark on him to show to everyone that no one had any right to punish Cain? ... Oh by the way: In the middle ages the people learned first something and afterwards they had an opinion. The people today seem to have an opinion independent from any truth (logos) or reality (creation) but with an extraordinary high darwinistic (ideological) will to kill everyone else who shares not the own stupidities.

Oh that explains it. Lol

Oh by the way: What says this, what you think what the theory of evolution could be, about the survival of idiots? To remember: The eldest tribe of mankind which lives meanwhile since thousands of years in the same tradition are Jews.

 

[Boss]

There is no God, until proven otherwise. Thread closed.

Let's break down what you are really saying... Until someone proves God to you, who has committed to not believing in God regardless, then God doesn't exist and all subsequent debate is meaningless.

And let's distill that further... You are a closed minded intolerant when it comes to God. You are prepared to reject any and all arguments for God or to objectively evaluate any evidence to suggest a God. The only way possible for you to ever believe in the existence of God is if someone captures you and, against your will, brainwashes you into such a belief.

And really, it's that simple. We can talk for days, weeks, months or years... we can present all kinds of arguments but you're never going to listen or pay attention because your mind is a steel trap... it cannot be changed on this subject.

Now... you will say, "Boss, how can you make such assumptions and judgments on me?" And it's because of my profound wisdom and understanding of the human condition. For example, I realize that this thing we call "PROOF" is a subjective thing which depends solely on perspectives of the individual. PROOF is something which convinces you that evidence is true. Since you believe no evidence can be true when it pertains to something you don't believe in, then nothing will ever suffice as proof.

Here's an analogy... Pretend I am a tribal chief living in an isolated African jungle far away from modern civilization.... I believe the Sun is raised and lowered in the sky by a God and the rain is a blessing showered down by a God... You encounter me, and armed with your modern science books and technology, attempt to show me the truth.... Well, it's all foreign to me. I simply cannot comprehend your books or your scientific explanations. You can talk to me for days, weeks, months, years... it won't matter because my father and his father believed the Sun God was real and that's what I am going to believe as well. You cannot "PROVE" something to me that I am not willing to accept... it's not PROOF to me.

 

[Mudda]

There is no God, until proven otherwise. Thread closed.

Let's break down what you are really saying... Until someone proves God to you, who has committed to not believing in God regardless, then God doesn't exist and all subsequent debate is meaningless.

And let's distill that further... You are a closed minded intolerant when it comes to God. You are prepared to reject any and all arguments for God or to objectively evaluate any evidence to suggest a God. The only way possible for you to ever believe in the existence of God is if someone captures you and, against your will, brainwashes you into such a belief.

And really, it's that simple. We can talk for days, weeks, months or years... we can present all kinds of arguments but you're never going to listen or pay attention because your mind is a steel trap... it cannot be changed on this subject.

Now... you will say, "Boss, how can you make such assumptions and judgments on me?" And it's because of my profound wisdom and understanding of the human condition. For example, I realize that this thing we call "PROOF" is a subjective thing which depends solely on perspectives of the individual. PROOF is something which convinces you that evidence is true. Since you believe no evidence can be true when it pertains to something you don't believe in, then nothing will ever suffice as proof.

Here's an analogy... Pretend I am a tribal chief living in an isolated African jungle far away from modern civilization.... I believe the Sun is raised and lowered in the sky by a God and the rain is a blessing showered down by a God... You encounter me, and armed with your modern science books and technology, attempt to show me the truth.... Well, it's all foreign to me. I simply cannot comprehend your books or your scientific explanations. You can talk to me for days, weeks, months, years... it won't matter because my father and his father believed the Sun God was real and that's what I am going to believe as well. You cannot "PROVE" something to me that I am not willing to accept... it's not PROOF to me.

I don't read long winded fartsmoke, if you can't make your point in four or five lines, then you have nothing to start with.
Here, I'll throw you a bone, if you can prove God, I'll admit that God exists. Can't be any fairer than that.

