No Longer David:*The State of Israel As Goliath

[Book of Jeremiah]

I guess Jeri has decided to avoid the above post #379.

Because it destroys her Christian hate agenda about Jesus in the Quran. .

My Jesus was crucified on a cross, died and on the third day rose again. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.

Your Issa never did. Not according to your book. Your Issa is coming back to punish the Jews and the Christians according to your book. You have a counterfeit Jesus on your hands. Toss him.

It is written:

Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is the anti christ that neither the Father and the Son. Whosoever denieth the Son hath not the Father and ( but ) he that acknowledgeth Son hath the Father also. 1 John 2:22,23

Issa of the Koran is never called the Son of God nor is God called his Father. It is a false Jesus and an anti christ teaching. You have been deceived according to the written word of God, Sunni.

You didn't answer my question Jeri. ..

Again, which of these descriptions of Jesus in the Quran differs from the Biblical Jesus??


* An angel told Mary she was pregnant with child.

* The virgin Mary gave birth to Mary

* Jesus was sinless and never committed a sin.

* Jesus was a Prophet of Jehovah.

* Jesus was a Jewish rabbi who lived in Israel

* Jesus taught the Torah

* Jesus performed many miracles.

* Jesus healed the sick and cured the leper.

* Jesus was sent to the Jewish people.

* The jewish priests sought to kill Jesus.

* Jesus will return in the End Times.

* And will fight against the Anti-Christ in the battle of Armageddon.

I was trying not to embarrass you, Sunni. Your book has some mistakes. Do you realize the angel that appeared to Miriam to tell her she was with child ( Jesus ) is recorded in your book as the "sister of Moses"...?!

They had the wrong Mary ( and you've got the wrong Jesus ) - there is a 1600 yr gap between Miriam the sister of Moses and Miriam the mother of Jesus. True story.

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

I guess Jeri has decided to avoid the above post #379.

Because it destroys her Christian hate agenda about Jesus in the Quran. .

My Jesus was crucified on a cross, died and on the third day rose again. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.

Your Issa never did. Not according to your book. Your Issa is coming back to punish the Jews and the Christians according to your book. You have a counterfeit Jesus on your hands. Toss him.

It is written:

Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is the anti christ that hath neither the Father and the Son. Whosoever denieth the Son hath not the Father and ( but ) he that acknowledgeth Son hath the Father also. 1 John 2:22,23

Issa of the Koran is never called the Son of God nor is God called his Father. It is a false Jesus and an anti christ teaching. You have been deceived according to the written word of God, Sunni.

As to your countering the Jews do not believe in Jesus. Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling and mind your own business.

It is written:

Salvation is of the Jews. John 4: 22

- Jeri

Hypocrisy is what much of that is, and what I address is you applying a different standard for Jews and Muslims to satisfy.

 

[irosie91]

Oh yes, they certainly do. Not just for the money reward but it is a great honor for parents to have a son/daughter who murdered Jews. That woman gets 'recycled' because she made herself available for interviews and was elected to government. She is a wonderful example, is she not, for people who like to defend the Palestinians?

It may be an "honor" - in much the same way as it's an "honor" for an IDF soldier to have been killed in the line of duty - a means for the parents to get through the horror of the death- but it is hardly "celebrated" or "desired". Those parents would far rather have their child alive and in their arms then dead and blown to bits.

It is no honor for a parent of an Israeli soldier to have him/her dead in the line of duty. They mourn their son/daughter and certainly there is no celebration.

Palestinian parents as I said rejoice if their sons/daughters take some Jews with them in the course of suicide bombings. The children are indoctrinated to hate Jews from day one. It is in their school text books, tv programs etc. It is an honor for a parent of a suicide bomber, not a shame or a tragedy.

Coyote is have a very hard time in understanding islamic culture and the concept
of MARTYRDOM in islam-----for that matter she seems to be having a hard time
understanding the force of "culture" altogether----and SOCIETAL PRESSURE

I do not doubt that mothers in china mourned the daughters that THEY THEMSELVES
killed -------SO? the culture mandated the activity. Islamic culture mandates
that people ACCEPT -----with a show of piety-----the martyrdom of their kids-----
and accept the rewards. She does not want to accept the fact that it is those
CULTURAL ISSUES that galvanize the activity and the most important social force--
THE MOTHERS, are not objecting

for the record-----girls in india----still proudly laud SATI as some sort of noble
act---------and a few do it---GLADLY (sorry cynical coyote----hindu
girls told me----proudly)

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

In their view it is no different than money paid to families of soldiers who died in combat - particularly if the families lost their primary means of support. And Jeri, sometimes the children are just killed for being in the wrong place at the wrong time - not because they did anything. They lost a child. They're no different than any other parents.

