Obama Is Ruining America - Really? Tell Us Exactly HOW He Is Doing That

[FA_Q2]

Really? From you who has no point whatsoever? Don’t be a troll…

I read your whole post.

And the "reality" of what's going on is that you have people with some very real greivances with no recourse or way to address them.

While I agree that violent acts like terrorism should never, ever be tolerated, I also think that if you deny an avenue of assuaging percieved injustices..that's exactly what you are going to get.

And not following our own protocols while calling others "evil" makes us look hypocritical at best.

You people? What is that supposed to mean? Really, who are you lumping me with?
I do not support any of the military actions we are now embroiled in except the first, Afghanistan, the only one that I feel we had a true right to perpetuate. I do not support water boarding though it is for other reasons. Who am I like on this board….

Aside from that, I am not talking about just the violent acts of terrorism. Limbs lost from .50 cal weapons are not from terrorists, they are from US forces. I am not saying that we are perpetuating these horrors without cause though. What I am saying is that the outrage against water boarding three of the worst type of slime in history is such an insignificant point compared to the REAL atrocities that make war. THAT is where the real points should be made. That is where the real focus should be and that is what we, as a people and as a nation, need to understand that we are accepting each and every time we decide to go to war. You are missing the entire point that I made.

Also, what are you referring to with “an avenue of assuaging perceived injustices.” That has absolutely nothing to do with water boarding in anyone’s mind. It is not a matter of revenge; it is a matter of getting intel. If there is no intel to be had then no one whatsoever would be for it. All right, no one is extreme, there are some totalitarians here but no one that actually thinks would support that.

 

[FA_Q2]

The financial and banking industries took huge risks and lost. That's what happened. And they had no liquidity to manage those losses..so they turned to the public sector for help. And they got it. It wasn't small help either..and the right is constantly bitching about the cost.

This is why so many of us are against the bailouts in the first place. In one breath you are berating the companies for seeking public help and praising Obama for giving it to them! Pick one or you are being a hack. Those companies should not have received help in the first place.

 

[Sallow]

obama is scaring people. It may be real or not, but he causes uncertainty in the public-sector.

Uncertainty is a very real thing and a driving force in business. Nobody wants to risk losing millions when it appears obama is about to slam them with massive taxes and mandates that are too expensive for them to afford.

Texas has the most job increases in the country, 33% of the new jobs and what is funny obama likes to crow about being the cause. In fact, low taxes and fewer state regulations is the cause.

On the other hand high taxes and massive regulations are destroying the job market in californian and new york. A friend of mine lives on long island. He was laid off a few weeks ago. Now he has to live off of unemployment. Jobs are leaving in droves because of obama and governments similar to his.

It's as simple as that.

that's ridiculous.

What's happening now is that corporations got 3/4 of the banana and they want the other quarter plus another banana.

The financial and banking industries took huge risks and lost. That's what happened. And they had no liquidity to manage those losses..so they turned to the public sector for help. And they got it. It wasn't small help either..and the right is constantly bitching about the cost.

It's absurd no one went to jail over this (well unless you count madoff but his scheme was so crude there was little anyone could do to save him) and worse still the very same people are holding the economy hostage because they don't want the goverment to up the amount of liquidity they must hold from 7% to 10%. Fucking jim dimon, who's company got one of the sweetest deals from the public sector, had the fucking stones to brow beat bernanke about this. Fuck him.

It's really time to push back. President obama has the power of the purse on this. Dimon doesn't like regulation? Bang. Move government employee funds out of morgan. Companies want to offshore labor. Boom. Government can play the same game and offshore contracts to foreign companies, provided they build factories domestically. He hasn't done any of that. And what the right wing is offering is the other 1 1/4 banana to the private sector.

Quite a pickle.

so republicans are responsible for sending jobs overseas?

Obama is responsible for sending trillions of dollars overseas.

Most of the qe2 and tarp went to bailing out european banks.

yes! Absolutely! Where the heck have you been???

 

[Sallow]

The financial and banking industries took huge risks and lost. That's what happened. And they had no liquidity to manage those losses..so they turned to the public sector for help. And they got it. It wasn't small help either..and the right is constantly bitching about the cost.

