Is Jesus the Word of God?

[EGR one]

I thought Jesus was God.

So many christians say despite there being no mention of it in the new testament.

There are many references in the NT to Jesus being God. First chapter of gospel of John. First chapter of Revelation. Start with those two.

No there are notm and you need to cite specific chapters and verses. as the other fools failed to to do

~14 billion years ago all the matter and energy that exists in the universe occupied the space of 1 billionth of 1 trillionth the size of a single atom and then began to expand and cool. We know this from the cosmic background radiation, red shift and solutions to Einstein's General Theory of Relativity.

In fact, the matter that makes up who you are was present for the creation of space and time.

The laws of nature were in place before space and time were created as they governed the creation of space and time. These same laws predestined being that know and create would eventually arise.

Actually no we do not know that.

We know the expansion happened, however thanks to Einstein and the red shift ad background radiation we only have a good idea of what happened a tiny fraction of a second AFTER the expansion began.

We really do not have any idea what happened in the time before that fraction of a second.

Therefore the rest of your post is pure ignorance of cosmology. Especially the part about the laws being present BEFORE the expansion began which we do NOT know and have no reason to state as a truth the way you did.

Also nothing whatsoever in cosmology and our understanding of the universe points to it being created as opposed to happening due to natural forces.

You are dishonestly citing evidence where their is none at all

What possible natural force could create time and space and fill it with matter and energy?

 

[EGR one]

Sure I did.

It is possible for matter to have a beginning. In a closed universe the gravitational energy which is always negative exactly compensates the positive energy of matter. So the energy of a closed universe is always zero. So nothing prevents this universe from being spontaneously created. Because the net energy is always zero. The positive energy of matter is balanced by the negative energy of the gravity of that matter which is the space time curvature of that matter. There is no conservation law that prevents the formation of such a universe. In quantum mechanics if something is not forbidden by conservation laws, then it necessarily happens with some non-zero probability. So a closed universe can spontaneously appear - through the laws of quantum mechanics - out of nothing. And in fact there is an elegant mathematical description which describes this process and shows that a tiny closed universe having very high energy can spontaneously pop into existence and immediately start to expand and cool. In this description, the same laws that describe the evolution of the universe also describe the appearance of the universe which means that the laws were in place before the universe itself.

You never did period.

you never came close.

Even if some ( not all ) of your references are accurate they DO NOT point to creation.

beginning and creation are not synonymous

I just did in the post you replied to. Are you blind?

Tell you what, let's you and me go to the bull ring and go one on one. I'll take the position that there is evidence for God's existence.

How's that? Are you game? You vs me. One on one.

No you did not in any of your posts.

There is no evidence whatsoever for the existence of a god.

You failed miserably to provide a shred or speck or shred of evidence of a creator or creation.

The existence of the universe and the begining of the universe is not direct or even indirect evidence of any god.

You failed massively and are being quite the coward and liar so no you would never step outside and face someone.

So then let's you and me debate it in the bull ring. For everyone to see.

When one or more of debaters get to wield "magic" as a rhetorical asset, there can be no debate. All methods for testing the truth of anything become null and void, and the one wielding magic can make anything into anything they want to make it into.

Sorry, but you magical thinkers all disqualify yourselves from rational debate concerning your magical ides.

Apparently, you are confused as to what constitutes rational debate. Clearly, when discussing a spiritual entity with unlimited powers, one must rationally concede the unlimited powers. It is not rational to attempt to limit this omnipotent entity to the laws of nature as we know them.

And, since intelligent people easily recognize that there is no evidence, pro or con as to the existence or non existence of the God of the Bible, rational debate is limited to the credibility of faith. For instance, I have strong faith that I will live to see tomorrow. I have no evidence to support this faith, beyond having the odds in my favor, so it is a conclusion based solely on faith.

 

[Soupnazi630]

See this is where it convolutes itself with the edict of Nantes.. This three personage being one is just to preposterous...

Because you aren't a father and a son and a brother?

No one can be their OWN father son or brother.

The trinity is a rationalization created by later christians,

Truth is discovered.

Do you believe in God? Or are you an atheist?

