No one white today owned slaves but most whites today benefitted from the 100 years after slavery.

[IM2]

Then why I sall the fcus always on black

None of this is true.

Blame Your Own Mediocrity, Not People of Color, For Your College Admission Shortcomings

Seven years ago, Abigail Fisher sued the University of Texas because she believed that she was denied acceptance, not because everyone in her graduating class was smarter than her, not because they busted their butts harder than her, but because she was white. Fisher claimed that she knew people who were accepted that were less qualified than her but were accepted just because they had different skin color. That lawsuit was upheld in 2009 by a federal district court who rejected it. After that Fisher appealed to the 5th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals which agreed with the prior ruling.

For just one second, let’s forget that the University of Texas’ admission rate is 40 percent and that it’s on record only 5 people of color with grades worse than her were accepted and 42 white people with grades worse than her were accepted from her class that year. Let’s forget that there were 168 Black and Latino students who got the same grades or even better grades than her but were denied admission. Let’s forget all of that and look at the real issue and problem with the case: Fisher and others refusing to believe that people of color can be smarter than them and can earn admission solely on their brain and not their skin color.

There’s always been this rhetoric that people of color who are accepted into these schools are accepted because of their skin color due to Affirmative Action. They didn’t study for their ACTs, they didn’t get 4.0s, they weren’t involved in their high schools. They just applied and the admissions people looked at what race they were and said “She’s brown, let’s get that acceptance letter to her.” But the reality of the situation is if that spot was really yours, you would have gotten it.

Danielle Templeton, a freshman at the University of Northern Iowa graduated from high school with a 3.7 GPA and a 29 on her ACT. Her hard work was rewarded with a full-ride scholarship, to which her white classmates responded asking her if she got the scholarship because she was Indian. The high scores and finishing in the top of her class can’t possibly be the reason she was accepted right? Wrong. It’s that amount of entitlement that has led to a misunderstanding of Affirmative Action is and who it really benefits.

Blame Your Own Mediocrity, Not People of Color, For Your College Admission Shortcomings | HuffPost

What you believe is a lie. A race baited lie at that. Stop believing it.

Fisher and others refusing to believe that people of color can be smarter than them and can earn admission solely on their brain and not their skin color.

There are plenty of smart minorities who get good grades and high test scores.
It's the ones who don't, and get in anyway, that cause concern.

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

And for how many years did white men who were not smart enough and could not get good test scores got allowed into colleges while non whites couldn't? Do you not think that impacts how things are now? Or is it that most of todays CEOS and our President don't exist.

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

They do exist.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

Sorry, I misread. No, whites who don't have good grades and high test scores don't get in.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified

Because adding 230 SAT points to let an unqualified person in is wrong when it keeps out a better qualified person.

like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

Why would less qualified whites get in over better qualified coloreds?

Yes they do. Stop lying to yourself.

The company analyzed the profiles of students who indicated their legacy status, and found that legacy students scored lower on the SAT than nonlegacy students.

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

Here's where to apply to college to increase your chances of getting in — no matter where you live

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students unless you are a kid of a parent who went to a HBCU because of past racial discrimination. Therefore whites with lower entrance scores are admitted and legacy is not the only case where this happens.

.You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points are redditt, a racist site, and another conservative website.

Race-Blind Admissions Are Affirmative Action for Whites

no group experiences more affirmative action than white people.

Supreme Court Case Winner Challenges High School Student to Debate on Affirmative Action

 

[Montrovant]

But all this is a moot argument given that test scores have been invalidated as any kind of standard for student success or entry into college.

You've said this a few times. Is there specific research you are referencing when you say it? I apologize if you previously mentioned the research and I missed it.

I don't make things up.

Do ACT and SAT scores really matter? New study says they shouldn’t

A study published Tuesday that probed the success of “test-optional” admissions policies in 33 public and private universities calls into question the need for such testing.

Former Dean of Admissions for Bates College William Hiss led the study which tracked the grades and graduation rates of students who submitted their test results against those who did not over several years.

