McDonalds Introduces Self Serving Kiosks in Response to Min Wage Increase

[hadit]

To be serious those have been around in fast food for over 10 years, I highly doubt they will become the norm.

Most people like me don't like them or use them, even in the supermarket self check out.


Let's look at history and human nature this has been around for a 100 years I think and didn't take over

There are so many differences in what was happening in the photo compared to what's happening in FF outlets today it's not even relevant to mix the two.
Literally every one of the food products being sold in the photo were 'pre prepared' items. That's just for starters.
Apples and oranges.

Your not getting my premise, it's the entire thing of people want to interact with a human, fast food kiosk been around for over 10 years plus in this country and have not taken off.

.

Self checkout at the grocery store, self serve gas pumps. Customers adapt to changing situations, and when given a choice, choose the option they want at that time.

Ever order food at a Wawa gas station? Completely automated. In a few decades the fastest and cheapest option will be the kiosk. If you want to interact with a human, you'll pay a premium to do it.

 

[Conservative65]

If you pay someone 7 bucks an hour do you expect good productivity and people to stay? McDonalds doesn't want nor expect good workers to stay. Otherwise they would pay more. Their business model is low wage and expecting little or no productivity. Some companies have to attract the least productive. Pretend to pay me I pretend to work.

When you're forced to pay someone a minimum of $7.25/hour because the federal government mandates it instead of paying based on skills required to do the job, absolutely I expect efficiency. You're already getting paid more than what you offer is worth.

They pay that amount because the job being done requires skills at that amount.

Pretend to work because you don't like what you agreed to work for and that won't be a problem. Someone else will be in your spot either doing the job correctly or they'll be replaced if they have the same attitude. When you offer low skills, don't expect anyone to come knocking on your door.

 

[hadit]

Thanks to the left, now even high school kids can't get jobs.

Thanks To 'Fight For $15' Minimum Wage, McDonald's Unveils Job-Replacing Self-Service Kiosks Nationwide

I also call bullshit. The same person that takes your order brings you your food. How would an automated order system reduce staff?

If you go into the FF outlet you simply press the buttons to make your order. You 'tap' your card to make payment. No cash. If you don't have a bank card of some sort you put whatever amount of paper currency into a 'robot' and it spits out a card which you use to tap when you make your order.
Many people will load up this sort of card and then be able to use it a number of times.
In the back a tray is positioned by a robot. The fries have been perfectly cooked and your portion is put into the cardboard container by a robot. Your 'customized' burger is built as it moves on the conveyor until it is wrapped by a robot.
Same with your drink.
Each item is positioned on the tray.
The tray is moved to a slot in the wall. On the other side you are informed that your order is ready. You walk up to the wall and your order is waiting. You lift the door and take your order.
The only humans involved are the few who are trained to feed the robots the products the robots use to make your order.
Currently there are THOUSANDS of these virtually fully automated FF outlets throughout Asia.
Within a few years every FF outlet in the US will be as automated as the owner can make them.

There is a huge cultural difference between Asians and Americans. Japan has the highest ratio of vending machines to people in the world. They will buy anything from a vending machine, which is really what you are describing. But imagine, an American dutifully keying in his order and handing over the money without speaking to a single soul. Then patiently waiting without any awareness as to the progress of his order, no communication with anyone, for a "bing". And the best part, trustingly picking up his order from a window with no person to hold accountable if it is screwed up. Oh yeah, I can see that place absolutely booming.

Customer expectations change and adapt.

 

[Wyatt earp]

To be serious those have been around in fast food for over 10 years, I highly doubt they will become the norm.

Most people like me don't like them or use them, even in the supermarket self check out.


Let's look at history and human nature this has been around for a 100 years I think and didn't take over

There are so many differences in what was happening in the photo compared to what's happening in FF outlets today it's not even relevant to mix the two.
Literally every one of the food products being sold in the photo were 'pre prepared' items. That's just for starters.
Apples and oranges.

Your not getting my premise, it's the entire thing of people want to interact with a human, fast food kiosk been around for over 10 years plus in this country and have not taken off.

.

Self checkout at the grocery store, self serve gas pumps. Customers adapt to changing situations, and when given a choice, choose the option they want at that time.