I am an atheist and yes truth is discovered through evidence and intelligent thought which is the opposite of faith and ancient myth

What evidence leads you to the intelligent thought that God does not exist?

A lot of evidence such as the fact that every holy book is proven to be false contradictory and essentially fiction, usually inspired by other previous works of mythology.

Also the fact that there is simply no evidence of a god.

And a great deal more.

 

[Soupnazi630]

So many christians say despite there being no mention of it in the new testament.

There are many references in the NT to Jesus being God. First chapter of gospel of John. First chapter of Revelation. Start with those two.

No there are notm and you need to cite specific chapters and verses. as the other fools failed to to do

~14 billion years ago all the matter and energy that exists in the universe occupied the space of 1 billionth of 1 trillionth the size of a single atom and then began to expand and cool. We know this from the cosmic background radiation, red shift and solutions to Einstein's General Theory of Relativity.

In fact, the matter that makes up who you are was present for the creation of space and time.

The laws of nature were in place before space and time were created as they governed the creation of space and time. These same laws predestined being that know and create would eventually arise.

Actually no we do not know that.

We know the expansion happened, however thanks to Einstein and the red shift ad background radiation we only have a good idea of what happened a tiny fraction of a second AFTER the expansion began.

We really do not have any idea what happened in the time before that fraction of a second.

Therefore the rest of your post is pure ignorance of cosmology. Especially the part about the laws being present BEFORE the expansion began which we do NOT know and have no reason to state as a truth the way you did.

Also nothing whatsoever in cosmology and our understanding of the universe points to it being created as opposed to happening due to natural forces.

You are dishonestly citing evidence where their is none at all

What possible natural force could create time and space and fill it with matter and energy?

I don't know in fact I do not know if anyone else can answer that.

On the other hand we can still continue to try and find the answer through science. Unless we give up and say it is some god.

 

[EGR one]

Because you aren't a father and a son and a brother?

No one can be their OWN father son or brother.

The trinity is a rationalization created by later christians,

Truth is discovered.

Do you believe in God? Or are you an atheist?

I am an atheist and yes truth is discovered through evidence and intelligent thought which is the opposite of faith and ancient myth

What evidence leads you to the intelligent thought that God does not exist?

A lot of evidence such as the fact that every holy book is proven to be false contradictory and essentially fiction, usually inspired by other previous works of mythology.

Also the fact that there is simply no evidence of a god.

And a great deal more.

So, you have no evidence. And, there is no evidence that the Bible has been proven to be anything beyond a book about the Judeo-Christian religion. So much for your intelligent thought processes.

 

[EGR one]

There are many references in the NT to Jesus being God. First chapter of gospel of John. First chapter of Revelation. Start with those two.

No there are notm and you need to cite specific chapters and verses. as the other fools failed to to do

~14 billion years ago all the matter and energy that exists in the universe occupied the space of 1 billionth of 1 trillionth the size of a single atom and then began to expand and cool. We know this from the cosmic background radiation, red shift and solutions to Einstein's General Theory of Relativity.

In fact, the matter that makes up who you are was present for the creation of space and time.

The laws of nature were in place before space and time were created as they governed the creation of space and time. These same laws predestined being that know and create would eventually arise.

Actually no we do not know that.

We know the expansion happened, however thanks to Einstein and the red shift ad background radiation we only have a good idea of what happened a tiny fraction of a second AFTER the expansion began.

We really do not have any idea what happened in the time before that fraction of a second.

Therefore the rest of your post is pure ignorance of cosmology. Especially the part about the laws being present BEFORE the expansion began which we do NOT know and have no reason to state as a truth the way you did.

Also nothing whatsoever in cosmology and our understanding of the universe points to it being created as opposed to happening due to natural forces.

You are dishonestly citing evidence where their is none at all

What possible natural force could create time and space and fill it with matter and energy?

I don't know in fact I do not know if anyone else can answer that.

On the other hand we can still continue to try and find the answer through science. Unless we give up and say it is some god.

You are correct. No one can answer that question, and it is doubtful that it will be answered anytime soon. In fact, no one can even imagine what the answer might be. But, by all means, seek out the answer. Powers beyond our imagination, who would have thought it?