Hiss’ data showed that there was a negligible difference in college performance between the two groups. Only .05 percent of a GPA point set “submitters” and “non-submitters” apart, and the difference in their graduation rates was just .6 percent.

Do ACT and SAT scores really matter? New study says they shouldn't

Ah. Your statement is a bit disingenuous; the study does not invalidate test scores as a standard for student success or entry into college. Instead, the study indicates that SAT and ACT scores may not be an important factor in student success. Unfortunately, the link for the actual study data does not work, but from what I read, it is specifically those 2 major standardized tests that are being discussed. More, it sounds as though the study does not actually look at test scores, but instead looks at those who did submit test scores and those who did not. One can reasonably assume that those submitting their test scores are likely to have scored higher than those who do not, but it would be nice to see the actual numbers.

It seems that this study was based entirely on Bates College students. I have no idea what factors might contribute to the outcomes at Bates College that would not apply to other universities.

I'd also like to point out that the college which did the study still has 2/3 of enrollees submit their test scores.

20-year Bates College study of optional SATs finds no differences

Certainly the study is evidence that SAT and ACT scores may not be important for determining college outcomes, but it does not invalidate test scores as a standard for student success. It may be true that SAT and ACT scores aren't particularly important in this context, but one study from students at one university does not irrefutably prove that, nor does it say that all testing is invalidated.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Then why I sall the fcus always on black

Fisher and others refusing to believe that people of color can be smarter than them and can earn admission solely on their brain and not their skin color.

There are plenty of smart minorities who get good grades and high test scores.
It's the ones who don't, and get in anyway, that cause concern.

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

And for how many years did white men who were not smart enough and could not get good test scores got allowed into colleges while non whites couldn't? Do you not think that impacts how things are now? Or is it that most of todays CEOS and our President don't exist.

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

They do exist.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

Sorry, I misread. No, whites who don't have good grades and high test scores don't get in.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified

Because adding 230 SAT points to let an unqualified person in is wrong when it keeps out a better qualified person.

like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

Why would less qualified whites get in over better qualified coloreds?

Yes they do. Stop lying to yourself.

The company analyzed the profiles of students who indicated their legacy status, and found that legacy students scored lower on the SAT than nonlegacy students.

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

Here's where to apply to college to increase your chances of getting in — no matter where you live

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students unless you are a kid of a parent who went to a HBCU because of past racial discrimination. Therefore whites with lower entrance scores are admitted and legacy is not the only case where this happens.

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points are redditt, a racist site, and another conservative website.

Race-Blind Admissions Are Affirmative Action for Whites

no group experiences more affirmative action than white people.

Supreme Court Case Winner Challenges High School Student to Debate on Affirmative Action

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

 

[IM2]

But all this is a moot argument given that test scores have been invalidated as any kind of standard for student success or entry into college.

You've said this a few times. Is there specific research you are referencing when you say it? I apologize if you previously mentioned the research and I missed it.

I don't make things up.

Do ACT and SAT scores really matter? New study says they shouldn’t

A study published Tuesday that probed the success of “test-optional” admissions policies in 33 public and private universities calls into question the need for such testing.

Former Dean of Admissions for Bates College William Hiss led the study which tracked the grades and graduation rates of students who submitted their test results against those who did not over several years.

Hiss’ data showed that there was a negligible difference in college performance between the two groups. Only .05 percent of a GPA point set “submitters” and “non-submitters” apart, and the difference in their graduation rates was just .6 percent.

Do ACT and SAT scores really matter? New study says they shouldn't

Ah. Your statement is a bit disingenuous; the study does not invalidate test scores as a standard for student success or entry into college. Instead, the study indicates that SAT and ACT scores may not be an important factor in student success. Unfortunately, the link for the actual study data does not work, but from what I read, it is specifically those 2 major standardized tests that are being discussed. More, it sounds as though the study does not actually look at test scores, but instead looks at those who did submit test scores and those who did not. One can reasonably assume that those submitting their test scores are likely to have scored higher than those who do not, but it would be nice to see the actual numbers.