This is why so many of us are against the bailouts in the first place. In one breath you are berating the companies for seeking public help and praising Obama for giving it to them! Pick one or you are being a hack. Those companies should not have received help in the first place.

The bailouts were necessary. But they came with no strings attached. That's my main objection to them.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

You have it on authority that the water boarding our soldiers experience in training is the same as the water boarding that would be administered to them by the enemy if captured or, for that matter, the same as the water boarding we practice on "enemy combatants"?

What do you think water boarding is? Seriously - tell me what you think happens, step by step, in a water boarding session.

I grow infinitely tired of the torture crap argument that is brought up again and again. We are both against water boarding but for completely different reasons. It seems that you are forgetting what this is and what we are dealing with. Framing this in a context of the horrible things that we are doing to the terrorists or how altruistic we should be to not condone those actions is utter nonsense. Get this through your head: war is hell. Water boarding is the ABSOLUTE LEAST of the crimes against humanity that occurs during wartime. You focus the entire debate on THREE worthless individuals that rival Hitler in the evil that spews from their efforts getting water boarded when there are FAR worse things occurring every moment of every war. You think that water boarding is worse than having ball bearings shot through your body until you bleed to death in the cab of a Humvee? How about burning to death? Maybe bleeding out after one of our .50 cal rounds passes NEAR your leg and abruptly removes it? Those are all kosher and ‘right’ because they follow some sort of gentleman’s rules in war while water boarding is the ultimate evil. That must be stopped but blowing off limbs, bombing people and 250mm rounds from the AC-130 are all perfectly OK.

War is ugly, PERIOD. There are terrible things that happen in war and hiding behind the supposed horror of water boarding is asinine. There is nothing terrible about that compared to the horrors that occur on a constant basis day in and day out in war. My only wish is that the American people actually see and understand the TRUE horrors that occur before pushing their blind support behind such heinous acts. War is a necessity that should only be called upon in the MOST DIRE of circumstances. The people use it as a righteous club and hide from the reality by acting aghast at something like water boarding when there is so much more and so much worse going on that they refuse to see. YOU are doing that exact same exercise. You are doing the true horrors a disservice when we argue about the idiotic use of water boarding.

Don’t even get started about war crime trials either. Those are a farce and pointless retribution for the victors. Were that not the case and war crimes were a reality then there would be hell to pay for what we did during the Vietnam War. We did things in that conflict that make all the acts of this war look like child’s play.

I disagree with water boarding for another reason altogether. It is ineffective. Period. That is where the debate should begin and that is where it should end. The one thing that we did learn from Bush’s idiotic policy toward the prisoners is that water boarding is useless in gathering accurate data. Had it been useful then there would be ample evidence provided by that administration to vindicate themselves.

Bullshit. We are a nation of laws. Our law prohibits the use of torture. Once we no longer follow laws..we become something else.

And that is unacceptable.

Waterboarding was not illegal when Bush was President. Not sure it is even now. Did Obama get a law passed? We use waterboarding in training on our own troops.

 

[FA_Q2]

The financial and banking industries took huge risks and lost. That's what happened. And they had no liquidity to manage those losses..so they turned to the public sector for help. And they got it. It wasn't small help either..and the right is constantly bitching about the cost.

This is why so many of us are against the bailouts in the first place. In one breath you are berating the companies for seeking public help and praising Obama for giving it to them! Pick one or you are being a hack. Those companies should not have received help in the first place.

The bailouts were necessary. But they came with no strings attached. That's my main objection to them.

I have always said, and stand by it, that the ONLY people that should have received any bailout were people that were somehow deceived or defrauded. No company whatsoever under any circumstance should EVER receive government cheese. It is the ultimate corruption and the absolute destroyer of competition. The one thing it does is create LARGER more INFLUENTIAL and CORRUPT businesses. The great equalizer in competition between the small fry and the large business is speed of adaptability and cost of bureaucracy, both of which are negated by the existence of bailouts. Tell me, the next time that a bailout is necessary, and there WILL be a next time, how are we to deal with the fact that every one of the takers and leeches of that ideal has INCREASED in size. The problem will only grow until we stand up and let them fail.

