If God Doesn’t Exist

[Taz]

So if you discovered something, share it with science. Otherwise, you didn't discover squat.

Science deals with what is physical. Every time we have an emotion, a philosophy, or an insight should we run to science? Should we remain a one note people?

Emotions can be picked up by science. Philosophy is simply a bunch of opinions. An insight is something we deduce. All perfectly provable. Your invisible friend, not so much.

There are things that are outside the realm of science. That is what most atheists simply don't get. Science is just ONE way of discovering truth, not the only way.

For example, logic and mathematics cannot be proven by science, because science presupposes them. Morality and ethics are also outside the realm of science. There are other things as well.

Science only explains the physical world. There is so much more than just the physical. And personally I think it's a waste of time to be so focused on ONLY the physical. You are missing out on so much more.

ETA: So trying to "prove" God's existence in the same way you'd prove something physical (via science) is like trying to hear a taste with your ears, or smell something with your eyes. It's just not the way it works.

I'm agnostic so don't see proof either for or against the possibility of an invisible superbeing who cares what I do. But leave the door open in case anyone comes up with proof either way. Can't be any fairer than that.

No. You are an atheist, Taz. You don't believe God exists. That's an atheist. If you say you don't know if God exists that's still an atheist because that's not believing in God.

You must be still high from last night because you're making even less sense than usual. I just said what I believe and you come along and say I believe something else? Go sober up.

 

[ding]

So if you discovered something, share it with science. Otherwise, you didn't discover squat.

Science deals with what is physical. Every time we have an emotion, a philosophy, or an insight should we run to science? Should we remain a one note people?

Emotions can be picked up by science. Philosophy is simply a bunch of opinions. An insight is something we deduce. All perfectly provable. Your invisible friend, not so much.

There are things that are outside the realm of science. That is what most atheists simply don't get. Science is just ONE way of discovering truth, not the only way.

For example, logic and mathematics cannot be proven by science, because science presupposes them. Morality and ethics are also outside the realm of science. There are other things as well.

Science only explains the physical world. There is so much more than just the physical. And personally I think it's a waste of time to be so focused on ONLY the physical. You are missing out on so much more.

ETA: So trying to "prove" God's existence in the same way you'd prove something physical (via science) is like trying to hear a taste with your ears, or smell something with your eyes. It's just not the way it works.

I'm agnostic so don't see proof either for or against the possibility of an invisible superbeing who cares what I do. But leave the door open in case anyone comes up with proof either way. Can't be any fairer than that.

No. You are an atheist, Taz. You don't believe God exists. That's an atheist. If you say you don't know if God exists that's still an atheist because that's not believing in God.

You must be still high from last night because you're making even less sense than usual. I just said what I believe and you come along and say I believe something else? Go sober up.

Taz, it's OK that you ARE an atheist. It's not like God doesn't already know that.

 

[Taz]

I wouldn’t accept the idea that one unthinkingly inherits the gods commonly associated with their familial / geographic location.

The same can be said about science. Or have you custom assembled your science? And then you custom assembled God so that you did not have to bother with God? Kind of like custom assembling a wardrobe so one doesn't have to bother with ironing...?

The same can’t be said about science. Science relies on a hypothesis, testing and evaluation of evidence to reach conclusions. Accepting culturally appropriate gods due to tradition and because those are the gods you inherited is like wearing a hand-me-down wardrobe.

Science is manifested by consciousness, Hollie. You can't get around the human element.

Science exists without man ever discovering any of it.

Yes, so does mathematics, music, love and truth. All of which are manifested by consciousness.

Math is part of the matrix of time and space. Music can be said to exist independent of man because the universe makes sounds. More Aaron Copeland than anything by the Beatles, but still.
Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them.

Everything is discovered.

By humans.

 

[ding]

I wouldn’t accept the idea that one unthinkingly inherits the gods commonly associated with their familial / geographic location.

The same can be said about science. Or have you custom assembled your science? And then you custom assembled God so that you did not have to bother with God? Kind of like custom assembling a wardrobe so one doesn't have to bother with ironing...?

The same can’t be said about science. Science relies on a hypothesis, testing and evaluation of evidence to reach conclusions. Accepting culturally appropriate gods due to tradition and because those are the gods you inherited is like wearing a hand-me-down wardrobe.