It seems that this study was based entirely on Bates College students. I have no idea what factors might contribute to the outcomes at Bates College that would not apply to other universities.

I'd also like to point out that the college which did the study still has 2/3 of enrollees submit their test scores.

20-year Bates College study of optional SATs finds no differences

Certainly the study is evidence that SAT and ACT scores may not be important for determining college outcomes, but it does not invalidate test scores as a standard for student success. It may be true that SAT and ACT scores aren't particularly important in this context, but one study from students at one university does not irrefutably prove that, nor does it say that all testing is invalidated.

When over 800 universities decide to make these tests optional, it goes beyond one study which was done by several universities. ..The study was about the college success of those who took the test and those who did not. Not that people submitted and did not submit the test, There were people who took the test and there were people who did not make it and they rate of graduation was measured and found that there was little difference and in fact it was negligible.

Even if we make the conclusion you tried making if those who had not submitted their tests got lower scores the fact s the study showed that the scores did not matter.

You guys just want to hang on to a lie no matter how much proof is shown that it s a lie..

 

[IM2]

Then why I sall the fcus always on black

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

And for how many years did white men who were not smart enough and could not get good test scores got allowed into colleges while non whites couldn't? Do you not think that impacts how things are now? Or is it that most of todays CEOS and our President don't exist.

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

They do exist.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

Sorry, I misread. No, whites who don't have good grades and high test scores don't get in.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified

Because adding 230 SAT points to let an unqualified person in is wrong when it keeps out a better qualified person.

like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

Why would less qualified whites get in over better qualified coloreds?

Yes they do. Stop lying to yourself.

The company analyzed the profiles of students who indicated their legacy status, and found that legacy students scored lower on the SAT than nonlegacy students.

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

Here's where to apply to college to increase your chances of getting in — no matter where you live

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students unless you are a kid of a parent who went to a HBCU because of past racial discrimination. Therefore whites with lower entrance scores are admitted and legacy is not the only case where this happens.

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points are redditt, a racist site, and another conservative website.

Race-Blind Admissions Are Affirmative Action for Whites

no group experiences more affirmative action than white people.

Supreme Court Case Winner Challenges High School Student to Debate on Affirmative Action

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Then why I sall the fcus always on black

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

They do exist.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

Sorry, I misread. No, whites who don't have good grades and high test scores don't get in.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified

Because adding 230 SAT points to let an unqualified person in is wrong when it keeps out a better qualified person.

like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

Why would less qualified whites get in over better qualified coloreds?

Yes they do. Stop lying to yourself.

The company analyzed the profiles of students who indicated their legacy status, and found that legacy students scored lower on the SAT than nonlegacy students.

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

Here's where to apply to college to increase your chances of getting in — no matter where you live

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students unless you are a kid of a parent who went to a HBCU because of past racial discrimination. Therefore whites with lower entrance scores are admitted and legacy is not the only case where this happens.

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points are redditt, a racist site, and another conservative website.

Race-Blind Admissions Are Affirmative Action for Whites

no group experiences more affirmative action than white people.

Supreme Court Case Winner Challenges High School Student to Debate on Affirmative Action

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities.

Any policy that adds 200 points or more to a black student's SAT score will result in some non-black students being displaced.

 

[IM2]

Then why I sall the fcus always on black
Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

Sorry, I misread. No, whites who don't have good grades and high test scores don't get in.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified

Because adding 230 SAT points to let an unqualified person in is wrong when it keeps out a better qualified person.

like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

Why would less qualified whites get in over better qualified coloreds?

Yes they do. Stop lying to yourself.

The company analyzed the profiles of students who indicated their legacy status, and found that legacy students scored lower on the SAT than nonlegacy students.

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

Here's where to apply to college to increase your chances of getting in — no matter where you live

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students unless you are a kid of a parent who went to a HBCU because of past racial discrimination. Therefore whites with lower entrance scores are admitted and legacy is not the only case where this happens.

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points are redditt, a racist site, and another conservative website.