Ever order food at a Wawa gas station? Completely automated. In a few decades the fastest and cheapest option will be the kiosk. If you want to interact with a human, you'll pay a premium to do it.

Self checkout at the grocery store,

You just made my point, they didn't take off, go to the store you will see more people waiting in line for the cashier then using self check outs.


.

 

[Conservative65]

Thanks to the left, now even high school kids can't get jobs.

Thanks To 'Fight For $15' Minimum Wage, McDonald's Unveils Job-Replacing Self-Service Kiosks Nationwide

I also call bullshit. The same person that takes your order brings you your food. How would an automated order system reduce staff?

If you go into the FF outlet you simply press the buttons to make your order. You 'tap' your card to make payment. No cash. If you don't have a bank card of some sort you put whatever amount of paper currency into a 'robot' and it spits out a card which you use to tap when you make your order.
Many people will load up this sort of card and then be able to use it a number of times.
In the back a tray is positioned by a robot. The fries have been perfectly cooked and your portion is put into the cardboard container by a robot. Your 'customized' burger is built as it moves on the conveyor until it is wrapped by a robot.
Same with your drink.
Each item is positioned on the tray.
The tray is moved to a slot in the wall. On the other side you are informed that your order is ready. You walk up to the wall and your order is waiting. You lift the door and take your order.
The only humans involved are the few who are trained to feed the robots the products the robots use to make your order.
Currently there are THOUSANDS of these virtually fully automated FF outlets throughout Asia.
Within a few years every FF outlet in the US will be as automated as the owner can make them.

There is a huge cultural difference between Asians and Americans. Japan has the highest ratio of vending machines to people in the world. They will buy anything from a vending machine, which is really what you are describing. But imagine, an American dutifully keying in his order and handing over the money without speaking to a single soul. Then patiently waiting without any awareness as to the progress of his order, no communication with anyone, for a "bing". And the best part, trustingly picking up his order from a window with no person to hold accountable if it is screwed up. Oh yeah, I can see that place absolutely booming.

I can't say I've every used a vending machine where if a mistake was made it was the machine's fault. If I push button C12 but meant to push D12, that I got what was in C12 isn't the machine's fault. However, if I order a burger without pickles and it comes with pickles, the fault lies with the dumbass that put pickles on it.

I have no problem keying in an order, handing over the money, and not speaking to anyone. Last time I went into a place like McDonalds, I couldn't understand the ebonics gibberish the person was saying.

 

[Conservative65]

Thanks to the left, now even high school kids can't get jobs.

Thanks To 'Fight For $15' Minimum Wage, McDonald's Unveils Job-Replacing Self-Service Kiosks Nationwide

I also call bullshit. The same person that takes your order brings you your food. How would an automated order system reduce staff?

If you go into the FF outlet you simply press the buttons to make your order. You 'tap' your card to make payment. No cash. If you don't have a bank card of some sort you put whatever amount of paper currency into a 'robot' and it spits out a card which you use to tap when you make your order.
Many people will load up this sort of card and then be able to use it a number of times.
In the back a tray is positioned by a robot. The fries have been perfectly cooked and your portion is put into the cardboard container by a robot. Your 'customized' burger is built as it moves on the conveyor until it is wrapped by a robot.
Same with your drink.
Each item is positioned on the tray.
The tray is moved to a slot in the wall. On the other side you are informed that your order is ready. You walk up to the wall and your order is waiting. You lift the door and take your order.
The only humans involved are the few who are trained to feed the robots the products the robots use to make your order.
Currently there are THOUSANDS of these virtually fully automated FF outlets throughout Asia.
Within a few years every FF outlet in the US will be as automated as the owner can make them.

There is a huge cultural difference between Asians and Americans. Japan has the highest ratio of vending machines to people in the world. They will buy anything from a vending machine, which is really what you are describing. But imagine, an American dutifully keying in his order and handing over the money without speaking to a single soul. Then patiently waiting without any awareness as to the progress of his order, no communication with anyone, for a "bing". And the best part, trustingly picking up his order from a window with no person to hold accountable if it is screwed up. Oh yeah, I can see that place absolutely booming.