Science is manifested by consciousness, Hollie. You can't get around the human element.

Science exists without man ever discovering any of it.

Yes, so does mathematics, music, love and truth. All of which are manifested by consciousness.

Math is part of the matrix of time and space. Music can be said to exist independent of man because the universe makes sounds. More Aaron Copeland than anything by the Beatles, but still.
Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them.

Everything is discovered.

By humans.

By consciousness.

Which means it exists unto itself since it was discovered.

 

[Taz]

So if you discovered something, share it with science. Otherwise, you didn't discover squat.

Science deals with what is physical. Every time we have an emotion, a philosophy, or an insight should we run to science? Should we remain a one note people?

Emotions can be picked up by science. Philosophy is simply a bunch of opinions. An insight is something we deduce. All perfectly provable. Your invisible friend, not so much.

There are things that are outside the realm of science. That is what most atheists simply don't get. Science is just ONE way of discovering truth, not the only way.

For example, logic and mathematics cannot be proven by science, because science presupposes them. Morality and ethics are also outside the realm of science. There are other things as well.

Science only explains the physical world. There is so much more than just the physical. And personally I think it's a waste of time to be so focused on ONLY the physical. You are missing out on so much more.

ETA: So trying to "prove" God's existence in the same way you'd prove something physical (via science) is like trying to hear a taste with your ears, or smell something with your eyes. It's just not the way it works.

I'm agnostic so don't see proof either for or against the possibility of an invisible superbeing who cares what I do. But leave the door open in case anyone comes up with proof either way. Can't be any fairer than that.

No. You are an atheist, Taz. You don't believe God exists. That's an atheist. If you say you don't know if God exists that's still an atheist because that's not believing in God.

You must be still high from last night because you're making even less sense than usual. I just said what I believe and you come along and say I believe something else? Go sober up.

Taz, it's OK that you ARE an atheist. It's not like God doesn't already know that.

You're just jealous of my agnosticism because you know that that's the thinking person's position, i.e., no proof EITHER way.

 

[ding]

So if you discovered something, share it with science. Otherwise, you didn't discover squat.

Science deals with what is physical. Every time we have an emotion, a philosophy, or an insight should we run to science? Should we remain a one note people?

Emotions can be picked up by science. Philosophy is simply a bunch of opinions. An insight is something we deduce. All perfectly provable. Your invisible friend, not so much.

There are things that are outside the realm of science. That is what most atheists simply don't get. Science is just ONE way of discovering truth, not the only way.

For example, logic and mathematics cannot be proven by science, because science presupposes them. Morality and ethics are also outside the realm of science. There are other things as well.

Science only explains the physical world. There is so much more than just the physical. And personally I think it's a waste of time to be so focused on ONLY the physical. You are missing out on so much more.

ETA: So trying to "prove" God's existence in the same way you'd prove something physical (via science) is like trying to hear a taste with your ears, or smell something with your eyes. It's just not the way it works.

I'm agnostic so don't see proof either for or against the possibility of an invisible superbeing who cares what I do. But leave the door open in case anyone comes up with proof either way. Can't be any fairer than that.

No. You are an atheist, Taz. You don't believe God exists. That's an atheist. If you say you don't know if God exists that's still an atheist because that's not believing in God.

You must be still high from last night because you're making even less sense than usual. I just said what I believe and you come along and say I believe something else? Go sober up.

Taz, it's OK that you ARE an atheist. It's not like God doesn't already know that.

You're just jealous of my agnosticism because you know that that's the thinking person's position, i.e., no proof EITHER way.

Don't be silly. You're an atheist. It's OK. Really, it is.

 

[Taz]

I wouldn’t accept the idea that one unthinkingly inherits the gods commonly associated with their familial / geographic location.

The same can be said about science. Or have you custom assembled your science? And then you custom assembled God so that you did not have to bother with God? Kind of like custom assembling a wardrobe so one doesn't have to bother with ironing...?

The same can’t be said about science. Science relies on a hypothesis, testing and evaluation of evidence to reach conclusions. Accepting culturally appropriate gods due to tradition and because those are the gods you inherited is like wearing a hand-me-down wardrobe.

Science is manifested by consciousness, Hollie. You can't get around the human element.

