Kurt Vonnegut on "Equality"

PoliticalChic

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1. Interesting because it represents the fulcrum between Liberal and Conservative viewponts, is the term “equality.” Here is misunderstanding writ large:
“I guess the Declaration of Independence was wrong then,
when it said that All men were created Equal, and All were endowed with the inalienable right of Liberty.
...the two can't exist together?”

Actually.....no.....they can't.

a. For the Left, equality extends beyond the view of the Founders, which is equality before the law. The concept has been modified with the growth of modern liberalism, and the ‘egalitarian’ impulse that fuels it. Here we witness the constant expansion into areas in which equality of sorts is seen as desirable and/or mandatory.

b. Dewey noted in 1936 that liberalism’s “philosophy has rarely been clear cut,” but “that government should regularly intervene to help equalize conditions between the wealthy and the poor, between the overprivileged and the underprivileged.”
Jo Ann Boydston, “John Dewey: The Later Works, 1925-1953,” p. 284-285.





2. . By the 20th century, the new ‘equality’ became a threat to freedom. FDR’s New Deal and Truman’s Fair Deal claimed the rectification of inequalities as within the purview of government. LBJ’s Great Society championed the redistribution of wealth and status in the name of equality. Realize that the concomitant movement toward collectivism meant a decline in the freedoms of business, private associations, families, and individuals.

a. It seems to me, self-evident that immobilizing the producers with regulations and confiscatory taxation proves that a nation can have prosperity or equality in all aspects of living- but not both.





3. Perhaps the best way to reveal the inanity of the Left’s campaign for their view of equality is to revisit the satirical exposition of equality, written in 1961 by Kurt Vonnegut….
"Harrison Bergeron" is a satirical and dystopian science-fiction short story written by Kurt Vonnegut Jr. and first published in October 1961…The satire raises a serious question concerning desirability of social equality and the extent to which society is prepared to go to achieve it.”
Harrison Bergeron - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

a. "All men are not created equal. It is the purpose of the Government to make them so." This is the premise of the Showtime film adaption of Kurt Vonnegut's futuristic short story Harrison Bergeron. The film centers around a young man (Harrison) who is smarter than his peers, and is not affected by the usual "Handicapping" which is used to train all Americans so everyone is of equal intelligence.”
Harrison Bergeron (TV 1995) - IMDb

b. “Kurt Vonnegut begins Harrison Bergeron this way: The year was 2081, and everybody was finally equal. They weren't only equal before God and the law. They were equal in every which way. Nobody was smarter than anybody else. Nobody was better looking than anybody else. Nobody was quicker or stronger than anybody else. All this equality was due to the 211th, 212th, and 213th Amendments to the Constitution, and to the unceasing vigilance of agents of the United States Handicapper General.”
Harrison Bergeron by Kurt Vonnegut


c. The government forced each individual to wear “handicaps” to offset any advantage they had, so that everyone could be truly and fully equal. Beautiful people had to wear ugly masks, the strong had to wear weights, the graceful had to wear bags of birdshot, and those with above-average intelligence had to wear government transmitters in their ears that would emit sharp noises every twenty seconds “to keep them from taking unfair advantage of their brains.”
Kurt Vonnegut, “Harrison Bergeron.”



4. So…is this view of “equality” funny? Perhaps…but it reminds me more of Lord Byron’s words: “And if I laugh at any mortal thing, 'Tis that I may not weep.”
 
"Harrison Bergeron" is a brilliant bit of writing.

The Statists' form of equality is to make us all equal in mediocrity and dependency.

No thanks.
 
"Harrison Bergeron" is a brilliant bit of writing.

The Statists' form of equality is to make us all equal in mediocrity and dependency.

No thanks.
This is why the entire notion of 'Social Justice' is so abhorrent to equality.

It is not the outcome that matters if one truly values freedom.
 
Harrison Bergeron is a fantastic science fiction short story that does a great job of mocking what equality for all could mean. That said, it doesn't reflect the cartoon version of what right wing nuts think the left believe.
 