I do not deny that at all, Coyote. That has surely happened. But according to the information and link I posted on this thread from FPM Front page Magazine - some families had aleady accepted that $ 20,000.00 pay check - some $ 10,000.00 and some inbetween apparently - from reports - yet in the FPM link it states 10 Million Dollars had already been distributed as reward money to the families of these dead suicide bombers. 10 million dollars? That is quite a few families, Coyote! We are not talking about a handful of people! We are talking about quite a few. I have not done the math but if you break it down in between to $ 15,000.00 per family and 10 million dollars has been distributed to the families by 2003. ( with it ending in 2008 so that is not even the grand total ) How many families is that? Has anyone done the math on that?

Your source is a hate site with no credibility.

Front Page Magazine is not a hate site although I understand why some would hate to read it. They put out some pretty embarassing facts about what has happened which is precisely why World Net Daily is accused of being a hate site - and isn't. - Jeri

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

It may be an "honor" - in much the same way as it's an "honor" for an IDF soldier to have been killed in the line of duty - a means for the parents to get through the horror of the death- but it is hardly "celebrated" or "desired". Those parents would far rather have their child alive and in their arms then dead and blown to bits.

It is no honor for a parent of an Israeli soldier to have him/her dead in the line of duty. They mourn their son/daughter and certainly there is no celebration.

Palestinian parents as I said rejoice if their sons/daughters take some Jews with them in the course of suicide bombings. The children are indoctrinated to hate Jews from day one. It is in their school text books, tv programs etc. It is an honor for a parent of a suicide bomber, not a shame or a tragedy.

Coyote is have a very hard time in understanding islamic culture and the concept
of MARTYRDOM in islam-----for that matter she seems to be having a hard time
understanding the force of "culture" altogether----and SOCIETAL PRESSURE

I do not doubt that mothers in china mourned the daughters that THEY THEMSELVES
killed -------SO? the culture mandated the activity. Islamic culture mandates
that people ACCEPT -----with a show of piety-----the martyrdom of their kids-----
and accept the rewards. She does not want to accept the fact that it is those
CULTURAL ISSUES that galvanize the activity and the most important social force--
THE MOTHERS, are not objecting

for the record-----girls in india----still proudly laud SATI as some sort of noble
act---------and a few do it---GLADLY (sorry cynical coyote----hindu
girls told me----proudly)

Coyote has a good heart and desires to believe the best in people. Have a nice day everyone! - Jeri

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

I guess Jeri has decided to avoid the above post #379.

Because it destroys her Christian hate agenda about Jesus in the Quran. .

My Jesus was crucified on a cross, died and on the third day rose again. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.

Your Issa never did. Not according to your book. Your Issa is coming back to punish the Jews and the Christians according to your book. You have a counterfeit Jesus on your hands. Toss him.

It is written:

Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is the anti christ that hath neither the Father and the Son. Whosoever denieth the Son hath not the Father and ( but ) he that acknowledgeth Son hath the Father also. 1 John 2:22,23

Issa of the Koran is never called the Son of God nor is God called his Father. It is a false Jesus and an anti christ teaching. You have been deceived according to the written word of God, Sunni.

As to your countering the Jews do not believe in Jesus. Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling and mind your own business.

It is written:

Salvation is of the Jews. John 4: 22

- Jeri

Hypocrisy is what much of that is, and what I address is you applying a different standard for Jews and Muslims to satisfy.

Coming from you, Sherri, that is the very height of hypocrisy.
I shall leave it at that. Good day.

- Jeri

 

[Sunni Man]

My Jesus was crucified on a cross, died and on the third day rose again. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.

Your Issa never did. Not according to your book. Your Issa is coming back to punish the Jews and the Christians according to your book. You have a counterfeit Jesus on your hands. Toss him.

It is written:

Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is the anti christ that neither the Father and the Son. Whosoever denieth the Son hath not the Father and ( but ) he that acknowledgeth Son hath the Father also. 1 John 2:22,23

Issa of the Koran is never called the Son of God nor is God called his Father. It is a false Jesus and an anti christ teaching. You have been deceived according to the written word of God, Sunni.