Science exists without man ever discovering any of it.

Yes, so does mathematics, music, love and truth. All of which are manifested by consciousness.

Math is part of the matrix of time and space. Music can be said to exist independent of man because the universe makes sounds. More Aaron Copeland than anything by the Beatles, but still.
Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them.

Everything is discovered.

By humans.

By consciousness.

Which means it exists unto itself since it was discovered.

That's totally random... and meaningless. Drink some more water.

 

[ding]

I wouldn’t accept the idea that one unthinkingly inherits the gods commonly associated with their familial / geographic location.

The same can be said about science. Or have you custom assembled your science? And then you custom assembled God so that you did not have to bother with God? Kind of like custom assembling a wardrobe so one doesn't have to bother with ironing...?

The same can’t be said about science. Science relies on a hypothesis, testing and evaluation of evidence to reach conclusions. Accepting culturally appropriate gods due to tradition and because those are the gods you inherited is like wearing a hand-me-down wardrobe.

Science is manifested by consciousness, Hollie. You can't get around the human element.

Science exists without man ever discovering any of it.

Yes, so does mathematics, music, love and truth. All of which are manifested by consciousness.

Math is part of the matrix of time and space. Music can be said to exist independent of man because the universe makes sounds. More Aaron Copeland than anything by the Beatles, but still.
Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them.

Everything is discovered.

By humans.

By consciousness.

Which means it exists unto itself since it was discovered.

That's totally random... and meaningless. Drink some more water.

Stop being silly. You already admitted that love and truth were discovered by humans, Taz. That's an acknowledgement that love and truth existed independently of humans.

 

[Taz]

I wouldn’t accept the idea that one unthinkingly inherits the gods commonly associated with their familial / geographic location.

The same can be said about science. Or have you custom assembled your science? And then you custom assembled God so that you did not have to bother with God? Kind of like custom assembling a wardrobe so one doesn't have to bother with ironing...?

The same can’t be said about science. Science relies on a hypothesis, testing and evaluation of evidence to reach conclusions. Accepting culturally appropriate gods due to tradition and because those are the gods you inherited is like wearing a hand-me-down wardrobe.

Science is manifested by consciousness, Hollie. You can't get around the human element.

Science exists without man ever discovering any of it.

Yes, so does mathematics, music, love and truth. All of which are manifested by consciousness.

Math is part of the matrix of time and space. Music can be said to exist independent of man because the universe makes sounds. More Aaron Copeland than anything by the Beatles, but still.
Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them.

Everything is discovered.

By humans.

By consciousness.

Which means it exists unto itself since it was discovered.

That's totally random... and meaningless. Drink some more water.

Stop being silly. You already admitted that love and truth were discovered by humans, Taz. That's an acknowledgement that love and truth existed independently of humans.

I never said they were discovered, you made that bullshit up. Here's what I said "Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them."

 

[esalla]

If God doesn’t exist, the universe came into existence by chance, the first living cell developed from non-living matter by chance, and all living things are the eventual product of the blind, undirected process of evolution. In such a case, human life is no more valuable than dust, and there is no basis for saying that any life matters. Only if there is an author of life who creates and imbues us with a meaning greater than our physical parts can lives actually matter, and in an equal way.

If God doesn’t exist, there’s also no objective standard for labeling an action—such as murder—wrong. If we’re all just the product of blind, purposeless forces, morality is just an opinion. Unless there is a higher-than-human moral authority, no one has a basis for claiming that murder is objectively wrong.

And finally, if God doesn’t exist, the concept of justice is meaningless because there can be no right or wrong in the first place to require justice. As C.S. Lewis famously said about his conversion to Christianity, “My argument against God was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust. But how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. What was I comparing this universe with when I called it unjust?” Justice requires a standard, and there is no objective standard in a purposeless universe.

5 Ways Christians are Getting Swept into a Secular Worldview in This Cultural Moment

Culture is influencing the church's response more than the church is influencing culture.

christianmomthoughts.com

That's why being agnostic is the thinking person's position. We don't know either way whether a god exists or not but leave the door open in case someone finds real proof either way.

Actually thinking people see that DNA is a molecular computer code of unimaginable ability that could not from itself by itself in a dead pond because nothing does not write code

No proof that's it's your preferred invisible dude. Only a possibility.

