Liberal Business owners - a true story of what I get to deal with right now

[BluePhantom]

Fucking liar. The story is fabricated.

No the story is reality. Read the fucking news LL. My business isn't the only place where the exact same thing is happening. Fucking tool.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Bullshit.

Every person here who possesses a brain knows that your story is bullshit.

 

[BluePhantom]

Bullshit.

Uh huh....what amazing skills you have at debate...let's see you have provided..."liar" and "bullshit". Pfft....I am going to bed. I have a business to run in the morning and you have unicorns to ride over rainbows. What an unbelievable fucking tool Night LL

 

[Ravi]

edited

Why did you not address what I linked to in post #2, mainly g5000's thorough debunking of your premise that ACA would bankrupt your "clients"?

Until you do that you are just another hack.

Another reason Republicans lost.

Ravi I made the OP in frustration...to vent....and then I went to bed...I came back tonight expecting maybe 10 replies. The amount it has generated...there's NO way I can read all that. I don't know what you linked to but I am not the only one telling them the same thing. Our legal team, our bookkeepers...all of the have confirmed what I have told them. The simple reality is that this business is ready to expand but cannot because of Obamacare. In recent weeks Papa John's, Wal-Mart, and Appelbees have made similar announcements. It aint me....it's the reality of a major shift in the business climate that requires industry to take extreme measures to maintain profitability.

This is the way it's going to be from now on, Ravi. I warned you.

I told you where it was. Post #2. That you are to lazy to find post number #2 tells me a lot about your integrity.

 

[Article 15]

Bullshit.

Uh huh....what amazing skills you have at debate...let's see you have provided..."liar" and "bullshit". Pfft....I am going to bed. I have a business to run in the morning and you have unicorns to ride over rainbows. What an unbelievable fucking tool Night LL

Your OP was eviscerated in this thread.

Get to reading, little liar.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Nutters commonly expect others to debate bullshit.

 

[Rinata]

Fucking liar. The story is fabricated.

No the story is reality. Read the fucking news LL. My business isn't the only place where the exact same thing is happening. Fucking tool.

Romney??? Just curious. That seems a little strange. Romney lost!!!

 

[zonly1]

Some people tend to put the best interest of their country ahead of their personal wealth. Warren Buffet supported Obama. He'll find ways to build his businesses, and probably figure out ways to leverage the improved health of his workers.

If someone I paid to manage my business came to me and said we can't grow because we're moving toward universal health care, I'd think about hiring someone who told me how I can grow. I'd prefer hiring a systems thinker, who thought of the here and now, and gave me an optimal strategy. I wouldn't want some pea brain partisan hack telling me how I voted limited my growth potential. Too bad managers aren't required to take course work in operations research.

I've worked for, and managed groups for, companies who did quite a bit of work for federal, state, and city governments. When we grew to the point where small business set asides were at risk, we didn't whine about not growing. The task was to figure out how to grow. Maybe you're not cut out to be a manager.

You guys do realize that Warren Buffet supports Obama because Obama enacts policies that make him more wealthy, right? You do realize that one of the reasons Obama wouldn't approve of the Keystone Pipeline was that Warren was going to make lots and lots of money off transporting oil that he would have lost if the Pipeline was approved? We aren't exactly talking about an altruistic man here.

Bingo was his name

 

[zonly1]

Fucking liar. The story is fabricated.

No the story is reality. Read the fucking news LL. My business isn't the only place where the exact same thing is happening. Fucking tool.

Romney??? Just curious. That seems a little strange. Romney lost!!!

Romney lost because his principles weren't in the plan like obama, the street organ grinder, passing off free zhit with means of NEVER paying for it and blaming bush.

Sal alinsky ...attack and ridicule your opponent and never answer direct questions.

 

[Toro]

Some people tend to put the best interest of their country ahead of their personal wealth. Warren Buffet supported Obama. He'll find ways to build his businesses, and probably figure out ways to leverage the improved health of his workers.