If you read any of the philosophers who envisioned utopian societies of full equality, you will understand how equality and freedom are mutually exclusive terms. The weight of the state gets heavier and heavier forcing equality and stamping out the unequal superiors. In Harrison Bergeron at the end, the superior Harrison and his brilliant and graceful ballerina girlfriend were both shot to death. Equality was preserved.

In the visions of utopian society there is no art, no music, no dance, food is controlled so that nothing cooked by one person tastes better than that cooked by someone else and weighed so that no person gets more or less than anyone else. Equality is forced and enforced.
 
Today's left encourages those who aren't living a healthy lifestyle to change their diet and to exercise regularly.

Harrison Bergeron is physically weighted down because of his great physique.

Today's left encourages making education more accessible and affordable to everyone.

Harrison Bergeron is a super intelligent person who constantly gets his ears severely rung to keep him from thinking.
 
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what alot of dancing the right does to try and kill the power of the people.


Why is it you hate Democracy so much?


You see if the people decide to help each other and its constitutional then what is your beef?
 
You go through these phoney manchinations all in an effeort to convince yourselves being selfish brutish people is somehow Morally superior to being a decent society that cars for its fellow man.


Its jsut so yesterday
 
Today's left encourages those who aren't living a healthy lifestyle to change their diet and to exercise regularly.

Harrison Bergeron is physically weighted down because of his great physique.

Today's left encourages making education more accessible and affordable to everyone.

Harrison Bergeron is a super intelligent person who constantly gets his ears severely rung to keep him from thinking.

Not quite true. The left mandates diet without regard to individual needs and requirements. The allotment is the same for the weightlifter as it is for the chess player.

The education is the lowest and basest form of instruction formed out of a need for mediocrity.

Nowhere is Kurt Vonnegut's vision more true than in schools where everyone gets the same award, there are no winners or losers. Birthdays are forbidden because not everyone was born on the same day. Holidays are discouraged because no day is any better than any other.

We're closer to Vonnegut's satire now than at any other time.
 
Today's left encourages those who aren't living a healthy lifestyle to change their diet and to exercise regularly.

Harrison Bergeron is physically weighted down because of his great physique.

Today's left encourages making education more accessible and affordable to everyone.

Harrison Bergeron is a super intelligent person who constantly gets his ears severely rung to keep him from thinking.

Not quite true. The left mandates diet without regard to individual needs and requirements. The allotment is the same for the weightlifter as it is for the chess player.

The education is the lowest and basest form of instruction formed out of a need for mediocrity.

Nowhere is Kurt Vonnegut's vision more true than in schools where everyone gets the same award, there are no winners or losers. Birthdays are forbidden because not everyone was born on the same day. Holidays are discouraged because no day is any better than any other.

We're closer to Vonnegut's satire now than at any other time.

Yet double lunch is available to those who want more and a student doesn't have to eat school lunch if they have special needs. Brown bags aren't banned.
Honor rolls are still posted.
Students still receive a class rank.
Aspiring student athletes don't make the varsity team every year.
Championships in all high school sports are won each year.
And on and on and on.

But why am I even responding to you anyway? You're just a lib dressed up as a conservative to make them look bad. And a nasty one at that.
 
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1. Interesting because it represents the fulcrum between Liberal and Conservative viewponts, is the term “equality.” Here is misunderstanding writ large:
“I guess the Declaration of Independence was wrong then,
when it said that All men were created Equal, and All were endowed with the inalienable right of Liberty.
...the two can't exist together?”

Actually.....no.....they can't.

a. For the Left, equality extends beyond the view of the Founders, which is equality before the law. The concept has been modified with the growth of modern liberalism, and the ‘egalitarian’ impulse that fuels it. Here we witness the constant expansion into areas in which equality of sorts is seen as desirable and/or mandatory.

b. Dewey noted in 1936 that liberalism’s “philosophy has rarely been clear cut,” but “that government should regularly intervene to help equalize conditions between the wealthy and the poor, between the overprivileged and the underprivileged.”
Jo Ann Boydston, “John Dewey: The Later Works, 1925-1953,” p. 284-285.





