Obama bypasses Congress on DREAM Act, stops deporting young illegals

[EriktheRed]

In addition to immigration that did receive a chilly reception from the GOP controlled Congress, President Bush was a mess on a lot of issues. His Senior Prescription Drug bill should never have been passed, but unfortunately the GOP reformers that had blessed Clinton's presidency had mostly term limited themselves out by the time GWB took office. His energy program was a disaster. NCLB had some good features but has obviously produced more negatives than positivies. In fact just about everything he compromised with the Democrats on has proved to be a mistake.

But President Bush did not disobey the laws he didn't like. He didn't order anybody not to enforce them. And he didn't use Executive Orders to set aside existing law and make a new one.

I am back to my first response to you then -

So you are upset that he was vocal about not supporting that Law? verses Not being vocal and ignoring that Law? Is this correct?

Can you show me in the last twenty years what/who supported that Law? Vocal or not?


It's okay to say GW messed up as well as others before him, it's not ok to say Obama is I have to think of a good PC word then what comes to mind -neglectful.

I've already said I didn't like President Bush's immigration policy. I didn't like Carter, Reagan, or Clinton's immigration policies either and they were all equally ineffective in stopping the flood of illegals across our border.

But now if you really REALLY focus, I think you might be able to understand that a President's views of immigration are NOT what this thread is about. I know that is hard for an Obama supporter to do, but I have faith in you that you are capable of getting it, Olivia. This is NOT about anybody's views on immigration or which President did more or less or enough to enforce immigration laws.

This is about a President who uses an executive order to set aside a law that our duly elected representatives have passed on our behalf. This is about a President who not only sets it aside but uses an Executive Order to make a brand new law.

President Obama has done that.

President Bush did not.

President Bush's Signing Statements

 

[Foxfyre]

Would somebody give Conservaderp a lollipop or something to occupy him so the grown ups can have a discussion here?

 

[NeoTemplar]

You said to "start shooting the bastards as they come across the border."

Right? You said that. No one else said it You said it.

Now, maybe I'm crazy, and you could have totally meant Canadians. But usually we're speaking about people coming up from Mexico when we talk like this right?

Yeah. Walk back the racism all you want, but it's racism, Pops. Pure and simple. You is be an racist.

This is whats wrong with people these days they confuse racism, its not racism unless i start shooting mexicans simply "Because" their mexican that wouldn't limit it to Illegals, you merely saw what you wanted to see and assumed the worst on your own, don't blame others for your own shortsightedness.

Okay, racist.

Definition of RACISM

1
: a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race
2
: racial prejudice or discrimination

Racism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

Where does my post prove im racist? Prejudiced against illegal immigrants as a group possibly but illegal immigrants don't have rights in the U.S. to begin with so its not unfounded and thats what prejudice is "unfounded" hate of a particular group.

1
: injury or damage resulting from some judgment or action of another in disregard of one's rights; especially : detriment to one's legal rights or claims
2
a (1) : preconceived judgment or opinion (2) : an adverse opinion or leaning formed without just grounds or before sufficient knowledge
b : an instance of such judgment or opinion
c : an irrational attitude of hostility directed against an individual, a group, a race, or their supposed characteristics

Prejudice[1] - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

 

[Foxfyre]

I am back to my first response to you then -

So you are upset that he was vocal about not supporting that Law? verses Not being vocal and ignoring that Law? Is this correct?

Can you show me in the last twenty years what/who supported that Law? Vocal or not?


It's okay to say GW messed up as well as others before him, it's not ok to say Obama is I have to think of a good PC word then what comes to mind -neglectful.

I've already said I didn't like President Bush's immigration policy. I didn't like Carter, Reagan, or Clinton's immigration policies either and they were all equally ineffective in stopping the flood of illegals across our border.

But now if you really REALLY focus, I think you might be able to understand that a President's views of immigration are NOT what this thread is about. I know that is hard for an Obama supporter to do, but I have faith in you that you are capable of getting it, Olivia. This is NOT about anybody's views on immigration or which President did more or less or enough to enforce immigration laws.

This is about a President who uses an executive order to set aside a law that our duly elected representatives have passed on our behalf. This is about a President who not only sets it aside but uses an Executive Order to make a brand new law.

President Obama has done that.

