Is there a god?

[toobfreak]

Really! So you haven't "found God," so don't know the first thing about Him, but you sure as hell know when someone else tells you they did and are lying?" Gee.

The funny thing about threads like this is that even when presented with a genuine opportunity to learn, none of the people actually asking the questions want to take advantage of the opportunity when presented to them! Proof positive that those claiming "a lack of evidence" are really just saying: "a lack of desire" on their part. You don't want to know, you just want to try to discredit and knock holes in anyone who says that religion and faith are not a waste of time. In other words, YOU are a waste of time.

I know all about the god believers talk about, I just don't see any real plausibility in what they tell me. Simply never makes any sense.

I'd like to learn about a real god, not some make up brah who drowned nearly all of humanity in his flood, he also helped the Israelites murder everyone in Jericho, Heshbon, Bashan and many more, usually killing women, children and animals at the same time. God once helped some Israelites kill 500,000 other Israelites. Totally cartoonish.

Then look beyond Western Christianity. God appears under many names and in many religions thousands of years before Christ.

I have, BUT haven't found a path to a reaL GOD YET.

Then maybe you need to let the path find you.

I'm open to god contacting me. Always have been. I'm agnostic, so don't see proof for or against a god, but am open to changing my mind given real proof. Can't be any fairer than that. And that's why I'm interested in the subject.

Good. Most of all, foster a sincere desire and yearning for something higher than yourself.

 

[harmonica]

they think they've found him--in their minds only

I have chosen the better portion. I hope you find half as much happiness in life as I have.

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

I think you are confusing man's interpretation of religious doctrine, with God's intent, expressed through said doctrine. Man is, by our very nature, imperfect, and therefore, do things that are against God's will. This fact does not, in any way, change God's will, or His plan/intent. God gave man the gift of reason so that each individual may CHOOSE their own path. That we may question the very existence of a god. What we do with that gift/ability is up to us, and our actions (regardless of their origins) are on us, as individuals.

Seriously brah, if there was a god, do you actually think that it would need to express its will through A FUCKING BOOK??? AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!

Taz, your making an awful mistake if you don't realize that God can reveal himself to you in countless ways--- ---of His choosing. An austerity, a repentance, a self-less act, a child's face, a lifelong friend, an animal's gratitude, a stranger's compassion, an unexpected event, a sudden epiphany, yes, even in a book.

god is just wishful thinking....''a child's face''??

 

[oldsoul]

Your refusal to accept the reality here is duly noted. Name call all you like, the fact remains you are being dishonest when you imply that you want a serious discussion to satisfy your curiosity. What you are looking for is a venue to attempt to discredit and impune the character of those who disagree with you.

The arguments for the god of the bible at this forum are of a feeble minded level. I came here looking for serious discussion, unfortunately I have found none, it's pretty much all nonsense that believers spout here. Which led me to my conclusion. That you can't accept it is your problem, not mine. maybe you can up god's side of the discussion here. Have any proof?

If it is proof you are looking for, I have what I believe and nothing more. One can "see" proof if one wishes, or one can "see" no proof, if that is what one wishes. Whether or not there is proof is not the point here. If you do not believe there is a god that's just fine with me. What I want to know from you, then, is what does that mean to you?

I'm agnostic, I see no proof either way for or against the possibility of a god(s), but am open to changing my mind given empirical proof either way. That's why I first came here, to see if there was anything concrete that people believed in. Apparently, there's not. Not here, anyways.

Well, if it's empirical proof you seek, I wish you all the luck in the world. I doubt you will ever find any, at least not in this life. See, the problem is that the very concept of god is far beyond anything we mere humans can comprehend. Therefore, empirical proof is impossible.

In other words, you have no real proof so you scapegoat your made up god and say that it's so on another level that there can be no proof. Oldest trick in The Book. YAWWWWN!

Ok, maybe this will be of more interest to you. Assume, for a moment, there is a god, and that said god created the entire universe. What tells you that we, as mere humans, would have the ability to come even close to comprehending what that god is, let alone "real proof" that said god exists? What tells you that we have the ability to explain such an entity? Such an entity would, I say is, so far beyond our ability to comprehend that we really have no hope of EVER understanding. Therefore, what you ask for is far beyond your ability to comprehend, and is, therefore, completely futile. Unless, of course, you can explain where all the matter in the universe came from... If not a god, then what? It just always has been? Where did the laws of nature come from? If evolution is the truth, then why did life on this planet only start once? Do you understand what the odds of THAT scenario are, that life, spontaneously, started only once in the entire history of the world?