 

[ChrisL]

Unless of course they had sex with their MOM.

Nice way to say Cain and Abel were motherfuckers and to express in this way your deep hate against the so called abrahamitic religions. And now travel somewhere into the world - for example on a market place somewhere in Pakistan and write on a shield "I am an US-American" and "Abel - the son of Eve, the mother of all mankind - was a motherfucker".

Well, how did they have children? Adam and Eve were the first people. They had two SONS. So explain that, little strange one.

And again, you cannot "hate" what you don't think exists.

 

[hobelim]

Well, how did they have children? Adam and Eve were the first people. They had two SONS. So explain that, little strange one.

while everyone is waiting for a strange reply and another strange music video I can tell you that obvious contradictions that inspire rational questions like yours were deliberately placed in the story like a giant X on a treasure map that marks a place where something of great value is buried and hidden.

Thats what Jesus meant by saying that you must become like a little child again. One has to read the stories as if they were fairy tales that convey a hidden sublime teaching for children.

 

[ChrisL]

Well, how did they have children? Adam and Eve were the first people. They had two SONS. So explain that, little strange one.

while everyone is waiting for a strange reply and another strange music video I can tell you that obvious contradictions that inspire rational questions like yours were deliberately placed in the story like a giant X on a treasure map that marks a place where something of great value is buried and hidden.

Thats what Jesus meant by saying that you must become like a little child again. One has to read the stories as if they were fairy tales that convey a hidden sublime teaching for children.

The point being that religion doesn't really make sense unless you live in a "fairy tale." It is full of contradictions, and was obviously a book written by men who were ignorant of the world around them thousands of years ago. None of it is "real."

 

[hobelim]

Well, how did they have children? Adam and Eve were the first people. They had two SONS. So explain that, little strange one.

while everyone is waiting for a strange reply and another strange music video I can tell you that obvious contradictions that inspire rational questions like yours were deliberately placed in the story like a giant X on a treasure map that marks a place where something of great value is buried and hidden.

Thats what Jesus meant by saying that you must become like a little child again. One has to read the stories as if they were fairy tales that convey a hidden sublime teaching for children.

The point being that religion doesn't really make sense unless you live in a "fairy tale." It is full of contradictions, and was obviously a book written by men who were ignorant of the world around them thousands of years ago. None of it is "real."

Like I asked before, what type of imaginary mythological creature corresponds to a person who would claim that they could turn the living God into something that doesn't even qualify as a cheap snack food that will give eternal life to anyone who eats it for a mere 10% of their income or even a nominal service charge or minor donation?

Isn't that a perfect description of a talking serpent? I'm not making this stuff up.

You thought it was funny but you were in a church with someone saying and doing just that and this ain't no fairy tale and that creature was very real.

Don't you believe in what you have seen with your own eyes and have heard with your own ears?

 

[Boss]

Well, how did they have children? Adam and Eve were the first people. They had two SONS. So explain that, little strange one.

Misinterpretation. That's your explanation in a nutshell.

There were already other people in the world when God created Adam and Eve in his image. This is evident by the accounts of Cain being cast out to the land of Nod, where he took a wife. Nowhere does it say in the Bible that Cain and Able were Adam and Eve's only children. We don't know how many more they might have had. The story is presented to explain God's intervention with mankind. It is the point at which God intervened and gave man the awareness of God where it was absent before. So it's not actually the literal creation of the first man and woman, it's the first creation of man and woman in God's image. Other men and women already existed.

 

[ChrisL]

Well, how did they have children? Adam and Eve were the first people. They had two SONS. So explain that, little strange one.

while everyone is waiting for a strange reply and another strange music video I can tell you that obvious contradictions that inspire rational questions like yours were deliberately placed in the story like a giant X on a treasure map that marks a place where something of great value is buried and hidden.

