Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

[Disgruntled_American]

Interesting...
Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Associated Press
By TAMI ABDOLLAH and ERIC TUCKER, Associated Press
1 hr ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — A U.S. magistrate ordered Apple Inc. on Tuesday to help the Obama administration hack into an encrypted iPhone belonging to one of the shooters in the December attack in San Bernardino, California, in a first-of-its-kind ruling that pits digital privacy against national security interests.

The ruling by Magistrate Judge Sheri Pym, a former federal prosecutor, requires Apple to supply highly specialized software the FBI can load onto the county-owned work iPhone to bypass a self-destruct feature, which erases the phone's data after too many unsuccessful attempts to unlock it. The FBI wants to be able to try different combinations in rapid sequence until it finds the right one.

The decision gives the Justice Department a significant victory in an entrenched technology policy battle, as more-powerful encryption services threaten the ability of federal agents to uncover important evidence in criminal or terrorism cases. The Obama administration, which has embraced stronger encryption as a way to keep consumers safe on the Internet, had struggled to find a compelling example to make its case.

The ruling Tuesday tied the problem to the deadliest terrorist attack on U.S. soil since the 2001 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Farook and his wife, Tashfeen Malik, killed 14 people in a Dec. 2 shooting at a holiday luncheon for Farook's co-workers. The couple later died in a gun battle with police.

Federal prosecutors told the judge in a court application Tuesday that they can't access a work phone used by Syed Farook because they don't know his passcode and Apple has not cooperated. Under U.S. law, a work phone is generally the property of a person's employer. The judge told Apple to provide an estimate of its cost to comply with her order, suggesting that the government will be expected to pay for the work.

...

"It is a big problem for law enforcement armed with a search warrant when you find a device that can't be opened even when a judge says there's probable cause to open it," Comey said. "It affects our counterterrorism work. San Bernardino, a very important investigation to us, we still have one of those killers' phones that we have not been able to open, and it's been over two months and we're still working on it."

Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Apparently Apple has unlocked over 70 phones for the feds in the past.
Why are they protecting this one?

In the past they already had methods to get into the phones that they purposely developed beforehand. In this case, they would have to create a backdoor and that goes against their phones being secure like they claim.

 

[dannyboys]

Apple should open the phone at their facility hand the open phone to the FBI and destroy the code...

Or they can just give the FBI a print-out of what's on the phone. It would be easy to hold a private meeting between Apple and the FBI. Have a bunch of FBI agents personally examine what's on the phone and certify the print-outs are complete. All the time Apple is in possession of the phone. Have the phone physically destroyed in the presence of the FBI experts and everyone goes back to their offices. No problem.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Interesting...
Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Associated Press
By TAMI ABDOLLAH and ERIC TUCKER, Associated Press
1 hr ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — A U.S. magistrate ordered Apple Inc. on Tuesday to help the Obama administration hack into an encrypted iPhone belonging to one of the shooters in the December attack in San Bernardino, California, in a first-of-its-kind ruling that pits digital privacy against national security interests.

The ruling by Magistrate Judge Sheri Pym, a former federal prosecutor, requires Apple to supply highly specialized software the FBI can load onto the county-owned work iPhone to bypass a self-destruct feature, which erases the phone's data after too many unsuccessful attempts to unlock it. The FBI wants to be able to try different combinations in rapid sequence until it finds the right one.

The decision gives the Justice Department a significant victory in an entrenched technology policy battle, as more-powerful encryption services threaten the ability of federal agents to uncover important evidence in criminal or terrorism cases. The Obama administration, which has embraced stronger encryption as a way to keep consumers safe on the Internet, had struggled to find a compelling example to make its case.

The ruling Tuesday tied the problem to the deadliest terrorist attack on U.S. soil since the 2001 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Farook and his wife, Tashfeen Malik, killed 14 people in a Dec. 2 shooting at a holiday luncheon for Farook's co-workers. The couple later died in a gun battle with police.

Federal prosecutors told the judge in a court application Tuesday that they can't access a work phone used by Syed Farook because they don't know his passcode and Apple has not cooperated. Under U.S. law, a work phone is generally the property of a person's employer. The judge told Apple to provide an estimate of its cost to comply with her order, suggesting that the government will be expected to pay for the work.

...

"It is a big problem for law enforcement armed with a search warrant when you find a device that can't be opened even when a judge says there's probable cause to open it," Comey said. "It affects our counterterrorism work. San Bernardino, a very important investigation to us, we still have one of those killers' phones that we have not been able to open, and it's been over two months and we're still working on it."

Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Apparently Apple has unlocked over 70 phones for the feds in the past.
Why are they protecting this one?

In the past they already had methods to get into the phones that they purposely developed beforehand. In this case, they would have to create a backdoor and that goes against their phones being secure like they claim.

If what is being said is true about the feds wanting a use at will backdoor into Apple phones I have to side with Apple.
Open the phone and hand it over,nothing more.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Apple should open the phone at their facility hand the open phone to the FBI and destroy the code...

Or they can just give the FBI a print-out of what's on the phone. It would be easy to hold a private meeting between Apple and the FBI. Have a bunch of FBI agents personally examine what's on the phone and certify the print-outs are complete. All the time Apple is in possession of the phone. Have the phone physically destroyed in the presence of the FBI experts and everyone goes back to their offices. No problem.

Hell,just download the contents to a storage device and give it to em.

 

[dannyboys]

Interesting...
Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Associated Press
By TAMI ABDOLLAH and ERIC TUCKER, Associated Press
1 hr ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — A U.S. magistrate ordered Apple Inc. on Tuesday to help the Obama administration hack into an encrypted iPhone belonging to one of the shooters in the December attack in San Bernardino, California, in a first-of-its-kind ruling that pits digital privacy against national security interests.

The ruling by Magistrate Judge Sheri Pym, a former federal prosecutor, requires Apple to supply highly specialized software the FBI can load onto the county-owned work iPhone to bypass a self-destruct feature, which erases the phone's data after too many unsuccessful attempts to unlock it. The FBI wants to be able to try different combinations in rapid sequence until it finds the right one.

The decision gives the Justice Department a significant victory in an entrenched technology policy battle, as more-powerful encryption services threaten the ability of federal agents to uncover important evidence in criminal or terrorism cases. The Obama administration, which has embraced stronger encryption as a way to keep consumers safe on the Internet, had struggled to find a compelling example to make its case.

The ruling Tuesday tied the problem to the deadliest terrorist attack on U.S. soil since the 2001 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Farook and his wife, Tashfeen Malik, killed 14 people in a Dec. 2 shooting at a holiday luncheon for Farook's co-workers. The couple later died in a gun battle with police.

Federal prosecutors told the judge in a court application Tuesday that they can't access a work phone used by Syed Farook because they don't know his passcode and Apple has not cooperated. Under U.S. law, a work phone is generally the property of a person's employer. The judge told Apple to provide an estimate of its cost to comply with her order, suggesting that the government will be expected to pay for the work.

...

"It is a big problem for law enforcement armed with a search warrant when you find a device that can't be opened even when a judge says there's probable cause to open it," Comey said. "It affects our counterterrorism work. San Bernardino, a very important investigation to us, we still have one of those killers' phones that we have not been able to open, and it's been over two months and we're still working on it."

Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Apparently Apple has unlocked over 70 phones for the feds in the past.
Why are they protecting this one?

In the past they already had methods to get into the phones that they purposely developed beforehand. In this case, they would have to create a backdoor and that goes against their phones being secure like they claim.

If what is being said is true about the feds wanting a use at will backdoor into Apple phones I have to side with Apple.
Open the phone and hand it over,nothing more.

The FBI has said from day one all they want is the contents. They aren't asking for the fucking 'backdoor' technology.
Apple has for decades separated their development programs into discrete autonomous units.
Meaning you are only tasked with engineering one part of the whole. You never even get to actually know what the final result will be. This how APPLE has been able to build an unbreachable security firewall around it's technology.
It would be very simple to do the same thing making a 'backdoor'.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Interesting...
Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Associated Press
By TAMI ABDOLLAH and ERIC TUCKER, Associated Press
1 hr ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — A U.S. magistrate ordered Apple Inc. on Tuesday to help the Obama administration hack into an encrypted iPhone belonging to one of the shooters in the December attack in San Bernardino, California, in a first-of-its-kind ruling that pits digital privacy against national security interests.

The ruling by Magistrate Judge Sheri Pym, a former federal prosecutor, requires Apple to supply highly specialized software the FBI can load onto the county-owned work iPhone to bypass a self-destruct feature, which erases the phone's data after too many unsuccessful attempts to unlock it. The FBI wants to be able to try different combinations in rapid sequence until it finds the right one.

The decision gives the Justice Department a significant victory in an entrenched technology policy battle, as more-powerful encryption services threaten the ability of federal agents to uncover important evidence in criminal or terrorism cases. The Obama administration, which has embraced stronger encryption as a way to keep consumers safe on the Internet, had struggled to find a compelling example to make its case.

