If the Sandy Hook incident does not bring on changes due to the NRA NO

[Pogo]

Well regulated...

In case the NRA crowd are wondering why no limits, save that of out and out bans of all guns, have ever been overturned by SCOTUS.

How many limits have been upheld by the SCotUS?
Be sure to cite the case and the limit(s) upheld by same.

Dammit M14-year-old, I thought you were supposed to be coming up with evidence of my Second Amendment "agenda". Don't tease me bro.

Frickin' hack.

 

[Pogo]

Well regulated...

In case the NRA crowd are wondering why no limits, save that of out and out bans of all guns, have ever been overturned by SCOTUS.

How many limits have been upheld by the SCotUS?
Be sure to cite the case and the limit(s) upheld by same.

How many quotes have been found on my "Second Amendment Agenda"?
Be sure to cite the post and the text by same.

 

[Pogo]

What happened to this thread? Everything reverts to page 12

 

[Skull Pilot]

While we agree in essence, nothing will assure that mass killings do not happen again. Sure; we can mitigate the severity, by reducing the lethality of weapons the general public can purchase, which we've always done since nasty ones came on line: nukes, grendades, full auto, etc. And the only reason to bar ownership of nukes, grenades, etc, vis a vis "well regulated," is they're massively lethal.

Whoa, back up here. This brings up a previous question that was never addressed.

If the Second Amendment is sacrosanct, then why can't I have a nuke? A grenade? Even a simple tank?
I don't remember any part of the Second Amendment referring to what's "massively lethal" and what isn't. Why isn't the NRA protesting these egregious tramplings of the Constitution?

Who drew that line? And if we accept that line, why do we accept that one and not another one?

Well regulated...

What did the term well regulated mean in the 1700s?

Did it mean controlled by the government? No.

It meant well disciplined or well equipped.

 

[squeeze berry]

unnecessary risk. The risk posed by assault weapons in the hands of hundreds of thousand without proper background checks for criminal pasts, mental illness and incompetence is completely unnecessary. The 2nd amendment is not a death sentence. Those who can't read it, particularly the clause that starts it off are using their peculiar attitude to perpetuate gun violence. And that's also an unnecessary risk. Public safety and the rights of the victims to live, grow and prosper are being repressed by the gun culture that cavalierly believes that guns are cool and make them big men so they should have them no matter what the consequences.

The risk numbers for dying via car accident are orders of magnitude higher than dying from an assault weapon. Its not about risk for people like you, its about fear. And for those in the government, its about control.

If cars were designed strictly to kill, you might have a point. But deflections like cars kill too are senseless given the non lethal utility of the car.

I could see your point if someone laid a firearm out on the sidewalk with a sign

" Free gun, Go Kill Someone"

but likely the gun was stolen because someone burglarized someone.

Why blame the victim?

 

[Koios]

Whoa, back up here. This brings up a previous question that was never addressed.

If the Second Amendment is sacrosanct, then why can't I have a nuke? A grenade? Even a simple tank?
I don't remember any part of the Second Amendment referring to what's "massively lethal" and what isn't. Why isn't the NRA protesting these egregious tramplings of the Constitution?

Who drew that line? And if we accept that line, why do we accept that one and not another one?

Well regulated...

What did the term well regulated mean in the 1700s?

Did it mean controlled by the government? No.

It meant well disciplined or well equipped.

Who else would have "regulated" it? And where else in 18th Century writing might we see where regulated = trained/equipped? (Tip: it never did, until a more recent, and right-leaning Court, deemed it thus, which is pure fucking nonsense. The intent is obvious: have guns but not let it go nuts, which in fact is what we have in America; some arms are allowed, but not all. And we can limit gun rights among undesireables, such as convicted of domestic violence, or a felony, or being mentally unstable. And we can bar them from all manner of places, i.e. bars, schools, government buildings. Simple truth. Look out the window, for godsake.)

 

[Skull Pilot]

Well regulated...

What did the term well regulated mean in the 1700s?

Did it mean controlled by the government? No.

It meant well disciplined or well equipped.

Who else would have "regulated" it? And where else in 18th Century writing might we see where regulated = trained/equipped? (Tip: it never did, until a more recent, and right-leaning Court, deemed it thus, which is pure fucking nonsense. The intent is obvious: have guns but not let it go nuts, which in fact is what we have in America; some arms are allowed, but not all. And we can limit gun rights among undesireables, such as convicted of domestic violence, or a felony, or being mentally unstable. And we can bar them from all manner of places, i.e. bars, schools, government buildings. Simple truth. Look out the window, for godsake.)

All it meant was well disciplined it had nothing to do with government you twit. People are capable of being well disciplined without the fucking government.

The bill of rights lists rights that belong to the people beyond the scope of government control.

