Nathan Bedford Forrest statue causing controversy

[Unkotare]

Time to unsubscribe from this thread.

Surrender again, huh?

 

[The Gadfly]

No, you were talking about the systematic murder of black confederates in uniform at the gates of northern prisons. All the other stuff you print means nothing and can be ignored: irrelevant.

Now, Forrest was responsible for mass murder.

And, no, great numbers of murders of black confederates in union prisons did not occur.

I was most certainly NOT, Jake. You have twisted a citation supporting one post, with one supporting another post describing another set of facts. Go back and look for yourself, and you will recognize your error, if it occurred because of honest stupidity. Otherwise, I will assume it is what it appears to be; an exercise in deliberate dishonesty, aimed at discrediting evidence I have presented which demonstrates just how wrongheaded and ignorant your supposed "historical knowledge" actually is. Frankly, if this is the case, I am not surprised; your behavior and mode of argumentation in this thread has been both ugly and childish. You've done everything from engaging in fallacies of argumentation, to name-calling, to outright lying; what you have NOT done, is contributed anything of legitimate debate or scholarly study to this discussion; no, you have been far more concerned with generating heat rather than light.

Actually, I find that Dicksuck, troll that he usually is, has contributed more substance to this thread than you have; though his scholarship is , to put it kindly, incomplete, he has at least made some effort to consult some reasonable sources. McPherson's book may not be the best history available (I don't believe it is) but at least his work is one of the more recognized modern histories of the conflict, and worth reading. You do not appear to have studied even that much, and if you have nothing more to contribute than name calling and twisting the posts and historical citations offered by others more interested in rational debate, I do not intend to respond further to your nonsense.

 

[GuyPinestra]

Time to unsubscribe from this thread.

Surrender again, huh?

Fuck you, you ignorant piece of slimy cat shit!! You've spent 60+ pages demonstrating your hate and ignorance, all the while NEVER using ANY piece of the historical record to support your vitriolic hatred of all things southern.

Hypothetically speaking, if I could get my hands around your neck you'd be having conversations with your war criminal ancestors and asking them what the fuck they were thinking when they rent the gash on this nation that STILL hasn't healed.

You are about the biggest cock-sucking piece of shit around here, Unkotard, and that comparison includes the morons like Franco and Ludley.

You worthless piece of shit!

 

[The Gadfly]

Time to unsubscribe from this thread. It seems that no matter how many documented facts are deposited in front of the faces of the Northern apologists, they continue to parrot the same big, bald-faced lies that their propagandists indoctrinated them with as children.

It's a crying shame that they've never grown past that point.

Fucking dupes!

(I hate to use that word, considering Frenchie's abuse of it, but there is not a better one to describe the willful ignorance of those who REFUSE to learn.)

Guy, Any attempt to provide historical education to these people is rather like trying to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time, and annoys the pig. One can educate the ignorant, but the sort of willful ignorance displayed here is beyond the remedy of education. You just can't fix stupid,, when the mind that exhibits it is utterly closed.

 

[The Gadfly]

Time to unsubscribe from this thread.

Surrender again, huh?

Were you born an idiot, or is that the sole achievement of your lifetime?

 

[GuyPinestra]

Time to unsubscribe from this thread. It seems that no matter how many documented facts are deposited in front of the faces of the Northern apologists, they continue to parrot the same big, bald-faced lies that their propagandists indoctrinated them with as children.

It's a crying shame that they've never grown past that point.

Fucking dupes!

(I hate to use that word, considering Frenchie's abuse of it, but there is not a better one to describe the willful ignorance of those who REFUSE to learn.)

Guy, Any attempt to provide historical education to these people is rather like trying to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time, and annoys the pig. One can educate the ignorant, but the sort of willful ignorance displayed here is beyond the remedy of education. You just can't fix stupid,, when the mind that exhibits it is utterly closed.

I'm afraid I must agree, and it pains me to think that these are the minds that our nation is left to...

 

[bripat9643]

Time to unsubscribe from this thread. It seems that no matter how many documented facts are deposited in front of the faces of the Northern apologists, they continue to parrot the same big, bald-faced lies that their propagandists indoctrinated them with as children.

It's a crying shame that they've never grown past that point.

Fucking dupes!

(I hate to use that word, considering Frenchie's abuse of it, but there is not a better one to describe the willful ignorance of those who REFUSE to learn.)

Guy, Any attempt to provide historical education to these people is rather like trying to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time, and annoys the pig. One can educate the ignorant, but the sort of willful ignorance displayed here is beyond the remedy of education. You just can't fix stupid,, when the mind that exhibits it is utterly closed.

The point is to educate the lurkers, not the imbeciles who vent their spleens on all things they are ignorant about. Threads like this expose a lot of people to information they've never encountered before.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Time to keep trying to educate the fringer who do not understand, but the dupes never will (like Guy, 9th ID, bripat, and others). No matter the number of documented facts are deposited in front of the faces of the Southern apologists, they continue to parrot the same big, bald-faced lies that their propagandists indoctrinated them with as children.

Although it's a shame they won't learn, we can keep on educating those on the fringe who are willing to know the real history of America.

 

[GuyPinestra]

Time to keep trying to educate the fringer who do not understand, but the dupes never will (like Guy, 9th ID, bripat, and others). No matter the number of documented facts are deposited in front of the faces of the Southern apologists, they continue to parrot the same big, bald-faced lies that their propagandists indoctrinated them with as children.

Although it's a shame they won't learn, we can keep on educating those on the fringe who are willing to know the real history of America.

You wouldn't know a fact if it shit in your mouth, you're a scumbag, Fakey! You have yet to post a verifiable fact in 66 pages. You must get paid to be such a hack, nobody would make themselves look this ignorant for FREE!