President Bush did not.

President Bush's Signing Statements

That is a list of the bills that Congress passed and President Bush signed into law which is a Constitutional function of the Presidency. You do know the difference between that and an Executive Order? Please tell me that you do.

 

[EriktheRed]

I've already said I didn't like President Bush's immigration policy. I didn't like Carter, Reagan, or Clinton's immigration policies either and they were all equally ineffective in stopping the flood of illegals across our border.

But now if you really REALLY focus, I think you might be able to understand that a President's views of immigration are NOT what this thread is about. I know that is hard for an Obama supporter to do, but I have faith in you that you are capable of getting it, Olivia. This is NOT about anybody's views on immigration or which President did more or less or enough to enforce immigration laws.

This is about a President who uses an executive order to set aside a law that our duly elected representatives have passed on our behalf. This is about a President who not only sets it aside but uses an Executive Order to make a brand new law.

President Obama has done that.

President Bush did not.

President Bush's Signing Statements

That is a list of the bills that Congress passed and President Bush signed into law which is a Constitutional function of the Presidency. You do know the difference between that and an Executive Order? Please tell me that you do.

I most certainly do know the difference and I'll also say that in the context of the conversation being had here it's a distinction without a difference.

Btw, here's another distinction without a difference: this is actually a DHS directive, not an executive order.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Would somebody give Conservaderp a lollipop or something to occupy him so the grown ups can have a discussion here?

Fuck lollipops. I want some cocaineeeeee!

Not really.

I just enjoy bugging the fuck out of you because you make shit up.

Have you said Classical Liberal in this thread yet?

 

[EriktheRed]

A number of Republican officials and conservatives have responded to Obama’s immigration announcement by attacking it on process grounds, arguing that the decision to circumvent Congress was an abuse of power, an affront to democracy, and even unconstitutional — and could encourage further lawbreaking.

But in an interview with me just now, Mark Shurtleff, Utah’s conservative Republican attorney general, dismissed those objections, arguing the move was perfectly within Obama’s powers, good law enforcement policy, and even a “conservative” solution.

“This is clearly within the president’s power,” Shurtleff said. “I was pleased when the president announced it.”

Have any Cons talked some sense into this guy yet, btw?


Utah’s GOP attorney general: Obama immigration move totally within his power - The Plum Line - The Washington Post

 

[steeliniraq13]

Obama is nothing but a political clown just like the rest of them. The man has done very little right, is already thumping for reelection (as opposed to doing his job), and every decision he makes is with that reelection in mind instead of what is best for the country. I would like to say he will not be reelected but he will and I just hope we are all ready for the destruction of our country as we know it starting later this year. Just my 2 cents

 

[P@triot]

Short answer: he isn't.

Short answer for ignorants with no facts: "he isn't". Long answer with FACTS:

You mean other than the fact that he has flat out said on camera "the way you do that is SPREAD THE WEALTH"? *Do you even know what Marxism is? *I highly doubt it. *But in a nut shell, it can be summed up by Karl Marx's own statement "from each according to his ability, to each according to his need". *So if you believe we should spread the wealth from those who do to those who do nothing, then you are a Marxist.

Furthermore, his entire life he has surrounded himself with NOTHING but Socialists/Marxists/Communists. *Consider these facts:

**President Obama Communist connections go back through his whole life. Obama's mother, Ann Dunham (born 12/29/1949 died 11/7/1995) was a communist sympathizer and his father, Barack Hussein Obama, Senior (born 1936 died 11/24/1982), (who he only met twice) was an anticolonialist Marxist.

**Black communist poet Frank Marshal Davis (born 1905) was a life long mentor to Barack Hussein Obama was a member of the communist Party's Dorie Miller Club (Chicago-card number 47544) along with involvement in communist front organizations like the National Negro Congress, the League of American Writers, the National Federation for Constitutional Liberties and the Civil Rights Congress. There are some 600 pages in the Frank Davis FBI file including the fact he was still listed in 1973 as an endorser of a major American Communist Party front organization, American Committee for Protection of Foreign Born.

* Obama hired Van Jones to work in the White House. *Van Jones is a SELF-PROFESSED Communist/Marxist.

* The Communist Party USA organization officially endorsed Barack Hussein Obama for President (enough said there).

