If Jefferson founded the Republican Party what place do Democrats have in America?

[Dragon]

You are a pessimist and I am not.

No, sir. I am NOT a pessimist. I firmly believe that things can and WILL get better. I look at the technology we have today, and the capacity of it to produce immense wealth and provide a good -- by the standards of the past, indeed, a lush, an incredible -- standard of living for everyone, and I am very, very hopeful and optimistic.

No, the difference between you and me is not that. It is that you believe in fairy-tales and I do not. To realize that potential requires that we recognize reality and do it the right way, and not stick our fingers in our ears, put on our blinders, and believe that it will all do itself. It won't.

 

[Brutus]

A liberal is a pessimist believing the finite pie must be divided with ever growing welfare while the conservative is an optimistic believing everyone can expand the pie.

 

[Polk]

FDR took office when the economy was bad, he took advantage of the desperate people and enacted all his progressive policies during the crisis, all of which failed. Only a world war and the creation of the 'industrial military complex' brought the US out of it.

FDR had no qualms about circumventing the constitution. When many of his New Deal legislation started to be undone by Congress and the Supreme Court, he tried to add more justices to the Supreme Court in order to fill it with a bunch of progressive hacks that would rule in his favor. Thankfully his attempt failed.

Obama is trying his best to mimic FDR. He's used the 'economic crisis' to pass 'stimulous' bills which were nothing more than slush funds for his cronies. He circumvents Congress whenever it suits him. And he is already trying to stir up more wars in the Middle East.

The conservative explanation of the Depression is laughable. "Increasing government spending is a failure, we were only lifted out of the Depression by a massive increase in government spending."

 

[regent]

People keep claiming that it was the spending of WWII that ended the depression, that seems like evidence that the government simply did not spend enough on Hoover's RFC or FDR's New Deal? In any case Hoover began the idea that the government has a responsiblity to be involved in recessions/depressions, and we seem to be following that Keynsian path to this day. Hoover started the government spending, FDR increased Hoover's spending but the evidence is that neither were enough it took a WWII type of spending to end the Great Depression. Would the depression have ended on its own, we may never know, but the bigger question would the American people have waited for it to end on its own?

 

[Bfgrn]

Our founding fathers did not subscribe to Adam Smith's 'invisible hand'. They believed in very heavy regulations and restrictions on corporations.

Of course thats even more perfectly idiotic and liberal than usual.
Show us something in the Constitution that our founders wrote that regulates corporations as you describe???

They did of course know and read Adam Smith!!

I just gave you a list of the heavy regulations imposed on corporations by our founding fathers. Maybe an adult can help you read them, and explain them to you.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Our founding fathers did not subscribe to Adam Smith's 'invisible hand'. They believed in very heavy regulations and restrictions on corporations.

Of course thats even more perfectly idiotic and liberal than usual.
Show us something in the Constitution that our founders wrote that regulates corporations as you describe???

They did of course know and read Adam Smith!!

I just gave you a list of the heavy regulations imposed on corporations by our founding fathers. Maybe an adult can help you read them, and explain them to you.

Too stupid and liberal, of course!! You gave a list about "state" regulations, but could not name even one one federal corporate regulation!!

You wanted them to be federal regulations so badly that you just flat out lied about it. What does that tell us about you and liberalism?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

it took a WWII type of spending to end the Great Depression.

of course thats 100% idiotic and liberal. If making planes and dumping them into the sea helped the economy BUsh and/or BO would have recommended it!! Did you see anyone recommending it??

See why we are positive liberalism is the absence of intelligence? What other conclusion is possible?

 

[code1211]

You are a pessimist and I am not.

No, sir. I am NOT a pessimist. I firmly believe that things can and WILL get better. I look at the technology we have today, and the capacity of it to produce immense wealth and provide a good -- by the standards of the past, indeed, a lush, an incredible -- standard of living for everyone, and I am very, very hopeful and optimistic.