Customer expectations change and adapt.

I did my own "experiment" a few years ago at the local McDonalds in the city where I work. I didn't eat the nasty shit just purchased it trying to prove that if people want $15/hour, they need to produce $15/hour results. In 21 days, 11 of the orders were wrong. I might order something without pickles or ask for mayo. On one occasion, a new item was on the menu. Not knowing, I asked for it without pickles or mayo to which the order taker said it didn't come with either. When I got it, it had both. Since I didn't eat it, what mattered was that they got it wrong.

 

[Winston]

Do the math. Franchise owners can't possibly swing the investment. Of the more than 2.4 million dollars in operating expenses it is doubtful more than $300,000 is in total labor cost. They send much more of that 2.4 million dollars to McDonalds corporate in the form of rents, royalties, and service fees So again, just how much can automation cut that three hundred grand? At what expense?

Nope, when your bottom line profit is half as much as your total labor cost, and your total labor cost accounts for less than 15% of your total costs, large capital investments to trim those already minimal labor costs are hard to justify.

One study found that raising the price of the Big Mac by just seventeen cents, and only raising the price of the Big Mac, McDonald's could fund a fifteen dollars an hour minimum wage. They couldn't put in a new drive thru window for that.

The Socialist rag where you got your numbers is spewing bullshit lies.
After you have owned and operated half a dozen FF outlets get back to us.
Until then fuck off!

LMAO

When I was younger I was a change agent for restaurant operators. Maybe you heard of a little company I helped expand in the Southeast. Outback Steakhouse. But anyways, McDonald's corporate recruited me back in the 1990's to help them design and incorporate a JIT process. I am intimately area of how they operate. The numbers are spot on..

Bullshit!
If the "numbers were spot on" the entire FF industry world wide would not be moving to as much automation as possible.
Or is the FF industry full on fucking dummies who can't get it through their heads that it's cheaper to pay someone fifteen bucks an hour to build a 'AW 'Buddy Burger' than to buy a machine that will turn out three 'customer-customized' burgers an hour? Each one perfectly built. No more: "I told you I didn't want fucking onions!!!!!!"
Wise up pal!

Well, McDonald's is backing away from automation. They were going to implement a create your own program with a self service kiosk in every location. The cost for the kiosk was forty grand. They pulled the national roll-out. Probably because the forty grand investment was not justified.

And honestly, you kind of hit on the problem with automation. Call it the John Henry problem. Sure, you will find some automation on the front end taking orders. But on the back end, in production. Three burgers an hour? Obviously no one is buying that machine. Turnaround times in the fast food industry are measured in minutes, seconds in the drive-thru. Even fresh ground cooked to order Five Guys--it is eight minutes.

And finally, something everyone seems to be missing. When a kiosk is not taking an order it is an expensive decoration. You can't tell it to check the restrooms, sweep the lobby, or make another batch of coffee. The same holds true in the back. When it is not making burgers it is taking up precious space that costs hundreds of dollars per square feet. Before you can justify a piece of automated equipment you have to examine the impact of that dedicated allocation of time and space to your operation.

I mistyped. I meant to type three hundred burgers an hour obviously.
If FF automation is so cost ineffective why is the FF industry world wide moving towards as much automation as possible?
You're full of shit!
Last November McDonald's announced the Kiosk roll-out.
Try to keep up.
McDonald's To Roll Out Self-Order Kiosks and Table Service in the U.S. | Fortune.com

Well, at three hundred burgers an hour you might have something. But I got to be honest, I think the replicator on the Enterprise took at least twelve seconds.

And nope, I think McDonald's new CEO axed that program. But even if he hadn't, that program would increase labor. Unless they are going to call the new "servers" tipped employees. You do realize "table-service" is more labor intensive than taking the order, right?

 

[Wyatt earp]

To be serious those have been around in fast food for over 10 years, I highly doubt they will become the norm.

Most people like me don't like them or use them, even in the supermarket self check out.


Let's look at history and human nature this has been around for a 100 years I think and didn't take over

There are so many differences in what was happening in the photo compared to what's happening in FF outlets today it's not even relevant to mix the two.
Literally every one of the food products being sold in the photo were 'pre prepared' items. That's just for starters.
Apples and oranges.