The ruling Tuesday tied the problem to the deadliest terrorist attack on U.S. soil since the 2001 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Farook and his wife, Tashfeen Malik, killed 14 people in a Dec. 2 shooting at a holiday luncheon for Farook's co-workers. The couple later died in a gun battle with police.

Federal prosecutors told the judge in a court application Tuesday that they can't access a work phone used by Syed Farook because they don't know his passcode and Apple has not cooperated. Under U.S. law, a work phone is generally the property of a person's employer. The judge told Apple to provide an estimate of its cost to comply with her order, suggesting that the government will be expected to pay for the work.

...

"It is a big problem for law enforcement armed with a search warrant when you find a device that can't be opened even when a judge says there's probable cause to open it," Comey said. "It affects our counterterrorism work. San Bernardino, a very important investigation to us, we still have one of those killers' phones that we have not been able to open, and it's been over two months and we're still working on it."

Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Apparently Apple has unlocked over 70 phones for the feds in the past.
Why are they protecting this one?

In the past they already had methods to get into the phones that they purposely developed beforehand. In this case, they would have to create a backdoor and that goes against their phones being secure like they claim.

If what is being said is true about the feds wanting a use at will backdoor into Apple phones I have to side with Apple.
Open the phone and hand it over,nothing more.

The FBI has said from day one all they want is the contents. They aren't asking for the fucking 'backdoor' technology.
Apple has for decades separated their development programs into discrete autonomous units.
Meaning you are only tasked with engineering one part of the whole. You never even get to actually know what the final result will be. This how APPLE has been able to build an unbreachable security firewall around it's technology.
It would be very simple to do the same thing making a 'backdoor'.

Fuck off ya little dickhead.
There was nothing in my post that warranted your crappy attitude towards me.

 

[Disgruntled_American]

Interesting...
Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Associated Press
By TAMI ABDOLLAH and ERIC TUCKER, Associated Press
1 hr ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — A U.S. magistrate ordered Apple Inc. on Tuesday to help the Obama administration hack into an encrypted iPhone belonging to one of the shooters in the December attack in San Bernardino, California, in a first-of-its-kind ruling that pits digital privacy against national security interests.

The ruling by Magistrate Judge Sheri Pym, a former federal prosecutor, requires Apple to supply highly specialized software the FBI can load onto the county-owned work iPhone to bypass a self-destruct feature, which erases the phone's data after too many unsuccessful attempts to unlock it. The FBI wants to be able to try different combinations in rapid sequence until it finds the right one.

The decision gives the Justice Department a significant victory in an entrenched technology policy battle, as more-powerful encryption services threaten the ability of federal agents to uncover important evidence in criminal or terrorism cases. The Obama administration, which has embraced stronger encryption as a way to keep consumers safe on the Internet, had struggled to find a compelling example to make its case.

The ruling Tuesday tied the problem to the deadliest terrorist attack on U.S. soil since the 2001 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Farook and his wife, Tashfeen Malik, killed 14 people in a Dec. 2 shooting at a holiday luncheon for Farook's co-workers. The couple later died in a gun battle with police.

Federal prosecutors told the judge in a court application Tuesday that they can't access a work phone used by Syed Farook because they don't know his passcode and Apple has not cooperated. Under U.S. law, a work phone is generally the property of a person's employer. The judge told Apple to provide an estimate of its cost to comply with her order, suggesting that the government will be expected to pay for the work.

...

"It is a big problem for law enforcement armed with a search warrant when you find a device that can't be opened even when a judge says there's probable cause to open it," Comey said. "It affects our counterterrorism work. San Bernardino, a very important investigation to us, we still have one of those killers' phones that we have not been able to open, and it's been over two months and we're still working on it."

Judge: Apple must help US hack San Bernardino killer's phone

Apparently Apple has unlocked over 70 phones for the feds in the past.
Why are they protecting this one?

In the past they already had methods to get into the phones that they purposely developed beforehand. In this case, they would have to create a backdoor and that goes against their phones being secure like they claim.

If what is being said is true about the feds wanting a use at will backdoor into Apple phones I have to side with Apple.
Open the phone and hand it over,nothing more.

The FBI has said from day one all they want is the contents. They aren't asking for the fucking 'backdoor' technology.
Apple has for decades separated their development programs into discrete autonomous units.
Meaning you are only tasked with engineering one part of the whole. You never even get to actually know what the final result will be. This how APPLE has been able to build an unbreachable security firewall around it's technology.
It would be very simple to do the same thing making a 'backdoor'.