 

[oldsoul]

They’re just going to spout a bunch of bible stuff without any serious proof. I have yet to find anyone who has actually found god, they might say they have, but when questioned, it’s obvious that they haven’t found shit.

they think they've found him--in their minds only

I have chosen the better portion. I hope you find half as much happiness in life as I have.

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

I think you are confusing man's interpretation of religious doctrine, with God's intent, expressed through said doctrine. Man is, by our very nature, imperfect, and therefore, do things that are against God's will. This fact does not, in any way, change God's will, or His plan/intent. God gave man the gift of reason so that each individual may CHOOSE their own path. That we may question the very existence of a god. What we do with that gift/ability is up to us, and our actions (regardless of their origins) are on us, as individuals.

Seriously brah, if there was a god, do you actually think that it would need to express its will through A FUCKING BOOK??? AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!

Are you being serious, or just facetious? HOW ELSE WOULD IT EXPRESS ITSELF? Furthermore, it was not God who expressed himself through a book. God expressed himself through men, and commanded men to write an account of said expression. Therefore, the Bible, Koran, Torah, and all other religious documents are, at most, man's interpretation of God's will. Are you really so uneducated as to not understand that?

 

[oldsoul]

I have chosen the better portion. I hope you find half as much happiness in life as I have.

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

The moral law is about what we ought to do, not what we do. But what we do does not negate the moral law.

But everyone who leans on religion thinks they are right and following your moral law. Like I said before, who gets to decide? Because ALL believers think that their view is right, especially Christians in the US, and they are obviously simply stupid and nuts.

Well, I guess that makes me a non-believer then. I do NOT think my view is the only way, I do NOT think my view is right for anyone but me. Therefore, by your logic, I am a non-believer.

See what happens when you start over generalising? It's offensive and immoral. You ONLY create animosity, and THAT is where your view falls.

You made something up to fit your world, which makes you a believer... in something made up. That it creates animosity is on you, people don't usually like the hard questions...

Hard questions? you want hard questions? Hows's this:

If not God, then how did EVERYTHING come to be? I mean before even the theory of "The Big Bang"? Where did the matter come from to begin with? How's that for a hard question?

 

[harmonica]

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

The moral law is about what we ought to do, not what we do. But what we do does not negate the moral law.

But everyone who leans on religion thinks they are right and following your moral law. Like I said before, who gets to decide? Because ALL believers think that their view is right, especially Christians in the US, and they are obviously simply stupid and nuts.

Well, I guess that makes me a non-believer then. I do NOT think my view is the only way, I do NOT think my view is right for anyone but me. Therefore, by your logic, I am a non-believer.

See what happens when you start over generalising? It's offensive and immoral. You ONLY create animosity, and THAT is where your view falls.

You made something up to fit your world, which makes you a believer... in something made up. That it creates animosity is on you, people don't usually like the hard questions...

Hard questions? you want hard questions? Hows's this:

If not God, then how did EVERYTHING come to be? I mean before even the theory of "The Big Bang"? Where did the matter come from to begin with? How's that for a hard question?

that's not proof of god when you ask questions..answers are proof--not questions

 

[Indeependent]

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

The moral law is about what we ought to do, not what we do. But what we do does not negate the moral law.

But everyone who leans on religion thinks they are right and following your moral law. Like I said before, who gets to decide? Because ALL believers think that their view is right, especially Christians in the US, and they are obviously simply stupid and nuts.

Well, I guess that makes me a non-believer then. I do NOT think my view is the only way, I do NOT think my view is right for anyone but me. Therefore, by your logic, I am a non-believer.

See what happens when you start over generalising? It's offensive and immoral. You ONLY create animosity, and THAT is where your view falls.

You made something up to fit your world, which makes you a believer... in something made up. That it creates animosity is on you, people don't usually like the hard questions...

Hard questions? you want hard questions? Hows's this:

If not God, then how did EVERYTHING come to be? I mean before even the theory of "The Big Bang"? Where did the matter come from to begin with? How's that for a hard question?

