If you aren’t going up in the rapture, are you ready to be interrogated?

[Not2BSubjugated]

Yea, but they like helping poor people.

What I was getting at wasn't what you think of the Christian-right's attitudes on helping people. You asked why it was so hard to believe that right wingers believe this stuff, implying that this stuff is incorrect and of course stupid right wingers would believe some incorrect stuff.

I was simply pointing out that many left wingers believe it to.

Now if you wanna get down to left and right and how they feel about helping people, allow me to distinguish, since it's on this very topic where I'm totally right wing.

I don't believe in the wellfare system and I don't believe in systems where the government redistributes wealth. This has nothing to do with whether or not I want to help people. In my personal life, I'm very charitable and always giving of my time to help out people around me. I don't believe that it's the government's job to force everyone to do as I do.

Wanting to help people and demanding that the government enforce your morals regarding charity are two very, very different things Rdean. Wanting to give away someone else's money to someone you feel needs it more isn't what generosity is. Generosity is giving of -yourself-

And to be clear, I've attended several evangelical churches in my lifetime. One or two pulled republican and one definitely pulled democrat. Know what the crazy part is? They were all heavily involved in community outreach and charity for the needy. Get off your high horse about Christian right wingers not wanting to help people. While you pat yourself on the back for being "kind" enough to demand that the government force people to give to oneanother, those people you condemn as selfish ACTUALLY give of themselves to help people. Not because it's a government mandate, but because they want to help people.

Quit being a dishonest, partisan dick.

That is pure bullshit and you know it. 85% of people on food stamps are children, veterans with disabilities and seniors.
And get this. The Catholic Charities gets most of it's money from the Government. I've linked to that several times already. I wonder how much money other so called charities get from the government.

Right wingers crying about "government" are like those morons with signs that say, "Keep government hands off my Medicare".

The problem with your kind, is that you've listened to this right wing bullshit for so long, it not only makes sense to you, but you believe it.

I'm not saying that the people running those churches are necessarily out to be charitable, they do get deductions afterall. But all the people volunteering at church community outreaches, soup kitchens, and food banks, many of whom I've met and many of whom I can honestly say are republican voters, aren't getting 1 cent of payment for their efforts.

Whether you care to admit it or not, people who disagree with you philosophically and politically aren't necessarily disagreeing because they're evil.

Also, I don't know why you're pointing out who the people are who are on disability. Who they are or why you feel they deserve their government money is immaterial. No matter how strong your opinion is on who deserves what, YOU ARE NOT GENEROUS FOR WANTING TO FORCE OTHERS TO PAY FOR THEM. Get the fuck over yourself.

There's plenty of right wingers out there who -actually- have more generous personalities than you do, as proven by their actions. Just because you judge your own generosity based on how strongly you feel certain groups of awesome people deserve the money of people you feel are much less awesome doesn't mean you're -actually- a giver.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

(1) I think those who believe in the Rapture worldwide are a small % of Christians.

(2) Scripture is quite clear that Christ would not condemn Roman law: "render unto Caesar's what is Caesar's".

The legality of taxation, welfare, etc., was decided long ago.

1. I agree, all I'm pointing out is that evangelicals, who are the source of the next biggest voting block of democrat Christians to the Catholics, -do- believe in the rapture despite not being uniformly right wing.

2. Christ said several times to obey the laws of the land, but he never said that whatever the law is you have to agree with it philosophically. My attitudes on taxation and welfare are generally pretty right-wing, but I've never advocated simply not paying your taxes. Just that I believe the laws should be different. Pretty big difference. There are those separatist advocates who say you should renounce your citizenship or claim sovereignty and just not pay, but I'd have to say that in my experience, most Christian right-wingers are pretty much in the same boat that I am where this is concerned. Obey the law, get it changed, that sorta thing. Arguably nothing un-Christ-like about it.

 

[hortysir]

(1) I think those who believe in the Rapture worldwide are a small % of Christians.

(2) Scripture is quite clear that Christ would not condemn Roman law: "render unto Caesar's what is Caesar's".

The legality of taxation, welfare, etc., was decided long ago.

1. I agree, all I'm pointing out is that evangelicals, who are the source of the next biggest voting block of democrat Christians to the Catholics, -do- believe in the rapture despite not being uniformly right wing.

2. Christ said several times to obey the laws of the land, but he never said that whatever the law is you have to agree with it philosophically. My attitudes on taxation and welfare are generally pretty right-wing, but I've never advocated simply not paying your taxes. Just that I believe the laws should be different. Pretty big difference. There are those separatist advocates who say you should renounce your citizenship or claim sovereignty and just not pay, but I'd have to say that in my experience, most Christian right-wingers are pretty much in the same boat that I am where this is concerned. Obey the law, get it changed, that sorta thing. Arguably nothing un-Christ-like about it.