Race-Blind Admissions Are Affirmative Action for Whites

no group experiences more affirmative action than white people.

Supreme Court Case Winner Challenges High School Student to Debate on Affirmative Action

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities.

Any policy that adds 200 points or more to a black student's SAT score will result in some non-black students being displaced.

That's not the hard data that you have been asked to present. .What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions? Does that men black students are being displaced? You see unlike the 230 point claim, I have actually produced a policy that shows preference points that are provided. and they are provided to whites.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

Sorry, I misread. No, whites who don't have good grades and high test scores don't get in.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified

Because adding 230 SAT points to let an unqualified person in is wrong when it keeps out a better qualified person.

like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

Why would less qualified whites get in over better qualified coloreds?

Yes they do. Stop lying to yourself.

The company analyzed the profiles of students who indicated their legacy status, and found that legacy students scored lower on the SAT than nonlegacy students.

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

Here's where to apply to college to increase your chances of getting in — no matter where you live

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students unless you are a kid of a parent who went to a HBCU because of past racial discrimination. Therefore whites with lower entrance scores are admitted and legacy is not the only case where this happens.

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points are redditt, a racist site, and another conservative website.

Race-Blind Admissions Are Affirmative Action for Whites

no group experiences more affirmative action than white people.

Supreme Court Case Winner Challenges High School Student to Debate on Affirmative Action

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities.

Any policy that adds 200 points or more to a black student's SAT score will result in some non-black students being displaced.

That's not the hard data that you have been asked to present. .What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions? Does that men black students are being displaced? You see unlike the 230 point claim, I have actually produced a policy that shows preference points that are provided. and they are provided to whites.

What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions?

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.


Ummmm....looks like 73 points. DERP!

Tell you what, end legacy admissions and AA admissions and in a few years we can discuss the huge drop in black admissions.

 

[Mudda]

US blacks are LUCKY that slavery happened, otherwise they'd all still be in Africa.

This thread is not about slavery. I reported your post and from this point on will report every post you make like this which is not on topic or attempting to discuss the thread topic to the administrators.

Are all blacks pussies or is it just you?

 

[Mudda]

Look, if there are 500 test takers and 450 of them are white who will have the majority of higher scores?

The average white scores will be higher than the average black scores.

But all this is a moot argument given that test scores have been invalidated as any kind of standard for student success or entry into college.

Of course. People noticed blacks with much lower scores were getting in to places where whites with much higher scores were getting rejected.
AA is easier when you can hide what you're doing.

None of this is true.

Blame Your Own Mediocrity, Not People of Color, For Your College Admission Shortcomings

Seven years ago, Abigail Fisher sued the University of Texas because she believed that she was denied acceptance, not because everyone in her graduating class was smarter than her, not because they busted their butts harder than her, but because she was white. Fisher claimed that she knew people who were accepted that were less qualified than her but were accepted just because they had different skin color. That lawsuit was upheld in 2009 by a federal district court who rejected it. After that Fisher appealed to the 5th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals which agreed with the prior ruling.

For just one second, let’s forget that the University of Texas’ admission rate is 40 percent and that it’s on record only 5 people of color with grades worse than her were accepted and 42 white people with grades worse than her were accepted from her class that year. Let’s forget that there were 168 Black and Latino students who got the same grades or even better grades than her but were denied admission. Let’s forget all of that and look at the real issue and problem with the case: Fisher and others refusing to believe that people of color can be smarter than them and can earn admission solely on their brain and not their skin color.

There’s always been this rhetoric that people of color who are accepted into these schools are accepted because of their skin color due to Affirmative Action. They didn’t study for their ACTs, they didn’t get 4.0s, they weren’t involved in their high schools. They just applied and the admissions people looked at what race they were and said “She’s brown, let’s get that acceptance letter to her.” But the reality of the situation is if that spot was really yours, you would have gotten it.