You didn't answer my question Jeri. ..

Again, which of these descriptions of Jesus in the Quran differs from the Biblical Jesus??


* An angel told Mary she was pregnant with child.

* The virgin Mary gave birth to Mary

* Jesus was sinless and never committed a sin.

* Jesus was a Prophet of Jehovah.

* Jesus was a Jewish rabbi who lived in Israel

* Jesus taught the Torah

* Jesus performed many miracles.

* Jesus healed the sick and cured the leper.

* Jesus was sent to the Jewish people.

* The jewish priests sought to kill Jesus.

* Jesus will return in the End Times.

* And will fight against the Anti-Christ in the battle of Armageddon.

I was trying not to embarrass you, Sunni. Your book has some mistakes. Do you realize the angel that appeared to Miriam to tell her she was with child ( Jesus ) is recorded in your book as the "sister of Moses"...?!

They had the wrong Mary ( and you've got the wrong Jesus ) - there is a 1600 yr gap between Miriam the sister of Moses and Miriam the mother of Jesus.

You didn't embarrass me at all.

The Quran was sent to correct errors in the bible.

btw Miriam is the arabic word for Mary.


So again, how does the description of Jesus in the Quran that I have listed differ from the Biblical Jesus?? .

.

 

[irosie91]

You didn't answer my question Jeri. ..

Again, which of these descriptions of Jesus in the Quran differs from the Biblical Jesus??


* An angel told Mary she was pregnant with child.

* The virgin Mary gave birth to Mary

* Jesus was sinless and never committed a sin.

* Jesus was a Prophet of Jehovah.

* Jesus was a Jewish rabbi who lived in Israel

* Jesus taught the Torah

* Jesus performed many miracles.

* Jesus healed the sick and cured the leper.

* Jesus was sent to the Jewish people.

* The jewish priests sought to kill Jesus.

* Jesus will return in the End Times.

* And will fight against the Anti-Christ in the battle of Armageddon.

I was trying not to embarrass you, Sunni. Your book has some mistakes. Do you realize the angel that appeared to Miriam to tell her she was with child ( Jesus ) is recorded in your book as the "sister of Moses"...?!

They had the wrong Mary ( and you've got the wrong Jesus ) - there is a 1600 yr gap between Miriam the sister of Moses and Miriam the mother of Jesus.

You didn't embarrass me at all.

The Quran was sent to correct errors in the bible.

btw Miriam is the arabic word for Mary.


So again, how does the description of Jesus in the Quran that I have listed differ from the Biblical Jesus?? .

.

the koran is an atrocity------it glorifies rape and murder and has galvanized the
murder of HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS AND COUNTING

the islamic CONCEPT of jesus----is OBSCENE as is 1400 years of islamic
murder of christians The genocide of christians in arabia as directed
by the rapist pig was an atrocity-------

I read the koran as a kid of about 19. I like old literature-----especially
the greek tragedies which always end with a PAYBACK against evil
I expected the rapist pig-----to get his INSIGHT into endless sin ----
and I expected some sort of character developement-------like in the
literature of all civilized people------NOPE-----nothing.
Not only as a scriptural writing-----but as ANY writing---the koran is
AN ATROCITY It culminates with something like
"you may not enjoy hacking people apart---but that is what
your 'god' wants you to do----then you get whories
forever"

 

[Sally]

You didn't answer my question Jeri. ..

Again, which of these descriptions of Jesus in the Quran differs from the Biblical Jesus??


* An angel told Mary she was pregnant with child.

* The virgin Mary gave birth to Mary

* Jesus was sinless and never committed a sin.

* Jesus was a Prophet of Jehovah.

* Jesus was a Jewish rabbi who lived in Israel

* Jesus taught the Torah

* Jesus performed many miracles.

* Jesus healed the sick and cured the leper.

* Jesus was sent to the Jewish people.

* The jewish priests sought to kill Jesus.

* Jesus will return in the End Times.

* And will fight against the Anti-Christ in the battle of Armageddon.

I was trying not to embarrass you, Sunni. Your book has some mistakes. Do you realize the angel that appeared to Miriam to tell her she was with child ( Jesus ) is recorded in your book as the "sister of Moses"...?!

They had the wrong Mary ( and you've got the wrong Jesus ) - there is a 1600 yr gap between Miriam the sister of Moses and Miriam the mother of Jesus.

You didn't embarrass me at all.

