Just a clump of cells

[C_Clayton_Jones]

I'll take that bet. No one is "pro-abortion". I don't know of anyone who thinks having an abortion is a good thing, or who encourages a woman to have one just for the sake of having an abortion. It's something you hope you never need. A decision you never want to make.

Then why, might I ask is this a fight for a 'choice'? It was funny you waited this late in the thread to make that clear. What you fight for is a choice to abort without a second thought. I mean there are some women who actually do think it through, but you fail to acknowledge the fact that there are some women who treat abortion as a commodity.

In your subjective opinion, not as a fact of law.

Citizens cannot be compelled to 'justify' the exercising of a right as a 'prerequisite' to indeed do so.

A woman has the fundamental Constitutional right to decide whether to have a child or not absent unwarranted interference by the state, and in the context of that protected liberty the woman may base her choice using whatever criteria she wishes, whether you 'approve' of her motives or not is legally and Constitutionally irrelevant.

 

[Dragonlady]

Why do you insist that millions of women have abortion without thought and care? You are the one without thought or care. Did you read the statistics on who had abortions?

Even the most self-centred, narcissistic woman I have ever known, did not obtain an abortion without thought or consequence.

You're whole attitude towards women is disgusting. Blaming and shaming is your game. You want women to bear the consequences. You said that.

If you want to end abortion, end the poverty that leads women to chose the children she has over the one she might have.

 

[Vigilante]

I'll take that bet. No one is "pro-abortion". I don't know of anyone who thinks having an abortion is a good thing, or who encourages a woman to have one just for the sake of having an abortion. It's something you hope you never need. A decision you never want to make.

Then why, might I ask is this a fight for a 'choice'? It was funny you waited this late in the thread to make that clear. What you fight for is a choice to abort without a second thought. I mean there are some women who actually do think it through, but you fail to acknowledge the fact that there are some women who treat abortion as a commodity.

In your subjective opinion, not as a fact of law.

Citizens cannot be compelled to 'justify' the exercising of a right as a 'prerequisite' to indeed do so.

A woman has the fundamental Constitutional right to decide whether to have a child or not absent unwarranted interference by the state, and in the context of that protected liberty the woman may base her choice using whatever criteria she wishes, whether you 'approve' of her motives or not is legally and Constitutionally irrelevant.

Bullshit.... because some assholes in black robes say so.... the fucking mulatto in the White House STEPS all over them! There is a HIGHER LAW than what man writes, and it's NOT GODS, it's knowing INSTINTIVELY what is RIGHT, MORAL, ETHICAL, PRINCIPLED, and what is WRONG and UNETHICAL.... you sure would make a lousy Shyster in front of some jury!

 

[TemplarKormac]

In your subjective opinion, not as a fact of law.

I've already quoted the law. Vigil has quoted it throughout this thread ad nauseam. You are free to peruse it at your leisure.

A woman has the fundamental Constitutional right to decide whether to have a child or not absent unwarranted interference by the state, and in the context of that protected liberty the woman may base her choice using whatever criteria she wishes, whether you 'approve' of her motives or not is legally and Constitutionally irrelevant.

So, where in the Constitution does it explicitly cover abortion? If the law applies equally to all living, breathing human beings (as per the 14th Amendment) then it stands to reason that the unborn child with a discernible heartbeat, noticeable movement, discernible human features, responses to stimuli, the ability to metabolize nutrients---should also be given the same right to be treated equally under the Constitution also, that and anyone has the right to life including the unborn child (as per the 5th Amendment).

How can you pontificate to me about the Constitutional rights of the woman when you won't even consider the rights of the unborn child? Please.

 

[Vigilante]

Why do you insist that millions of women have abortion without thought and care? You are the one without thought or care. Did you read the statistics on who had abortions?

Even the most self-centred, narcissistic woman I have ever known, did not obtain an abortion without thought or consequence.

You're whole attitude towards women is disgusting.

Your WILLINGNESS to KILL is disgusting.... a woman can fight for herself, the UNBORN doesn't have a voice to protect them, you piece of dirt!

 

[TemplarKormac]

Why do you insist that millions of women have abortion without thought and care? You are the one without thought or care. Did you read the statistics on who had abortions?

Why? Have you seen these statistics lately?

"Planned Parenthood proudly announced that for the fiscal year 2011-2012, they aborted 333,964 babies, effective to one baby killed every 94 seconds. The chairwoman of Planned Parenthood in an introductory letter to their annual report said:

"We are so proud of the year's many successes, and deeply grateful for all the partners, sponsors, volunteers, staff and friends who helped make them possible."