Danielle Templeton, a freshman at the University of Northern Iowa graduated from high school with a 3.7 GPA and a 29 on her ACT. Her hard work was rewarded with a full-ride scholarship, to which her white classmates responded asking her if she got the scholarship because she was Indian. The high scores and finishing in the top of her class can’t possibly be the reason she was accepted right? Wrong. It’s that amount of entitlement that has led to a misunderstanding of Affirmative Action is and who it really benefits.

Blame Your Own Mediocrity, Not People of Color, For Your College Admission Shortcomings | HuffPost

What you believe is a lie. A race baited lie at that. Stop believing it.

Fisher and others refusing to believe that people of color can be smarter than them and can earn admission solely on their brain and not their skin color.

There are plenty of smart minorities who get good grades and high test scores.
It's the ones who don't, and get in anyway, that cause concern.

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

And for how many years did white men who were not smart enough and could not get good test scores got allowed into colleges while non whites couldn't? Do you not think that impacts how things are now? Or is it that most of todays CEOS and our President don't exist.

Quit you're whining, we gave you affirmative action to get into universities that white people built. And you had a dark president for the past 8 years as well. And still not satisfied. Sheesh!

You don't even have a proper comeback, figures.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

How about the whites who don't and get in? Don't they exist?

Sorry, I misread. No, whites who don't have good grades and high test scores don't get in.

Then why do you guys always want to talk about blacks who are not qualified

Because adding 230 SAT points to let an unqualified person in is wrong when it keeps out a better qualified person.

like there are no whites not qualified admitted into college over better qualified blacks or other people of color?

Why would less qualified whites get in over better qualified coloreds?

Yes they do. Stop lying to yourself.

The company analyzed the profiles of students who indicated their legacy status, and found that legacy students scored lower on the SAT than nonlegacy students.

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

Here's where to apply to college to increase your chances of getting in — no matter where you live

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students unless you are a kid of a parent who went to a HBCU because of past racial discrimination. Therefore whites with lower entrance scores are admitted and legacy is not the only case where this happens.

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points are redditt, a racist site, and another conservative website.

Race-Blind Admissions Are Affirmative Action for Whites

no group experiences more affirmative action than white people.

Supreme Court Case Winner Challenges High School Student to Debate on Affirmative Action

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities.

Any policy that adds 200 points or more to a black student's SAT score will result in some non-black students being displaced.

That's not the hard data that you have been asked to present. .What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions? Does that men black students are being displaced? You see unlike the 230 point claim, I have actually produced a policy that shows preference points that are provided. and they are provided to whites.

Lee's next slide shows three columns of numbers from a Princeton University study that tried to measure how race and ethnicity affect admissions by using SAT scores as a benchmark. It uses the term “bonus” to describe how many extra SAT points an applicant's race is worth. She points to the first column.

African Americans received a “bonus” of 230 points, Lee says.

She points to the second column.

“Hispanics received a bonus of 185 points.”


The last column draws gasps.

Asian Americans, Lee says, are penalized by 50 points — in other words, they had to do that much better to win admission.

“Do Asians need higher test scores? Is it harder for Asians to get into college? The answer is yes,” Lee says.

For Asian Americans, a changing landscape on college admissions

 

[IM2]

Yes they do. Stop lying to yourself.

Here's where to apply to college to increase your chances of getting in — no matter where you live

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students unless you are a kid of a parent who went to a HBCU because of past racial discrimination. Therefore whites with lower entrance scores are admitted and legacy is not the only case where this happens.

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points are redditt, a racist site, and another conservative website.

Race-Blind Admissions Are Affirmative Action for Whites

Supreme Court Case Winner Challenges High School Student to Debate on Affirmative Action

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities.

Any policy that adds 200 points or more to a black student's SAT score will result in some non-black students being displaced.

That's not the hard data that you have been asked to present. .What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions? Does that men black students are being displaced? You see unlike the 230 point claim, I have actually produced a policy that shows preference points that are provided. and they are provided to whites.

What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions?

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.


Ummmm....looks like 73 points. DERP!

Tell you what, end legacy admissions and AA admissions and in a few years we can discuss the huge drop in black admissions.