The Bible teaches you to obey man's law as long as it doesn't contradict God's law.
Sounds kinda specific to me

 

[JakeStarkey]

This is interesting. "Rapture doctrine did not exist before John Darby invented it in 1830 AD. Before it "popped into John Darby's head" no one had ever heard of a secret rapture doctrine." Rapture Doctrine invented by John Darby in 1830 AD

I have no idea whether the philosophy is correct.

 

[Chuckt]

This is interesting. "Rapture doctrine did not exist before John Darby invented it in 1830 AD. Before it "popped into John Darby's head" no one had ever heard of a secret rapture doctrine." Rapture Doctrine invented by John Darby in 1830 AD

I have no idea whether the philosophy is correct.

No. He actually read about it and discovered it.

 

[YWN666]

I find it so difficult to believe that Right Wingers really believe this stuff.

Well, if it's any consolation, how you treat the poor will determine where you end up if Jesus is any indication. That's means most "Feed the poor and they will breed" Republicans will burn for eternity in hell.

If christians will be suddenly and unexpectedly taken from the earth, what happens if one of them is a doctor performing open heart surgery or one is a pilot flying a 757 with 300 people on it? If there was any legitimacy to this rapture nonsense, you'd see hospitals and airlines refusing to hire christians for fear that they would disappear and cause hundreds of deaths.

 

[hortysir]

I find it so difficult to believe that Right Wingers really believe this stuff.

Well, if it's any consolation, how you treat the poor will determine where you end up if Jesus is any indication. That's means most "Feed the poor and they will breed" Republicans will burn for eternity in hell.

If christians will be suddenly and unexpectedly taken from the earth, what happens if one of them is a doctor performing open heart surgery or one is a pilot flying a 757 with 300 people on it? If there was any legitimacy to this rapture nonsense, you'd see hospitals and airlines refusing to hire christians for fear that they would disappear and cause hundreds of deaths.

Every eye will see when HE returns
THAT is when the living will be called up

In the midst of His glory, will day-to-day trivialities really be that major?
Who is to say that patient won't be called up? Or 299 passengers?

Quit worrying about the "ifs" and start looking for the "when"


vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

 

[JakeStarkey]

This is interesting. "Rapture doctrine did not exist before John Darby invented it in 1830 AD. Before it "popped into John Darby's head" no one had ever heard of a secret rapture doctrine." Rapture Doctrine invented by John Darby in 1830 AD

I have no idea whether the philosophy is correct.

No. He actually read about it and discovered it.

God is always consistent, and to suggest a new doctrine is made available 19 centuries later because someone "actually read about it and discovered it" simply does not hold water.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The above comments clearly indicate there is no need to concern one's self with the Rapture.

 

[Chuckt]

This is interesting. "Rapture doctrine did not exist before John Darby invented it in 1830 AD. Before it "popped into John Darby's head" no one had ever heard of a secret rapture doctrine." Rapture Doctrine invented by John Darby in 1830 AD

I have no idea whether the philosophy is correct.

No. He actually read about it and discovered it.

God is always consistent, and to suggest a new doctrine is made available 19 centuries later because someone "actually read about it and discovered it" simply does not hold water.

The doctrine was available 2000 years ago and before.
You don't make the criteria. God makes the criteria.
Faithful Christians who knew the Bible were either martyred or hiding in the catacombs.
Over time, people started trying to harmonize the Bible with other writings instead of sticking to scripture.
The Bible is a book that you need inspiration, illumination and revelation to understand because the carnal man does not receive the things of God.
The Catholic church forbid people to read the Bible for years keeping people ignorant of what the Bible meant.
You're not a Christian to tell me what it means.

 

[YWN666]

I find it so difficult to believe that Right Wingers really believe this stuff.

Well, if it's any consolation, how you treat the poor will determine where you end up if Jesus is any indication. That's means most "Feed the poor and they will breed" Republicans will burn for eternity in hell.

If christians will be suddenly and unexpectedly taken from the earth, what happens if one of them is a doctor performing open heart surgery or one is a pilot flying a 757 with 300 people on it? If there was any legitimacy to this rapture nonsense, you'd see hospitals and airlines refusing to hire christians for fear that they would disappear and cause hundreds of deaths.

Every eye will see when HE returns
THAT is when the living will be called up

In the midst of His glory, will day-to-day trivialities really be that major?
Who is to say that patient won't be called up? Or 299 passengers?

Quit worrying about the "ifs" and start looking for the "when"


vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

There won't be a "when". I'm just asking some legitimate questions to point out the nonsensical nature of the whole story.

 

[Chuckt]

If christians will be suddenly and unexpectedly taken from the earth, what happens if one of them is a doctor performing open heart surgery or one is a pilot flying a 757 with 300 people on it? If there was any legitimacy to this rapture nonsense, you'd see hospitals and airlines refusing to hire christians for fear that they would disappear and cause hundreds of deaths.

