No frivolous gun control laws would have stopped this...

[2aguy]

Dimitrios Pagourtzis Identified As Sante Fe High School Shooter


“Governor Greg Abbott confirmed Pagourtzis used a shotgun and .38 revolver in the shooting that belonged to his father.”

Gun control does not work....

Of course gun control works. So does banning guns.

When was the last time you saw a fully automatic machine gun outside a museum or movie?

That law was passed in the 1930s. It's goal was to take all fully automatic weapons off the streets and not allow them to be sold in the nation again.

It worked. There are no fully automatic weapons being sold legally in America.

The same thing with sawed off shot guns. They've been illegal for decades.

Then there's the rest of the world. There's very strict laws on guns in just about every other nation in the world. They don't have mass shootings or very much gun violence.

Just saying that gun control doesn't work doesn't make that statement true.

and you are wrong..... Terrorists in France, where fully automatic military weapons are completely illegal, got fully automatic military weapons and murdered 135 people in Paris...these terrorists were on government terrorist watch lists and had criminal records on top of that.......

Europe has mass shootings, they have never had as many as we have, but they are deadlier when they happen...gun crime in Europe is increasing even with their extreme gun control...

Meanwhile, in the U.S.....our gun crime, gun murder and violent crime is going down as more Americans own and carry guns...explain that,,,

Guns in the hands of law abiding people do not increase the gun crime rate....Europe is on the verge of an explosion of violence and gun crime...about where we were in the 1960s....and they are doing all the wrong things to stop it....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 17 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%

--gun crime down 75%

--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

 

[Dana7360]

Where are the constructive suggestions, on the part of firearms permissiveness extremists, for ending the continued plague of 'gun' related violence?

I believe the idea is to arm teachers so they can defend themselves against students with some serious mental problems, pretty constructive I'd think

Then you're putting a target on the teachers and pretty much guaranteeing that the teachers will be the first to be shot.

If you notice, all the police guards with guns are the first ones to be shot. Some die. The one who was shot yesterday didn't die and it in the hospital.

The shooters first go after the person who will try to stop them then move on to the kids.

It happened in the night club in Florida. It happened yesterday in Texas.

There are some instances where an armed teacher's gun went off in class injuring a student. You can read about it at the search below. Just pick your article.


teachers gun goes off in school

The fact that people believe there's only one solution to this is incorrect. We don't live in a one size fits all world. It's a combination of several things.

More guns isn't the answer.

 

[2aguy]

Where are the constructive suggestions, on the part of firearms permissiveness extremists, for ending the continued plague of 'gun' related violence?

I believe the idea is to arm teachers so they can defend themselves against students with some serious mental problems, pretty constructive I'd think

Then you're putting a target on the teachers and pretty much guaranteeing that the teachers will be the first to be shot.

If you notice, all the police guards with guns are the first ones to be shot. Some die. The one who was shot yesterday didn't die and it in the hospital.

The shooters first go after the person who will try to stop them then move on to the kids.

It happened in the night club in Florida. It happened yesterday in Texas.

There are some instances where an armed teacher's gun went off in class injuring a student. You can read about it at the search below. Just pick your article.


teachers gun goes off in school

The fact that people believe there's only one solution to this is incorrect. We don't live in a one size fits all world. It's a combination of several things.

More guns isn't the answer.

Wrong......when teachers carry they will have concealed guns so any killer won't know who is armed...this is the important part of getting rid of democrat gun free zones...as Parkland, and this shooting show, they are not interested in a shoot out...they run away as soon as they are confronted by people with guns.....we know that mass shooters choose their targets based on being gun free zones...so armed staff, that the shooter can't plan for, will make them choose another target, and not the school.

There are 14 states or more that already allow school districts to arm staff......your response has no basis in truth,facts or reality.

 

[2aguy]

Where are the constructive suggestions, on the part of firearms permissiveness extremists, for ending the continued plague of 'gun' related violence?

I believe the idea is to arm teachers so they can defend themselves against students with some serious mental problems, pretty constructive I'd think

Then you're putting a target on the teachers and pretty much guaranteeing that the teachers will be the first to be shot.