2. . By the 20th century, the new ‘equality’ became a threat to freedom. FDR’s New Deal and Truman’s Fair Deal claimed the rectification of inequalities as within the purview of government. LBJ’s Great Society championed the redistribution of wealth and status in the name of equality. Realize that the concomitant movement toward collectivism meant a decline in the freedoms of business, private associations, families, and individuals.

a. It seems to me, self-evident that immobilizing the producers with regulations and confiscatory taxation proves that a nation can have prosperity or equality in all aspects of living- but not both.





3. Perhaps the best way to reveal the inanity of the Left’s campaign for their view of equality is to revisit the satirical exposition of equality, written in 1961 by Kurt Vonnegut….
"Harrison Bergeron" is a satirical and dystopian science-fiction short story written by Kurt Vonnegut Jr. and first published in October 1961…The satire raises a serious question concerning desirability of social equality and the extent to which society is prepared to go to achieve it.”
Harrison Bergeron - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

a. "All men are not created equal. It is the purpose of the Government to make them so." This is the premise of the Showtime film adaption of Kurt Vonnegut's futuristic short story Harrison Bergeron. The film centers around a young man (Harrison) who is smarter than his peers, and is not affected by the usual "Handicapping" which is used to train all Americans so everyone is of equal intelligence.”
Harrison Bergeron (TV 1995) - IMDb

b. “Kurt Vonnegut begins Harrison Bergeron this way: The year was 2081, and everybody was finally equal. They weren't only equal before God and the law. They were equal in every which way. Nobody was smarter than anybody else. Nobody was better looking than anybody else. Nobody was quicker or stronger than anybody else. All this equality was due to the 211th, 212th, and 213th Amendments to the Constitution, and to the unceasing vigilance of agents of the United States Handicapper General.”
Harrison Bergeron by Kurt Vonnegut


c. The government forced each individual to wear “handicaps” to offset any advantage they had, so that everyone could be truly and fully equal. Beautiful people had to wear ugly masks, the strong had to wear weights, the graceful had to wear bags of birdshot, and those with above-average intelligence had to wear government transmitters in their ears that would emit sharp noises every twenty seconds “to keep them from taking unfair advantage of their brains.”
Kurt Vonnegut, “Harrison Bergeron.”



4. So…is this view of “equality” funny? Perhaps…but it reminds me more of Lord Byron’s words: “And if I laugh at any mortal thing, 'Tis that I may not weep.”

The Great Society had nothing to do with redistribution of wealth.
 
Funny thing; I remember reading this short story in middle school. That was about 15 years ago, though. I wonder how many people read it during middle school nowadays?
 
Today's left encourages those who aren't living a healthy lifestyle to change their diet and to exercise regularly.

Harrison Bergeron is physically weighted down because of his great physique.

Today's left encourages making education more accessible and affordable to everyone.

Harrison Bergeron is a super intelligent person who constantly gets his ears severely rung to keep him from thinking.

Not quite true. The left mandates diet without regard to individual needs and requirements. The allotment is the same for the weightlifter as it is for the chess player.

The education is the lowest and basest form of instruction formed out of a need for mediocrity.

Nowhere is Kurt Vonnegut's vision more true than in schools where everyone gets the same award, there are no winners or losers. Birthdays are forbidden because not everyone was born on the same day. Holidays are discouraged because no day is any better than any other.

We're closer to Vonnegut's satire now than at any other time.




where has anyone mandated what someone can eat?



You people are just insane
 
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7koaGNDr5KA]DANCE monkeys DANCE - YouTube[/ame]
 
Funny thing; I remember reading this short story in middle school. That was about 15 years ago, though. I wonder how many people read it during middle school nowadays?

Probably about as many as back then.

They still teach Shakespeare too.
 
I just dont understand why all this pretending that caring for your neighbor is a crime.
 