So you can't prove yourself. AA is not just for blacks. If these end and black admissions drop, it will be due to white racism.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities.

Any policy that adds 200 points or more to a black student's SAT score will result in some non-black students being displaced.

That's not the hard data that you have been asked to present. .What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions? Does that men black students are being displaced? You see unlike the 230 point claim, I have actually produced a policy that shows preference points that are provided. and they are provided to whites.

What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions?

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.


Ummmm....looks like 73 points. DERP!

Tell you what, end legacy admissions and AA admissions and in a few years we can discuss the huge drop in black admissions.

So you can't prove yourself. AA is not just for blacks. If these end and black admissions drop, it will be due to white racism.

Prove myself? WTH?

AA is not just for blacks.

Never said it was.

If these end and black admissions drop, it will be due to white racism.

Or poor grades and test scores by blacks.

 

[IM2]

Yes they do. Stop lying to yourself.

Here's where to apply to college to increase your chances of getting in — no matter where you live

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students unless you are a kid of a parent who went to a HBCU because of past racial discrimination. Therefore whites with lower entrance scores are admitted and legacy is not the only case where this happens.

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points are redditt, a racist site, and another conservative website.

Race-Blind Admissions Are Affirmative Action for Whites

Supreme Court Case Winner Challenges High School Student to Debate on Affirmative Action

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities.

Any policy that adds 200 points or more to a black student's SAT score will result in some non-black students being displaced.

That's not the hard data that you have been asked to present. .What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions? Does that men black students are being displaced? You see unlike the 230 point claim, I have actually produced a policy that shows preference points that are provided. and they are provided to whites.

Lee's next slide shows three columns of numbers from a Princeton University study that tried to measure how race and ethnicity affect admissions by using SAT scores as a benchmark. It uses the term “bonus” to describe how many extra SAT points an applicant's race is worth. She points to the first column.

African Americans received a “bonus” of 230 points, Lee says.

She points to the second column.

“Hispanics received a bonus of 185 points.”


The last column draws gasps.

Asian Americans, Lee says, are penalized by 50 points — in other words, they had to do that much better to win admission.

“Do Asians need higher test scores? Is it harder for Asians to get into college? The answer is yes,” Lee says.

For Asian Americans, a changing landscape on college admissions

Asians are 5 percent of the overall population but 18.5 percent of Ivy league students. So just how tough is it really for Asians.? Or have they been race baited?

Princeton for example has 22 percent Asian students which is 4 times the population of Asians in this country, At Princeton Asians are admitted almost at a 3:1 rate over blacks. This is a classic case of white race baiting by pitting one minority group against another.

Race Demographics of Ivy League Schools

 

[IM2]

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities.

Any policy that adds 200 points or more to a black student's SAT score will result in some non-black students being displaced.

That's not the hard data that you have been asked to present. .What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions? Does that men black students are being displaced? You see unlike the 230 point claim, I have actually produced a policy that shows preference points that are provided. and they are provided to whites.

What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions?

Of the 3,478 profiles which responded to the legacy question, legacy profiles scored 1870 on the SAT versus 1943 for nonlegacy students.


Ummmm....looks like 73 points. DERP!

Tell you what, end legacy admissions and AA admissions and in a few years we can discuss the huge drop in black admissions.

So you can't prove yourself. AA is not just for blacks. If these end and black admissions drop, it will be due to white racism.

Prove myself? WTH?

AA is not just for blacks.

Never said it was.

If these end and black admissions drop, it will be due to white racism.

Or poor grades and test scores by blacks.

No there is no or, it would be due to white racism only.

 

[Unkotare]

...

I know plenty of brothers who have degrees too. I see one every morning when I look in the mirror when I brush my teeth.

Standing right behind you? You gotta get a bigger place.

You might want to not do this again considering you got called a racial slur elsewhere and now you do the same things they do.

What have I done?

Don't play dumb.

Have I used a slur?