If you notice, all the police guards with guns are the first ones to be shot. Some die. The one who was shot yesterday didn't die and it in the hospital.

The shooters first go after the person who will try to stop them then move on to the kids.

It happened in the night club in Florida. It happened yesterday in Texas.

There are some instances where an armed teacher's gun went off in class injuring a student. You can read about it at the search below. Just pick your article.


teachers gun goes off in school

The fact that people believe there's only one solution to this is incorrect. We don't live in a one size fits all world. It's a combination of several things.

More guns isn't the answer.

You should really check your link before you post...from the very first link...the guy was not allowed to have the gun in the school at the time.....and was not part of an armed staff operation.....

School Teacher's Gun Goes Off In Class, One Student Injured

Diffenbaugh noted that state law and school policy forbids carrying firearms on campus without authorization. Alexander, he said, was not authorized.

 

[2aguy]

Where are the constructive suggestions, on the part of firearms permissiveness extremists, for ending the continued plague of 'gun' related violence?

I believe the idea is to arm teachers so they can defend themselves against students with some serious mental problems, pretty constructive I'd think

Then you're putting a target on the teachers and pretty much guaranteeing that the teachers will be the first to be shot.

If you notice, all the police guards with guns are the first ones to be shot. Some die. The one who was shot yesterday didn't die and it in the hospital.

The shooters first go after the person who will try to stop them then move on to the kids.

It happened in the night club in Florida. It happened yesterday in Texas.

There are some instances where an armed teacher's gun went off in class injuring a student. You can read about it at the search below. Just pick your article.


teachers gun goes off in school

The fact that people believe there's only one solution to this is incorrect. We don't live in a one size fits all world. It's a combination of several things.

More guns isn't the answer.

You don't know the issues and no one says that armed staff are the only solution, it is just the most immediate solution...the long term solution does not involve banning guns, but in getting more mental health care, working on single teenage girl run households.....and getting the media to stop glamorizing these shooters....

Could you explain this?

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 17 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%

--gun crime down 75%

--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

 

[Dana7360]

Ban schools, leave people's unalienable rights alone.

Wow, you guys are getting desperate, aren't you?

Most of us are getting tired of sharing our streets with gun-wielding crazy people. Fuck their "Rights".

And we carry guns because liberals don't want to keep crazy people locked up and off the streets.

Unfortunately it's people like you who want mentally unstable people and terrorists to be able to get guns.

When the nation wanted to ban terrorists from getting guns, the gun nuts screamed about it and the republicans in congress refused to pass legislation that will help keep guns out of the hands of terrorists.

Gun nuts had hissy fits when Obama signed an executive order making it more difficult for people with mental problems from getting guns. You all screamed that he was taking guns from people. Which is such an old and tired lie.

Then when trump came into office he reversed Obama's executive order. Resulting in trump making it easier for those with mental problems to get guns you gun nuts cheered him on and said he was doing the job you voted for him to do.

It's not democrats who kicked mental patients out of hospitals and slashed mental health programs. It was ronald reagan who opened the doors of our mental hospitals and allowed people to be kicked out. It's republicans who refuse to support mental health programs. Who screamed when democrats included mental health coverage in Obamacare.

It's conservatives who say it's mentally unstable people who do this violence but at the same time make sure it's easier for those people to get a gun and make it much harder for them to get the proper help they need.

So it's your own policies and laws that have made you believe you need to carry a gun.

 

[there4eyeM]

No constructive suggestions for addressing the hideous contagion of sick psychologies paired with firearm availability? What do firearms enthusiasts plan to do to avoid the inevitable repercussions of public disgust with these massacres?

 

[Defiant1]

Ban schools, leave people's unalienable rights alone.

Wow, you guys are getting desperate, aren't you?

Most of us are getting tired of sharing our streets with gun-wielding crazy people. Fuck their "Rights".

And we carry guns because liberals don't want to keep crazy people locked up and off the streets.

Unfortunately it's people like you who want mentally unstable people and terrorists to be able to get guns.

