No Special Master As DOJ Drops Bombshell 40 Page Ruling Obstruction By Trump Team

[BackAgain]

that is a lot of words to avoid just admitting you lied

I didn’t. But you’re too stubborn to even admit that you didn’t ask civilly.

 

[Indeependent]

I didn’t. But you’re too stubborn to even admit that you didn’t ask civilly.

You're expecting a Libertarian to act civilly?

 

[Seymour Flops]

But these are not similar circumstances.

Comey said this:
In looking back at our investigations into mishandling or removal of classified information, we cannot find a case that would support bringing criminal charges on these facts. All the cases prosecuted involved some combination of: clearly intentional and willful mishandling of classified information; or vast quantities of materials exposed in such a way as to support an inference of intentional misconduct; or indications of disloyalty to the United States; or efforts to obstruct justice. We do not see those things here.

In Trump’s case, the mishandling is clearly intentional. Those documents are absolutely unambiguously labeled classified. The second is that we see efforts to obstruct justice.

But Hillary's was not?

Are you saying that she accidentally set up a server that was less secure than gmail in the bathroom of her home and then sent and received highly classified documents on it, making them available to foreign hackers?

Or are you claiming that the Secretary of State did not know that her work-related emails frequently contain highly classified information?

I'm not sure what crime you allege that Trump intended, other than mishandling of classified information (if they can prove it was not declassified). If that's the crime, Hillary was as clearly guilty of it as Trump. If intent is the important factor, Trump was no more intentional in committing a crime than Hillary. Unless you are seriously using the Hillary-as-naive-bumpkin defense.

 

[lantern2814]

They got nothing again... you know that right?.... this is the same bunch that ran Russia gate....

These people desperate to defend this forget that the FBI has already admitted they staged that photo. Meaning they did not find what they claim to have found in that room. That word staged has meaning.

 

[BackAgain]

LOL, it seems you are unwilling to argue who counted the votes from each of the states in the 2020 election.

Nice wall of words. By the way, you didn’t ask any such question. Each of the states counted their own votes. By any chance are you attempting to grunt something about Electoral College votes? You dopes need to try to be coherent.

I admit I could not find an written part of the Constitution that the VP counts the votes from the several states, however, here is a link:

Are you continuing some conversation you and I hadn’t been a part of?

How the Electoral College Votes and How the Votes are Counted

It’s practically impossible to miss a Presidential election in the United States. By contrast, the meetings of the Electoral College electors across the country and the official counting of their votes probably pass by most people without much notice. Today, casting and counting Electoral...

www.congressionalinstitute.org

The new Congress is sworn in on January 3, and their first order of business is organizing the Chamber, electing their officers, and, in the House, passing the rules by which they will be governed. The Code states that the Congress must convene in a joint session on at 1:00 pm on January 6 following the meetings of the Electors. The House, with its more spacious Chamber, must host the meeting. This creates a somewhat unusual parliamentary situation: Normally, as the House of Representatives hosts the joint session, the Speaker would preside, but since the Constitution requires the Vice President to count the votes, he does. The Code, in fact, goes so far as to prescribe that the President of the Senate is to be seated upon the Speaker’s chair during the counting of the votes, and that the Speaker is to be seated to his left. It also specifies that Senators are to be seated to his right and Representatives are seated in the remainder of the Hall. The tellers, the Clerk of the House and the Secretary of the Senate are seated at the Clerk’s desk, and the other officers of the two Houses are seated in front of them.

Are you offering this trivia for any particular reason?

When the time comes for the Joint Session to start, the House has already been gathered in its Chamber. The House Sergeant-at-Arms addresses the Speaker, announcing the arrival of the President of the Senate, the Secretary of the Senate and the Senate. The Senate’s pages precede the party, bearing the electoral vote certificates in wooden chests. They place these on the middle-tier of the rostrum, to the Speaker’s right. Then the Vice President and the Senate file in and take their places. (If you watch a recording, you’ll notice that attendance at this joint session is higher than for a typical House or Senate debate, but not as high as it normally is for something like the annual State of the Union address.)

So far, so dull.

Each House appoints two tellers to count the votes. Contemporary practice is that the chairmen and ranking members of the Committee on House Administration and the Senate Committee on Rules and Administration serve as tellers. (These two committees have jurisdiction over Federal elections; hence, the designation of their chairmen and ranking members as tellers.) The President of the Senate opens the certificates of the states in alphabetical order, starting with Alabama. Immediately after he opens a certificate, he hands it, along with any accompanying papers, to the tellers. In recent elections, the tellers have simply noted that the certificates appear valid and read the votes, but previously, they would read the entire certificate. The Senate Rules Committee chairman reads the first certificate, followed by the House Administration chairman who reads the second, followed by their respective ranking members who read the third and fourth. This order continues for the rest of the states.