 

[MPS777]

There are many references in the NT to Jesus being God. First chapter of gospel of John. First chapter of Revelation. Start with those two.

No there are notm and you need to cite specific chapters and verses. as the other fools failed to to do

~14 billion years ago all the matter and energy that exists in the universe occupied the space of 1 billionth of 1 trillionth the size of a single atom and then began to expand and cool. We know this from the cosmic background radiation, red shift and solutions to Einstein's General Theory of Relativity.

In fact, the matter that makes up who you are was present for the creation of space and time.

The laws of nature were in place before space and time were created as they governed the creation of space and time. These same laws predestined being that know and create would eventually arise.

Actually no we do not know that.

We know the expansion happened, however thanks to Einstein and the red shift ad background radiation we only have a good idea of what happened a tiny fraction of a second AFTER the expansion began.

We really do not have any idea what happened in the time before that fraction of a second.

Therefore the rest of your post is pure ignorance of cosmology. Especially the part about the laws being present BEFORE the expansion began which we do NOT know and have no reason to state as a truth the way you did.

Also nothing whatsoever in cosmology and our understanding of the universe points to it being created as opposed to happening due to natural forces.

You are dishonestly citing evidence where their is none at all

What possible natural force could create time and space and fill it with matter and energy?

I don't know in fact I do not know if anyone else can answer that.

On the other hand we can still continue to try and find the answer through science. Unless we give up and say it is some god.

The inflaton is one theory:
Inflaton - Wikipedia

 

[Soupnazi630]

No one can be their OWN father son or brother.

The trinity is a rationalization created by later christians,

Truth is discovered.

Do you believe in God? Or are you an atheist?

I am an atheist and yes truth is discovered through evidence and intelligent thought which is the opposite of faith and ancient myth

What evidence leads you to the intelligent thought that God does not exist?

A lot of evidence such as the fact that every holy book is proven to be false contradictory and essentially fiction, usually inspired by other previous works of mythology.

Also the fact that there is simply no evidence of a god.

And a great deal more.

So, you have no evidence. And, there is no evidence that the Bible has been proven to be anything beyond a book about the Judeo-Christian religion. So much for your intelligent thought processes.

Yes I do

That which can be proclaimed without evidence is intelligently and logically dismissed without evidence.

So much for YOUR intelligence.

Sorry wrong the evidence is overwhelming that the bible is fiction. Fact deal with it

 

[BreezeWood]

For instance, I have strong faith that I will live to see tomorrow. I have no evidence to support this faith, beyond having the odds in my favor, so it is a conclusion based solely on faith.

faith is not limitless as that would prove its premise meaningless even if true - in your case your faith is resolved by the next days occurrence.

faith in a 4th century book is no different, at some point the faith becomes meaningless by the dearth for any meaningful occurrence over time as is true of the christian bible. some other outside source is required or the faith then morphs into a fantasy.

 

[ding]

How exactly do you prove there is no God?

The only knowledge you have of any god comes from ancient mythological books which we can prove are fictional.

Anything else is simply something you imagine.

Gee, you are even more ignorant than first thought.

Far less than you and i am correct.

No. Now go back to your minimum wage paying job.

Yes I and proved you wrong and ignorant and you know it.

You make Taz look intelligent.

 

[ding]

No. Now go back to your minimum wage paying job.

Says the guy who works at McDonald’s.

Says the guy who posts under multiple accounts.

Says the guy who believes in god with no proof.

The proof you are looking for can be found in your life in the absence of peace and harmony.

No it cannot and you have failed to provide any proof of any kind.

Says the chicken who never showed up in the Bull Ring.

 

[ding]

No there are notm and you need to cite specific chapters and verses. as the other fools failed to to do

~14 billion years ago all the matter and energy that exists in the universe occupied the space of 1 billionth of 1 trillionth the size of a single atom and then began to expand and cool. We know this from the cosmic background radiation, red shift and solutions to Einstein's General Theory of Relativity.

In fact, the matter that makes up who you are was present for the creation of space and time.