* "The left can and should advance its own views and disagree with the Obama administration without being disagreeable. Its tone should be respectful. We are speaking to a friend.”–Sam Webb, National Chair Communist Party USA

And this is but an extremely small sample of the overwhelming facts that illustrate he is a dirt bag Marxist. *You have to be a fool of EPIC proportions if you think Obama is "capping" the tax rate at 39% because he wants to. *He's doing it because he has no choice right now. *He knows he can't get re-elected if he comes out and admits what he is and that he wants to tax at a 90% rate so he can redistribute wealth.

Game. Set. Match.

Nah, just in paranoid wingnut wannabe-cold-warrior fantasies.

Everything listed there is FACT - which is why you had NO response other than a juvenile comment. Typical liberal wingnut ignoring reality for fantasy...

 

[P@triot]

Why don't they just charge him with a host of criminal charges? He has violated the US Constitution on multiple occassions (a Constitution which he took an oath to uphold). He has broken the law numerous times - why don't we just charge him and remove him from office? I suppose the thought of drunk Joe Biden running the country scares everyone too much to actually stop Barack Hussein from breaking the law.

Because there is only six month's left in this term and less than that until we have the next Presidential election. Barack Hussein Obama controls the White House, the Senate, and largely controls the media and therefore largely controls the message for anybody who doesn't do their own research and analysis which is most Americans. The Republicans will be made out to be the worst kind of ideologues and political opportunists, witch hunters, and all that all the way to the election and there is no way they would be able to make their case and show people the truth within that time frame.

And Fearless Leader knows it which is why he is waiting until now to make moves like this.

If nothing else should persuade us to look to the track record and character of the person we are electing to high office, this should be a really good lesson. Alas, it likely won't be.

When I see the hate Obama crowd resort to paranoia such as this I know they don't have anything (sound familiar?).

Here's a better answer: He hasn't done anything more than be the President and that's not enough to charge him with anything, no matter how much the people who stick pins in dolls of him would like to believe otherwise.

He's violated the US Constitution on at least a dozen different times. You know, that document which provides you with the freedom to lie and support Communism, but which you don't have enough respect for to even take 15 minutes to actually read one time. Thank you for showing everyone that you have no idea what you're talking about...

 

[P@triot]

divide and conquer?

you mean like saying "our primary objective is to make sure that obama is a one term president"?

that type of divide and conquer?

the minute rushbo told the GOP to say "i hope he fails"...

the president should have found his cojones and kicked your butts. at least then he'd get blamed for what he actually did... instead of for congress' obstruction and what the rightwingnuts make up.

as for the second term... eh... i sucked it up for 8 years of the worst president in my lifetime. and couldn't wait til shrub hit the road.

and he didn't even WIN election the first time around.

so i'd suggest getting over it.

The worst president of your lifetime is currently in office.

Nah. He's back on his ranch at Crawford, Gramps. Thanks for trying.

The worst president of ANY lifetime is currently in office. He's destroyed the economy, spent us into collapse, violated the Constitution, alienated our allies, and has made more crooked deals than the mafia.

He's a complete failure and you know it. You've just been brainwashed like all other idiot liberals to support communism no matter how much it fails.

 

[Foxfyre]

President Bush's Signing Statements

That is a list of the bills that Congress passed and President Bush signed into law which is a Constitutional function of the Presidency. You do know the difference between that and an Executive Order? Please tell me that you do.

I most certainly do know the difference and I'll also say that in the context of the conversation being had here it's a distinction without a difference.

Btw, here's another distinction without a difference: this is actually a DHS directive, not an executive order.

Well you found one source of one guy that says it is not an executive order. I have looked at the story in about a dozen prominent newspapers and websites such as CNN and the comments of Senators and Congressmen, all who are probably lawyers, who say it is an executive order. Even Marcos Rubio, who has been a supporter of a good "Dream Act" opposes this on the grounds that it should not be done piecemeal and it will make it tougher to arrive at a workable immigration policy that gives some people a break.

800,000 people now eligible to file for work permits? I can guarantee there will be double that amount because how many folks do you think will now claim they came here as kids? And that they have been here five years? Who do you think will not say that? And what kid can prove what year he arrived in the country?