Your not getting my premise, it's the entire thing of people want to interact with a human, fast food kiosk been around for over 10 years plus in this country and have not taken off.

.

Self checkout at the grocery store, self serve gas pumps. Customers adapt to changing situations, and when given a choice, choose the option they want at that time.

Ever order food at a Wawa gas station? Completely automated. In a few decades the fastest and cheapest option will be the kiosk. If you want to interact with a human, you'll pay a premium to do it.

I don't know about wawa, but I know gas stations in Ohio that is similar that you are talking about, that's how I know they have been around for over 10 years.


And they didn't take off.


.

 

[martybegan]

Because it replaces some of the salaries they would have to pay, and the hourly operating costs even with maintenance figured in is much much less than a breathing employee?

Do the math. Franchise owners can't possibly swing the investment. Of the more than 2.4 million dollars in operating expenses it is doubtful more than $300,000 is in total labor cost. They send much more of that 2.4 million dollars to McDonalds corporate in the form of rents, royalties, and service fees So again, just how much can automation cut that three hundred grand? At what expense?

Nope, when your bottom line profit is half as much as your total labor cost, and your total labor cost accounts for less than 15% of your total costs, large capital investments to trim those already minimal labor costs are hard to justify.

One study found that raising the price of the Big Mac by just seventeen cents, and only raising the price of the Big Mac, McDonald's could fund a fifteen dollars an hour minimum wage. They couldn't put in a new drive thru window for that.

The Socialist rag where you got your numbers is spewing bullshit lies.
After you have owned and operated half a dozen FF outlets get back to us.
Until then fuck off!

LMAO

When I was younger I was a change agent for restaurant operators. Maybe you heard of a little company I helped expand in the Southeast. Outback Steakhouse. But anyways, McDonald's corporate recruited me back in the 1990's to help them design and incorporate a JIT process. I am intimately area of how they operate. The numbers are spot on..

Bullshit!
If the "numbers were spot on" the entire FF industry world wide would not be moving to as much automation as possible.
Or is the FF industry full on fucking dummies who can't get it through their heads that it's cheaper to pay someone fifteen bucks an hour to build a 'AW 'Buddy Burger' than to buy a machine that will turn out three 'customer-customized' burgers an hour? Each one perfectly built. No more: "I told you I didn't want fucking onions!!!!!!"
Wise up pal!

Well, McDonald's is backing away from automation. They were going to implement a create your own program with a self service kiosk in every location. The cost for the kiosk was forty grand. They pulled the national roll-out. Probably because the forty grand investment was not justified.

And honestly, you kind of hit on the problem with automation. Call it the John Henry problem. Sure, you will find some automation on the front end taking orders. But on the back end, in production. Three burgers an hour? Obviously no one is buying that machine. Turnaround times in the fast food industry are measured in minutes, seconds in the drive-thru. Even fresh ground cooked to order Five Guys--it is eight minutes.

And finally, something everyone seems to be missing. When a kiosk is not taking an order it is an expensive decoration. You can't tell it to check the restrooms, sweep the lobby, or make another batch of coffee. The same holds true in the back. When it is not making burgers it is taking up precious space that costs hundreds of dollars per square feet. Before you can justify a piece of automated equipment you have to examine the impact of that dedicated allocation of time and space to your operation.

Automation will not eliminate employees, just reduce the #, and make them backups to the machines which will handle the work.

I saw my first kiosk based McDonald's when i was in Ottawa.

 

[dannyboys]

To be serious those have been around in fast food for over 10 years, I highly doubt they will become the norm.

Most people like me don't like them or use them, even in the supermarket self check out.


Let's look at history and human nature this has been around for a 100 years I think and didn't take over

There are so many differences in what was happening in the photo compared to what's happening in FF outlets today it's not even relevant to mix the two.
Literally every one of the food products being sold in the photo were 'pre prepared' items. That's just for starters.
Apples and oranges.

Your not getting my premise, it's the entire thing of people want to interact with a human, fast food kiosk been around for over 10 years plus in this country and have not taken off.