There is no backdoor that exists right now, so how can they get the contents? That's the point, since when can the government order someone to MAKE a backdoor?

 

[Iceweasel]

Aside from the obvious question already posted (i.e., the feds incapable without Apple's help?) --- I would like to know why these kinds of matters are leaked into the public domain? Should this not be a more secret matter between the FBI and a judge or Apple top brass? Should they not be doing this kind of clandestine operations without barking to the public "Apple won't help us?"

I strongly suspect this is all for show and they want the terrorists to think it hasn't been hacked.

 

[Iceweasel]

Unfortunately the precedent was set under Bush that the government can over-reach in terms of fighting against what the government labels as "terrorist" thanks to the so called "War on terror" that was coined and given power under Bush. That's not to say Obama hasn't continued the same thing, only that Pandora's box was opened and it's going to take a long time for that one to close if ever.

You had to find a way to blame Boooosh? LOL.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Aside from the obvious question already posted (i.e., the feds incapable without Apple's help?) --- I would like to know why these kinds of matters are leaked into the public domain? Should this not be a more secret matter between the FBI and a judge or Apple top brass? Should they not be doing this kind of clandestine operations without barking to the public "Apple won't help us?"

I strongly suspect this is all for show and they want the terrorists to think it hasn't been hacked.

Or it's Apple covering their ass with the consumers and they gave the feds access a long time ago.

 

[dannyboys]

Apple should open the phone at their facility hand the open phone to the FBI and destroy the code...

Or they can just give the FBI a print-out of what's on the phone. It would be easy to hold a private meeting between Apple and the FBI. Have a bunch of FBI agents personally examine what's on the phone and certify the print-outs are complete. All the time Apple is in possession of the phone. Have the phone physically destroyed in the presence of the FBI experts and everyone goes back to their offices. No problem.

Hell,just download the contents to a storage device and give it to em.

The FBI can't do that. The phone is designed to delete everything permanently when anyone without the access code tries to many times but fails to enter the correct code.
All APPLE needs to do is disable the 'delete' command.
Then the FBI experts can run millions/billions of possible access codes until statistically the correct code pops up.
Or APPLE can keep the phone and do the access code run at APPLE then in the presence of the FBI print out what's on the phone. Then APPLE can do whatever they want with the phone.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Apple should open the phone at their facility hand the open phone to the FBI and destroy the code...

Or they can just give the FBI a print-out of what's on the phone. It would be easy to hold a private meeting between Apple and the FBI. Have a bunch of FBI agents personally examine what's on the phone and certify the print-outs are complete. All the time Apple is in possession of the phone. Have the phone physically destroyed in the presence of the FBI experts and everyone goes back to their offices. No problem.

Hell,just download the contents to a storage device and give it to em.

The FBI can't do that. The phone is designed to delete everything permanently when anyone without the access code tries to many times but fails to enter the correct code.
All APPLE needs to do is disable the 'delete' command.
Then the FBI experts can run millions/billions of possible access codes until statistically the correct code pops up.
Or APPLE can keep the phone and do the access code run at APPLE then in the presence of the FBI print out what's on the phone. Then APPLE can do whatever they want with the phone.

Have Apple download the contents to a storage device.
I kinda figured it was a given that I meant Apple since the feds are unable to access the contents.

 

[ClosedCaption]

I think I smell the stench of a wedge issue here.

I'm pretty sure apple, if given the phone, would happily make available to whatever extent is possible, the data on that phone for law enforcement to review at their leisure. And I'm ok with that.

Unfortunately and I suspect that's not what law enforcement wants. Law enforcement wants apple to give them the technology to open every iphone. Not just the terrorist iphone.

And so If that's the case, I'm on apples side.

Thats it in a nutshell. They can crack the phone. But thats not their play here. Its to get Apple to create something to crack all phones anytime all in the name of saftey. Its worked before and American Patriots even cheered it on when it was AT&T (I think)

 

[Katzndogz]

How stupid is that judge? Someone can be ordered to turn over something thst exists and is wrongfully withheld. No one can be ordered to create something that doesn't exist.

 

[sealybobo]

so now the Fed gov can order a privately owned company around.

for our safety, of course.


mmmm, love that little slice of tyranny

Trump says apple should cooperate

thanks for letting me know

fyi; I'm not a republican and wouldn't vote for trump who I think is nothing more than another statist.