No, the difference between you and me is not that. It is that you believe in fairy-tales and I do not. To realize that potential requires that we recognize reality and do it the right way, and not stick our fingers in our ears, put on our blinders, and believe that it will all do itself. It won't.

I'm not sure you know what a pessimist does.

If you assume that those around you are bound to fail, that is pessimism.

If you assume that the conditions are right to achieve, that is optimism.

Why is planning, hard work, continuous effort and not giving up a fairy tale?

How can we live in the world you describe above and not hold the opinion that this is the best place and time to ever have lived and that all who live here and now are blessed beyond all who came before and that they need to reach out and grab the opportunity that everyone who came before would die to have.

The hardship of 1800 was starvation. The hardship of today is being limited to basic cable.

Do you assert that people blessed with everything of today are just plain incompetent?

 

[code1211]

People keep claiming that it was the spending of WWII that ended the depression, that seems like evidence that the government simply did not spend enough on Hoover's RFC or FDR's New Deal? In any case Hoover began the idea that the government has a responsiblity to be involved in recessions/depressions, and we seem to be following that Keynsian path to this day. Hoover started the government spending, FDR increased Hoover's spending but the evidence is that neither were enough it took a WWII type of spending to end the Great Depression. Would the depression have ended on its own, we may never know, but the bigger question would the American people have waited for it to end on its own?

What we know for a fact is that it did not.

Keynsian Economics provides that in good time the government collects a surplus that it can spend in the lean time. We are not practicing this.

We are witnessing political hacks draining the treasury to buy votes.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

we were only lifted out of the Depression by a massive increase in government spending."

****Here's what Henry Morgenthau, FDR's Secretary of the Treasury (the man who desperately needed the New Deal to succeed as much as Roosevelt) said about the New Deal stimulus: "We have tried spending money.We are spending more than we ever have spent before and it does not work... We have never made good on our promises...I say after eight years of this administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started... And an enormous debt to boot!"

"The New Republic"( at the time a FDR greatest supporter") noted. In June 1939, the federal public works programs still supported almost 19 million people, nearly 15% of the population" [page 313]

In fact in 1939, unemployment was at 17%, and there were 11 million additional in stimulus make work welfare jobs. Today when the population is 2.5 times greater we have only 8 million unemployed. Conclusion: legislation to make Democrats illegal
is urgently needed

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

We are witnessing political hacks draining the treasury to buy votes.

yes exactly; who ever conceived of democracy as liberal politicians buying votes?? The liberals have subverted our democracy!! They should be made illegal as the Constitution intended.


"When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."
-Benjamin Franklin

 

[Bfgrn]

Of course thats even more perfectly idiotic and liberal than usual.
Show us something in the Constitution that our founders wrote that regulates corporations as you describe???

They did of course know and read Adam Smith!!

I just gave you a list of the heavy regulations imposed on corporations by our founding fathers. Maybe an adult can help you read them, and explain them to you.

Too stupid and liberal, of course!! You gave a list about "state" regulations, but could not name even one one federal corporate regulation!!

You wanted them to be federal regulations so badly that you just flat out lied about it. What does that tell us about you and liberalism?

You can try to spin it anyway you wish with your tiny little brain. Our founding fathers did not believe in the invisible hand. They believed in a firm hand by GOVERNMENT.

 

[code1211]

I just gave you a list of the heavy regulations imposed on corporations by our founding fathers. Maybe an adult can help you read them, and explain them to you.

Too stupid and liberal, of course!! You gave a list about "state" regulations, but could not name even one one federal corporate regulation!!

You wanted them to be federal regulations so badly that you just flat out lied about it. What does that tell us about you and liberalism?

You can try to spin it anyway you wish with your tiny little brain. Our founding fathers did not believe in the invisible hand. They believed in a firm hand by GOVERNMENT.

Demonstrate that belief by quoting the Constitution.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

You can try to spin it anyway you wish with your tiny little brain. Our founding fathers did not believe in the invisible hand. They believed in a firm hand by GOVERNMENT.

of course thats an idiotic lie which perfectly explains why you are so afraid to present any evidence!! what on earth did you think the Revolution was about??? OMG!!