 

[MizMolly]

You seem to call anyone who disagrees with you a racist, you sure don't know the definition. Your masters degree did not give you any intelligence. You can't prove you worked harder than me. Everything I have achieved I worked for, nothing going through AA. You apparently had bogus or misinformed research tools and information. Your attempt to degrade white people is lame and unneccessary.

He CLAIMS he has a masters degree.

The incredible stupidity of his statements belies such a claim. Affirmative action can help get unqualified individuals into college, but it can't help THAT much.

You really don't know anything about this policy do you?

Were you addressing my comment? If you are talking about the AA policy, I in NO way benefited.

You don't know that Molly. An employer cannot tell you that you were hired because women are a group that is covered under affirmative action. Tat's why none of you should be making comments about me or other blacks and affirmative action because whites are the ones who have benefitted the most and I do not have bogus information. Just because you don't want to accept the facts doesn't make those facts bogus.

I have the required skills for a job, should I NOT get the job because I am qualified? It has nothing to do with AA, if I am qualified.

 

[Montrovant]

But all this is a moot argument given that test scores have been invalidated as any kind of standard for student success or entry into college.

You've said this a few times. Is there specific research you are referencing when you say it? I apologize if you previously mentioned the research and I missed it.

I don't make things up.

Do ACT and SAT scores really matter? New study says they shouldn’t

A study published Tuesday that probed the success of “test-optional” admissions policies in 33 public and private universities calls into question the need for such testing.

Former Dean of Admissions for Bates College William Hiss led the study which tracked the grades and graduation rates of students who submitted their test results against those who did not over several years.

Hiss’ data showed that there was a negligible difference in college performance between the two groups. Only .05 percent of a GPA point set “submitters” and “non-submitters” apart, and the difference in their graduation rates was just .6 percent.

Do ACT and SAT scores really matter? New study says they shouldn't

Ah. Your statement is a bit disingenuous; the study does not invalidate test scores as a standard for student success or entry into college. Instead, the study indicates that SAT and ACT scores may not be an important factor in student success. Unfortunately, the link for the actual study data does not work, but from what I read, it is specifically those 2 major standardized tests that are being discussed. More, it sounds as though the study does not actually look at test scores, but instead looks at those who did submit test scores and those who did not. One can reasonably assume that those submitting their test scores are likely to have scored higher than those who do not, but it would be nice to see the actual numbers.

It seems that this study was based entirely on Bates College students. I have no idea what factors might contribute to the outcomes at Bates College that would not apply to other universities.

I'd also like to point out that the college which did the study still has 2/3 of enrollees submit their test scores.

20-year Bates College study of optional SATs finds no differences

Certainly the study is evidence that SAT and ACT scores may not be important for determining college outcomes, but it does not invalidate test scores as a standard for student success. It may be true that SAT and ACT scores aren't particularly important in this context, but one study from students at one university does not irrefutably prove that, nor does it say that all testing is invalidated.

When over 800 universities decide to make these tests optional, it goes beyond one study which was done by several universities. ..The study was about the college success of those who took the test and those who did not. Not that people submitted and did not submit the test, There were people who took the test and there were people who did not make it and they rate of graduation was measured and found that there was little difference and in fact it was negligible.

Even if we make the conclusion you tried making if those who had not submitted their tests got lower scores the fact s the study showed that the scores did not matter.

You guys just want to hang on to a lie no matter how much proof is shown that it s a lie..

This isn't a discussion with "you guys," this is a discussion between you and me. I am not trying to "hang onto a lie." I very clearly pointed out that the conclusions of the study may be true, but you say it as though it is proven fact. It is not.

If you read the article in your own link, it absolutely says that the study looked at students who submitted tests vs those who did not. It did not say the students who did not submit their test scores did not take the tests, just that they did not submit them. From your article : "Former Dean of Admissions for Bates College William Hiss led the study which tracked the grades and graduation rates of students who submitted their test results against those who did not over several years." It was about the difference in success of students who submitted their test scores, not about the difference in success of students who did and did not take the SAT and/or ACT. In fact, it never mentions students not taking the SAT or ACT.