The Quran was sent to correct errors in the bible.

btw Miriam is the arabic word for Mary.


So again, how does the description of Jesus in the Quran that I have listed differ from the Biblical Jesus?? .

.

This is really a slap in the face telling Jerimach that the Quran was sent to correct errors in the Bible. If Mohammed had been born in Asia, he would have never have learned about the Bible. Since, he lived among Christians and Jews and one of his wives were Jesus, of course he learned about it from the people in the area where he was living. Could Mohammed have started a new religion if he lived among Buddhists and Hindus instead of Christians and Jews? Why not tell us about that fake Gospel the Muslims have where even the bowel movements of Jesus are discussed? Years ago another Muslim told the readers of a message board all about this, and perhaps you can be the Muslim to enlighten the readers of this board. If I am not mistaken, it was called the Gospel of Thomas.

 

[irosie91]

I was trying not to embarrass you, Sunni. Your book has some mistakes. Do you realize the angel that appeared to Miriam to tell her she was with child ( Jesus ) is recorded in your book as the "sister of Moses"...?!

They had the wrong Mary ( and you've got the wrong Jesus ) - there is a 1600 yr gap between Miriam the sister of Moses and Miriam the mother of Jesus.

You didn't embarrass me at all.

The Quran was sent to correct errors in the bible.

btw Miriam is the arabic word for Mary.


So again, how does the description of Jesus in the Quran that I have listed differ from the Biblical Jesus?? .

.

This is really a slap in the face telling Jerimach that the Quran was sent to correct errors in the Bible. If Mohammed had been born in Asia, he would have never have learned about the Bible. Since, he lived among Christians and Jews and one of his wives were Jesus, of course he learned about it from the people in the area where he was living. Could Mohammed have started a new religion if he lived among Buddhists and Hindus instead of Christians and Jews? Why not tell us about that fake Gospel the Muslims have where even the bowel movements of Jesus are discussed? Years ago another Muslim told the readers of a message board all about this, and perhaps you can be the Muslim to enlighten the readers of this board. If I am not mistaken, it was called the Gospel of Thomas.

jeremiah-----the concept that the bible----old and new are utterly "corrupted" is
a very important central belief in islam. If you learn anything about islam FROM
a musim educated in an islamic land or system------one of the first things that you
learn is that there are TENS OF THOUSANDS OF DIFFERENT "VERSIONS" of the
bible-------evil christians and jews keep changing them INCESSANTLY-----the idea is
that the ORIGINAL "bible" is the koran

Long ago ----when I was young-----I got this information from a young pakistani
surgeon------The 'thousands of versions' thing. He was VERY intelligent---and not
exactly religious------but he KNEW that the bible comes in thousands of
differing versions and is being constantly ----"changed" It's 'gospel'
amongst muslims. My son----ended up in a special school for the very bright--
lots of the very bright-----are the kids of imported "very bright" -------in the area
in which we live-------his first ---"sit next to" in chem class-----was a PAKISTANI
very bright. Every day my kid would come home and say "you won't believe
what siddique told me today" among the things I wouldn't believe------
was "THE THOUSANDS OF VERSIONS OF THE BIBLE" thing and the "fact"
that the koran-------which was actually not written until more than 100 years after
muhummad died------is WORD FOR WORD-----exactly as muhummad heard it from
GABRIEL------while not a word of the bible is in anyway AUTHENTIC----even the dead
sea scrolls are a "FORGERY" there is no reason to argue with any muslim
on this issue-------IT IS A FIRM BELIEF

 

[Coyote]

Coyote is have a very hard time in understanding islamic culture and the concept
of MARTYRDOM in islam-----for that matter she seems to be having a hard time
understanding the force of "culture" altogether----and SOCIETAL PRESSURE

Rosie makes a lot of assumptions about other posters

I do not doubt that mothers in china mourned the daughters that THEY THEMSELVES killed -------SO?

So?

the culture mandated the activity. Islamic culture mandates
that people ACCEPT -----with a show of piety-----the martyrdom of their kids-----
and accept the rewards. She does not want to accept the fact that it is those
CULTURAL ISSUES that galvanize the activity and the most important social force--
THE MOTHERS, are not objecting

I have no problem with facing "facts" - you just need to provide "facts" - something from a reputable source besides hearsay and cherry picked videos that shows that the majority of Palestinian families celebrate their children being blown up and the mother's do not object.

for the record-----girls in india----still proudly laud SATI as some sort of noble
act---------and a few do it---GLADLY (sorry cynical coyote----hindu
girls told me----proudly)

Sorry assumptive Rosie, but I am familiar with the concept of sati. For the record.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

I was trying not to embarrass you, Sunni. Your book has some mistakes. Do you realize the angel that appeared to Miriam to tell her she was with child ( Jesus ) is recorded in your book as the "sister of Moses"...?!