If someone I paid to manage my business came to me and said we can't grow because we're moving toward universal health care, I'd think about hiring someone who told me how I can grow. I'd prefer hiring a systems thinker, who thought of the here and now, and gave me an optimal strategy. I wouldn't want some pea brain partisan hack telling me how I voted limited my growth potential. Too bad managers aren't required to take course work in operations research.

I've worked for, and managed groups for, companies who did quite a bit of work for federal, state, and city governments. When we grew to the point where small business set asides were at risk, we didn't whine about not growing. The task was to figure out how to grow. Maybe you're not cut out to be a manager.

You guys do realize that Warren Buffet supports Obama because Obama enacts policies that make him more wealthy, right? You do realize that one of the reasons Obama wouldn't approve of the Keystone Pipeline was that Warren was going to make lots and lots of money off transporting oil that he would have lost if the Pipeline was approved? We aren't exactly talking about an altruistic man here.

Warren Buffet has been a liberal Democrat his whole life.

Keystone would have had a minimal effect on his pipeline business.

Buffet has pledged most of his $50 billion fortune to charity.

 

[zonly1]

Our CPA/accounting people are being flooded with calls right now, business owners who are trying to deal with this. The answer is usually the same: "There's no magic bullet here; you have to deal with it, we'll try to help you mitigate the costs and damage." Right now the most common approach is to scale back hours, hiring or both.

For business owners, this isn't about greed. It's about survival.

Here it comes, gang, enjoy.

.

Sorry, but for places like Papa Johns and Walmart, it IS about greed.

And their positions aren't doing them any favors...

Papa John's Obamacare Stance Costs Company Its Reputation: Study

your graph indicates you like the decline and hate job creation....thanks

 

[L.K.Eder]

OP, what are your credentials to be giving such business advice?

thats my first question.

He's a head chef, a restaurant owner, a college professor, and now apparently a business consultant.

Maybe he's just stretching himself too thin...

he is also a poll analyst.

 

[G.T.]

Bullshit.

Uh huh....what amazing skills you have at debate...let's see you have provided..."liar" and "bullshit". Pfft....I am going to bed. I have a business to run in the morning and you have unicorns to ride over rainbows. What an unbelievable fucking tool Night LL

Your thread is fake.

I can prove it, with actual numbers. All you need to tell the class is how many employees they were looking to hire, in the second place.

There's not a flaming chance in hell it would bankrupt any currently solvent and ready to expand company.

The fine is $2k per employee, and isn't even levied on the first 30 employees for fuck's sake, which brings it down to well under $2k per employee, per year. Are you saying your current profit margin per employee is less than $2k per YEAR? Because that's the only way it would "bankrupt" you, and even if it was a little less than that, WHICH IS A SAD BUSINESS ALREADY, each employee could take like a $20 per check pay-cut to eat the cost.

Your story is complete bullshit, math does not support it.

 

[L.K.Eder]

the educator of liberals forgot to price in the effect of sandy.

 

[JoeB131]

So I have to share this because it really pisses me off. So I manage a business for two owners who are absolutely fabulous people...I mean wonderful people and I love them to death...but they are flaming liberals and can't see their hand two inches past their nose. ...

I didn't get fired. The expansion will not take place. 45 jobs set and ready just got lost thanks to Obamacare.

So you give people crappy advice based on your own political bile?

That's kind of sad.

You really need to learn to check your politics at the door.

 

[JoeB131]

Sorry, but for places like Papa Johns and Walmart, it IS about greed.

And what about the hundreds of thousands of small and mid-size businesses who are already struggling in a tough economy, doing everything they can just to keep their business afloat?

What would you tell them?

.

I would say, "Too bad you spent years and years and years oppossing single payer like every other sensible country has done."

I have no doubt that some undercapitalized, marginal businesses are going to be swamped by ObamaCare's requirements, but they probably weren't going to last long run, anyway.