Journey to a Brave New World - By David Watts

Question:

Does that statistic suggest that women are thinking this through? No. If that were the case, that number wouldn't exceed 10,000.

 

[Dragonlady]

Your idea of morals and ethics is just plain wrong. You have no moral authority over the rest of the world.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Your idea of morals and ethics is just plain wrong. You have no moral authority over the rest of the world.

And you milady, have no moral authority to determine what life is or isn't. You don't get to sit there and say "it isn't life because I said so."

 

[TemplarKormac]

This thread has lived a good life. Let it die as it lived. Er, that came out wrong.

...

...

That also came out wrong. Wait! No! That's not what I meant to say! Ack!

 

[Vigilante]

This thread has lived a good life. Let it die as it lived. Er, that came out wrong.

...

...

That also came out wrong. Wait! No! That's not what I meant to say! Ack!

No, TK, let them come at us, I LOVE showing just what immoral, and unethical scum look like and react to!

 

[Dragonlady]

Your idea of morals and ethics is just plain wrong. You have no moral authority over the rest of the world.

And you milady, have no moral authority to determine what life is or isn't. You don't get to sit there and say "it isn't life because I said so."

If I am pregnant, it is my choice and my choice alone whether to carry that child to term or whether to terminate that pregnancy. My body, my choice.

 

[Vigilante]

Your idea of morals and ethics is just plain wrong. You have no moral authority over the rest of the world.

And you milady, have no moral authority to determine what life is or isn't. You don't get to sit there and say "it isn't life because I said so."

If I am pregnant, it is my choice and my choice alone whether to carry that child to term or whether to terminate that pregnancy. My body, my choice.

Unfortunately, they let mental defectives get pregnant!!!!!! Another travesty of the liberal laws gone insane!

 

[Faun]

I'll take that bet. No one is "pro-abortion". I don't know of anyone who thinks having an abortion is a good thing, or who encourages a woman to have one just for the sake of having an abortion. It's something you hope you never need. A decision you never want to make.

Then why, might I ask is this a fight for a 'choice'? It was funny you waited this late in the thread to make that clear. What you fight for is a choice to abort without a second thought. I mean there are some women who actually do think it through, but you fail to acknowledge the fact that there are some women who treat abortion as a commodity.

In your subjective opinion, not as a fact of law.

Citizens cannot be compelled to 'justify' the exercising of a right as a 'prerequisite' to indeed do so.

A woman has the fundamental Constitutional right to decide whether to have a child or not absent unwarranted interference by the state, and in the context of that protected liberty the woman may base her choice using whatever criteria she wishes, whether you 'approve' of her motives or not is legally and Constitutionally irrelevant.

Bullshit.... because some assholes in black robes say so.... the fucking mulatto in the White House STEPS all over them! There is a HIGHER LAW than what man writes, and it's NOT GODS, it's knowing INSTINTIVELY what is RIGHT, MORAL, ETHICAL, PRINCIPLED, and what is WRONG and UNETHICAL.... you sure would make a lousy Shyster in front of some jury!

Why on Earth should anyone give a shit about your morals, ethics, or principles, vagisil ? You're nothing but a brain-dead dumb-fucking right-wing conservative who doesn't know a damn thing about morals, ethics or principles.

 

[Faun]

In your subjective opinion, not as a fact of law.

I've already quoted the law. Vigil has quoted it throughout this thread ad nauseam. You are free to peruse it at your leisure.

A woman has the fundamental Constitutional right to decide whether to have a child or not absent unwarranted interference by the state, and in the context of that protected liberty the woman may base her choice using whatever criteria she wishes, whether you 'approve' of her motives or not is legally and Constitutionally irrelevant.

So, where in the Constitution does it explicitly cover abortion? If the law applies equally to all living, breathing human beings (as per the 14th Amendment) then it stands to reason that the unborn child with a discernible heartbeat, noticeable movement, discernible human features, responses to stimuli, the ability to metabolize nutrients---should also be given the same right to be treated equally under the Constitution also, that and anyone has the right to life including the unborn child (as per the 5th Amendment).

How can you pontificate to me about the Constitutional rights of the woman when you won't even consider the rights of the unborn child? Please.

You lose by that measure since a fetus does not breathe. The first breath is taken at birth.

 

[Faun]

Your idea of morals and ethics is just plain wrong. You have no moral authority over the rest of the world.

And you milady, have no moral authority to determine what life is or isn't. You don't get to sit there and say "it isn't life because I said so."

That's true. That's for the mother to decide.

 

[TemplarKormac]

If I am pregnant, it is my choice and my choice alone whether to carry that child to term or whether to terminate that pregnancy. My body, my choice.