Again it isn't that it is a horrendous idea. But the way it has been done is unprecedented, dangerous, and should not stand.

 

[EriktheRed]

Short answer for ignorants with no facts: "he isn't". Long answer with FACTS:

You mean other than the fact that he has flat out said on camera "the way you do that is SPREAD THE WEALTH"? *Do you even know what Marxism is? *I highly doubt it. *But in a nut shell, it can be summed up by Karl Marx's own statement "from each according to his ability, to each according to his need". *So if you believe we should spread the wealth from those who do to those who do nothing, then you are a Marxist.

Furthermore, his entire life he has surrounded himself with NOTHING but Socialists/Marxists/Communists. *Consider these facts:

**President Obama Communist connections go back through his whole life. Obama's mother, Ann Dunham (born 12/29/1949 died 11/7/1995) was a communist sympathizer and his father, Barack Hussein Obama, Senior (born 1936 died 11/24/1982), (who he only met twice) was an anticolonialist Marxist.

**Black communist poet Frank Marshal Davis (born 1905) was a life long mentor to Barack Hussein Obama was a member of the communist Party's Dorie Miller Club (Chicago-card number 47544) along with involvement in communist front organizations like the National Negro Congress, the League of American Writers, the National Federation for Constitutional Liberties and the Civil Rights Congress. There are some 600 pages in the Frank Davis FBI file including the fact he was still listed in 1973 as an endorser of a major American Communist Party front organization, American Committee for Protection of Foreign Born.

* Obama hired Van Jones to work in the White House. *Van Jones is a SELF-PROFESSED Communist/Marxist.

* The Communist Party USA organization officially endorsed Barack Hussein Obama for President (enough said there).

* "The left can and should advance its own views and disagree with the Obama administration without being disagreeable. Its tone should be respectful. We are speaking to a friend.”–Sam Webb, National Chair Communist Party USA

And this is but an extremely small sample of the overwhelming facts that illustrate he is a dirt bag Marxist. *You have to be a fool of EPIC proportions if you think Obama is "capping" the tax rate at 39% because he wants to. *He's doing it because he has no choice right now. *He knows he can't get re-elected if he comes out and admits what he is and that he wants to tax at a 90% rate so he can redistribute wealth.

Game. Set. Match.

Nah, just in paranoid wingnut wannabe-cold-warrior fantasies.

Everything listed there is FACT - which is why you had NO response other than a juvenile comment. Typical liberal wingnut ignoring reality for fantasy...

Ok, then. Go fight that good fight to show the rest of voting public the Prez has The Red Book on his nightstand. In the meantime I'll just stay in the real world and laugh.

 

[Flopper]

Obama is a modern day Benedict Arnold!

He's not showing his hand until after the election. If he is reelected, his abuses against the Constitution will escalate.

Translation: If he's reelected he'll continue to pursue policies people like me won't like.


Oh, the horror....

Actually, there're the policies that most Americans support. The public supports Obama's policy as they did the Dream Act. They do not support deportation as a solution to the problem.

The real solution to the problem lies in a reasonable immigration policy with respect to Mexico. Unless you are a wealthy Mexican, who isn't interested in leaving Mexico, it is almost impossible to enter the US on a visa. It can take 10 years and more money than many can afford to enter the US in order to seek citizenship. Mexico has even been excluded from the immigration lottery.

Spending billions of dollars building walls around the country and crazy ideas of deporting 15 million people is not going to solve the problem. Realistic immigration policy, good border security, and a sensible plan for dealing with undocumented immigrants will.

 

[P@triot]

I've already said I didn't like President Bush's immigration policy. I didn't like Carter, Reagan, or Clinton's immigration policies either and they were all equally ineffective in stopping the flood of illegals across our border.

But now if you really REALLY focus, I think you might be able to understand that a President's views of immigration are NOT what this thread is about. I know that is hard for an Obama supporter to do, but I have faith in you that you are capable of getting it, Olivia. This is NOT about anybody's views on immigration or which President did more or less or enough to enforce immigration laws.

This is about a President who uses an executive order to set aside a law that our duly elected representatives have passed on our behalf. This is about a President who not only sets it aside but uses an Executive Order to make a brand new law.

President Obama has done that.

President Bush did not.