They had the wrong Mary ( and you've got the wrong Jesus ) - there is a 1600 yr gap between Miriam the sister of Moses and Miriam the mother of Jesus.

You didn't embarrass me at all.

The Quran was sent to correct errors in the bible.

btw Miriam is the arabic word for Mary.


So again, how does the description of Jesus in the Quran that I have listed differ from the Biblical Jesus?? .

.

This is really a slap in the face telling Jerimach that the Quran was sent to correct errors in the Bible. If Mohammed had been born in Asia, he would have never have learned about the Bible. Since, he lived among Christians and Jews and one of his wives were Jesus, of course he learned about it from the people in the area where he was living. Could Mohammed have started a new religion if he lived among Buddhists and Hindus instead of Christians and Jews? Why not tell us about that fake Gospel the Muslims have where even the bowel movements of Jesus are discussed? Years ago another Muslim told the readers of a message board all about this, and perhaps you can be the Muslim to enlighten the readers of this board. If I am not mistaken, it was called the Gospel of Thomas.

Sally, Sunni is right of course that the name Mary is the name for Miriam. Both women shared the same name. Which is why his Prophet got the two Mary's confused -

He thought the sister of Moses who was also named Miriam ( Mary ) was the mother of Jesus ( Mary ) . Mohammad did not realize that Mary the Mother of Jesus wasn't born until 1600 years after Moses sister, Miriam ( Mary ) was dead and buried!

The amazing thing is it was a Jewish man who actually discovered the mistake and pointed out the - 1600 year Gap - mistake Mohammad had made. It is recorded in the Qu'ran just as Mohammad had thought he heard it from his travels during his caravan route days - the problem was he misunderstood and thought Moses sister was the mother of Jesus.

That is a serious mistake in the Qu'ran and Sunni's claim that the Qur'an was sent to correct the bible is completely false.

The Qu'ran was written by a man who took bits and pieces of what he heard along his travels - and then made it into a religion of his own. Some parts are directly lifted from the bible others were rewritten, revised, changed and some places as in the matter of Mary being recorded in the Qu'ran as Moses sister - blatant errors....

I suppose this was God's gentle way of letting the Muslims know that if their prophet was mistaken on who the mother of Jesus was he could also be mistake about who Jesus was too. Which is what I was pointing out to Sunni. That Jesus is not Issa mentioned in the Qur'an.

 

[Coyote]

When people talk about describing Jesus or God or or any great religious figures that multiple groups incorporate into their faith - I always think of the story of the blind men and the elephant. Each see's only a part of the whole even though they are examining the same thing.

 

[Sally]

You didn't embarrass me at all.

The Quran was sent to correct errors in the bible.

btw Miriam is the arabic word for Mary.


So again, how does the description of Jesus in the Quran that I have listed differ from the Biblical Jesus?? .

.

This is really a slap in the face telling Jerimach that the Quran was sent to correct errors in the Bible. If Mohammed had been born in Asia, he would have never have learned about the Bible. Since, he lived among Christians and Jews and one of his wives were Jesus, of course he learned about it from the people in the area where he was living. Could Mohammed have started a new religion if he lived among Buddhists and Hindus instead of Christians and Jews? Why not tell us about that fake Gospel the Muslims have where even the bowel movements of Jesus are discussed? Years ago another Muslim told the readers of a message board all about this, and perhaps you can be the Muslim to enlighten the readers of this board. If I am not mistaken, it was called the Gospel of Thomas.

jeremiah-----the concept that the bible----old and new are utterly "corrupted" is
a very important central belief in islam. If you learn anything about islam FROM
a musim educated in an islamic land or system------one of the first things that you
learn is that there are TENS OF THOUSANDS OF DIFFERENT "VERSIONS" of the
bible-------evil christians and jews keep changing them INCESSANTLY-----the idea is
that the ORIGINAL "bible" is the koran