You keep repeating that meme. That child has the right to live. The fact that child forms as a distinct, separate human form does in fact contradict the "my body, my choice" contention.

 

[Dragonlady]

Unfortunately, they let mental defectives get pregnant!!!!!! Another travesty of the liberal laws gone insane!

I'm so glad you posted this.

Aren't you the "every fetus is sacred guy? Are you saying that you should decide who gets to have a baby? Or perhaps a conservative government gets to decide. Governments did that you know. They sterilized the "weak minded" for their own good.

You're just full of moral superiority. What happens if one or your mentally defectives slips through and gets herself pregnant? Is that fetus sacred and entitled to life too. Who gets to decide?

 

[Pedro de San Patricio]

Unfortunately, they let mental defectives get pregnant!!!!!! Another travesty of the liberal laws gone insane!

I'm so glad you posted this.

Aren't you the "every fetus is sacred guy? Are you saying that you should decide who gets to have a baby? Or perhaps a conservative government gets to decide. Governments did that you know. They sterilized the "weak minded" for their own good.

You're just full of moral superiority. What happens if one or your mentally defectives slips through and gets herself pregnant? Is that fetus sacred and entitled to life too. Who gets to decide?

Socialist governments have typically been very much in favor of sterilizing the "weak minded" for the good of society. You're right about that. Abortion and sterilization were even two key planks of the original Progressive movement here. It was considered the state's right to determine who was a person and who wasn't, whether the unfit should be taken out back and shot or simply sterilized, and which of the humans deemed persons were fit enough to breed the next generation of workers for the Socialist cause/state. The single positive thing you can say about the Holocaust is that it showed people exactly where that kind of thinking inevitably leads and led to most people outside of the most left-wing circles and the Scandinavian countries ending their support of it.

 

[Vigilante]

Unfortunately, they let mental defectives get pregnant!!!!!! Another travesty of the liberal laws gone insane!

I'm so glad you posted this.

Aren't you the "every fetus is sacred guy? Are you saying that you should decide who gets to have a baby? Or perhaps a conservative government gets to decide. Governments did that you know. They sterilized the "weak minded" for their own good.

You're just full of moral superiority. What happens if one or your mentally defectives slips through and gets herself pregnant? Is that fetus sacred and entitled to life too. Who gets to decide?

I'm saying that if a woman walks into get an abortion, and does so, she SHOULD BE STERILIZED so she can't do it again! The only reason I give it this much leeway is that it is CURRENT LAW that the woman can have an abortion! If not for that, I wouldn't go along with the first abortion at all.

And YES, I am morally superior than a dumb ass that KILLS innocents, just because she didn't take responsibility for her own actions! ALL fetus are sacred, they ARE LIVING BEINGS, you idiot!

 

[Cecilie1200]

The way to stop abortion, is to end the need for it. That includes improving the economic situation for working poor families. Poor people have fewer children, on average, than those who are better off.

62% of women having abortions are living below the poverty line. 28% have income between 100 - 199% of the poverty level income. Poor and low income families account for 90% of all abortions.

Unless and until the issues of minimum wage and maternity leave are addressed, these numbers aren't going to change.

Do these people ever think of BUYING a CONDUM? They are LESS than a SIX PACK! Ever hear of personal responsibility...even the poor KNOW right from wrong, and if they can fuck, they KNOW how NOT to get pregnant! You besmirch the name of all POOR WOMEN as IDIOTS!!!

Try reading the links I posted.

More than half the women who have abortions used birth control and STILL got pregnant.

Propaganda, if that were so, they would EVER be able to sell birth control pills! Use you head dumbass!

I have not responded to your insults and abusive comments to this point. Both are indicative of a lack of effective response to the debate. You do not appear to have read my posts or accessed the links I have posted. You just want to heap abuse on those with a better understanding of the realities of abortion than you.

You indicate not the least bit of understanding of life for poor people. And you are unwilling to consider how many babies are being aborted because of dire poverty.

You just want to attack people who do understand that the way to end abortion is to make it unnecessary.

You try to claim the moral high ground while refusing to consider aid to poor families. You judge women who have abortions. These are all indications that you are morally bankrupt and in no position to judge others.

It's easy to care about unborn babies. They're an idea, not a reality. They need nothing from you. They aren't asking YOU to do anything. The living children that are quite rightly the pregnant mother's first priority, are ignored. If she can't work, they'll lose their home. But you don't care about them. You care about that precious zygote.

How hypocritical is that?

So women can't work if they're pregnant?

Someone should mention this to my coworkers, because fully half the women here seem to be pregnant at any given moment. I'm starting to wonder if there's something in the water. Fortunately, I never drink water.