Actually there is proof that you are there and I am here.

Grow up

That also doesn't prove your preferred invisible dude.

That's why being agnostic is the thinking person's position.

Some prefer not to sit and think, but to explore and discover.

That's what agnostic's do, I know I do, and if I ever come across any real proof either way, I'm open to changing my mind. Seems fair to me, what do you think?

You would not change your mind if God stood before you and cured your blindness. Yea I know that you have no clue that you are blind

Actually, I'm AM blind. To con jobs.

So explain how even one line of DNA could form itself without an intelligence writing it? Keeping in mind that thousands of genes are needed for a small primordial life form.

You can't so you are implying the supernatural.

I can't, meaning science is still trying to figure it out. You on the other hand, don't know, so you settle on your preferred invisible buddy. Quite illogical.

OK this is progress, you say that you can't explain how DNA code wrote itself but reject that God did it because you consider God to be supernatural. The reason that you can not explain DNA is because you see that it is a complicated computer code that arranges molecules to do things, and that the molecules are code directed not arranging by weight or charge. Saying that DNA created itself out of nothing one it's own when it did not exist nor did any life exist is also supernatural

Since no one can explain how DNA created itself a creator is required, this is a scientific requirement. Tyson now sees this and in opposition of everything he has ever said is now saying that the universe is a computer program which requires a creator.

Also the only thing supernatural about God is that he is not here but perhaps trillions of miles away if his race still exist. That said God does still exist right here in you whether you know it or not

 

[Hollie]

If God doesn’t exist, the universe came into existence by chance, the first living cell developed from non-living matter by chance, and all living things are the eventual product of the blind, undirected process of evolution. In such a case, human life is no more valuable than dust, and there is no basis for saying that any life matters. Only if there is an author of life who creates and imbues us with a meaning greater than our physical parts can lives actually matter, and in an equal way.

If God doesn’t exist, there’s also no objective standard for labeling an action—such as murder—wrong. If we’re all just the product of blind, purposeless forces, morality is just an opinion. Unless there is a higher-than-human moral authority, no one has a basis for claiming that murder is objectively wrong.

And finally, if God doesn’t exist, the concept of justice is meaningless because there can be no right or wrong in the first place to require justice. As C.S. Lewis famously said about his conversion to Christianity, “My argument against God was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust. But how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. What was I comparing this universe with when I called it unjust?” Justice requires a standard, and there is no objective standard in a purposeless universe.

5 Ways Christians are Getting Swept into a Secular Worldview in This Cultural Moment

Culture is influencing the church's response more than the church is influencing culture.

christianmomthoughts.com

That's why being agnostic is the thinking person's position. We don't know either way whether a god exists or not but leave the door open in case someone finds real proof either way.

Actually thinking people see that DNA is a molecular computer code of unimaginable ability that could not from itself by itself in a dead pond because nothing does not write code

No proof that's it's your preferred invisible dude. Only a possibility.

Actually there is proof that you are there and I am here.

Grow up

That also doesn't prove your preferred invisible dude.

That's why being agnostic is the thinking person's position.

Some prefer not to sit and think, but to explore and discover.

That's what agnostic's do, I know I do, and if I ever come across any real proof either way, I'm open to changing my mind. Seems fair to me, what do you think?

You would not change your mind if God stood before you and cured your blindness. Yea I know that you have no clue that you are blind

Actually, I'm AM blind. To con jobs.

So explain how even one line of DNA could form itself without an intelligence writing it? Keeping in mind that thousands of genes are needed for a small primordial life form.

You can't so you are implying the supernatural.

I can't, meaning science is still trying to figure it out. You on the other hand, don't know, so you settle on your preferred invisible buddy. Quite illogical.

OK this is progress, you say that you can't explain how DNA code wrote itself but reject that God did it because you consider God to be supernatural. The reason that you can not explain DNA is because you see that it is a complicated computer code that arranges molecules to do things, and that the molecules are code directed not arranging by weight or charge. Saying that DNA created itself out of nothing one it's own when it did not exist nor did any life exist is also supernatural

Since no one can explain how DNA created itself a creator is required, this is a scientific requirement. Tyson now sees this and in opposition of everything he has ever said is now saying that the universe is a computer program which requires a creator.