Long ago ----when I was young-----I got this information from a young pakistani
surgeon------The 'thousands of versions' thing. He was VERY intelligent---and not
exactly religious------but he KNEW that the bible comes in thousands of
differing versions and is being constantly ----"changed" It's 'gospel'
amongst muslims. My son----ended up in a special school for the very bright--
lots of the very bright-----are the kids of imported "very bright" -------in the area
in which we live-------his first ---"sit next to" in chem class-----was a PAKISTANI
very bright. Every day my kid would come home and say "you won't believe
what siddique told me today" among the things I wouldn't believe------
was "THE THOUSANDS OF VERSIONS OF THE BIBLE" thing and the "fact"
that the koran-------which was actually not written until more than 100 years after
muhummad died------is WORD FOR WORD-----exactly as muhummad heard it from
GABRIEL------while not a word of the bible is in anyway AUTHENTIC----even the dead
sea scrolls are a "FORGERY" there is no reason to argue with any muslim
on this issue-------IT IS A FIRM BELIEF

According to Wikipedia, Mary is this in Arabic: Mary (مريم Marīam in Arabic),
It is not Miriam as Sunni Man claims. I would think that Miriam is the Hebrew version of Mary, just like Maryam is the way girls are named in Persian. It appears that there is more than one version of the Koran.
The Different Arabic Versions of the Qur'an - part 2: Are all Qur'ans the same?

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

If Moses sister Miriam was the mother of Jesus and she was still a young girl, Moses would have had to have been alive too. If Moses were still alive Jesus would not have said Moses past tense as dead because Jesus was a sinless man according to Mohammad and could not have told a lie. Furthermore if Moses were still alive then Jesus could not have referred to the prophets after Moses such as Isaiah, nor could he have referred to King David who would also have been after Moses. The claim is obviously an error and Sunni will save himself much embarrassment by dropping the matter and accepting that his book is in error and so is its teaching of a false christ named Issa. - Jeri

 

[Sunni Man]

According to Wikipedia, Mary is this in Arabic: Mary (مريم Marīam in Arabic), It is not Miriam as Sunni Man claims. I would think that Miriam is the Hebrew version of Mary, just like Maryam is the way girls are named in Persian.

It is a translation and thus can be spelled several different ways. .

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

When people talk about describing Jesus or God or or any great religious figures that multiple groups incorporate into their faith - I always think of the story of the blind men and the elephant. Each see's only a part of the whole even though they are examining the same thing.

In part this is true, Coyote. The only difference being that the Issa spoken of in the Qur'an is not the Jesus of the Bible. The Jesus of the Bible was crucified on a cross by the Romans, he was buried, arose on the 3rd day from the grave -many witnesses saw him after the resurrection - then he ascended into heaven and was seated at the right hand of the father. The account of this is not written in the Qur'an. It is a mixture of fact, fiction, fable, poetic writings. Not the historical Jesus of the Bible. If a truth is not 100% truth it is no longer the truth. It must be completely true or it is a false Christ. Same with a teaching. It must be 100% true in accuracy according to the Doctrine of Jesus Christ or it is not accepted as truth.

It is written:
Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. - 2 John 1: 9

The Qu'ran teaches that Allah did not have an only begotten Son and that Jesus is not the Son of God. Therein the rejection of the doctrine of the Qur'an. It came after and was again misunderstood by translation or hearsay back in 622 a.d. or somewhere thereabouts.
- Jeri

p.s. I did respond to you and Sally as I cannot get into a dispute over these things with Sunni after I have already pointed it out. Christians are not to argue the doctrine of Christ - just point it out and move on..

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

This is really a slap in the face telling Jerimach that the Quran was sent to correct errors in the Bible. If Mohammed had been born in Asia, he would have never have learned about the Bible. Since, he lived among Christians and Jews and one of his wives were Jesus, of course he learned about it from the people in the area where he was living. Could Mohammed have started a new religion if he lived among Buddhists and Hindus instead of Christians and Jews? Why not tell us about that fake Gospel the Muslims have where even the bowel movements of Jesus are discussed? Years ago another Muslim told the readers of a message board all about this, and perhaps you can be the Muslim to enlighten the readers of this board. If I am not mistaken, it was called the Gospel of Thomas.

jeremiah-----the concept that the bible----old and new are utterly "corrupted" is
a very important central belief in islam. If you learn anything about islam FROM
a musim educated in an islamic land or system------one of the first things that you
learn is that there are TENS OF THOUSANDS OF DIFFERENT "VERSIONS" of the
bible-------evil christians and jews keep changing them INCESSANTLY-----the idea is
that the ORIGINAL "bible" is the koran