I'm just thinking, shouldn't Republicans have a problem with making a private company do something they don't want to do? What about privacy?

If a terrorist kidnapped your daughter and left their cell phone behind would you want the government to be able to open the phone? That is essentially the case here. Who knows what future terrorists murders of innocent people the cell phone in this case might prevent?
Charles Krauthammer offered the perfect solution:
Just give the cell phone to Apple. Tell them "Take the cell phone anywhere you want. Do whatever you need to look at what's on the cell phone. Give us what you find on the cell phone. You keep the cell phone and destroy it if you want. How you get the data is your business. Your people already know how to do what you need to do. You have been able for decades to keep your secrets secret within your company. Just do it again."
If in the future the Government needs to go to Apple again in the future both parties know there's no problem.

You don't have to convince me. It's conservatives who would normally say the company and their customers have a right to privacy at all costs.

"who knows" what we will find on that cell phone? Sounds like scare tactics to me. Are you going to use the mushroom cloud argument that this could stop a future terrorist attack?

Benjamin Franklin once said: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

My point is that Republicans would normally say the company has a right to privacy and they should not set a precedent here. In the future, the government is going to want to get apple to "just unlock your phone" because "it might" unlock some evidence against you.

Isn't that why we have these phones? We don't want the government to be able to spy on us.

 

[dannyboys]

How stupid is that judge? Someone can be ordered to turn over something thst exists and is wrongfully withheld. No one can be ordered to create something that doesn't exist.

How do know vital data doesn't exist on the cell phone?
The technology to write code to delete the firewall exists.
There's a locked box belonging to Bin Laden and there's one one key to open it. If anyone tries to open it without using the key the box will explode.
The one person with the key is refusing to open the box.
Your argument is don't make the person with the key open the box because there's nothing in the box.
YES! That is exactly what you are saying.
Anyone can 'create' something that didn't previuosly exist.
Did Bill Gates 'create' something that didn't exist? Did Michelangelo?
Go back to your logical thinking drawing board.

 

[Two Thumbs]

so now the Fed gov can order a privately owned company around.

for our safety, of course.


mmmm, love that little slice of tyranny

Trump says apple should cooperate

thanks for letting me know

fyi; I'm not a republican and wouldn't vote for trump who I think is nothing more than another statist.

I'm just thinking, shouldn't Republicans have a problem with making a private company do something they don't want to do? What about privacy?

I was clear that this is tyranny.

shouldn't liberals have a problem with a government that's actually doing it?

or is this one of those things that different b/c there's a (D) in the WH

yea, that's it, freedom only matters when you get what you want and fuck the consequences.

 

[Katzndogz]

How stupid is that judge? Someone can be ordered to turn over something thst exists and is wrongfully withheld. No one can be ordered to create something that doesn't exist.

How do know vital data doesn't exist on the cell phone?
The technology to write code to delete the firewall exists.
There's a locked box belonging to Bin Laden and there's one one key to open it. If anyone tries to open it without using the key the box will explode.
The one person with the key is refusing to open the box.
Your argument is don't make the person with the key open the box because there's nothing in the box.
YES! That is exactly what you are saying.
Anyone can 'create' something that didn't previuosly exist.
Did Bill Gates 'create' something that didn't exist? Did Michelangelo?
Go back to your logical thinking drawing board.

You really don't understand. People invent things that don't exist all the time. They aren't ordered to by a judge. There is no key to open the box. The judge wants Apple to make the key.

No. That's what Kim Jong Un does.

 

[Katzndogz]

There's nothing stopping the government from buying a bunch of phones and letting hackers have at it. They just can't order someone to create something that doesn't exist. Give a big enough reward and Apple programmers might try it themselves.

 

[Disgruntled_American]

so now the Fed gov can order a privately owned company around.

for our safety, of course.


mmmm, love that little slice of tyranny

Trump says apple should cooperate

thanks for letting me know

fyi; I'm not a republican and wouldn't vote for trump who I think is nothing more than another statist.

I'm just thinking, shouldn't Republicans have a problem with making a private company do something they don't want to do? What about privacy?

I was clear that this is tyranny.

shouldn't liberals have a problem with a government that's actually doing it?

or is this one of those things that different b/c there's a (D) in the WH

yea, that's it, freedom only matters when you get what you want and fuck the consequences.

Um your conservative buddy Dannyboy is wanting the government to force Apple to do this. Just look at post 56 or are you calling Dannyboy a liberal?