.

Self checkout at the grocery store, self serve gas pumps. Customers adapt to changing situations, and when given a choice, choose the option they want at that time.

Ever order food at a Wawa gas station? Completely automated. In a few decades the fastest and cheapest option will be the kiosk. If you want to interact with a human, you'll pay a premium to do it.

Self checkout at the grocery store,

You just made my point, they didn't take off, go to the store you will see more people waiting in line for the cashier then using self check outs.


.

They didn't "take off" because back then your average person was used to eating half decent meals prepared at home. That's only one of a hundred reasons.
The number one reason people will go to a regular checkout is if they have a shopping cart full of items. They aren't going to stand at a self checkout and scan a hundred items! AND have to bag them. And have to deal with the machine that won't accept paper money which has a crease in it.
Studies have proven that customers with less than five items use self checkouts.
The proof is obvious.
Anyone who has ever lined up at a regular check-out with five items in a basket and is stuck behind three customers with full shopping carts is going to be looking for the self checkout aisle.
Simple logic.

 

[Wyatt earp]

To be serious those have been around in fast food for over 10 years, I highly doubt they will become the norm.

Most people like me don't like them or use them, even in the supermarket self check out.


Let's look at history and human nature this has been around for a 100 years I think and didn't take over

There are so many differences in what was happening in the photo compared to what's happening in FF outlets today it's not even relevant to mix the two.
Literally every one of the food products being sold in the photo were 'pre prepared' items. That's just for starters.
Apples and oranges.

Your not getting my premise, it's the entire thing of people want to interact with a human, fast food kiosk been around for over 10 years plus in this country and have not taken off.

.

Self checkout at the grocery store, self serve gas pumps. Customers adapt to changing situations, and when given a choice, choose the option they want at that time.

Ever order food at a Wawa gas station? Completely automated. In a few decades the fastest and cheapest option will be the kiosk. If you want to interact with a human, you'll pay a premium to do it.

Self checkout at the grocery store,

You just made my point, they didn't take off, go to the store you will see more people waiting in line for the cashier then using self check outs.


.

They didn't "take off" because back then your average person was used to eating half decent meals prepared at home. That's only one of a hundred reasons.
The number one reason people will go to a regular checkout is if they have a shopping cart full of items. They aren't going to stand at a self checkout and scan a hundred items! AND have to bag them. And have to deal with the machine that won't accept paper money which has a crease in it.
Studies have proven that customers with less than five items use self checkouts.
The proof is obvious.
Anyone who has ever lined up at a regular check-out with five items in a basket and is stuck behind three customers with full shopping carts is going to be looking for the self checkout aisle.
Simple logic.

Anyone who has ever lined up at a regular check-out with five items in a basket and is stuck behind three customers with full shopping carts is going to be looking for the self checkout aisle

I don't know what world you live in, but mine people are polite down here in South Carolina and let me go ahead.

 

[Wyatt earp]

To be serious those have been around in fast food for over 10 years, I highly doubt they will become the norm.

Most people like me don't like them or use them, even in the supermarket self check out.


Let's look at history and human nature this has been around for a 100 years I think and didn't take over

There are so many differences in what was happening in the photo compared to what's happening in FF outlets today it's not even relevant to mix the two.
Literally every one of the food products being sold in the photo were 'pre prepared' items. That's just for starters.
Apples and oranges.

Your not getting my premise, it's the entire thing of people want to interact with a human, fast food kiosk been around for over 10 years plus in this country and have not taken off.

.

Self checkout at the grocery store, self serve gas pumps. Customers adapt to changing situations, and when given a choice, choose the option they want at that time.

Ever order food at a Wawa gas station? Completely automated. In a few decades the fastest and cheapest option will be the kiosk. If you want to interact with a human, you'll pay a premium to do it.

Self checkout at the grocery store,

You just made my point, they didn't take off, go to the store you will see more people waiting in line for the cashier then using self check outs.


.