Thats what Jesus meant by saying that you must become like a little child again. One has to read the stories as if they were fairy tales that convey a hidden sublime teaching for children.

The point being that religion doesn't really make sense unless you live in a "fairy tale." It is full of contradictions, and was obviously a book written by men who were ignorant of the world around them thousands of years ago. None of it is "real."

Like I asked before, what type of imaginary mythological creature corresponds to a person who would claim that they could turn the living God into something that doesn't even qualify as a cheap snack food that will give eternal life to anyone who eats it for a mere 10% of their income or even a nominal service charge or minor donation?

Isn't that a perfect description of a talking serpent? I'm not making this stuff up.

You thought it was funny but you were in a church with someone saying and doing just that and this ain't no fairy tale and that creature was very real.

Don't you believe in what you have seen with your own eyes and have heard with your own ears?

TBH, I think you are nuts. Lol.

 

[zaangalewa]

Unless of course they had sex with their MOM.

Nice way to say Cain and Abel were motherfuckers and to express in this way your deep hate against the so called abrahamitic religions. And now travel somewhere into the world - for example on a market place somewhere in Pakistan and write on a shield "I am an US-American" and "Abel - the son of Eve, the mother of all mankind - was a motherfucker".

Well, how did they have children? Adam and Eve were the first people. They had two SONS. So explain that, little strange one.

We are idiots?

And again, you cannot "hate" what you don't think exists.

I'm sure I could "hate" a not existing piece of cake, if I would be hungry. Are you hungry? Or do you just simple prefer to spit on everything what you don't like to know?



in the songtext is written a wrong sentence:
wrong sentence "... und sie kennt mein heißes Verlangen das Brennen erwacht ..."
Right sentence: "... und sie kennt mein heißes Verlangen das brennend erwacht ..."

 

[Boss]

I don't read long winded fartsmoke...

It doesn't matter because your mind is not going to ever be changed.

 

[hobelim]

TBH, I think you are nuts. Lol.

lol... sure, thats what they all say.

 

[ChrisL]

while everyone is waiting for a strange reply and another strange music video I can tell you that obvious contradictions that inspire rational questions like yours were deliberately placed in the story like a giant X on a treasure map that marks a place where something of great value is buried and hidden.

Thats what Jesus meant by saying that you must become like a little child again. One has to read the stories as if they were fairy tales that convey a hidden sublime teaching for children.

The point being that religion doesn't really make sense unless you live in a "fairy tale." It is full of contradictions, and was obviously a book written by men who were ignorant of the world around them thousands of years ago. None of it is "real."

Like I asked before, what type of imaginary mythological creature corresponds to a person who would claim that they could turn the living God into something that doesn't even qualify as a cheap snack food that will give eternal life to anyone who eats it for a mere 10% of their income or even a nominal service charge or minor donation?

Isn't that a perfect description of a talking serpent? I'm not making this stuff up.

You thought it was funny but you were in a church with someone saying and doing just that and this ain't no fairy tale and that creature was very real.

Don't you believe in what you have seen with your own eyes and have heard with your own ears?[/QUOTE]

TBH, I think you are nuts. Lol.[/QUOTE]


lol... sure, thats what they all say.[/QUOTE]

Well, I've never seen a talking serpent. Lol. I see PEOPLE who are brainwashed and ignorant perhaps.

 

[hobelim]

Well, I've never seen a talking serpent. Lol. I see PEOPLE who are brainwashed and ignorant perhaps.

Who do you think is doing the brainwashing of ignorant people if not a talking serpent? Can people who have had the misfortune of being deceived in this way be more accurately described than by saying that they are possessed by a devil?

Think about it. They claim to have the power to grant eternal life to those who do the exact opposite of what the God of the story promises results in life, exactly like the talking serpent of the fairy tale said that Adam and Eve could do the opposite of what God commands and they would not die. Once bitten many die and never recover.