And I don't care if guns aren't allowed in certain places because quite frankly I don't frequent schools or government buildings and whatever a private property owner wants or doesn't want in his establishment is fine with me.

Therefore whatever I want to keep in my own home as far as guns, knives, samurai swords or whatever is none of your fucking business and you have no right to tell me what I can or cannot have.

But who the fuck are you to say I can't buy a simple semiauto rifle with a 30 round mag just because some other idiot may have killed someone with a similar weapon?

What other people do is not in anyway predictive of what I will do is it?

 

[bripat9643]

What did the term well regulated mean in the 1700s?

Did it mean controlled by the government? No.

It meant well disciplined or well equipped.

More like "well drilled and well trained."

 

[bripat9643]

Well regulated...

What did the term well regulated mean in the 1700s?

Did it mean controlled by the government? No.

It meant well disciplined or well equipped.

Who else would have "regulated" it? And where else in 18th Century writing might we see where regulated = trained/equipped? (Tip: it never did, until a more recent, and right-leaning Court, deemed it thus, which is pure fucking nonsense. The intent is obvious: have guns but not let it go nuts, which in fact is what we have in America; some arms are allowed, but not all. And we can limit gun rights among undesireables, such as convicted of domestic violence, or a felony, or being mentally unstable. And we can bar them from all manner of places, i.e. bars, schools, government buildings. Simple truth. Look out the window, for godsake.)

The following are taken from the Oxford English Dictionary, and bracket in time the writing of the 2nd amendment:

1709: "If a liberal Education has formed in us well-regulated Appetites and worthy Inclinations."

1714: "The practice of all well-regulated courts of justice in the world."

1812: "The equation of time ... is the adjustment of the difference of time as shown by a well-regulated clock and a true sun dial."

1848: "A remissness for which I am sure every well-regulated person will blame the Mayor."

1862: "It appeared to her well-regulated mind, like a clandestine proceeding."

1894: "The newspaper, a never wanting adjunct to every well-regulated American embryo city."

 

[Koios]

Me in red

What did the term well regulated mean in the 1700s?

Did it mean controlled by the government? No.

It meant well disciplined or well equipped.

Who else would have "regulated" it? And where else in 18th Century writing might we see where regulated = trained/equipped? (Tip: it never did, until a more recent, and right-leaning Court, deemed it thus, which is pure fucking nonsense. The intent is obvious: have guns but not let it go nuts, which in fact is what we have in America; some arms are allowed, but not all. And we can limit gun rights among undesireables, such as convicted of domestic violence, or a felony, or being mentally unstable. And we can bar them from all manner of places, i.e. bars, schools, government buildings. Simple truth. Look out the window, for godsake.)

The following are taken from the Oxford English Dictionary, and bracket in time the writing of the 2nd amendment:

1709: "If a liberal Education has formed in us well-regulated Appetites and worthy Inclinations." (So trained and equipped Appetites??? Or maybe Appetites that are rational and not over board? Tip: the latter.)

1714: "The practice of all well-regulated courts of justice in the world." (So a trained and equipped court??? Or one that's fucking balanced and rational in how it adjudicates? tip: the latter.)

1812: "The equation of time ... is the adjustment of the difference of time as shown by a well-regulated clock and a true sun dial." (Accurate, and controlled. Not equipped, you numbskull.)

Need I go on??? Are you really that dense?

1848: "A remissness for which I am sure every well-regulated person will blame the Mayor."

1862: "It appeared to her well-regulated mind, like a clandestine proceeding."

1894: "The newspaper, a never wanting adjunct to every well-regulated American embryo city."

 

[Koios]

What did the term well regulated mean in the 1700s?

Did it mean controlled by the government? No.

It meant well disciplined or well equipped.

More like "well drilled and well trained."

You mean like military? Only military can have guns????

Ridiculous!!!

We can have guns, subject to well (sensible) REGULATED use of them. Which, btw, you can see right now, in America, if you look out the fucking window.

 

[Skull Pilot]

What did the term well regulated mean in the 1700s?

Did it mean controlled by the government? No.

It meant well disciplined or well equipped.

More like "well drilled and well trained."

You mean like military? Only military can have guns????

Ridiculous!!!

We can have guns, subject to well (sensible) REGULATED use of them. Which, btw, you can see right now, in America, if you look out the fucking window.

So only the military is capable of being well trained with a weapon?

Are you that fucking stupid. I know people who have never been in the military that can hit a postage stamp at 200 yards.

Gee I guess I should tell them that they aren't well trained huh?

 

[Koios]

More like "well drilled and well trained."

You mean like military? Only military can have guns????

Ridiculous!!!

We can have guns, subject to well (sensible) REGULATED use of them. Which, btw, you can see right now, in America, if you look out the fucking window.