 

[Skynet]

The financial and banking industries took huge risks and lost. That's what happened. And they had no liquidity to manage those losses..so they turned to the public sector for help. And they got it. It wasn't small help either..and the right is constantly bitching about the cost.

This is why so many of us are against the bailouts in the first place. In one breath you are berating the companies for seeking public help and praising Obama for giving it to them! Pick one or you are being a hack. Those companies should not have received help in the first place.

just about every economist agreed that the stimulus and bailout was necessary to help stop the skid. even McCain's old campaign manager has publicly stated that McCain would have done something similar to get the economy started and mitigate the losses. This issue that I have when people say they were against the stimulus and bailout, is they fail to take into account what basically all economists believe would have happened and that would have been 12-14% unemployment and a possible depression. So, lets say Obama had rejected the bailouts and stimulus, and unemployment would have risen to 12-14%, would you be on the otherside of the argument calling for a bailout and stimulus? if Gm and Chrysler had failed and as predicted 1 millions jobs were lost between those 2 companies, would you have said they deserved help?

 

[mudwhistle]

that's ridiculous.

What's happening now is that corporations got 3/4 of the banana and they want the other quarter plus another banana.

The financial and banking industries took huge risks and lost. That's what happened. And they had no liquidity to manage those losses..so they turned to the public sector for help. And they got it. It wasn't small help either..and the right is constantly bitching about the cost.

It's absurd no one went to jail over this (well unless you count madoff but his scheme was so crude there was little anyone could do to save him) and worse still the very same people are holding the economy hostage because they don't want the goverment to up the amount of liquidity they must hold from 7% to 10%. Fucking jim dimon, who's company got one of the sweetest deals from the public sector, had the fucking stones to brow beat bernanke about this. Fuck him.

It's really time to push back. President obama has the power of the purse on this. Dimon doesn't like regulation? Bang. Move government employee funds out of morgan. Companies want to offshore labor. Boom. Government can play the same game and offshore contracts to foreign companies, provided they build factories domestically. He hasn't done any of that. And what the right wing is offering is the other 1 1/4 banana to the private sector.

Quite a pickle.

so republicans are responsible for sending jobs overseas?

Obama is responsible for sending trillions of dollars overseas.

Most of the qe2 and tarp went to bailing out european banks.

yes! Absolutely! Where the heck have you been???

Paying attention. More so than you I might add. You've been buying the left's populist drivel and not looking at what's really going on. Ask a business owner what makes his job tougher. What drains away his profits? Evil profits according to Democrats.

Higher wages and higher state and local taxes are the cause.

Unions are responsible for some of it due to collective-bargaining agreements on retirement packages and health insurance, not to mention Workman's Compensation requirements mandated by Washington.

 

[Skynet]

so republicans are responsible for sending jobs overseas?

Obama is responsible for sending trillions of dollars overseas.

Most of the qe2 and tarp went to bailing out european banks.

yes! Absolutely! Where the heck have you been???

Paying attention. More so than you I might add. You've been buying the left's populist drivel and not looking at what's really going on. Ask a business owner what makes his job tougher. What drains away his profits? Evil profits according to Democrats.

Higher wages and higher state and local taxes are the cause.

Unions are responsible for some of it due to collective-bargaining agreements on retirement packages and health insurance, not to mention Workman's Compensation requirements mandated by Washington.

so what you just said is that because american workers make higher wages business owners turn to cheap labor over seas, so in essence americans should demand lower wages cause then we'll have more jobs..

tax rates are at the lowest level in 60 years, so im definitely sure those super high tax rates are just killing jobs

we are not over taxed compared to the rest of the world:

12 Countries With The Highest & Lowest Tax Rates | Business Pundit
Corporate Tax Revenues Nearing Historic Lows As A Percentage Of GDP, Report Says

 

[mudwhistle]

yes! Absolutely! Where the heck have you been???

Paying attention. More so than you I might add. You've been buying the left's populist drivel and not looking at what's really going on. Ask a business owner what makes his job tougher. What drains away his profits? Evil profits according to Democrats.