1. Interesting because it represents the fulcrum between Liberal and Conservative viewponts, is the term “equality.” Here is misunderstanding writ large:
“I guess the Declaration of Independence was wrong then,
when it said that All men were created Equal, and All were endowed with the inalienable right of Liberty.
...the two can't exist together?”

Actually.....no.....they can't.

a. For the Left, equality extends beyond the view of the Founders, which is equality before the law. The concept has been modified with the growth of modern liberalism, and the ‘egalitarian’ impulse that fuels it. Here we witness the constant expansion into areas in which equality of sorts is seen as desirable and/or mandatory.

b. Dewey noted in 1936 that liberalism’s “philosophy has rarely been clear cut,” but “that government should regularly intervene to help equalize conditions between the wealthy and the poor, between the overprivileged and the underprivileged.”
Jo Ann Boydston, “John Dewey: The Later Works, 1925-1953,” p. 284-285.





2. . By the 20th century, the new ‘equality’ became a threat to freedom. FDR’s New Deal and Truman’s Fair Deal claimed the rectification of inequalities as within the purview of government. LBJ’s Great Society championed the redistribution of wealth and status in the name of equality. Realize that the concomitant movement toward collectivism meant a decline in the freedoms of business, private associations, families, and individuals.

a. It seems to me, self-evident that immobilizing the producers with regulations and confiscatory taxation proves that a nation can have prosperity or equality in all aspects of living- but not both.





3. Perhaps the best way to reveal the inanity of the Left’s campaign for their view of equality is to revisit the satirical exposition of equality, written in 1961 by Kurt Vonnegut….
"Harrison Bergeron" is a satirical and dystopian science-fiction short story written by Kurt Vonnegut Jr. and first published in October 1961…The satire raises a serious question concerning desirability of social equality and the extent to which society is prepared to go to achieve it.”
Harrison Bergeron - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

a. "All men are not created equal. It is the purpose of the Government to make them so." This is the premise of the Showtime film adaption of Kurt Vonnegut's futuristic short story Harrison Bergeron. The film centers around a young man (Harrison) who is smarter than his peers, and is not affected by the usual "Handicapping" which is used to train all Americans so everyone is of equal intelligence.”
Harrison Bergeron (TV 1995) - IMDb

b. “Kurt Vonnegut begins Harrison Bergeron this way: The year was 2081, and everybody was finally equal. They weren't only equal before God and the law. They were equal in every which way. Nobody was smarter than anybody else. Nobody was better looking than anybody else. Nobody was quicker or stronger than anybody else. All this equality was due to the 211th, 212th, and 213th Amendments to the Constitution, and to the unceasing vigilance of agents of the United States Handicapper General.”
Harrison Bergeron by Kurt Vonnegut


c. The government forced each individual to wear “handicaps” to offset any advantage they had, so that everyone could be truly and fully equal. Beautiful people had to wear ugly masks, the strong had to wear weights, the graceful had to wear bags of birdshot, and those with above-average intelligence had to wear government transmitters in their ears that would emit sharp noises every twenty seconds “to keep them from taking unfair advantage of their brains.”
Kurt Vonnegut, “Harrison Bergeron.”



4. So…is this view of “equality” funny? Perhaps…but it reminds me more of Lord Byron’s words: “And if I laugh at any mortal thing, 'Tis that I may not weep.”

To put Vonnegut's point another way, in many ways money IS the great equalizer. None of us are born with equal gifts. Therefore, those with less at birth can get closer to equality thru production and innovation. The irony of the left decrying the one percenters, is that without income inequality, then the inequality of all other things like looks, atheletic ability, artistic ability are emphasized even more thus reinforcing another more insidious kind of inequality. Furthermore, while income inequality is usually earned thru productivity, being beautiful or atheletic are random events that aren't earned. So a society that the left envisions as equal is actually more unequal and is an unjust society where randomness is rewarded rather than hard work and skill.
 
No literate person who has read much Vonnegut is going to come away thinking he's a devotee of Ayn Rand's philosphy of selfishness.
 

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