Also the only thing supernatural about God is that he is not here but perhaps trillions of miles away if his race still exist. That said God does still exist right here in you whether you know it or not

There are a number of obvious fallacies in the above.
“Since no one can explain how DNA created itself a creator is required, this is a scientific requirement.”

Since no one can explain how DNA a supernatural creator created itself a creator is required, an endless hierarchy of super-supernatural creators is required, this is a scientific requirement.

It’s a common tactic of religious extremists to retreat to fear and ignorance when they don’t understand something. It’s a bit like the gods of thunder and lightning have become the gods of DNA.


Secondly, you make a common error of confusing protein based DNA with computer code. This is a falsehood and a rather juvenile effort promoted by various fundie creation ministries to press their religious agenda.

 

[Taz]

If God doesn’t exist, the universe came into existence by chance, the first living cell developed from non-living matter by chance, and all living things are the eventual product of the blind, undirected process of evolution. In such a case, human life is no more valuable than dust, and there is no basis for saying that any life matters. Only if there is an author of life who creates and imbues us with a meaning greater than our physical parts can lives actually matter, and in an equal way.

If God doesn’t exist, there’s also no objective standard for labeling an action—such as murder—wrong. If we’re all just the product of blind, purposeless forces, morality is just an opinion. Unless there is a higher-than-human moral authority, no one has a basis for claiming that murder is objectively wrong.

And finally, if God doesn’t exist, the concept of justice is meaningless because there can be no right or wrong in the first place to require justice. As C.S. Lewis famously said about his conversion to Christianity, “My argument against God was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust. But how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. What was I comparing this universe with when I called it unjust?” Justice requires a standard, and there is no objective standard in a purposeless universe.

5 Ways Christians are Getting Swept into a Secular Worldview in This Cultural Moment

Culture is influencing the church's response more than the church is influencing culture.

christianmomthoughts.com

That's why being agnostic is the thinking person's position. We don't know either way whether a god exists or not but leave the door open in case someone finds real proof either way.

Actually thinking people see that DNA is a molecular computer code of unimaginable ability that could not from itself by itself in a dead pond because nothing does not write code

No proof that's it's your preferred invisible dude. Only a possibility.

Actually there is proof that you are there and I am here.

Grow up

That also doesn't prove your preferred invisible dude.

That's why being agnostic is the thinking person's position.

Some prefer not to sit and think, but to explore and discover.

That's what agnostic's do, I know I do, and if I ever come across any real proof either way, I'm open to changing my mind. Seems fair to me, what do you think?

You would not change your mind if God stood before you and cured your blindness. Yea I know that you have no clue that you are blind

Actually, I'm AM blind. To con jobs.

So explain how even one line of DNA could form itself without an intelligence writing it? Keeping in mind that thousands of genes are needed for a small primordial life form.

You can't so you are implying the supernatural.

I can't, meaning science is still trying to figure it out. You on the other hand, don't know, so you settle on your preferred invisible buddy. Quite illogical.

OK this is progress, you say that you can't explain how DNA code wrote itself but reject that God did it because you consider God to be supernatural. The reason that you can not explain DNA is because you see that it is a complicated computer code that arranges molecules to do things, and that the molecules are code directed not arranging by weight or charge. Saying that DNA created itself out of nothing one it's own when it did not exist nor did any life exist is also supernatural

Since no one can explain how DNA created itself a creator is required, this is a scientific requirement. Tyson now sees this and in opposition of everything he has ever said is now saying that the universe is a computer program which requires a creator.

Also the only thing supernatural about God is that he is not here but perhaps trillions of miles away if his race still exist. That said God does still exist right here in you whether you know it or not

I'm agnostic, so I don't say that god couldn't have done it because I have no proof to base that statement on, I'm saying that sure, it could be a god, but so far there's no proof for that, and the fact that science hasn't figured it out yet is also not proof of a supernatural being.

 

[Meriweather]

Supernaturalism. Outside of the natural.

Recall, I asked for specific examples.

 

[Meriweather]

What is spiritual? Are there spirit realms? Are spirit realms natural or supernatural.

Perhaps spirit/spiritual might best be defined as intelligence (or life) that can also exist outside that which is physical. As you may recall, I reject the terms natural and supernatural as physical and non-physical are more accurate. For example, humans consist of body, mind, and spirit.

