Liberal Business owners - a true story of what I get to deal with right now

[Article 15]

objects? Wow, they are so far from being objects its not even funny. I could go into why they are not objects but that would most likely offend you because you would consider it porn or some stupid notion.
Oh wait they are objects when it comes to abortion though We can't forget that about you people. I love double standards. Like you have some high ground in this you hack.

not really sure what reading a book has to do with this, but ok.

I realize that you don't understand what reading a book has to do with eliminating ignorance. That's why I am encouraging you to do so.
And I think you've demonstrated that you can't deal with what I actually say. You have to make up some nonsense about non-existant double standards. See neither women, nor babies, are objects that you can use and dispose of as you please. Which, of course, is why some of us support policies protecting life and encourage others to respect others instead of discuss them as if they are empty cells or an object to be used and thrown away.

Then i guess I shouldn't be surprise by your projection.

Any reading you've done has been counter-productive.

You are one of the more willfully ignornant people on this site.

 

[Avatar4321]

Any reading you've done has been counter-productive.

You are one of the more willfully ignornant people on this site.

So you say. But thankfully, your saying so doesn't make it true. Any more than insulting me somehow changes the fact that the ACA is going to have a negative effect on small businesses and the economy.

 

[MikeK]

So I have to share this because it really pisses me off. So I manage a business for two owners who are absolutely fabulous people...I mean wonderful people and I love them to death...but they are flaming liberals and can't see their hand two inches past their nose. So prior to the election they tasked me with setting up a plan fo expansion into a second location. Now I know the books and so the other day we meet and ask my plan and my response was: "I don't think we can expand now"

"Why not?" they asked confused.

"Well," I said. "Right now our company has 47 employees. Expanding to a second locaton will put us over the 50 employee limit on Obamacare and we will have to pay health benefits for every one of our employees or pay the fine to avoid it. After looking at the books, that will bankrupt us." I explained.

"But our business is ready to take the next step." they said to me.

"Yes it is," I responded "but we can't afford to anymore. The good old days of expanding according to sales and demand are over." I explained. "That's not the way it works anymore."

"Well why not?" they asked sincerely.

"Well because of the Affordable Health Care Act" I said. I then explained all the implications and do you know what their response was? These flaming liberals who voted for Obama and pounded the "health care is a human right" angle? Know what they said to me? They said "Well we have to find a loophole to get out of this. We can't afford that. it will end our business."

I was tempted at that point to reach across the table and strangle them both screaming "this is what you voted for mother fuckers!!!!" but I kept my cool. I said slowly "the business landscape has changed. Now here are our options.....#1 cut every employee to below 30 hours a week. If they go over 30 hours we fire them on the spot."

"Well how will they support their families on only 30 hours a week?" they asked.

"If they go over 30 hours after the expansion," I explained "then you will support their families directly from your own pocket because the business cannot sustain the expense incurred by Obamacare." I got incredulous at this point. "Jesus fucking Christ have you not been paying attention?" I was met with silence.

"Now the other option is to expand to the new location but to sub-contract labor to a different entity. Technically, you will have no new employees and be under the 50 cap. On the other hand you have to entrust your labor to a totally different business...and don't even think about creating a dummy corporation yourself to hire those workers under unless you want a nice battle with the IRS for fraud. It will have to be a completely unrelated business with totally unrelated ownership."

So after a while of them thinking they looked at me and asked.

"So what you are saying is that we can't expand our business unless we slash the hours of our employees who need every hour they can get, sub-contract out our labor an allow an independent business to control our labor, or just say fuck it and not expand at all?"

i said "Yep"

"THAT'S TOTAL BULLSHIT" they screamed

"That's what you voted for" I said calmly risking my job.

I didn't get fired. The expansion will not take place. 45 jobs set and ready just got lost thanks to Obamacare.

This is a very well composed propaganda piece and I don't believe a word of it.

 

[Lakhota]

Am I correct that these cheap asses don't already provide health benefits for their current 47 employees? Are they instructing their employees how to apply for food stamps and Medicaid?

Sounds like a little sweat shop full of illegal aliens.

"Flaming liberals" is a nice touch.

 

[Barb]

and btw, you deserve to be fired for 1) trash talking people that hired you in good faith and 2) giving bad advice to your clients to further your political agenda.

If this story is even true.

You should let them read your posts here, especially your polling predictions, and let them evaluate your mental capabilities.

 

[Barb]

Some people tend to put the best interest of their country ahead of their personal wealth. Warren Buffet supported Obama. He'll find ways to build his businesses, and probably figure out ways to leverage the improved health of his workers.