Shhh!

 

[alang1216]

Hard questions? you want hard questions? Hows's this:

If not God, then how did EVERYTHING come to be? I mean before even the theory of "The Big Bang"? Where did the matter come from to begin with? How's that for a hard question?

That's an easy question to answer. The answer is: We don't know. Plenty of theories, maybe one is even true but in the end we just don't know. I'm optimistic that one day we'll have a real answer but for now, we don't know.

 

[Taz]

The arguments for the god of the bible at this forum are of a feeble minded level. I came here looking for serious discussion, unfortunately I have found none, it's pretty much all nonsense that believers spout here. Which led me to my conclusion. That you can't accept it is your problem, not mine. maybe you can up god's side of the discussion here. Have any proof?

If it is proof you are looking for, I have what I believe and nothing more. One can "see" proof if one wishes, or one can "see" no proof, if that is what one wishes. Whether or not there is proof is not the point here. If you do not believe there is a god that's just fine with me. What I want to know from you, then, is what does that mean to you?

I'm agnostic, I see no proof either way for or against the possibility of a god(s), but am open to changing my mind given empirical proof either way. That's why I first came here, to see if there was anything concrete that people believed in. Apparently, there's not. Not here, anyways.

Well, if it's empirical proof you seek, I wish you all the luck in the world. I doubt you will ever find any, at least not in this life. See, the problem is that the very concept of god is far beyond anything we mere humans can comprehend. Therefore, empirical proof is impossible.

In other words, you have no real proof so you scapegoat your made up god and say that it's so on another level that there can be no proof. Oldest trick in The Book. YAWWWWN!

Ok, maybe this will be of more interest to you. Assume, for a moment, there is a god, and that said god created the entire universe. What tells you that we, as mere humans, would have the ability to come even close to comprehending what that god is, let alone "real proof" that said god exists? What tells you that we have the ability to explain such an entity? Such an entity would, I say is, so far beyond our ability to comprehend that we really have no hope of EVER understanding. Therefore, what you ask for is far beyond your ability to comprehend, and is, therefore, completely futile. Unless, of course, you can explain where all the matter in the universe came from... If not a god, then what? It just always has been? Where did the laws of nature come from? If evolution is the truth, then why did life on this planet only start once? Do you understand what the odds of THAT scenario are, that life, spontaneously, started only once in the entire history of the world?

What tells you that we wouldn't have the ability to explain and understand such an entity? You're assuming facts not in evidence. And then say, well, since such an entity is beyond our scope, then I'll simply make one up, some hateful brah who drowns babies and adults, helps kills others, and threatens up with roasting if we don't obey a book. It's so totally ludicrous that I'm amazed that in this day and age, ANYONE still believes in that nonsense.

 

[Taz]

The arguments for the god of the bible at this forum are of a feeble minded level. I came here looking for serious discussion, unfortunately I have found none, it's pretty much all nonsense that believers spout here. Which led me to my conclusion. That you can't accept it is your problem, not mine. maybe you can up god's side of the discussion here. Have any proof?

If it is proof you are looking for, I have what I believe and nothing more. One can "see" proof if one wishes, or one can "see" no proof, if that is what one wishes. Whether or not there is proof is not the point here. If you do not believe there is a god that's just fine with me. What I want to know from you, then, is what does that mean to you?

I'm agnostic, I see no proof either way for or against the possibility of a god(s), but am open to changing my mind given empirical proof either way. That's why I first came here, to see if there was anything concrete that people believed in. Apparently, there's not. Not here, anyways.

Well, if it's empirical proof you seek, I wish you all the luck in the world. I doubt you will ever find any, at least not in this life. See, the problem is that the very concept of god is far beyond anything we mere humans can comprehend. Therefore, empirical proof is impossible.

In other words, you have no real proof so you scapegoat your made up god and say that it's so on another level that there can be no proof. Oldest trick in The Book. YAWWWWN!