 

[Hollie]

Supernaturalism. Outside of the natural.

Recall, I asked for specific examples.

I have no examples of supernaturalism. I'm not aware of any event in human history that can be attributed to supernaturalism.

I would think that those suggesting supernaturalism is extant should provide specific examples. Those making a positive claim are tasked with supporting their claims.

 

[Hollie]

What is spiritual? Are there spirit realms? Are spirit realms natural or supernatural.

Perhaps spirit/spiritual might best be defined as intelligence (or life) that can also exist outside that which is physical. As you may recall, I reject the terms natural and supernatural as physical and non-physical are more accurate. For example, humans consist of body, mind, and spirit.

Please describe this ''spirit'' thing you claim exists. How does anyone identify a spirit realm outside of the physical body? I believe you're unnecessarily ascribing supernatural concepts to purely physical (chemical / electro chemical functions of the brain that are fairly well understood.

 

[LittleNipper]

If God doesn’t exist, the universe came into existence by chance, the first living cell developed from non-living matter by chance, and all living things are the eventual product of the blind, undirected process of evolution. In such a case, human life is no more valuable than dust, and there is no basis for saying that any life matters. Only if there is an author of life who creates and imbues us with a meaning greater than our physical parts can lives actually matter, and in an equal way.

If God doesn’t exist, there’s also no objective standard for labeling an action—such as murder—wrong. If we’re all just the product of blind, purposeless forces, morality is just an opinion. Unless there is a higher-than-human moral authority, no one has a basis for claiming that murder is objectively wrong.

And finally, if God doesn’t exist, the concept of justice is meaningless because there can be no right or wrong in the first place to require justice. As C.S. Lewis famously said about his conversion to Christianity, “My argument against God was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust. But how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. What was I comparing this universe with when I called it unjust?” Justice requires a standard, and there is no objective standard in a purposeless universe.

5 Ways Christians are Getting Swept into a Secular Worldview in This Cultural Moment

Culture is influencing the church's response more than the church is influencing culture.

christianmomthoughts.com

That's why being agnostic is the thinking person's position. We don't know either way whether a god exists or not but leave the door open in case someone finds real proof either way.

Actually thinking people see that DNA is a molecular computer code of unimaginable ability that could not from itself by itself in a dead pond because nothing does not write code

No proof that's it's your preferred invisible dude. Only a possibility.

Actually there is proof that you are there and I am here.

Grow up

That also doesn't prove your preferred invisible dude.

That's why being agnostic is the thinking person's position.

Some prefer not to sit and think, but to explore and discover.

That's what agnostic's do, I know I do, and if I ever come across any real proof either way, I'm open to changing my mind. Seems fair to me, what do you think?

You would not change your mind if God stood before you and cured your blindness. Yea I know that you have no clue that you are blind

Actually, I'm AM blind. To con jobs.

So explain how even one line of DNA could form itself without an intelligence writing it? Keeping in mind that thousands of genes are needed for a small primordial life form.

You can't so you are implying the supernatural.

I can't, meaning science is still trying to figure it out. You on the other hand, don't know, so you settle on your preferred invisible buddy. Quite illogical.

OK this is progress, you say that you can't explain how DNA code wrote itself but reject that God did it because you consider God to be supernatural. The reason that you can not explain DNA is because you see that it is a complicated computer code that arranges molecules to do things, and that the molecules are code directed not arranging by weight or charge. Saying that DNA created itself out of nothing one it's own when it did not exist nor did any life exist is also supernatural

Since no one can explain how DNA created itself a creator is required, this is a scientific requirement. Tyson now sees this and in opposition of everything he has ever said is now saying that the universe is a computer program which requires a creator.

Also the only thing supernatural about God is that he is not here but perhaps trillions of miles away if his race still exist. That said God does still exist right here in you whether you know it or not

There are a number of obvious fallacies in the above.
“Since no one can explain how DNA created itself a creator is required, this is a scientific requirement.”

Since no one can explain how DNA a supernatural creator created itself a creator is required, an endless hierarchy of super-supernatural creators is required, this is a scientific requirement.