Still dull.

As they read the certificates, they make a list of the votes. Once this process is done, they give the list of votes and the tally to the President of the Senate, who announces the result. After announcing the result, he states that the results, along with a copy of the tally, will be entered into the Journals of the House and Senate. After that, the joint session ends, and the Senate departs from the House Chamber.

Some things get duller the further you delve into them.

Thus, there are enough facts that VP's announce the winner over time.

So?

Is there any chance at all that you think you’re making any point?

 

[lantern2814]

A picture is worth a thousand words, friend.

Those documents didn’t belong in Trump’s closet. The government was right to try to retrieve them. They tried doing it nicely. Trump decided to fuck around and so he found out.

What was unconstitutional about it?

Your photo isn’t worth shit. An admittedly STAGED photograph. Seems you don’t know the meaning of that word. Too bad for you there’s also a letter from NARA thanking Trump for cooperating with them.

 

[Batcat]

WRONG....The Traitor has zero authority to declassify any U.S. Government material. There policies, procedures, rules and reglations that must be followed for purposes of declassification.

The lies you Cons believe...

You must watch MSNBC.

The question will likely be decided in the courts.

You might learn something if you take the time to read this article. It deals with an incident in2017. The source is ABC news (not a real conservative site.)

Trump has legal authority to declassify intelligence

Despite the blowback, Trump is right.

abcnews.go.com

***snip***

Executive Order 13526​

As president, Trump has the legal power to declassify information. He also has the authority to share information with whomever he wants, including foreign adversaries.

At the White House today, Trump's national security adviser, H.R. McMaster, defended Trump's disclosure and said it "is wholly appropriate for the president to share whatever information he thinks is necessary to advance the security of the American people."

The 1978 Presidential Records Act, which requires presidents to turn over documents to the National Archives at the end of their administration, lacks an enforcement mechanism, but there are multiple federal laws regarding the handling of classified documents. Trump signed one such law in 2018, increasing the penalty for "unauthorized removal and retention of classified documents or material" from one year to five years in prison.

But those in Trump’s orbit say that no president is personally bound by the removal and retention rules governing classified documents, which can be declassified if the president simply says they are, according to Ric Grenell, who was Trump’s acting director of national intelligence and who handled highly classified information.

“There is no approval process for the president of the United States to declassify intelligence. There is this phony idea that he must provide notification for declassification but that’s just silly. Who is he supposed to notify? I think it’s the height of swampism to think the president should seek bureaucrats’ approval,” Grenell told NBC News, emphasizing that he wasn’t personally speaking for the president.

Trump himself said on his Truth Social platform Friday, "It was all declassified."

But as with many issues there are good arguments on both sides. That’s why I predict this will be decided in the courts and quite possibly the Supreme Court.

​

 

[lantern2814]

it was an evidence photo, with a ruler in lower part to scale the size of items retrieved in the search, WHICH IS DONE IN ALL SEARCHES.....

I almost choked from laughing while watching Hannity and f ox hosts claiming the photo was for show, or Trump claiming that he would never have them on the floor spread out like that, for guests to see....

Well duh, no one put them on the ground to make you look untidy Donald.... They are evidence photos, done with all search warrants.

HEY dumbfuck, that photo was STAGED. By the FBI’s own admission. Meaning they didn’t find what they claim to. That is not done all the time as that could damage any real evidence (which you don’t have). Of course idiots like you and Gator swallow the crap you’re fed like good little lemmings.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Mea culpa, I left out Executive Branch! He's not the entire population of the Executive Offices.

He has the entire power. You really don't know this? Ok, not your fault, it's the education system.

Here you go:

Article II, Section 1

Section 1​

The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America.

That is a President . . . period. No "and . . . " The president has the executive Power. The rest of the "branch" derives any power they have from his delegation of it.

I usually link to any quote, but since this is (supposedly) common knowledge, I won't. I recommend that you search on "U.S. Constitution" and see it for yourself, so you do not suspect that I'm using some right-wing edited version.

Your claim that both of his Impeachments were political, no more so than the one that was the impeachment of President Clinton.

Which was highly political and incredibly stupid. As was the impeachment of Andrew Johnson. You can tell when an impeachment was incredibly stupid: The guy who got impeached winds up still being president. Now you've just made him a persecuted hero, galvanizing his supporters and made him feel invincible since you did your worst and he's still standing. That was true for Johnson, for Clinton, and twice as true for Trump.

Moral of the stories: Don't impeach a guy because you hate or because you cannot believe his supporters still support him even though ___________________ . Impeach a guy because there is bipartisan agreement that he is guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors and the conviction is a near certainty.

As to the Executive Branch, consider the fact that the Vice President was granted the power to unseat The Donald.