Further, the leader of the study disagrees with your statement that test scores are invalidated by the study (even if you assume you meant SATs and ACTs and not all test scores). Again, from your link: "I would never say the SATs and ACTs have no predictive value for anybody; they have predictive value for some people. We just don’t find them reliable cross populations,” says Hiss."

What we seem to have is a study which shows SAT and ACT scores are not reliably predictive of student outcomes. That is a far cry from "test scores have been invalidated as any kind of standard for student success." It also is not definitive, even if it is compelling.

Oh, and while the 850 test-optional schools in the article is certainly a large number, it still leaves perhaps 2200 other 4 year universities without such a policy Fast Facts . It also doesn't mean those 850 schools have completely given up on SAT and ACT scores as a measure for determining admittance.

I'm not dismissing the conclusion that SAT and ACT scores aren't a good indicator of college success. I think it's a reasonable conclusion that different people will have different strengths, and some may not do well on standardized tests yet still be able to perform well in other aspects of education. My issue is with your taking that conclusion and broadening it to say that all testing is invalidated for determining school success, a conclusion not made by the study's lead. If you had said something more like, "Studies show that SAT scores don't matter for college success" I would have had no problems.

I think you used poor phrasing, and drew a too-broad conclusion from the study. I don't think the study is invalid.

 

[Unkotare]

What should be used?
GPA?

Go read the studies. The claim of anti white discrimination is bogus.

If blacks are getting a huge bump added to their actual test scores, who loses that college slot?

If blacks are getting a huge bump added to their test scores then its apparent whites already had the points before the test was taken..

This is illogical.

No it is not. But what you and the other whites don't seem to get is that the white skin carries preferences that add up for them they never have to consider.

Illogical is illogical regardless of one's politics or what you or I might consider 'fair.' That's how logic operates.

 

[Unkotare]

Legacy admissions are given to primarily white students

What percentage of all admissions are white legacies? Give me some hard data.

The trend remained for students who were accepted into top 25 schools (as ranked by the US News & World Report), where legacy students scored 2133 versus 2156 for nonlegacy students.

What were the scores for the black students who were accepted?

You know the only places hat suggest blacks are getting 230 points

How many do they get?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities. How about we do that? Show me a reduction In white college graduates because of these programs. How about we do that? How about you show me were ZERO whites are admitted with lower scores than blacks in universities in this nation. How about we do that. You guys make all these comments then you ask for everyone else to prove themselves but you guys never do. How about you do so?

You give me the hard data that shows how white college admittances have been reduced by any policy which allows backs to be admitted into universities.

Any policy that adds 200 points or more to a black student's SAT score will result in some non-black students being displaced.

That's not the hard data that you have been asked to present. .What abut the 200 points whites get for legacy admissions? Does that men black students are being displaced? You see unlike the 230 point claim, I have actually produced a policy that shows preference points that are provided. and they are provided to whites.

Lee's next slide shows three columns of numbers from a Princeton University study that tried to measure how race and ethnicity affect admissions by using SAT scores as a benchmark. It uses the term “bonus” to describe how many extra SAT points an applicant's race is worth. She points to the first column.

African Americans received a “bonus” of 230 points, Lee says.

She points to the second column.

“Hispanics received a bonus of 185 points.”


The last column draws gasps.

Asian Americans, Lee says, are penalized by 50 points — in other words, they had to do that much better to win admission.

“Do Asians need higher test scores? Is it harder for Asians to get into college? The answer is yes,” Lee says.

For Asian Americans, a changing landscape on college admissions

Asians are 5 percent of the overall population but 18.5 percent of Ivy league students. So just how tough is it really for Asians.? Or have they been race baited?

Princeton for example has 22 percent Asian students which is 4 times the population of Asians in this country, At Princeton Asians are admitted almost at a 3:1 rate over blacks. This is a classic case of white race baiting by pitting one minority group against another.

Race Demographics of Ivy League Schools

Should the composition of a college's student body mirror the demographics of society, or represent the most qualified applicants?