The laws of nature were in place before space and time were created as they governed the creation of space and time. These same laws predestined being that know and create would eventually arise.

Actually no we do not know that.

We know the expansion happened, however thanks to Einstein and the red shift ad background radiation we only have a good idea of what happened a tiny fraction of a second AFTER the expansion began.

We really do not have any idea what happened in the time before that fraction of a second.

Therefore the rest of your post is pure ignorance of cosmology. Especially the part about the laws being present BEFORE the expansion began which we do NOT know and have no reason to state as a truth the way you did.

Also nothing whatsoever in cosmology and our understanding of the universe points to it being created as opposed to happening due to natural forces.

You are dishonestly citing evidence where their is none at all

What possible natural force could create time and space and fill it with matter and energy?

I don't know in fact I do not know if anyone else can answer that.

On the other hand we can still continue to try and find the answer through science. Unless we give up and say it is some god.

The inflaton is one theory:
Inflaton - Wikipedia

Yes, but that means the laws of nature existed before space and time itself.

 

[Taz]

What I mean is it made no sense. Please explain.

The law of self compensation never sleeps, Taz. It is always at work. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. You are being pruned whether you believe it or not. Nothing is as it seems.

Got a link to your "law"?

I am afraid you will have to experience it for yourself.

So you've got no law, just as I thought.

You're kidding right? You've never even heard of the law of karma?

Karma - Wikipedia

Is that a good enough link? Want 50 more? I know it is a total waste of time talking to you and anything I say will utterly fall right off your back since you obviously are not looking for spiritual experience, but think God is something you must be able to sit on a table and examine. And you dare God to show himself, prove himself to you as you stand there eyes closed, hands in pocket, balancing on one foot with your pocket watch giving him conditions and a time limit. You don't believe in God because you don't WANT to believe in God, not that it's just a matter of faith, but it is a matter of being open and ready, its a matter of meeting him half way rather than as YOU think---- that you will believe in him after he shows himself to you, it is a matter of being far enough along the path to have the eyes to see him, a matter of your soul being ready. So you go right on being a skeptic, that is your right, because you will remain a skeptic all of your life, you'll never see God in your life because it is your very skepticism that forever bars you from having eyes that He might reveal his true wondrous nature to you.

Karma isn't a scientific effect. I don't believe that god has been proven yet because it hasn't, all you have is wishful thinking. If there's a god and it wanted me to see it, it would show itself to me, not leave me and everyone else dangling.

 

[hobelim]

The law of self compensation never sleeps, Taz. It is always at work. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. You are being pruned whether you believe it or not. Nothing is as it seems.

Got a link to your "law"?

I am afraid you will have to experience it for yourself.

So you've got no law, just as I thought.

You're kidding right? You've never even heard of the law of karma?

Karma - Wikipedia

Is that a good enough link? Want 50 more? I know it is a total waste of time talking to you and anything I say will utterly fall right off your back since you obviously are not looking for spiritual experience, but think God is something you must be able to sit on a table and examine. And you dare God to show himself, prove himself to you as you stand there eyes closed, hands in pocket, balancing on one foot with your pocket watch giving him conditions and a time limit. You don't believe in God because you don't WANT to believe in God, not that it's just a matter of faith, but it is a matter of being open and ready, its a matter of meeting him half way rather than as YOU think---- that you will believe in him after he shows himself to you, it is a matter of being far enough along the path to have the eyes to see him, a matter of your soul being ready. So you go right on being a skeptic, that is your right, because you will remain a skeptic all of your life, you'll never see God in your life because it is your very skepticism that forever bars you from having eyes that He might reveal his true wondrous nature to you.

Karma isn't a scientific effect. I don't believe that god has been proven yet because it hasn't, all you have is wishful thinking. If there's a god and it wanted me to see it, it would show itself to me, not leave me and everyone else dangling.

If there's a God and he wanted you to see it,it would show itself to you..

There you go. Perfectly logical..good for you.

Apparently, God has better things to do.

Maybe you can't entice him to visit you with a new perfume, and some empty promises?

Did you ever consider wearing a mini skirt?