They didn't "take off" because back then your average person was used to eating half decent meals prepared at home. That's only one of a hundred reasons.
The number one reason people will go to a regular checkout is if they have a shopping cart full of items. They aren't going to stand at a self checkout and scan a hundred items! AND have to bag them. And have to deal with the machine that won't accept paper money which has a crease in it.
Studies have proven that customers with less than five items use self checkouts.
The proof is obvious.
Anyone who has ever lined up at a regular check-out with five items in a basket and is stuck behind three customers with full shopping carts is going to be looking for the self checkout aisle.
Simple logic.

BTW where is your link of the study's?

Do you even shop, or does your mom do it?


.

 

[danielpalos]

Go back and read my posts on this subject.
I told you all this was coming.
FYI the "infrastructure" required to virtually make FF outlets 100 automated is a one-time investment (which is written off in tax deferments).
The bottom line cost savings by installing automated FF equipment is close to double digits per piece of equipment.
No more fucking semi-literates who don't wash their hands, who show up late/drunk/stoned.
No more fucking 'paperwork'!
No more product loss and theft.
A business acquaintance who owns a few FF outlets is switching over to fully automated operations.
Three years ago he had 40 people on the 'on-call' list to cover four outlets.
Today he employs three full time 'mature' employees, all over fifty with other sources of income like pensions, at each outlet.
And about ten 'mature' part time 'on call' employees also with other sources of income to cover evening shifts etc.
His businesses have never run so smoothly.
He is installing fully automated pieces of equipment as soon as they are available.
The fully automated chip fryers he installed eliminated about twenty part time jobs.

Some of this equipment is probably not a "one time cost" as their replacement cycles are less than 10 years, and unless the automation is a "slap on" model, you have to rebuy the new automation when you get the new cooking/sorting/prepping unit in.

Still the sad fact is that yes, the people that the "fight for 15" people think think they are helping are the ones hurt the most by automation, but there is also another mechanism at play, which is you open up the work pool to a better class of employee. If you pay $15 an hour, someone in a $15 an hour job that is harder may decide to take the easier $15 an hour job (the former $8 an hour job). That pushes out the only worth $8 an hour employee as well.

some wages are "tied to the minimum wage" in some manner; a rising tide lifts all boats, eventually.

and you do realize that the phenomenon makes raising the minimum wage a futile cyclical fight, right?

resistance is Not futile, if wages outpace inflation. a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage can make that happen.

A $15 minimum would increase inflation, and any gap between the wage increase and the inflation increase would be temporary at best.

It's like you think economics is some magic show instead of an actual process of inputs and outputs.

yes, it is in any mixed market economy.

increasing the cost of labor means capital must seek gains from efficiency.

 

[danielpalos]

To be serious those have been around in fast food for over 10 years, I highly doubt they will become the norm.

Most people like me don't like them or use them, even in the supermarket self check out.


Let's look at history and human nature this has been around for a 100 years I think and didn't take over

There are so many differences in what was happening in the photo compared to what's happening in FF outlets today it's not even relevant to mix the two.
Literally every one of the food products being sold in the photo were 'pre prepared' items. That's just for starters.
Apples and oranges.

Your not getting my premise, it's the entire thing of people want to interact with a human, fast food kiosk been around for over 10 years plus in this country and have not taken off.

.

we have smartphone technology, now.

 

[danielpalos]

If you pay someone 7 bucks an hour do you expect good productivity and people to stay? McDonalds doesn't want nor expect good workers to stay. Otherwise they would pay more. Their business model is low wage and expecting little or no productivity. Some companies have to attract the least productive. Pretend to pay me I pretend to work.

When you're forced to pay someone a minimum of $7.25/hour because the federal government mandates it instead of paying based on skills required to do the job, absolutely I expect efficiency. You're already getting paid more than what you offer is worth.

They pay that amount because the job being done requires skills at that amount.

Pretend to work because you don't like what you agreed to work for and that won't be a problem. Someone else will be in your spot either doing the job correctly or they'll be replaced if they have the same attitude. When you offer low skills, don't expect anyone to come knocking on your door.

Only the right wing is that, fantastical.

Your current metrics are based on our current minimum wage.

 

[martybegan]

Some of this equipment is probably not a "one time cost" as their replacement cycles are less than 10 years, and unless the automation is a "slap on" model, you have to rebuy the new automation when you get the new cooking/sorting/prepping unit in.