If someone I paid to manage my business came to me and said we can't grow because we're moving toward universal health care, I'd think about hiring someone who told me how I can grow. I'd prefer hiring a systems thinker, who thought of the here and now, and gave me an optimal strategy. I wouldn't want some pea brain partisan hack telling me how I voted limited my growth potential. Too bad managers aren't required to take course work in operations research.

I've worked for, and managed groups for, companies who did quite a bit of work for federal, state, and city governments. When we grew to the point where small business set asides were at risk, we didn't whine about not growing. The task was to figure out how to grow. Maybe you're not cut out to be a manager.

 

[Avatar4321]

Some people tend to put the best interest of their country ahead of their personal wealth. Warren Buffet supported Obama. He'll find ways to build his businesses, and probably figure out ways to leverage the improved health of his workers.

If someone I paid to manage my business came to me and said we can't grow because we're moving toward universal health care, I'd think about hiring someone who told me how I can grow. I'd prefer hiring a systems thinker, who thought of the here and now, and gave me an optimal strategy. I wouldn't want some pea brain partisan hack telling me how I voted limited my growth potential. Too bad managers aren't required to take course work in operations research.

I've worked for, and managed groups for, companies who did quite a bit of work for federal, state, and city governments. When we grew to the point where small business set asides were at risk, we didn't whine about not growing. The task was to figure out how to grow. Maybe you're not cut out to be a manager.

You guys do realize that Warren Buffet supports Obama because Obama enacts policies that make him more wealthy, right? You do realize that one of the reasons Obama wouldn't approve of the Keystone Pipeline was that Warren was going to make lots and lots of money off transporting oil that he would have lost if the Pipeline was approved? We aren't exactly talking about an altruistic man here.

 

[auditor0007]

Since we are making up stories....

I work for a conservative business owner

I told him that our employees do not have health insurance and will go bankrupt if they have a major illness. He said screw them, they are not my problem let the taxpayer pick up their healthcare costs

I explained that I agreed with him and that businesses should not be the ones providing healthcare and that it should be a government function. He jumped up and screamed THATS SOCIALISM

I explained that his attitude is just the problem that Obamacare faced, that no matter what solution was proposed, conservatives tried to block it

He replied....LET THEM DIE

It really doesn't matter. I honestly can't figure out why so many "business owners" were against a public option. In the end, business owners will lead the way to a one payer system. While Obamacare may speed this up, it would have happened eventually anyway. How many times do we hear how the corporate tax rate is the reason companies are not expanding in the US? It's not the corporate tax rate that is the problem; it's health insurance costs. Companies in most countries outside of the US do not have to worry about these costs because they are a function of government or paid individually.

 

[Barb]

and btw, you deserve to be fired for 1) trash talking people that hired you in good faith and 2) giving bad advice to your clients to further your political agenda.

If this story is even true.

You should let them read your posts here, especially your polling predictions, and let them evaluate your mental capabilities.

You think people should be hired and fired based on posts on a message board?

I think results is a better way, if someone has gotten you to the point of expansion, then they are doing something right.

Do you own or manage a business?

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[Barb]

Our CPA/accounting people are being flooded with calls right now, business owners who are trying to deal with this. The answer is usually the same: "There's no magic bullet here; you have to deal with it, we'll try to help you mitigate the costs and damage." Right now the most common approach is to scale back hours, hiring or both.

For business owners, this isn't about greed. It's about survival.

Here it comes, gang, enjoy.

.

Sorry, but for places like Papa Johns and Walmart, it IS about greed.

And their positions aren't doing them any favors...

Papa John's Obamacare Stance Costs Company Its Reputation: Study

 

[Barb]

 

[Dick Tuck]

Because you are forcing me to take this job.......so the least you can do is pay for my health insurance....especially since you get to sit in your office and do nothing all day long while making millions of dollars while I have to be the one who is responsible for generating the revenue.

Thats how.

"Because you are forcing me to take this job"

How can anyone force you to take a job?

The fact that you feel you are "exploited" by having a job and being gainfully employed is an inconvenience is a glaring example of the parasite mind set of the idiot liberal dumbocrat.

What a LYING PIECE OF SHIT YOU ARE. You create a quote to pretend it's my words, and then argue against it. You're garbage.

 

[Dick Tuck]

He manages the business.

and I asked for his credentials, maybe you should read a bit more. See, you should not be giving this sort of advice unless you are qualified. I have a feeling he is not qualified.

And ALL of us on USMB have a feeling that you are an asshole. No wait.... we know you are an asshole, because you've already proved it.

The asshole on this board is you, you fucking loser. Why did you put your words in my quote, you dishonest piece of shit?

 

[Dick Tuck]

Because you are forcing me to take this job.......so the least you can do is pay for my health insurance....especially since you get to sit in your office and do nothing all day long while making millions of dollars while I have to be the one who is responsible for generating the revenue.