Long ago ----when I was young-----I got this information from a young pakistani
surgeon------The 'thousands of versions' thing. He was VERY intelligent---and not
exactly religious------but he KNEW that the bible comes in thousands of
differing versions and is being constantly ----"changed" It's 'gospel'
amongst muslims. My son----ended up in a special school for the very bright--
lots of the very bright-----are the kids of imported "very bright" -------in the area
in which we live-------his first ---"sit next to" in chem class-----was a PAKISTANI
very bright. Every day my kid would come home and say "you won't believe
what siddique told me today" among the things I wouldn't believe------
was "THE THOUSANDS OF VERSIONS OF THE BIBLE" thing and the "fact"
that the koran-------which was actually not written until more than 100 years after
muhummad died------is WORD FOR WORD-----exactly as muhummad heard it from
GABRIEL------while not a word of the bible is in anyway AUTHENTIC----even the dead
sea scrolls are a "FORGERY" there is no reason to argue with any muslim
on this issue-------IT IS A FIRM BELIEF

According to Wikipedia, Mary is this in Arabic: Mary (مريم Marīam in Arabic),
It is not Miriam as Sunni Man claims. I would think that Miriam is the Hebrew version of Mary, just like Maryam is the way girls are named in Persian. It appears that there is more than one version of the Koran.
The Different Arabic Versions of the Qur'an - part 2: Are all Qur'ans the same?

I see why Sunni is not undestanding what I am saying now! I am talking about more than a name confusion here. I am talking about getting the two women confused! Here read this and I will get you the link. One a direct quote from the Qu'ran the other is a direct quote from the Bible ( Torah - which some call the Old testament )

When the wife of Imran said, 'Lord, I have vowed to Thee, in dedication, what is within my womb. Receive Thou this from me; Thou hearest, and knowest.' And when she gave birth to her she said, 'Lord, I have given birth to her, a female.' (And God knew very well what she had given birth to; the male is not as the female.) 'And I have named her Mary, and commend her to Thee with her seed, to protect them from the accursed Satan.' S. 3:35-36 Arberry

Then she brought the child to her folk carrying him; and they said, 'Mary, thou hast surely committed a monstrous thing! Sister of Aaron, thy father was not a wicked man, nor was thy mother a woman unchaste.' S. 19:27-28

And Mary, Imran's daughter, who guarded her virginity, so We breathed into her of Our Spirit, and she confirmed the Words of her Lord and His Books, and became one of the obedient. S. 66:12

Compare this to what the Holy Bible says:

"Then Mary (Hebrew- Mariam), the prophetess, the sister of Aaron, took the timbrel in her hand…" Exodus 15:20

"The name of Amram's wife was Jochebed, the daughter of Levi, who was born to Levi in Egypt; and to Amram she bore Aaron and Moses and their sister Miriam." Numbers 26:49

"The children of Amram: Aaron, Moses, and Miriam. The sons of Aaron: Nadab, Abihu, Eleazar, and Ithamar." 1 Chronicles 6:3

"For I brought you up from the land of Egypt and redeemed you from the house of slavery, and I sent before you Moses, Aaron, and Miriam." Micah 6:4

"Miriam and Aaron spoke against Moses because of the Cushite woman whom he had married, for he had married a Cushite woman. And they said, ‘Has the LORD indeed spoken only through Moses? Has he not spoken through us also?" And the LORD heard it. Now the man Moses was very meek, more than all people who were on the face of the earth. And suddenly the LORD said to Moses and to Aaron and Miriam, ‘Come out, you three, to the tent of meeting.’ And the three of them came out. And the LORD came down in a pillar of cloud and stood at the entrance of the tent and called Aaron and Miriam, and they both came forward… When the cloud removed from over the tent, behold, Miriam was leprous, like snow. And Aaron turned toward Miriam, and behold, she was leprous. And Aaron said to Moses, ‘Oh, my lord, do not punish us because we have done foolishly and have sinned. Let her not be as one dead, whose flesh is half eaten away when he comes out of his mother's womb.’ And Moses cried to the LORD, ‘O God, please heal her--please.’ But the LORD said to Moses, ‘If her father had but spit in her face, should she not be shamed seven days? Let her be shut outside the camp seven days, and after that she may be brought in again." So Miriam was shut outside the camp seven days, and the people did not set out on the march till Miriam was brought in again." Numbers 12:1-5, 10-15

It is very hard to accept the idea that the Quran wasn’t identifying Jesus’ mother with the sister of Moses in light of the fact that both these Marys had brothers named Aaron and fathers named Imran/Amram! It is rather obvious to any unbiased reader that Muhammad has clearly confused the identity of Jesus’ mother with the sister of Aaron and Moses. He mistakenly thought that the mother of the Lord Jesus was the sister of Moses and Aaron.