 

[Unkotare]

Time to unsubscribe from this thread.

Surrender again, huh?

Fuck you, you ignorant piece of slimy cat shit!! !

Ah, a little covering fire while you retreat? Not gonna change the outcome, loser.

 

[GuyPinestra]

Surrender again, huh?

Fuck you, you ignorant piece of slimy cat shit!! !

Ah, a little covering fire while you retreat? Not gonna change the outcome, loser.

If you're going to quote it, you pussy motherfucker, quote the whole fucking thing!!

Fuck you, you ignorant piece of slimy cat shit!! You've spent 60+ pages demonstrating your hate and ignorance, all the while NEVER using ANY piece of the historical record to support your vitriolic hatred of all things southern.

Hypothetically speaking, if I could get my hands around your neck you'd be having conversations with your war criminal ancestors and asking them what the fuck they were thinking when they rent the gash on this nation that STILL hasn't healed.

You are about the biggest cock-sucking piece of shit around here, Unkotard, and that comparison includes the morons like Franco and Ludley.

You worthless piece of shit!

 

[Unkotare]

Hypothetically speaking, if I could get my hands around your neck...

That would be great! I could make them into ashtrays or decorative lamps or something. That would be a lot of fun.

 

[Unkotare]

Fuck you, you ignorant piece of slimy cat shit!! !

Ah, a little covering fire while you retreat? Not gonna change the outcome, loser.

If you're going to quote it,

I did quote it. I even quoted the really funny part in a separate post. Thanks for the laugh, by the way.

 

[Unkotare]

it pains me to think that these are the minds that our nation is left to...

Your 'what' is left to? Hmmm?

 

[Unkotare]

Gaypinestra's meltdown is going pretty well so far. Highly entertaining.

 

[bripat9643]

Now you're just admitting that you know you were wrong. Even Congress and Union generals admit that Forrest wasn't responsible.

You're a lying imbecile, Fakey. Your lies are so pathetic and transparent that not even an imbecile would fall for them.

9th ID makes assumptions, the truth of which we can't know unless he provides the document numbers.

9th ID's banal defense of mass murder is mere deflection. The point was that as commanding officer, the General was responsible for loss of command control and thus liable for trial and execution.

9th ID is guilty of false analogy of comparing Ft Pillow (a military action between rival armies) and a race riot in NYC that took three infantry regiments to control.

 

[JakeStarkey]

bripat knows that 9ID used a false analogy and has also not produced sufficient documents for his case.

Both bripat and 9ID have a right to express their opinions, but that is all that they have, opinions which are not evidence.

 

[The Gadfly]

bripat knows that 9ID used a false analogy and has also not produced sufficient documents for his case.

Both bripat and 9ID have a right to express their opinions, but that is all that they have, opinions which are not evidence.

A fals analogy huh? Well, try this one. We know that the Garrison at Ft. Pillow was some 557 men of which some 262 (13th Tennessee Infantry) were White, and some 295 USCT, of which number around 20 were White officers. We also know that both Union and Confederate accounts agree that the number of bodies buried was 228-231. That would mean at least 326 survivors from the Union garrison. Accounts of 300+ USCT "massacred" are simply impossible to reconcile wit these numbers. Now, if the guards at Camp Douglas executed around 200 Black Confederates, that would have been more than the number of USCT killed at Ft. Pillow, not to mention that many if not most of the deaths of USCT at Ft. Pillow resulted from direct combat i.e., they were NOT "executed". Yet you call Ft. Pillow a "massacre" for which you blame Forrest, while absolving the command at Camp Douglas of any responsibility for a policy carried out not once, but repeatedly over several years. Who was it who systematically killed Black POWs, again?

By the way, from the compiled Union and Confederate documentation in the OR (no, I am NOT going to put the citation out here again; it's been posted, and you can just go back and find it for yourself!) Forrest had a total force of no more than 1500-1600. Even at that, had Forrest ordered No Quarter, the Confederates could easily have killed the entire garrison. This did NOT happen, because there was no such order given. The entire action took place in fifteen minutes or less, from the initial charge to the end of the shooting by the river.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Numbers in massacres generally confuse all researchers because of conflicting reports, some less reliable than others. Witness the Bear River Massacre in 1863: somewhere between 60 and 500 plus Native Americans were killed or died in the aftermath.

Yes, many, many men were killed after surrender, many of them African American. Yes, this is execution of POWs, and, yes, Forrest was responsible, particularly if he ordered “no quarter”. At least you know have the Camp Douglas killings down to several. Give us exact numbers using credible evidence.

Don’t say check the OR, because a professor would flunk your paper for that type of nonsense. Your citation was singular, it was not comprehensive, thus it is a hasty generalization from which you were trying to derive a conclusion unwarranted by the evidence.

 

[Dick Tuck]

Time to unsubscribe from this thread. It seems that no matter how many documented facts are deposited in front of the faces of the Northern apologists, they continue to parrot the same big, bald-faced lies that their propagandists indoctrinated them with as children.

It's a crying shame that they've never grown past that point.

Fucking dupes!

(I hate to use that word, considering Frenchie's abuse of it, but there is not a better one to describe the willful ignorance of those who REFUSE to learn.)

Guy, Any attempt to provide historical education to these people is rather like trying to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time, and annoys the pig. One can educate the ignorant, but the sort of willful ignorance displayed here is beyond the remedy of education. You just can't fix stupid,, when the mind that exhibits it is utterly closed.

The point is to educate the lurkers, not the imbeciles who vent their spleens on all things they are ignorant about. Threads like this expose a lot of people to information they've never encountered before.

Have you looked up what the word "cede" means yet?