Still the sad fact is that yes, the people that the "fight for 15" people think think they are helping are the ones hurt the most by automation, but there is also another mechanism at play, which is you open up the work pool to a better class of employee. If you pay $15 an hour, someone in a $15 an hour job that is harder may decide to take the easier $15 an hour job (the former $8 an hour job). That pushes out the only worth $8 an hour employee as well.

some wages are "tied to the minimum wage" in some manner; a rising tide lifts all boats, eventually.

and you do realize that the phenomenon makes raising the minimum wage a futile cyclical fight, right?

resistance is Not futile, if wages outpace inflation. a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage can make that happen.

A $15 minimum would increase inflation, and any gap between the wage increase and the inflation increase would be temporary at best.

It's like you think economics is some magic show instead of an actual process of inputs and outputs.

yes, it is in any mixed market economy.

increasing the cost of labor means capital must seek gains from efficiency.

or they raise prices, which is made easier by people making more money, but doesn't lead to an increase in buying POWER.

 

[danielpalos]

To be serious those have been around in fast food for over 10 years, I highly doubt they will become the norm.

Most people like me don't like them or use them, even in the supermarket self check out.


Let's look at history and human nature this has been around for a 100 years I think and didn't take over

There are so many differences in what was happening in the photo compared to what's happening in FF outlets today it's not even relevant to mix the two.
Literally every one of the food products being sold in the photo were 'pre prepared' items. That's just for starters.
Apples and oranges.

Your not getting my premise, it's the entire thing of people want to interact with a human, fast food kiosk been around for over 10 years plus in this country and have not taken off.

.

Self checkout at the grocery store, self serve gas pumps. Customers adapt to changing situations, and when given a choice, choose the option they want at that time.

Ever order food at a Wawa gas station? Completely automated. In a few decades the fastest and cheapest option will be the kiosk. If you want to interact with a human, you'll pay a premium to do it.

Self checkout at the grocery store,

You just made my point, they didn't take off, go to the store you will see more people waiting in line for the cashier then using self check outs.


.

a co-op that invests in electric vehicles, may qualify for not-for-profit.

 

[danielpalos]

some wages are "tied to the minimum wage" in some manner; a rising tide lifts all boats, eventually.

and you do realize that the phenomenon makes raising the minimum wage a futile cyclical fight, right?

resistance is Not futile, if wages outpace inflation. a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage can make that happen.

A $15 minimum would increase inflation, and any gap between the wage increase and the inflation increase would be temporary at best.

It's like you think economics is some magic show instead of an actual process of inputs and outputs.

yes, it is in any mixed market economy.

increasing the cost of labor means capital must seek gains from efficiency.

or they raise prices, which is made easier by people making more money, but doesn't lead to an increase in buying POWER.

that is up to them; but, they may have to compete, with Henry Ford imitators.

 

[martybegan]

and you do realize that the phenomenon makes raising the minimum wage a futile cyclical fight, right?

resistance is Not futile, if wages outpace inflation. a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage can make that happen.

A $15 minimum would increase inflation, and any gap between the wage increase and the inflation increase would be temporary at best.

It's like you think economics is some magic show instead of an actual process of inputs and outputs.

yes, it is in any mixed market economy.

increasing the cost of labor means capital must seek gains from efficiency.

or they raise prices, which is made easier by people making more money, but doesn't lead to an increase in buying POWER.

that is up to them; but, they may have to compete, with Henry Ford imitators.

The current "Henry Ford" concept IS automation..

 

[danielpalos]

resistance is Not futile, if wages outpace inflation. a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage can make that happen.

A $15 minimum would increase inflation, and any gap between the wage increase and the inflation increase would be temporary at best.

It's like you think economics is some magic show instead of an actual process of inputs and outputs.

yes, it is in any mixed market economy.

increasing the cost of labor means capital must seek gains from efficiency.

or they raise prices, which is made easier by people making more money, but doesn't lead to an increase in buying POWER.

that is up to them; but, they may have to compete, with Henry Ford imitators.

The current "Henry Ford" concept IS automation..

your point?

the left already has an answer to the right wing, canard, of unemployment.