When the nation wanted to ban terrorists from getting guns, the gun nuts screamed about it and the republicans in congress refused to pass legislation that will help keep guns out of the hands of terrorists.

Gun nuts had hissy fits when Obama signed an executive order making it more difficult for people with mental problems from getting guns. You all screamed that he was taking guns from people. Which is such an old and tired lie.

Then when trump came into office he reversed Obama's executive order. Resulting in trump making it easier for those with mental problems to get guns you gun nuts cheered him on and said he was doing the job you voted for him to do.

It's not democrats who kicked mental patients out of hospitals and slashed mental health programs. It was ronald reagan who opened the doors of our mental hospitals and allowed people to be kicked out. It's republicans who refuse to support mental health programs. Who screamed when democrats included mental health coverage in Obamacare.

It's conservatives who say it's mentally unstable people who do this violence but at the same time make sure it's easier for those people to get a gun and make it much harder for them to get the proper help they need.

So it's your own policies and laws that have made you believe you need to carry a gun.

Do unalienable rights mean nothing to you?
Do you think the government should take your life because your name is on a random list?
Your liberty gone because you hire someone to take care of your finances?
Your property taken because your next door neighbor doesn't like the Trump sign on your lawn?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

No constructive suggestions for addressing the hideous contagion of sick psychologies paired with firearm availability? What do firearms enthusiasts plan to do to avoid the inevitable repercussions of public disgust with these massacres?

Well.......we could take everybody's firearms away and make them illegal. Worked so well for recreational narcotics in this country.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

When the nation wanted to ban terrorists from getting guns, the gun nuts screamed about it and the republicans in congress refused to pass legislation that will help keep guns out of the hands of terrorists.

Ban terrorists from getting gun? What legislation was that? Link please.

Gun nuts had hissy fits when Obama signed an executive order making it more difficult for people with mental problems from getting guns. You all screamed that he was taking guns from people. Which is such an old and tired lie.

What Hussein signed was an order to ban guns from people on Social Security who had a hard time managing their affairs. How many old people on SS go out on a shooting spree?

It's not democrats who kicked mental patients out of hospitals and slashed mental health programs. It was ronald reagan who opened the doors of our mental hospitals and allowed people to be kicked out. It's republicans who refuse to support mental health programs. Who screamed when democrats included mental health coverage in Obamacare.

Yes, Reagan did do that, but remember it was also Geraldo (who had a show on at the time) that accused our government of falsely imprisoning innocent people who did nothing wrong. He called institutions and committing people crime less prisons. After enough public pressure, they unlocked those institutions and the people freely left. They've been roaming our streets ever since.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Right. Obama was making school officials not do their jobs right after he got done making your boss cancel your health insurance. Obama is hiding behind every bush. Watch out, Obama might pop out and get you!!!

The PROMISE program was praised by the Obama administration and the Broward school district was awarded $54 million in grants from the $4 billion 'Race to the Top' initiative.

On Feb. 28 Sunshine State News reported possible ways the school system's PROMISE Program, and the aims behind it, may have stopped confessed shooter Nikolas Cruz from being arrested well before he killed 14 students and three teachers at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School -- despite numerous allegations of criminal behavior. The PROMISE Program’s goal is to reduce the number of students arrested for minor infractions. But the pursuit of that goal may have stopped Cruz from entering the criminal justice system before carrying out the massacre on Valentine’s Day.

Progressive PROMISE Program Still at Issue in the Making of Parkland Tragedy

Are you starting to learn something now, or are you just going to keep making excuses for your Mulatto Prince?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Progressive controlled areas dominate the country for violence, In fact they breed it

Go hang out in Mercer county all republican and you can still get robbed in broad day light! A bunch of opium heads. Realy sad it use to be a great place to live!