 

[Taz]

Got a link to your "law"?

I am afraid you will have to experience it for yourself.

So you've got no law, just as I thought.

You're kidding right? You've never even heard of the law of karma?

Karma - Wikipedia

Is that a good enough link? Want 50 more? I know it is a total waste of time talking to you and anything I say will utterly fall right off your back since you obviously are not looking for spiritual experience, but think God is something you must be able to sit on a table and examine. And you dare God to show himself, prove himself to you as you stand there eyes closed, hands in pocket, balancing on one foot with your pocket watch giving him conditions and a time limit. You don't believe in God because you don't WANT to believe in God, not that it's just a matter of faith, but it is a matter of being open and ready, its a matter of meeting him half way rather than as YOU think---- that you will believe in him after he shows himself to you, it is a matter of being far enough along the path to have the eyes to see him, a matter of your soul being ready. So you go right on being a skeptic, that is your right, because you will remain a skeptic all of your life, you'll never see God in your life because it is your very skepticism that forever bars you from having eyes that He might reveal his true wondrous nature to you.

Karma isn't a scientific effect. I don't believe that god has been proven yet because it hasn't, all you have is wishful thinking. If there's a god and it wanted me to see it, it would show itself to me, not leave me and everyone else dangling.

If there's a God and he wanted you to see it,it would show itself to you..

There you go.

Apparently, God has better things to do.

Maybe you can't entice him to visit you with a new perfume, and empty promises?

Did you ever consider wearing a mini skirt?

Nobody else has actually ever been in touch with an invisible superbeing in another dimension either. You're delusional.

 

[IsaacNewton]

I thought he was a carpenter.

 

[hobelim]

I am afraid you will have to experience it for yourself.

So you've got no law, just as I thought.

You're kidding right? You've never even heard of the law of karma?

Karma - Wikipedia

Is that a good enough link? Want 50 more? I know it is a total waste of time talking to you and anything I say will utterly fall right off your back since you obviously are not looking for spiritual experience, but think God is something you must be able to sit on a table and examine. And you dare God to show himself, prove himself to you as you stand there eyes closed, hands in pocket, balancing on one foot with your pocket watch giving him conditions and a time limit. You don't believe in God because you don't WANT to believe in God, not that it's just a matter of faith, but it is a matter of being open and ready, its a matter of meeting him half way rather than as YOU think---- that you will believe in him after he shows himself to you, it is a matter of being far enough along the path to have the eyes to see him, a matter of your soul being ready. So you go right on being a skeptic, that is your right, because you will remain a skeptic all of your life, you'll never see God in your life because it is your very skepticism that forever bars you from having eyes that He might reveal his true wondrous nature to you.

Karma isn't a scientific effect. I don't believe that god has been proven yet because it hasn't, all you have is wishful thinking. If there's a god and it wanted me to see it, it would show itself to me, not leave me and everyone else dangling.

If there's a God and he wanted you to see it,it would show itself to you..

There you go.

Apparently, God has better things to do.

Maybe you can't entice him to visit you with a new perfume, and empty promises?

Did you ever consider wearing a mini skirt?

Nobody else has actually ever been in touch with an invisible superbeing in another dimension either. You're delusional.

Me delusional? It certainly agree that it must seem that way to you, lol...Is it any wonder? you are all hung up on kangaroos.

If no one else was ever in touch with an invisible superbeing from another dimension the bible would never have been written.

Maybe if you complain louder he will come down from his resting place to kiss your ass? Have you ever tried winking and waving? Blowing kisses? Can you twerk?

 

[hobelim]

I thought he was a carpenter.

I heard he spent a lot of time running amok with sinners in the holy land.

Must have been unemployed.

Oh, wait... In that story, things got so bad for the prodigal son that he almost ate the garbage that he was feeding the pigs.

Sounds like he got another job, feeding pigs, and almost lost his sanity in some sect or cult.

 

[Taz]

So you've got no law, just as I thought.

You're kidding right? You've never even heard of the law of karma?