President Bush's Signing Statements

That is a list of the bills that Congress passed and President Bush signed into law which is a Constitutional function of the Presidency. You do know the difference between that and an Executive Order? Please tell me that you do.

Are you kidding Fox? The idiot liberal has never even read the US Constitution, and you're going to expect them to understand laws and how the government works? That's like expecting a raccoon to work as a NASA engineer.

You have to realize you are dealing with people who are not terribly bright. First, they refuse to acknowledge reality, so facts mean nothing to them. Seconds, they've been brainwashed since birth to believe Socialism/Marxism/Communism leads to utopia. Third, they don't accept the law. They believe it is perfectly acceptable to violate anything so long as it is a step towards Socialism/Marxism/Communism.

 

[P@triot]

Would somebody give Conservaderp a lollipop or something to occupy him so the grown ups can have a discussion here?

Fuck lollipops. I want some cocaineeeeee!

Not really.

I just enjoy bugging the fuck out of you because you make shit up.

Have you said Classical Liberal in this thread yet?

Shocking - idiot liberal asking for cocaine. Is it any wonder that side is destroying America?

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Ha ha ha.

Someone missed the train to Joke Town, and got on the Fucktard Express instead.

HI-OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

 

[CaféAuLait]

CNN: 20% of school's graduates are illegal

(CNN) -- In a scene unfolding in many Latino communities throughout the country, the graduation ceremony at Garcia High School in Chicago was especially celebratory Saturday: 20% of the graduating seniors are illegal immigrants who can now put their education to use with work permits authorized by President Obama's new immigration rules.

"What the president did this week was an amazing gift to me and other students who are undocumented," graduating senior Andrea Labra, 18, told CNN.

"It's just an emotional thing to have the same opportunities that other students have and that we didn't have just because we didn't have papers," added Labra, who was born in Mexico and came to the United States at age 5 with her family.

For iIllegal immigrant graduates, a 'leap of faith has been answered,' educator says - CNN.com

 

[Annie]

CNN: 20% of school's graduates are illegal

(CNN) -- In a scene unfolding in many Latino communities throughout the country, the graduation ceremony at Garcia High School in Chicago was especially celebratory Saturday: 20% of the graduating seniors are illegal immigrants who can now put their education to use with work permits authorized by President Obama's new immigration rules.

"What the president did this week was an amazing gift to me and other students who are undocumented," graduating senior Andrea Labra, 18, told CNN.

"It's just an emotional thing to have the same opportunities that other students have and that we didn't have just because we didn't have papers," added Labra, who was born in Mexico and came to the United States at age 5 with her family.

For iIllegal immigrant graduates, a 'leap of faith has been answered,' educator says - CNN.com

My heart rejoices in their hope, but also weeps at may well be false promises. It's the kids that are harmed, on that I agree with Obama. My problem is that documented American high school grads, yes even those graduating with honors, have faced summers of no jobs, will face the same in college summers too.

Meanwhile down in Mexico or China, their top tier students haven't a problem in getting the costs for college paid for. Not at all.

 

[gallantwarrior]

Why don't they just charge him with a host of criminal charges? He has violated the US Constitution on multiple occassions (a Constitution which he took an oath to uphold). He has broken the law numerous times - why don't we just charge him and remove him from office? I suppose the thought of drunk Joe Biden running the country scares everyone too much to actually stop Barack Hussein from breaking the law.

Because there is only six month's left in this term and less than that until we have the next Presidential election. Barack Hussein Obama controls the White House, the Senate, and largely controls the media and therefore largely controls the message for anybody who doesn't do their own research and analysis which is most Americans. The Republicans will be made out to be the worst kind of ideologues and political opportunists, witch hunters, and all that all the way to the election and there is no way they would be able to make their case and show people the truth within that time frame.

And Fearless Leader knows it which is why he is waiting until now to make moves like this.

If nothing else should persuade us to look to the track record and character of the person we are electing to high office, this should be a really good lesson. Alas, it likely won't be.

When I see the hate Obama crowd resort to paranoia such as this I know they don't have anything (sound familiar?).

Here's a better answer: He hasn't done anything more than be the President and that's not enough to charge him with anything, no matter how much the people who stick pins in dolls of him would like to believe otherwise.

He hasn't actually been a president, mostly being "present".