Some Muslims try very hard to get around this and have sought to refute the assertion that the Quran is mistaken:

http://www.answering-islam.org/Responses/Menj/sister_of_aaron.htm

I posted a link for Sunni in answer to his question on Moses sister not being the mother of Jesus. It is was quite literally impossible. 1600 yr gap.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

You didn't answer my question Jeri. ..

Again, which of these descriptions of Jesus in the Quran differs from the Biblical Jesus??


* An angel told Mary she was pregnant with child.

* The virgin Mary gave birth to Mary

* Jesus was sinless and never committed a sin.

* Jesus was a Prophet of Jehovah.

* Jesus was a Jewish rabbi who lived in Israel

* Jesus taught the Torah

* Jesus performed many miracles.

* Jesus healed the sick and cured the leper.

* Jesus was sent to the Jewish people.

* The jewish priests sought to kill Jesus.

* Jesus will return in the End Times.

* And will fight against the Anti-Christ in the battle of Armageddon.

I was trying not to embarrass you, Sunni. Your book has some mistakes. Do you realize the angel that appeared to Miriam to tell her she was with child ( Jesus ) is recorded in your book as the "sister of Moses"...?!

They had the wrong Mary ( and you've got the wrong Jesus ) - there is a 1600 yr gap between Miriam the sister of Moses and Miriam the mother of Jesus.

You didn't embarrass me at all.

The Quran was sent to correct errors in the bible.

btw Miriam is the arabic word for Mary.


So again, how does the description of Jesus in the Quran that I have listed differ from the Biblical Jesus?? .

.

Mary, the Mother of Jesus and Sister of Aaron and Moses

 

[irosie91]

Coyote is have a very hard time in understanding islamic culture and the concept
of MARTYRDOM in islam-----for that matter she seems to be having a hard time
understanding the force of "culture" altogether----and SOCIETAL PRESSURE

Rosie makes a lot of assumptions about other posters

I do not doubt that mothers in china mourned the daughters that THEY THEMSELVES killed -------SO?

So?

the culture mandated the activity. Islamic culture mandates
that people ACCEPT -----with a show of piety-----the martyrdom of their kids-----
and accept the rewards. She does not want to accept the fact that it is those
CULTURAL ISSUES that galvanize the activity and the most important social force--
THE MOTHERS, are not objecting

I have no problem with facing "facts" - you just need to provide "facts" - something from a reputable source besides hearsay and cherry picked videos that shows that the majority of Palestinian families celebrate their children being blown up and the mother's do not object.

for the record-----girls in india----still proudly laud SATI as some sort of noble
act---------and a few do it---GLADLY (sorry cynical coyote----hindu
girls told me----proudly)

Sorry assumptive Rosie, but I am familiar with the concept of sati. For the record.

I did not see anyone claim that NONE OF THE MOTHERS OBJECT-----however there is
AMPLE EVIDENCE based on the PUBLIC STATEMENTS BY MUSLIM LEADERS and the
FACT that girls who tie bombs to their asses for the EXPRESS PURPOSE of murdering
babies are HEROINES and that there are MANY schools and public places named for
the sluts who so engage that the activity is VERY MUCH ACCEPTABLE AND LAUDED
IN THAT CULTURE --------a logical conclusion for all but the brain dead.

Long ago I refused to endorse a child as "physically fit" to take BOXING LESSONS--
because the kid was ten years old and I ----AS A MOTHER OBJECT TO TEN YEAR OLD
KIDS BOXING-----I would not allow my own child to engage in that sport--------however
anyone who claims that BOXING is not a prized sport in the USA-----just because
there are a few mothers (like me) who object----is also brain dead. -----

it is a fact that GIRLS WHO TIE BOMBS ON THEIR ASSES FOR THE PURPOSE OF
MURDERING JEWS ARE ISLAMIC NATIONAL HEROINES <<<<irrefutable fact
no matter what their mothers "feel"