I never heard of it before, so I looked it up. Seems like you are making it sound worse than it is, especially if you want to compare it to Democrat areas:

Rankings

Go hang out there you will see. If you are in Cleveland it is not a far drive. I am heart broken the way it is. I grew up there it was some of the best hunting and fishing in the state. You would not believe the size of the deer due to all the corn feilds. You look at the statistics they publish which are bull shit! My mother was a big wig at Human services and was privy to some stats the locals fooled with. Like the fact that there was seventy five rapes commited in a bathroom at east view park. This was not made public and it continued. They finaly caught the guy who had done most of them, but till then they just let mothers send their children into that bathroom. Isee the the face book pleas for prayers of my freinds children that are currently in rehab, i see next to no one in their twenties up town on a friday night because they are laying waisted in some garage on the west side lying in thier own puke.

I've made deliveries in that area. I didn't see much wrong with it until I got into a large city. And according to the map I linked to, it's rated not all that bad. Maybe it's just because of where I live and I'm used to it. We have shootings in Cuyahoga county nearly every day, and sometimes several times a day. As far as getting robbed in broad daylight, that only happens once in a great while over here.

Like any where it has it's areas. There is a public housing apartment complex off of meyers rd you want to stay away from. I am not there enough any more to tell you all the places to stay away from any more, but this much I can tell you. This is not the great place it used to be to live! When I lived there I never locked my doors. I would if I lioved there now!

That may be, but it's nothing compared to Cleveland. When I did home delivery, I went to every project ten times over in Cleveland, and I can guarantee you if I survived that, I can survive anything. And mind you, this was long before we had CCW's in the state.

If you ever come this way sometime, check out the east side where it's all black. Venture out of downtown going east on any main street and you'll understand what I'm talking about; particularly Cedar Road, Quincy Road, and Woodland. If you have no plans on coming here, use Goggle street view.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I never heard of it before, so I looked it up. Seems like you are making it sound worse than it is, especially if you want to compare it to Democrat areas:

Rankings

Go hang out there you will see. If you are in Cleveland it is not a far drive. I am heart broken the way it is. I grew up there it was some of the best hunting and fishing in the state. You would not believe the size of the deer due to all the corn feilds. You look at the statistics they publish which are bull shit! My mother was a big wig at Human services and was privy to some stats the locals fooled with. Like the fact that there was seventy five rapes commited in a bathroom at east view park. This was not made public and it continued. They finaly caught the guy who had done most of them, but till then they just let mothers send their children into that bathroom. Isee the the face book pleas for prayers of my freinds children that are currently in rehab, i see next to no one in their twenties up town on a friday night because they are laying waisted in some garage on the west side lying in thier own puke.

Firearms have never been the problem, socialist behavior always seems to have its roots into violence.

Unfortunately life aint that simple. Socialism can not be the problem where no socialist exist!
PS it aint the guns either! It is the idiot holding the gun that is at issue! You have noticed I am pro gun rights, right!

Like I said it’s medicated kids in a socialist environment, results in crazies.
More frivolous gun control laws will not save a single soul.
We have no real freedom in this country because of socialism…

Unfortunaetly both sides have contributed to the drugging of our children. I blame pharma for that! You can believe this when I tell ya, pharma has spread the money to boith sides of the fence on that one! We have some bi-partisian support to sue pharma in Ohio right now. I believe this is a step in the right direction to sorting this mess out. Unfortunbately we can all look in the mirror and take some responsibilty for this one. Parents, teachers and the governemt has failed thier children on this one. We were all here and share some responsibilty!

The other side of that coin is that there are people suffering dearly because physicians are afraid to prescribe pain killers to those who really need them. In desperation, they do turn to street drugs to get what they used to get from their doctor, and in essence, we create another criminal.

 

[rightwinger]

Can’t stop them all

Doesn’t mean you shouldn’t try to stop any

Agree. An armed security guard or at the very least, some CCW teachers could have stopped this kid.

I have no issue with armed security guards

I think armed teachers is asking for trouble

 

[SmokeALib]

Where are the constructive suggestions, on the part of firearms permissiveness extremists, for ending the continued plague of 'gun' related violence?

I believe the idea is to arm teachers so they can defend themselves against students with some serious mental problems, pretty constructive I'd think

Then you're putting a target on the teachers and pretty much guaranteeing that the teachers will be the first to be shot.