Only the Donald? Because if you mean the 25th amendment, if Harris hasn't taken out Biden for being incapacitated, talking about it for the Donald is ludicrous.

BTW, more constitution for you. Here is what happens right after the VP and a majority of executive officers make the VP acting president (not the president as happens when a president dies):

Thereafter, when the President transmits to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives his written declaration that no inability exists, he shall resume the powers and duties of his office unless the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive department or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit within four days to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office. Thereupon Congress shall decide the issue, assembling within forty-eight hours for that purpose if not in session. If the Congress, within twenty-one days after receipt of the latter written declaration, or, if Congress is not in session, within twenty-one days after Congress is required to assemble, determines by two-thirds vote of both Houses that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President shall continue to discharge the same as Acting President; otherwise, the President shall resume the powers and duties of his office.

Theoretically, if Harris could convince a majority of heads of executive departments, she could become the acting president. But the process that follows stacks the deck heavily in favor of the elected president, as it should.

Notice also that this is what a process looks like. Many on here (and I don't know if you were one) have stated as a fact that there is a process for the president to declassify documents. But they can never show the process as I just did for my claim. Because them wanting there to be a process is not the same as one existing.

Trying to defend trump is an impossible effort. But feel free to insult all of us who post facts and not ad hominems.

Never my intention to insult. Well, rarely anyway.

If I insulted you, my apologies. I'll scroll up and if I see what you mean I'll apologize specifically. If I can't find it, my apology still stands as a goodwill gesture.

EDIT: I did see what you mean. My apologies for saying "you" will succeed in making yourselves laughing stocks. I should have said that the Dems in congress will succeed in making themselves laughing stocks.

 

[Esdraelon]

I wonder if she understands the implications of that admission?

Likely better than YOU. The bottom line, despite your hysteria is Trump doesn't have to PROVE he declassified that material. He had an ABSOLUTE RIGHT to do so and no bureaucrat can stand in the way. The case will have to go to SCOTUS because once again DC will scream like the world is ending because they know he can win again.

They plan to indict and convict him (if the trial can be kept in DC) and then use that criminal statute to say he's disqualified from running. Except that statute doesn't apply to the one person who has the right to declassify ANYTHING AT ANY TIME. So, we're off to the races again and while you will lose, the fact that SCOTUS has to intervene will enable the scum in DC and their media whores to stir up even more hate and violence from idiots like you.

 

[Batcat]

It’s a fine copy paste but ultimately it comes from Trump sycophants who have no problem ignoring relevant details.

For starters, two things offset Trump’s case from Clinton’s. One is that the hundreds of documents he took were clearly marked classified. Two is that he has evidence suggesting he obstructed justice in the DoJ’s attempt to get them back.

We can see the DoJ is crafting it’s case to avoid having to worry about whether Trump did or didn’t declassify them. The espionage act violation doesn’t say classified information, just national defense information. Add to that obstruction of justice in their failure to turn over subpoenaed documents and evidence that their actions intended to hide documents.

Last, whether Trump actually declassified anything may be an open question in the courts but to anyone with a lick of common sense, it fails miserably.

There is no evidence that he ever declassified any of them and to this day I have yet to see any claim from his lawyers that he did declassify those documents.

I have this suspicion that the documents deal with how the DOJ and the FBI handled the Trump/Putin investigation. Trump hoped to use them to teach the American public just how corrupt our government is. The information might b so damning that our wonderful corrupt government had to get those records back at any and all cost.

Trump Associate's Stated Plan to Publicly Release "Declassified" Documents

New revelations "could have significant legal implications for the Justice Department’s ongoing criminal investigation."

www.justsecurity.org

***snip***

The Dissemination Plan​

When news of the Mar-a-Lago documents began heating up in May 2022, Patel spoke with right-wing media outlets about Trump’s objectives in retaining these documents. He began laying out the defense that the documents had been “declassified,” and specifically identified Trump’s goal to release the information publicly. He described the content of the documents to include matters related to the FBI’s Russia investigation (Crossfire Hurricane), but also a much broader range of issues.

“It’s information that Trump felt spoke to matters regarding everything from Russiagate to the Ukraine impeachment fiasco to major national security matters of great public importance — anything the president felt the American people had a right to know is in there and more,” Patel told Breitbart on May 5. He also said, “Trump declassified whole sets of materials in anticipation of leaving government that he thought the American public should have the right to read themselves.”

That same day, Patel spoke with a right-wing video show and discussed Trump’s goal of “transparency” in releasing such information. He said:

“Part of that transparency comes in the form of, you know, providing the American public with information that should never have been classified or kept from them in the first place. And what he did was on his way out of the White House, he declassified — made available to every American citizen in the world — large volumes of information relating, not just to Russiagate, but to national security matters, to the Ukraine impeachment, to his impeachment one, impeachment two.”
All things that deep-staters, as you know, Buck, in government go in there and get their hands on and classify ’cause they don’t want the truth to get out ’cause it’s gonna make Trump look good ’cause he always supported the truth and the facts. And that’s what we have here is a whole slew of documents and information that President Trump wanted to put out.”