"That government is best which governs the least, because its people discipline themselves"- Jefferson.

"The path we have to pursue[when Jefferson was President ] is so quiet that we have nothing scarcely to propose to our Legislature."-Jefferson

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Too stupid and liberal, of course!! You gave a list about "state" regulations, but could not name even one one federal corporate regulation!!

You wanted them to be federal regulations so badly that you just flat out lied about it. What does that tell us about you and liberalism?

You can try to spin it anyway you wish with your tiny little brain. Our founding fathers did not believe in the invisible hand. They believed in a firm hand by GOVERNMENT.

Demonstrate that belief by quoting the Constitution.

whats really interesting is that in the one area where they did seek some control over business, the Commerce Clause, the intent was as per Adam Smith to use that control to secure and promote free trade among the States.

 

[regent]

we were only lifted out of the Depression by a massive increase in government spending."

****Here's what Henry Morgenthau, FDR's Secretary of the Treasury (the man who desperately needed the New Deal to succeed as much as Roosevelt) said about the New Deal stimulus: "We have tried spending money.We are spending more than we ever have spent before and it does not work... We have never made good on our promises...I say after eight years of this administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started... And an enormous debt to boot!"

"The New Republic"( at the time a FDR greatest supporter") noted. In June 1939, the federal public works programs still supported almost 19 million people, nearly 15% of the population" [page 313]

In fact in 1939, unemployment was at 17%, and there were 11 million additional in stimulus make work welfare jobs. Today when the population is 2.5 times greater we have only 8 million unemployed. Conclusion: legislation to make Democrats illegal
is urgently needed

As many posters have already noted the New Deal did not spend enough money, it took war time spending to end the Great Depression. Will any administration now fail to spend stimulus money in a depression/recession?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

As many posters have already noted the New Deal did not spend enough money, it took war time spending to end the Great Depression. Will any administration now fail to spend stimulus money in a depression/recession?

too stupid!! if making planes and dumping them into the sea would end recession and depressions at least one person would propose it!! Who has, you simple idiot liberal?

Why not try to explain why on earth that would work?? Don't be 100% afraid, try!!

 

[regent]

it took a WWII type of spending to end the Great Depression.

of course thats 100% idiotic and liberal. If making planes and dumping them into the sea helped the economy BUsh and/or BO would have recommended it!! Did you see anyone recommending it??

See why we are positive liberalism is the absence of intelligence? What other conclusion is possible?

By war time spending we mean of course tremendous amounts of money, not for tanks and weapons but internal improvements or whatever. Guess you didn't know that?

 

[regent]

People keep claiming that it was the spending of WWII that ended the depression, that seems like evidence that the government simply did not spend enough on Hoover's RFC or FDR's New Deal? In any case Hoover began the idea that the government has a responsiblity to be involved in recessions/depressions, and we seem to be following that Keynsian path to this day. Hoover started the government spending, FDR increased Hoover's spending but the evidence is that neither were enough it took a WWII type of spending to end the Great Depression. Would the depression have ended on its own, we may never know, but the bigger question would the American people have waited for it to end on its own?

What we know for a fact is that it did not.

Keynsian Economics provides that in good time the government collects a surplus that it can spend in the lean time. We are not practicing this.

We are witnessing political hacks draining the treasury to buy votes.

So you are saying that the problem is that we don't follow Keynes totally we only practice part of Keynes and we should be practicing the whole thing. So from now on instead of tax breaks for the wealthy we should pay back the borrowed money. Good idea.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

By war time spending we mean of course tremendous amounts of money, not for tanks and weapons

you said war spending ended the Great Depression. I assumed they spent a lot on planes tanks and ships, and everything was rationed at home??

but internal improvements or whatever. Guess you didn't know that?

there were internal imporvements during WW2, not rationing???

See why we are 100% positive a liberal will be slow?? Is any other conclusion possible?