If you notice, all the police guards with guns are the first ones to be shot. Some die. The one who was shot yesterday didn't die and it in the hospital.

The shooters first go after the person who will try to stop them then move on to the kids.

It happened in the night club in Florida. It happened yesterday in Texas.

There are some instances where an armed teacher's gun went off in class injuring a student. You can read about it at the search below. Just pick your article.


teachers gun goes off in school

The fact that people believe there's only one solution to this is incorrect. We don't live in a one size fits all world. It's a combination of several things.

More guns isn't the answer.

Bullshit.
If only the bad guys have guns, the bad guys WILL win.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Can’t stop them all

Doesn’t mean you shouldn’t try to stop any

Agree. An armed security guard or at the very least, some CCW teachers could have stopped this kid.

I have no issue with armed security guards

I think armed teachers is asking for trouble

More trouble than 10 dead and 10 injured?

 

[Flash]

 

[jon_berzerk]

Where are the constructive suggestions, on the part of firearms permissiveness extremists, for ending the continued plague of 'gun' related violence?

I believe the idea is to arm teachers so they can defend themselves against students with some serious mental problems, pretty constructive I'd think

Then you're putting a target on the teachers and pretty much guaranteeing that the teachers will be the first to be shot.

If you notice, all the police guards with guns are the first ones to be shot. Some die. The one who was shot yesterday didn't die and it in the hospital.

The shooters first go after the person who will try to stop them then move on to the kids.

It happened in the night club in Florida. It happened yesterday in Texas.

There are some instances where an armed teacher's gun went off in class injuring a student. You can read about it at the search below. Just pick your article.


teachers gun goes off in school

The fact that people believe there's only one solution to this is incorrect. We don't live in a one size fits all world. It's a combination of several things.

More guns isn't the answer.

Bullshit.
If only the bad guys have guns, the bad guys WILL win.

More guns isn't the answer

it certainly has been in the past couple of cases

this one several good guys with gun intervened and engaged the shooter

which stopped him from continuing his murderous spree

and the day before in a school in Dixon Il a good guy with a gun

intervened and engaged immediately the shooter and stopped the spree before anyone

other then the shooter was injured

saving many lives I might add

 

[there4eyeM]

No constructive suggestions for addressing the hideous contagion of sick psychologies paired with firearm availability? What do firearms enthusiasts plan to do to avoid the inevitable repercussions of public disgust with these massacres?

Well.......we could take everybody's firearms away and make them illegal. Worked so well for recreational narcotics in this country.

Being obtuse does not indicate having an authentic response.
To be clear to the point of near invisibility, this is the central theme of the post: "...constructive suggestions for addressing the hideous contagion of sick psychologies..."
The camp that refuses to acknowledge the resistance to their '2nd' orthodoxy simply keeps repeating their interpretation of that amendment and declaring its 'right'. There is a problem, however, in American culture involving violence, especially with firearms. Not even the most dense posters here can possibly deny that. Where are the constructive alternatives to eventual public backlash? Repression is definitely coming if things continue as they have been. What does the 'Orthodox 2nd' wing have to offer that can avoid such a poor outcome?

 

[Rustic]

In other countries, their Ben Franklin or Thomas Jefferson have not yet been born.

True, the people who founded their countries weren't stupid.

And most people wouldn't do it. Criminals would love that situation. Nobody in a household being armed.

again, a gun in the house is 43 times more likely to kill a household member than a bad guy. Most gun deaths are people shooting themselves or being shot by someone they know.

Well little Billy was protected by the Promise Program. It was a program created by DumBama to help keep minorities out of trouble. Of course he couldn't just apply it to minorities, so school officials and even law enforcement ignored the warning signs that could have stopped that school shooting. Democrats getting paid to keep their mouth shut.

Right. Obama was making school officials not do their jobs right after he got done making your boss cancel your health insurance. Obama is hiding behind every bush. Watch out, Obama might pop out and get you!!!

Lol
400+ million firearms in America legally, what percentage of those are used to commit violent acts? You’re a fucking retard...