 

[ba1614]

500+ posts in one night? Jesus H Christ. You know there's no way in hell I can read all of these and respond. Ok I read a few...let's establish those.

a) Yes the situation is real

b) No I am not trying to trash talk the owners. I said at the beginning of the OP that I have great respect and caring for them....but even those you care about can frustrate the living hell out of you sometimes.

c) i gave many options on how to avoid all this...I indentified several loopholes that would allow the expansion to take place. Each came with consequences...for example cutting all hours to 30 maximum creates the problems that they will have to find a second job and that means scheduling conflicts, potential loyalty issues, a decrease in consistency of product and services...the solution is just bad as the problem. In the end there was no solution that did not carry consequences and that ownership was willing to bear. Dont blame me...blame the liberals who were all in favor of a concept in principle until they realized they were the ones who were going to have to pay for it.

d) Their decision not to expand is good business. Expansion will increase costs and reduce profitability. They are better off staying with one location..if they expand they will realize less profit than if they stayed where they were because of the increases in benefits that will be mandated or by the decrease in the quality of goods and services.

e) The Repblican (me) gave them plenty of options. It was the Democrats (ownership) that said "we have to find a way to avoid giving our employees benefits and defeat Obamacare or we will go broke." Don't get pissed at the messenger.

f) This is but a taste of what is to come. Small businesses will reach a point where they have a glass roof above their heads. That's what I am dealing with now. We can see the potential for greater profits but going for it is a trap that will result in less without investing in a major expansion of several locations.

g) I have everything to gain from a successful expansion. If we expand to two locations I become a corporate manager instead of a location manager and as such my salary will increase. I WANT this expansion to take place. Those who suggest that I am trying to kill the expansion out of sour grapes are fucking morons. Do you really think I will give up a 50% salary increase to make a point?

h) It seems to me that some liberals have forgotten what the point of a business is. The point of a business is to generate profit. The point is NOT to make the employees lives better. In a perfect world both would happen at the same time, but this is not a perfect world and one takes precedence over the other. Profit will win every time and to suggest that it should be otherwise is moronic to the point of drool stained straight jackets.

i) Republicans warned you that shit like this would happen. Don't get pissed at us that you chose not to listen

Just stand back and wait for it, there's going to be a whole lot of progressives left standing with their dicks in their hands wondering "where did that fee/tax come from" very shortly. It's actually going to be entertaining watching them try to spin the new regulations to being the fault of bush and the republicans in general.

 

[G.T.]

OHHHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhhhhhh....he made the mistake of giving the actual number of new jobs! Great.

45 news jobs, plus existing 47 = 92 total jobs.

Fine = $2k for every job over the 30th one, so 92-30 = 62, X $2, 000 = $124, 000.00

Divide the cost into the total amount of employees, and it equals --> $1, 347.82.

Blue is telling us, that after overhead but before the fine, the Business he consults makes less than $1347.82 per employee, per YEAR, are somehow looking to EXPAND with that shitty, shitty margin, and also doesnt know that employees themselves could eat that cost by a mere $26 a paycheck.

Someone is a shitty ship captain, or someone's thread is stank and I just went sliced quality Ham all over it.

 

[JoeB131]

This discussion reminds me of video rental stores. You couldn't drive a mile in any direction without running into one of them. Boy those people were making money huh? Go out and put up another one was the way to make money huh? How is that working out? Now imagine having to provide health coverage while expanding like that.

But doesn't that show the foolishiness of tying health coverage to employment to start with?

Look every other country in the world has figured this out. Single payer.

It was the businesses that opposed it because they didn't want to pay more in taxes, or they didn't want to cover their employees because they figured someone else would.

 

[JoeB131]

To Blue Phantom...

Honestly, if your business advice was anything like your "poll analysis" (you know, the one where you had the Weird Mormon Robot winning every swing state when he won only NC- barely), I'm amazed you have any clients who are still in business.