Thats how.

"Because you are forcing me to take this job"

How can anyone force you to take a job?

The fact that you feel you are "exploited" by having a job and being gainfully employed is an inconvenience is a glaring example of the parasite mind set of the idiot liberal dumbocrat.

Maybe he's just a really clever double agent for the conservatives. Hard to believe someone is that partisan by accident. Hilarious!

You are aware that this scumbag manufactured my quote? Perhaps you're too dumb to notice and check.

 

[BluePhantom]

500+ posts in one night? Jesus H Christ. You know there's no way in hell I can read all of these and respond. Ok I read a few...let's establish those.

a) Yes the situation is real

b) No I am not trying to trash talk the owners. I said at the beginning of the OP that I have great respect and caring for them....but even those you care about can frustrate the living hell out of you sometimes.

c) i gave many options on how to avoid all this...I indentified several loopholes that would allow the expansion to take place. Each came with consequences...for example cutting all hours to 30 maximum creates the problems that they will have to find a second job and that means scheduling conflicts, potential loyalty issues, a decrease in consistency of product and services...the solution is just bad as the problem. In the end there was no solution that did not carry consequences and that ownership was willing to bear. Dont blame me...blame the liberals who were all in favor of a concept in principle until they realized they were the ones who were going to have to pay for it.

d) Their decision not to expand is good business. Expansion will increase costs and reduce profitability. They are better off staying with one location..if they expand they will realize less profit than if they stayed where they were because of the increases in benefits that will be mandated or by the decrease in the quality of goods and services.

e) The Repblican (me) gave them plenty of options. It was the Democrats (ownership) that said "we have to find a way to avoid giving our employees benefits and defeat Obamacare or we will go broke." Don't get pissed at the messenger.

f) This is but a taste of what is to come. Small businesses will reach a point where they have a glass roof above their heads. That's what I am dealing with now. We can see the potential for greater profits but going for it is a trap that will result in less without investing in a major expansion of several locations.

g) I have everything to gain from a successful expansion. If we expand to two locations I become a corporate manager instead of a location manager and as such my salary will increase. I WANT this expansion to take place. Those who suggest that I am trying to kill the expansion out of sour grapes are fucking morons. Do you really think I will give up a 50% salary increase to make a point?

h) It seems to me that some liberals have forgotten what the point of a business is. The point of a business is to generate profit. The point is NOT to make the employees lives better. In a perfect world both would happen at the same time, but this is not a perfect world and one takes precedence over the other. Profit will win every time and to suggest that it should be otherwise is moronic to the point of drool stained straight jackets.

i) Republicans warned you that shit like this would happen. Don't get pissed at us that you chose not to listen

 

[Ravi]

At least these losers can say they were consistent. All of them resorted to discrediting the poster and no one disproved the issue.

g5000 did. You ignored it. Not to mention that you keep repeating the lie that aca is going to affect your company next year.

 

[Ravi]

edited

Why did you not address what I linked to in post #2, mainly g5000's thorough debunking of your premise that ACA would bankrupt your "clients"?

Until you do that you are just another hack.

Another reason Republicans lost.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Fucking liar. The story is fabricated.

 

[Ravi]

Because you are forcing me to take this job.......so the least you can do is pay for my health insurance....especially since you get to sit in your office and do nothing all day long while making millions of dollars while I have to be the one who is responsible for generating the revenue.

Thats how.

"Because you are forcing me to take this job"

How can anyone force you to take a job?

The fact that you feel you are "exploited" by having a job and being gainfully employed is an inconvenience is a glaring example of the parasite mind set of the idiot liberal dumbocrat.

What a LYING PIECE OF SHIT YOU ARE. You create a quote to pretend it's my words, and then argue against it. You're garbage.

Altering quotes used to be against the rules. For libs anyway. My how things have changed.

 

[BluePhantom]

edited

Why did you not address what I linked to in post #2, mainly g5000's thorough debunking of your premise that ACA would bankrupt your "clients"?

Until you do that you are just another hack.

Another reason Republicans lost.

Ravi I made the OP in frustration...to vent....and then I went to bed...I came back tonight expecting maybe 10 replies. The amount it has generated...there's NO way I can read all that. I don't know what you linked to but I am not the only one telling them the same thing. Our legal team, our bookkeepers...all of the have confirmed what I have told them. The simple reality is that this business is ready to expand but cannot because of Obamacare. In recent weeks Papa John's, Wal-Mart, and Appelbees have made similar announcements. It aint me....it's the reality of a major shift in the business climate that requires industry to take extreme measures to maintain profitability.

This is the way it's going to be from now on, Ravi. I warned you.