Ok, maybe this will be of more interest to you. Assume, for a moment, there is a god, and that said god created the entire universe. What tells you that we, as mere humans, would have the ability to come even close to comprehending what that god is, let alone "real proof" that said god exists? What tells you that we have the ability to explain such an entity? Such an entity would, I say is, so far beyond our ability to comprehend that we really have no hope of EVER understanding. Therefore, what you ask for is far beyond your ability to comprehend, and is, therefore, completely futile. Unless, of course, you can explain where all the matter in the universe came from... If not a god, then what? It just always has been? Where did the laws of nature come from? If evolution is the truth, then why did life on this planet only start once? Do you understand what the odds of THAT scenario are, that life, spontaneously, started only once in the entire history of the world?

Just because at this point in time we don't know where all matter comes from doesn't default over to it being from an invisible being. That's pure fantasy.

If evolution isn't the truth, then do you believe that god just started plopping people around there earth? How did that work exactly? He made Adam out of thin air, then ripped out one of his ribs to make Eve?

 

[Taz]

they think they've found him--in their minds only

I have chosen the better portion. I hope you find half as much happiness in life as I have.

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

I think you are confusing man's interpretation of religious doctrine, with God's intent, expressed through said doctrine. Man is, by our very nature, imperfect, and therefore, do things that are against God's will. This fact does not, in any way, change God's will, or His plan/intent. God gave man the gift of reason so that each individual may CHOOSE their own path. That we may question the very existence of a god. What we do with that gift/ability is up to us, and our actions (regardless of their origins) are on us, as individuals.

Seriously brah, if there was a god, do you actually think that it would need to express its will through A FUCKING BOOK??? AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!

Are you being serious, or just facetious? HOW ELSE WOULD IT EXPRESS ITSELF? Furthermore, it was not God who expressed himself through a book. God expressed himself through men, and commanded men to write an account of said expression. Therefore, the Bible, Koran, Torah, and all other religious documents are, at most, man's interpretation of God's will. Are you really so uneducated as to not understand that?

Is god so lame that he can't express himself directly to me, and that I can only get in touch with him through a 2000 year old book of non-stop nonsense not in evidence written by people who were so primitive that they hadn't even been able to invent toilet paper at that time? Do you understand THAT?

 

[ding]

I have chosen the better portion. I hope you find half as much happiness in life as I have.

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

I think you are confusing man's interpretation of religious doctrine, with God's intent, expressed through said doctrine. Man is, by our very nature, imperfect, and therefore, do things that are against God's will. This fact does not, in any way, change God's will, or His plan/intent. God gave man the gift of reason so that each individual may CHOOSE their own path. That we may question the very existence of a god. What we do with that gift/ability is up to us, and our actions (regardless of their origins) are on us, as individuals.

Seriously brah, if there was a god, do you actually think that it would need to express its will through A FUCKING BOOK??? AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!

Are you being serious, or just facetious? HOW ELSE WOULD IT EXPRESS ITSELF? Furthermore, it was not God who expressed himself through a book. God expressed himself through men, and commanded men to write an account of said expression. Therefore, the Bible, Koran, Torah, and all other religious documents are, at most, man's interpretation of God's will. Are you really so uneducated as to not understand that?

Is god so lame that he can't express himself directly to me, and that I can only get in touch with him through a 2000 year old book of non-stop nonsense not in evidence written by people who were so primitive that they hadn't even been able to invent toilet paper at that time? Do you understand THAT?

Are you waiting for a personal invitation before you stop being a militant atheist?

 

[Taz]

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

The moral law is about what we ought to do, not what we do. But what we do does not negate the moral law.

But everyone who leans on religion thinks they are right and following your moral law. Like I said before, who gets to decide? Because ALL believers think that their view is right, especially Christians in the US, and they are obviously simply stupid and nuts.

Well, I guess that makes me a non-believer then. I do NOT think my view is the only way, I do NOT think my view is right for anyone but me. Therefore, by your logic, I am a non-believer.

See what happens when you start over generalising? It's offensive and immoral. You ONLY create animosity, and THAT is where your view falls.

You made something up to fit your world, which makes you a believer... in something made up. That it creates animosity is on you, people don't usually like the hard questions...

Hard questions? you want hard questions? Hows's this:

If not God, then how did EVERYTHING come to be? I mean before even the theory of "The Big Bang"? Where did the matter come from to begin with? How's that for a hard question?

Think about this, when god said let there be light, that wasn't the Big Bang, because after the BB happened, the universe was dark for a few hundred million years. Light only started to appear after some of the matter spewed out by the BB coalesced and because stars.