“We’re hoping to get this information out soon,” he added.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

I didn’t. But you’re too stubborn to even admit that you didn’t ask civilly.

did I hurt your wittle feelings?

 

[Esdraelon]

One of the important details is that these documents were found not in the storage room... but in a desk in Donald Trump's office,"

View attachment 689524

The fact that you continue to cite this info like it matters, just means you refuse to accept that every document he had possession of, he considered private documents THAT HAD BEEN DECLASSIFIED.

The disconnect with you people is clear. You NEVER accepted him as being a legitimate president and because of that you are easily convinced, time after time, that he did not have the powers invested in that office. It gets tiresome. It's like trying to convince a child that they're wrong.

If he runs and is re-elected he needs to GUT DHS and CIA top down to mid-level of all execs. Let the media melt down, fok 'em. The FBI is irretrievably corrupt and needs to be disbanded. The CIA needs to be drastically reined in. Of course, if he actually tried that, he'd be killed in record time. We no longer can control these behemoths but we CAN expose them for the corrupt filth that they have become and convince Americans to resist them in every conceivable way short of violence.

 

[Esdraelon]

We’re hoping to get this information out soon,” he added.

If/when they convict him of this bullshit, he should have a "poison pill" or "dead man switch" to dump every one of those documents, Assange-style into the public realm.

 

[BackAgain]

You're expecting a Libertarian to act civilly?

I know some libertarians. Some are cool. But some (and I won’t mention any names) are not so cool — or civil.

 

[Batcat]

If/when they convict him of this bullshit, he should have a "poison pill" or "dead man switch" to dump every one of those documents, Assange-style into the public realm.

Oh, come on man. I must have read 1000 predictions that Trump was going to be convicted and it never happens.

You would think that after a while you would begin to realize that your wonderful liberal media thinks you are a sucker.

 

[bravoactual]

You must watch MSNBC.

The question will likely be decided in the courts.

You might learn something if you take the time to read this article. It deals with an incident in2017. The source is ABC news (not a real conservative site.)

Trump has legal authority to declassify intelligence

Despite the blowback, Trump is right.

abcnews.go.com

***snip***

Executive Order 13526​

As president, Trump has the legal power to declassify information. He also has the authority to share information with whomever he wants, including foreign adversaries.

At the White House today, Trump's national security adviser, H.R. McMaster, defended Trump's disclosure and said it "is wholly appropriate for the president to share whatever information he thinks is necessary to advance the security of the American people."

The 1978 Presidential Records Act, which requires presidents to turn over documents to the National Archives at the end of their administration, lacks an enforcement mechanism, but there are multiple federal laws regarding the handling of classified documents. Trump signed one such law in 2018, increasing the penalty for "unauthorized removal and retention of classified documents or material" from one year to five years in prison.

But those in Trump’s orbit say that no president is personally bound by the removal and retention rules governing classified documents, which can be declassified if the president simply says they are, according to Ric Grenell, who was Trump’s acting director of national intelligence and who handled highly classified information.

“There is no approval process for the president of the United States to declassify intelligence. There is this phony idea that he must provide notification for declassification but that’s just silly. Who is he supposed to notify? I think it’s the height of swampism to think the president should seek bureaucrats’ approval,” Grenell told NBC News, emphasizing that he wasn’t personally speaking for the president.

Trump himself said on his Truth Social platform Friday, "It was all declassified."

But as with many issues there are good arguments on both sides. That’s why I predict this will be decided in the courts and quite possibly the Supreme Court.

​

I sure as shit don't watch Fux Snooze, OWNED or read Breitfart. I think for myself.

Congress wrote the laws governing declassification. The Traitor does get to wave his baby 2-month old hands decide what is and what is not declassified. He ain't got that power.

 

[BackAgain]

did I hurt your wittle feelings?

No ma’am. I’m just trying to train you.

Sit! Good girl!

 

[BackAgain]

I sure as shit don't watch Fux Snooze, OWNED or read Breitfart. I think for myself.

Congress wrote the laws governing declassification. The Traitor does get to wave his baby 2-month old hands decide what is and what is not declassified. He ain't got that power.

You don’t think at all. You can’t.

The President, in fact, has plenary power to declassify any classified document. Congress lack the ability to constrain that power. It’s called Separation of Powers.

Your infantile mind just doesn’t comprehend adult matters. Go toddle off now, child. Be a good little libtard and play in heavy traffic.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

that is a lot of words to avoid just admitting you lied

but hE iS hOnEsT and aCcUrAte