Karma - Wikipedia

Is that a good enough link? Want 50 more? I know it is a total waste of time talking to you and anything I say will utterly fall right off your back since you obviously are not looking for spiritual experience, but think God is something you must be able to sit on a table and examine. And you dare God to show himself, prove himself to you as you stand there eyes closed, hands in pocket, balancing on one foot with your pocket watch giving him conditions and a time limit. You don't believe in God because you don't WANT to believe in God, not that it's just a matter of faith, but it is a matter of being open and ready, its a matter of meeting him half way rather than as YOU think---- that you will believe in him after he shows himself to you, it is a matter of being far enough along the path to have the eyes to see him, a matter of your soul being ready. So you go right on being a skeptic, that is your right, because you will remain a skeptic all of your life, you'll never see God in your life because it is your very skepticism that forever bars you from having eyes that He might reveal his true wondrous nature to you.

Karma isn't a scientific effect. I don't believe that god has been proven yet because it hasn't, all you have is wishful thinking. If there's a god and it wanted me to see it, it would show itself to me, not leave me and everyone else dangling.

If there's a God and he wanted you to see it,it would show itself to you..

There you go.

Apparently, God has better things to do.

Maybe you can't entice him to visit you with a new perfume, and empty promises?

Did you ever consider wearing a mini skirt?

Nobody else has actually ever been in touch with an invisible superbeing in another dimension either. You're delusional.

Me delusional? It certainly agree that it must seem that way to you, lol...Is it any wonder? you are all hung up on kangaroos.

If no one else was ever in touch with an invisible superbeing from another dimension the bible would never have been written.

Maybe if you complain louder he will come down from his resting place to kiss your ass? Have you ever tried winking and waving? Can you twerk?

The bible was written to control people, accept your lot in this life because in the next you'll be rewarded. Most people fell/fall for that because they desperately want to be liked and in a group of like minded people. Simpletons really, gullible enough to swallow that nonsense. I see nothing supernatural in the bible, just a bunch of cartoonish stories that nobody believes.

 

[hobelim]

You're kidding right? You've never even heard of the law of karma?

Karma - Wikipedia

Is that a good enough link? Want 50 more? I know it is a total waste of time talking to you and anything I say will utterly fall right off your back since you obviously are not looking for spiritual experience, but think God is something you must be able to sit on a table and examine. And you dare God to show himself, prove himself to you as you stand there eyes closed, hands in pocket, balancing on one foot with your pocket watch giving him conditions and a time limit. You don't believe in God because you don't WANT to believe in God, not that it's just a matter of faith, but it is a matter of being open and ready, its a matter of meeting him half way rather than as YOU think---- that you will believe in him after he shows himself to you, it is a matter of being far enough along the path to have the eyes to see him, a matter of your soul being ready. So you go right on being a skeptic, that is your right, because you will remain a skeptic all of your life, you'll never see God in your life because it is your very skepticism that forever bars you from having eyes that He might reveal his true wondrous nature to you.

Karma isn't a scientific effect. I don't believe that god has been proven yet because it hasn't, all you have is wishful thinking. If there's a god and it wanted me to see it, it would show itself to me, not leave me and everyone else dangling.

If there's a God and he wanted you to see it,it would show itself to you..

There you go.

Apparently, God has better things to do.

Maybe you can't entice him to visit you with a new perfume, and empty promises?

Did you ever consider wearing a mini skirt?

Nobody else has actually ever been in touch with an invisible superbeing in another dimension either. You're delusional.

Me delusional? It certainly agree that it must seem that way to you, lol...Is it any wonder? you are all hung up on kangaroos.

If no one else was ever in touch with an invisible superbeing from another dimension the bible would never have been written.

Maybe if you complain louder he will come down from his resting place to kiss your ass? Have you ever tried winking and waving? Can you twerk?

The bible was written to control people, accept your lot in this life because in the next you'll be rewarded. Most people fell/fall for that because they desperately want to be liked and in a group of like minded people. Simpletons really, gullible enough to swallow that nonsense. I see nothing supernatural in the bible, just a bunch of cartoonish stories that nobody believes.

You read the bible and see nothing..lol... What can I say, Taz?

Congratulations? Goodie for you and whoop di doo?