It really does't require any intellectual effort at all to see in reality that which is described in fantastical tales with imaginative descriptions of PEOPLE that actually exist..

 

[ChrisL]

Well, I've never seen a talking serpent. Lol. I see PEOPLE who are brainwashed and ignorant perhaps.

Who do you think is doing the brainwashing of ignorant people if not a talking serpent?

Think about it. They claim to have the power to grant eternal life to those who do the exact opposite of what the God of the story promises results in life, exactly like the talking serpent of the fairy tale said that Adam and Eve could do the opposite of what God commands and they would not die.

It really does't require any intellectual effort at all to see in reality that which is described in fantastical tales with imaginative descriptions of PEOPLE that actually exist..

I think it's because they are ignorant people and they truly believe these fantastical stories. When something has been pounded into your head since the time you were born, and scare tactics that have been passed on from generation to generation . . . well, this is what you get. Same with Islam and most other religions. I think a lot of people who flock towards these types of beliefs have problems dealing with real life and that their lives are going to end someday too.

Of course no one can say for SURE whether there is some kind of "god figure or gods" as there is no evidence, and some people will cling to their beliefs because that is all they have in this life. Some of these people are actually suffering on the inside. I suppose that means I should be a bit nicer and more gentle in my approach, but I find them to be extremely annoying people.

 

[Boss]

Well, I've never seen a talking serpent. Lol. I see PEOPLE who are brainwashed and ignorant perhaps.

Do you not comprehend what an allegory is? Does it not register in your brain that way long ago, before we had moving pictures and CGI or special effects, the way people often told stories was through allegories? It was a way to portray a vivid image in order to make a more profound point because simple words weren't sufficient to explain the magnanimous message trying to be conveyed. There was never an actual snake who talked... it was symbolic. Presented in a way that conveyed a certain image in order to make the point. Why did da Vinci paint the Mona Lisa smiling but not showing her teeth? Was it because she was toothless, do you think? Or maybe it was because she was ashamed of her ugly teeth? OR.... maybe something more profound was being conveyed? We have to look deeper than the superficial, especially when it comes to things from distant times. We can't translate things into modern context and draw ignorant assumptions.

 

[hobelim]

Well, I've never seen a talking serpent. Lol. I see PEOPLE who are brainwashed and ignorant perhaps.

Who do you think is doing the brainwashing of ignorant people if not a talking serpent?

Think about it. They claim to have the power to grant eternal life to those who do the exact opposite of what the God of the story promises results in life, exactly like the talking serpent of the fairy tale said that Adam and Eve could do the opposite of what God commands and they would not die.

It really does't require any intellectual effort at all to see in reality that which is described in fantastical tales with imaginative descriptions of PEOPLE that actually exist..

I think it's because they are ignorant people and they truly believe these fantastical stories. When something has been pounded into your head since the time you were born, and scare tactics that have been passed on from generation to generation . . . well, this is what you get. Same with Islam and most other religions. I think a lot of people who flock towards these types of beliefs have problems dealing with real life and that their lives are going to end someday too.

Of course no one can say for SURE whether there is some kind of "god figure or gods" as there is no evidence, and some people will cling to their beliefs because that is all they have in this life. Some of these people are actually suffering on the inside. I suppose that means I should be a bit nicer and more gentle in my approach, but I find them to be extremely annoying people.

Don't get me wrong. I agree with you. I am just pointing out that these fantastical stories were never intended to be taken literally by intelligent people and anyone who would teach others that they are historical documents recording actual events that should be taken literally fits perfectly the detailed scriptural descriptions and imaginative figurative allusions to deceitful low-life people portrayed as brazenly deceitful talking serpents dressed up like enlightened beings who are always on the prowl for the gullible.

 

[ChrisL]

Well, I've never seen a talking serpent. Lol. I see PEOPLE who are brainwashed and ignorant perhaps.