Like I said, not knowing something doesn't lead to an invisible superbeing in another dimension, when there is absolutely no proof, only speculation, for said invisible superbeing.

 

[ding]

The moral law is about what we ought to do, not what we do. But what we do does not negate the moral law.

But everyone who leans on religion thinks they are right and following your moral law. Like I said before, who gets to decide? Because ALL believers think that their view is right, especially Christians in the US, and they are obviously simply stupid and nuts.

Well, I guess that makes me a non-believer then. I do NOT think my view is the only way, I do NOT think my view is right for anyone but me. Therefore, by your logic, I am a non-believer.

See what happens when you start over generalising? It's offensive and immoral. You ONLY create animosity, and THAT is where your view falls.

You made something up to fit your world, which makes you a believer... in something made up. That it creates animosity is on you, people don't usually like the hard questions...

Hard questions? you want hard questions? Hows's this:

If not God, then how did EVERYTHING come to be? I mean before even the theory of "The Big Bang"? Where did the matter come from to begin with? How's that for a hard question?

Think about this, when god said let there be light, that wasn't the Big Bang, because after the BB happened, the universe was dark for a few hundred million years. Light only started to appear after some of the matter spewed out by the BB coalesced and because stars.

Like I said, not knowing something doesn't lead to an invisible superbeing in another dimension, when there is absolutely no proof, only speculation, for said invisible superbeing.

The account of genesis is the allegorical account of creation. Creation includes everything.

 

[Taz]

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

I think you are confusing man's interpretation of religious doctrine, with God's intent, expressed through said doctrine. Man is, by our very nature, imperfect, and therefore, do things that are against God's will. This fact does not, in any way, change God's will, or His plan/intent. God gave man the gift of reason so that each individual may CHOOSE their own path. That we may question the very existence of a god. What we do with that gift/ability is up to us, and our actions (regardless of their origins) are on us, as individuals.

Seriously brah, if there was a god, do you actually think that it would need to express its will through A FUCKING BOOK??? AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!

Are you being serious, or just facetious? HOW ELSE WOULD IT EXPRESS ITSELF? Furthermore, it was not God who expressed himself through a book. God expressed himself through men, and commanded men to write an account of said expression. Therefore, the Bible, Koran, Torah, and all other religious documents are, at most, man's interpretation of God's will. Are you really so uneducated as to not understand that?

Is god so lame that he can't express himself directly to me, and that I can only get in touch with him through a 2000 year old book of non-stop nonsense not in evidence written by people who were so primitive that they hadn't even been able to invent toilet paper at that time? Do you understand THAT?

Are you waiting for a personal invitation before you stop being a militant atheist?

If I'm a militant atheists as you claim, then why would I be waiting for an invitation from a god? I'd have to be agnostic for wanting that. Please try again, and this time, try to make sense.

 

[harmonica]

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

I think you are confusing man's interpretation of religious doctrine, with God's intent, expressed through said doctrine. Man is, by our very nature, imperfect, and therefore, do things that are against God's will. This fact does not, in any way, change God's will, or His plan/intent. God gave man the gift of reason so that each individual may CHOOSE their own path. That we may question the very existence of a god. What we do with that gift/ability is up to us, and our actions (regardless of their origins) are on us, as individuals.

Seriously brah, if there was a god, do you actually think that it would need to express its will through A FUCKING BOOK??? AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!

Are you being serious, or just facetious? HOW ELSE WOULD IT EXPRESS ITSELF? Furthermore, it was not God who expressed himself through a book. God expressed himself through men, and commanded men to write an account of said expression. Therefore, the Bible, Koran, Torah, and all other religious documents are, at most, man's interpretation of God's will. Are you really so uneducated as to not understand that?

Is god so lame that he can't express himself directly to me, and that I can only get in touch with him through a 2000 year old book of non-stop nonsense not in evidence written by people who were so primitive that they hadn't even been able to invent toilet paper at that time? Do you understand THAT?

Are you waiting for a personal invitation before you stop being a militant atheist?

atheist is not really a good term--realist is better

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Nature Is Not Supernatural

Tree-hugging nature-worship by misfits who know they don't belong is actually primitive and pagan.

Atheist Liberals hug trees.