So only the military is capable of being well trained with a weapon?

Are you that fucking stupid. I know people who have never been in the military that can hit a postage stamp at 200 yards.

Gee I guess I should tell them that they aren't well trained huh?

No. That was my point as to why interpretting "well-rgulated" as being "drilled/trained" is dead fucking wrong, which you'll note is NOT a requirement of gun ownership in America. The only requirement is that it falls within CURRENT GUN REGULATIONS!!!!

Look. See. Learn. Works like a charm.

 

[bripat9643]

What did the term well regulated mean in the 1700s?

Did it mean controlled by the government? No.

It meant well disciplined or well equipped.

More like "well drilled and well trained."

You mean like military? Only military can have guns????

Ridiculous!!!

No, not like the military. Militia groups used to train together all the time. They still do. Of course, freaks like you think that should be outlawed.

We can have guns, subject to well (sensible) REGULATED use of them. Which, btw, you can see right now, in America, if you look out the fucking window.

I have no idea what this is supposed to mean.

 

[bripat9643]

No. That was my point as to why interpretting "well-rgulated" as being "drilled/trained" is dead fucking wrong, which you'll note is NOT a requirement of gun ownership in America. The only requirement is that it falls within CURRENT GUN REGULATIONS!!!!

Look. See. Learn. Works like a charm.

The "well regulated militia" part of the 2nd Amendment is purely explanatory. It has no legal force, much as turds like you try to claim it does.

 

[Koios]

More like "well drilled and well trained."

You mean like military? Only military can have guns????

Ridiculous!!!

No, not like the military. Militia groups used to train together all the time. They still do. Of course, freaks like you think that should be outlawed.

We can have guns, subject to well (sensible) REGULATED use of them. Which, btw, you can see right now, in America, if you look out the fucking window.

I have no idea what this is supposed to mean.

Knock me over with a feather.

 

[bripat9643]

Me in red

The following are taken from the Oxford English Dictionary, and bracket in time the writing of the 2nd amendment:

1709: "If a liberal Education has formed in us well-regulated Appetites and worthy Inclinations." (So trained and equipped Appetites??? Or maybe Appetites that are rational and not over board? Tip: the latter.)

It obviously isn't used to mean "regulated" as in government regulation, moron

1714: "The practice of all well-regulated courts of justice in the world." (So a trained and equipped court??? Or one that's fucking balanced and rational in how it adjudicates? tip: the latter.)

It obviously isn't used to mean "regulated" as in government regulation, moron

1812: "The equation of time ... is the adjustment of the difference of time as shown by a well-regulated clock and a true sun dial." (Accurate, and controlled. Not equipped, you numbskull.)

It obviously isn't used to mean "regulated" as in government regulation, moron. Furthermore, no one ever claimed "regulated" means "equipped."

Need I go on??? Are you really that dense?

Please continue making a fool of yourself.

The phrase "well-regulated" was in common use long before 1789, and remained so for a century thereafter. It referred to the property of something being in proper working order. Something that was well-regulated was calibrated correctly, functioning as expected. Establishing government oversight of the people's arms was not only not the intent in using the phrase in the 2nd amendment, it was precisely to render the government powerless to do so that the founders wrote it

 

[PredFan]

Me in red

The following are taken from the Oxford English Dictionary, and bracket in time the writing of the 2nd amendment:

1709: "If a liberal Education has formed in us well-regulated Appetites and worthy Inclinations." (So trained and equipped Appetites??? Or maybe Appetites that are rational and not over board? Tip: the latter.)

It obviously isn't used to mean "regulated" as in government regulation, moron

1714: "The practice of all well-regulated courts of justice in the world." (So a trained and equipped court??? Or one that's fucking balanced and rational in how it adjudicates? tip: the latter.)

It obviously isn't used to mean "regulated" as in government regulation, moron

1812: "The equation of time ... is the adjustment of the difference of time as shown by a well-regulated clock and a true sun dial." (Accurate, and controlled. Not equipped, you numbskull.)

It obviously isn't used to mean "regulated" as in government regulation, moron

Need I go on??? Are you really that dense?

Please continue making a fool of yourself.

1848: "A remissness for which I am sure every well-regulated person will blame the Mayor."

1862: "It appeared to her well-regulated mind, like a clandestine proceeding."

1894: "The newspaper, a never wanting adjunct to every well-regulated American embryo city."

Good job.

 

[bripat9643]

We can have guns, subject to well (sensible) REGULATED use of them. Which, btw, you can see right now, in America, if you look out the fucking window.

I have no idea what this is supposed to mean.

Knock me over with a feather.

It's incoherent gibberish, moron.

 

[Koios]

I have no idea what this is supposed to mean.

Knock me over with a feather.

It's incoherent gibberish, moron.

Good info. Thanks.