Do you not comprehend what an allegory is? Does it not register in your brain that way long ago, before we had moving pictures and CGI or special effects, the way people often told stories was through allegories? It was a way to portray a vivid image in order to make a more profound point because simple words weren't sufficient to explain the magnanimous message trying to be conveyed. There was never an actual snake who talked... it was symbolic. Presented in a way that conveyed a certain image in order to make the point. Why did da Vinci paint the Mona Lisa smiling but not showing her teeth? Was it because she was toothless, do you think? Or maybe it was because she was ashamed of her ugly teeth? OR.... maybe something more profound was being conveyed? We have to look deeper than the superficial, especially when it comes to things from distant times. We can't translate things into modern context and draw ignorant assumptions.

Right, it's nothing more than a story book based on ancient beliefs. BUT, people back then certainly did attribute natural occurrences to acts of gods or a god back in the old days. That is because they did not understand how the world worked or science. So you are wrong.

 

[Boss]

Right, it's nothing more than a story book based on ancient beliefs. BUT, people back then certainly did attribute natural occurrences to acts of gods or a god back in the old days. That is because they did not understand how the world worked or science. So you are wrong.

Humans have ALWAYS done that and they still do that. Which is MY point... there's a reason humans do that and no other species does. We have it in our DNA... it's an inherent thing that makes us what we are. We are spiritually connected to something greater than ourselves.... we always have been and always will be. We can't simply pretend like that doesn't matter and it's all made up nonsense... that doesn't comport with rationality.

We are inspired by something to be more than what we are. We have the inspiration to learn and grow and expand on what we know. This stems from our spiritual awareness of something greater than ourselves. And yes... this spiritual awareness that we inherently have as humans often manifests itself into supernatural beliefs in things that aren't real... religions that are false... concocted notions by men who are grappling with their own spiritual understanding.

You can understand HOW science works all day long... do you know WHY science works? Why does a molecule of oxygen compel itself to bond with two molecules of hydrogen when it doesn't have to? If it didn't, we couldn't have water.... but it does... why? Why do certain atomic particles become electrically charged while others don't? What IS electricity? What IS light? We know what they do and how they work... but WHY? You see... there is nothing in the laws of physics which says it HAS to be that way, it just is. So while science is very useful at explaining HOW the universe works, it cannot explain WHY.

 

[ChrisL]

Right, it's nothing more than a story book based on ancient beliefs. BUT, people back then certainly did attribute natural occurrences to acts of gods or a god back in the old days. That is because they did not understand how the world worked or science. So you are wrong.

Humans have ALWAYS done that and they still do that. Which is MY point... there's a reason humans do that and no other species does. We have it in our DNA... it's an inherent thing that makes us what we are. We are spiritually connected to something greater than ourselves.... we always have been and always will be. We can't simply pretend like that doesn't matter and it's all made up nonsense... that doesn't comport with rationality.

We are inspired by something to be more than what we are. We have the inspiration to learn and grow and expand on what we know. This stems from our spiritual awareness of something greater than ourselves. And yes... this spiritual awareness that we inherently have as humans often manifests itself into supernatural beliefs in things that aren't real... religions that are false... concocted notions by men who are grappling with their own spiritual understanding.

You can understand HOW science works all day long... do you know WHY science works? Why does a molecule of oxygen compel itself to bond with two molecules of hydrogen when it doesn't have to? If it didn't, we couldn't have water.... but it does... why? Why do certain atomic particles become electrically charged while others don't? What IS electricity? What IS light? We know what they do and how they work... but WHY? You see... there is nothing in the laws of physics which says it HAS to be that way, it just is. So while science is very useful at explaining HOW the universe works, it cannot explain WHY.

That means nothing at all. Yes, we are natural "story tellers." We feel a need to explain that which we don't understand, such as labeling things as "good" and "evil." I've given you plenty of examples of things that people actually really did believe that have been proven to be false once they are better understood.