Left and Right Come From the Same Source

They do it to make them feel morally superior to everyone else, which makes them theists.

Which has what to do with scientific anamolies?

Dismiss Dyslexics

If you can't spell anomaly, you don't have a high enough IQ to discuss science.

Having a discussion with one such as yourself who relies on ad hominems raises it to a new level.
Address the topic.

Bossy Buttboys for the Bosses

I have no obligation to enlighten you, but ad hominem is significant evidence. "Fallacy" only means it can't be used for conclusive proof, supposedly clinching the debate once it is introduced. Authoritarian conformists aren't worth discussing anything with, so I won't go into why scientific "anomalies" actually indicate that there is something wrong with the basic principles Postmodern scientists use.

 

[Indeependent]

Atheist Liberals hug trees.

Left and Right Come From the Same Source

They do it to make them feel morally superior to everyone else, which makes them theists.

Which has what to do with scientific anamolies?

Dismiss Dyslexics

If you can't spell anomaly, you don't have a high enough IQ to discuss science.

Having a discussion with one such as yourself who relies on ad hominems raises it to a new level.
Address the topic.

Bossy Buttboys for the Bosses

I have no obligation to enlighten you, but ad hominem is significant evidence. "Fallacy" only means it can't be used for conclusive proof, supposedly clinching the debate once it is introduced. Authoritarian conformists aren't worth discussing anything with, so I won't go into why scientific "anomalies" actually indicate that there is something wrong with the basic principles Postmodern scientists use.

Organic science is decades behind non-organic.
Too many scientific theories are not even worth being theories.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Curious why you say that? Of course there is! But it is unique to every individual and you must find your own way. The spiritual path isn't like a diet that someone can recommend and you simple follow steps A, B and C and get there. The soul measures progress in its own way---- for some it might take many lifetimes; for others, they might realize God in an instant. The best way to find God is to first find someone else who has found God, a bonafide aspirant you have faith in who can guide you.

They’re just going to spout a bunch of bible stuff without any serious proof. I have yet to find anyone who has actually found god, they might say they have, but when questioned, it’s obvious that they haven’t found shit.

they think they've found him--in their minds only

I have chosen the better portion. I hope you find half as much happiness in life as I have.

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

I think you are confusing man's interpretation of religious doctrine, with God's intent, expressed through said doctrine. Man is, by our very nature, imperfect, and therefore, do things that are against God's will. This fact does not, in any way, change God's will, or His plan/intent. God gave man the gift of reason so that each individual may CHOOSE their own path. That we may question the very existence of a god. What we do with that gift/ability is up to us, and our actions (regardless of their origins) are on us, as individuals.

Worms Trying to Wriggle off the Hook

The same kind of predatory rationalization is used by Constitutionazis. They preach that their political Bible is almost divinely superior to the opinion of the majority. That's what allows them to exonerate the Constitution by saying that any harmful outcomes from that supremacy document are "misinterpretations" of it by the masses, whom they have a desperate need to feel superior to.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

If it makes you feel better, than believer in the Spaghetti Monster if you want. Where I have a problem is when religion is the reason for so much killing in the world, or when parents want Creation taught in science class, which is fucking with kids' minds, or when idiots say that they have a god given right to a gun... then I have a big problem with religion.

The moral law is about what we ought to do, not what we do. But what we do does not negate the moral law.

But everyone who leans on religion thinks they are right and following your moral law. Like I said before, who gets to decide? Because ALL believers think that their view is right, especially Christians in the US, and they are obviously simply stupid and nuts.

Well, I guess that makes me a non-believer then. I do NOT think my view is the only way, I do NOT think my view is right for anyone but me. Therefore, by your logic, I am a non-believer.

See what happens when you start over generalising? It's offensive and immoral. You ONLY create animosity, and THAT is where your view falls.

You made something up to fit your world, which makes you a believer... in something made up. That it creates animosity is on you, people don't usually like the hard questions...

Hard questions? you want hard questions? Hows's this:

If not God, then how did EVERYTHING come to be? I mean before even the theory of "The Big Bang"? Where did the matter come from to begin with? How's that for a hard question?

Your Special and Selective "Logic"

How did God come to be? If God has always been, without a beginning, then why don't you allow us to say the same about matter?