It’s a common tactic of religious extremists to retreat to fear and ignorance when they don’t understand something. It’s a bit like the gods of thunder and lightning have become the gods of DNA.


Secondly, you make a common error of confusing protein based DNA with computer code. This is a falsehood and a rather juvenile effort promoted by various fundie creation ministries to press their religious agenda.

Atheists are trying to fit what presently exists into some eternal spectrum. BEFORE GOD created the heavens and the earth, there existed NO TIME. GOD simply was. An atheist might say matter always existed throughout ALL eternity past.The Christian will ask, "But who created matter?" The atheist would laugh and say matter didn't need to be created. Well, atheists have it backwards. GOD/SPIRIT/LOVE always simply existed. THIS SPIRIT created time, space and matter. The entire Universe is an extension of GOD's thought. HE spoke and it came to be. HE formulated DNA. HE designed the various animals and gave them tasks to perform in the environment HE created. Then HE created MAN to exist in the environment HE established. HE gave HUMANS tasks to do and provided humans with the ability to think, interact, and make things. The one class that every kid loves is arts and crafts. Expression has been built into our nature. When it is stifled, people will very often begin to express themselves in ways that are destructive and harmful.

 

[ding]

I wouldn’t accept the idea that one unthinkingly inherits the gods commonly associated with their familial / geographic location.

The same can be said about science. Or have you custom assembled your science? And then you custom assembled God so that you did not have to bother with God? Kind of like custom assembling a wardrobe so one doesn't have to bother with ironing...?

The same can’t be said about science. Science relies on a hypothesis, testing and evaluation of evidence to reach conclusions. Accepting culturally appropriate gods due to tradition and because those are the gods you inherited is like wearing a hand-me-down wardrobe.

Science is manifested by consciousness, Hollie. You can't get around the human element.

Science exists without man ever discovering any of it.

Yes, so does mathematics, music, love and truth. All of which are manifested by consciousness.

Math is part of the matrix of time and space. Music can be said to exist independent of man because the universe makes sounds. More Aaron Copeland than anything by the Beatles, but still.
Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them.

Everything is discovered.

By humans.

By consciousness.

Which means it exists unto itself since it was discovered.

That's totally random... and meaningless. Drink some more water.

Stop being silly. You already admitted that love and truth were discovered by humans, Taz. That's an acknowledgement that love and truth existed independently of humans.

I never said they were discovered, you made that bullshit up. Here's what I said "Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them."

Sure you did. Go back and re-read the exchange.

 

[Taz]

I wouldn’t accept the idea that one unthinkingly inherits the gods commonly associated with their familial / geographic location.

The same can be said about science. Or have you custom assembled your science? And then you custom assembled God so that you did not have to bother with God? Kind of like custom assembling a wardrobe so one doesn't have to bother with ironing...?

The same can’t be said about science. Science relies on a hypothesis, testing and evaluation of evidence to reach conclusions. Accepting culturally appropriate gods due to tradition and because those are the gods you inherited is like wearing a hand-me-down wardrobe.

Science is manifested by consciousness, Hollie. You can't get around the human element.

Science exists without man ever discovering any of it.

Yes, so does mathematics, music, love and truth. All of which are manifested by consciousness.

Math is part of the matrix of time and space. Music can be said to exist independent of man because the universe makes sounds. More Aaron Copeland than anything by the Beatles, but still.
Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them.

Everything is discovered.

By humans.

By consciousness.

Which means it exists unto itself since it was discovered.

That's totally random... and meaningless. Drink some more water.

Stop being silly. You already admitted that love and truth were discovered by humans, Taz. That's an acknowledgement that love and truth existed independently of humans.

I never said they were discovered, you made that bullshit up. Here's what I said "Love and truth are characteristics of humans and can't exist without them."

Sure you did. Go back and re-read the exchange.

I just quoted what I said, idiot. So how was church today? You still going to hell?

 

[Meriweather]

I have no examples of supernaturalism. I'm not aware of any event in human history that can be attributed to supernaturalism.

I would think that those suggesting supernaturalism is extant should provide specific examples. Those making a positive claim are tasked with supporting their claims.

Okay, so let's get this straight. I do not talk about supernaturalism and you say you are not aware of any event that can be attributed to it. So are you asking me to support the claims of those who do? If so, don't I need a specific example of something someone considers supernatural?