Every eye will see when HE returns
THAT is when the living will be called up

In the midst of His glory, will day-to-day trivialities really be that major?
Who is to say that patient won't be called up? Or 299 passengers?

Quit worrying about the "ifs" and start looking for the "when"


vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

There won't be a "when". I'm just asking some legitimate questions to point out the nonsensical nature of the whole story.

What do you think I will say about it when I'm up in heaven?
They all said the Bible wasn't true. What do you think I will think about that kind of character then? They didn't believe. They fought about it. They argued. They made life harder for other people. They lied about it. What kind of conclusion do you think I will come to then?

 

[YWN666]

Every eye will see when HE returns
THAT is when the living will be called up

In the midst of His glory, will day-to-day trivialities really be that major?
Who is to say that patient won't be called up? Or 299 passengers?

Quit worrying about the "ifs" and start looking for the "when"


vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

There won't be a "when". I'm just asking some legitimate questions to point out the nonsensical nature of the whole story.

What do you think I will say about it when I'm up in heaven?
They all said the Bible wasn't true. What do you think I will think about that kind of character then? They didn't believe. They fought about it. They argued. They made life harder for other people. They lied about it. What kind of conclusion do you think I will come to then?

That's a loaded question. First you have to prove that there IS a heaven and that you are going to be there. THEN you can ask that question. Good luck.

 

[Chuckt]

There won't be a "when". I'm just asking some legitimate questions to point out the nonsensical nature of the whole story.

What do you think I will say about it when I'm up in heaven?
They all said the Bible wasn't true. What do you think I will think about that kind of character then? They didn't believe. They fought about it. They argued. They made life harder for other people. They lied about it. What kind of conclusion do you think I will come to then?

That's a loaded question. First you have to prove that there IS a heaven and that you are going to be there. THEN you can ask that question. Good luck.

Actually, we're all in this together and you're giving up your rights to tell me what I should about it in order to think fairly about it.

 

[YWN666]

What do you think I will say about it when I'm up in heaven?
They all said the Bible wasn't true. What do you think I will think about that kind of character then? They didn't believe. They fought about it. They argued. They made life harder for other people. They lied about it. What kind of conclusion do you think I will come to then?

That's a loaded question. First you have to prove that there IS a heaven and that you are going to be there. THEN you can ask that question. Good luck.

Actually, we're all in this together and you're giving up your rights to tell me what I should about it in order to think fairly about it.

Can I have an English translation please?

 

[hortysir]

If christians will be suddenly and unexpectedly taken from the earth, what happens if one of them is a doctor performing open heart surgery or one is a pilot flying a 757 with 300 people on it? If there was any legitimacy to this rapture nonsense, you'd see hospitals and airlines refusing to hire christians for fear that they would disappear and cause hundreds of deaths.

Every eye will see when HE returns
THAT is when the living will be called up

In the midst of His glory, will day-to-day trivialities really be that major?
Who is to say that patient won't be called up? Or 299 passengers?

Quit worrying about the "ifs" and start looking for the "when"


vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

There won't be a "when". I'm just asking some legitimate questions to point out the nonsensical nature of the whole story.

No.
You were making up imaginary "Ifs", without taking into account the magnitude of that Day

 

[JakeStarkey]

No. He actually read about it and discovered it.

God is always consistent, and to suggest a new doctrine is made available 19 centuries later because someone "actually read about it and discovered it" simply does not hold water.

The doctrine was available 2000 years ago and before.
You don't make the criteria. God makes the criteria.
Faithful Christians who knew the Bible were either martyred or hiding in the catacombs.
Over time, people started trying to harmonize the Bible with other writings instead of sticking to scripture.
The Bible is a book that you need inspiration, illumination and revelation to understand because the carnal man does not receive the things of God.
The Catholic church forbid people to read the Bible for years keeping people ignorant of what the Bible meant.
You're not a Christian to tell me what it means.

No, the doctrine was not available 1900 years ago.

Yes, you don't make criteria, God does.

Your faith understanding of scripture does not impute scriptural authority to you.

You having no divine authority to dictate doctrine to other Christians.

 

[JakeStarkey]

There is no "Day" coming based on scripture.

The interpretation was generated after 1830, without authority.

 

[theword]

There is no "Day" coming based on scripture.

The interpretation was generated after 1830, without authority.

You have no idea what God has planned for His people. The "Day" will prove that God's prophecies came from the Truth.

 

[hortysir]

There is no "Day" coming based on scripture.

The interpretation was generated after 1830, without authority.

So my Bible never says anything about man not knowing the day or the hour?

Or nothing about the dead in Christ rising first and the living being called up to be with Him