Higher wages and higher state and local taxes are the cause.

Unions are responsible for some of it due to collective-bargaining agreements on retirement packages and health insurance, not to mention Workman's Compensation requirements mandated by Washington.

so what you just said is that because american workers make higher wages business owners turn to cheap labor over seas, so in essence americans should demand lower wages cause then we'll have more jobs..

tax rates are at the lowest level in 60 years, so im definitely sure those super high tax rates are just killing jobs

we are not over taxed compared to the rest of the world:

12 Countries With The Highest & Lowest Tax Rates | Business Pundit
Corporate Tax Revenues Nearing Historic Lows As A Percentage Of GDP, Report Says

If youi want to be retarded that's what it sounds like.

Problem is we not only have a high standard of living but everything is becoming more and more expensive.

So companies that can afford to move do.

I'm sure 4 more years of Obama will lower our standard of living.

Not sure that will bring any jobs back because cost to run a business will continue to go up thanks to green energy requirements.

 

[Skynet]

Paying attention. More so than you I might add. You've been buying the left's populist drivel and not looking at what's really going on. Ask a business owner what makes his job tougher. What drains away his profits? Evil profits according to Democrats.

Higher wages and higher state and local taxes are the cause.

Unions are responsible for some of it due to collective-bargaining agreements on retirement packages and health insurance, not to mention Workman's Compensation requirements mandated by Washington.

so what you just said is that because american workers make higher wages business owners turn to cheap labor over seas, so in essence americans should demand lower wages cause then we'll have more jobs..

tax rates are at the lowest level in 60 years, so im definitely sure those super high tax rates are just killing jobs

we are not over taxed compared to the rest of the world:

12 Countries With The Highest & Lowest Tax Rates | Business Pundit
Corporate Tax Revenues Nearing Historic Lows As A Percentage Of GDP, Report Says

If youi want to be retarded that's what it sounds like.

Problem is we not only have a high standard of living but everything is becoming more and more expensive.

So companies that can afford to move do.

I'm sure 4 more years of Obama will lower our standard of living.

Not sure that will bring any jobs back because cost to run a business will continue to go up thanks to green energy requirements.

so again, what you are proposing that we pay the american workers less so that companies can continue their large profits....

so if were working in say manufacturing and was making $20 an hour, but a worker in say India or China makes $5 an hour, i should accept that fact that i will have to make it on 1/4th the wage because the company I work for wants to maximize profits?

 

[Sallow]

so republicans are responsible for sending jobs overseas?

Obama is responsible for sending trillions of dollars overseas.

Most of the qe2 and tarp went to bailing out european banks.

yes! Absolutely! Where the heck have you been???

Paying attention. More so than you I might add. You've been buying the left's populist drivel and not looking at what's really going on. Ask a business owner what makes his job tougher. What drains away his profits? Evil profits according to Democrats.

Higher wages and higher state and local taxes are the cause.

Unions are responsible for some of it due to collective-bargaining agreements on retirement packages and health insurance, not to mention Workman's Compensation requirements mandated by Washington.

You could be right..higher executive compensation and higher taxes on everyone else might be the culprit.

 

[Sallow]

so what you just said is that because american workers make higher wages business owners turn to cheap labor over seas, so in essence americans should demand lower wages cause then we'll have more jobs..

tax rates are at the lowest level in 60 years, so im definitely sure those super high tax rates are just killing jobs

we are not over taxed compared to the rest of the world:

12 Countries With The Highest & Lowest Tax Rates | Business Pundit
Corporate Tax Revenues Nearing Historic Lows As A Percentage Of GDP, Report Says

If youi want to be retarded that's what it sounds like.

Problem is we not only have a high standard of living but everything is becoming more and more expensive.

So companies that can afford to move do.

I'm sure 4 more years of Obama will lower our standard of living.

Not sure that will bring any jobs back because cost to run a business will continue to go up thanks to green energy requirements.

so again, what you are proposing that we pay the american workers less so that companies can continue their large profits....

so if were working in say manufacturing and was making $20 an hour, but a worker in say India or China makes $5 an hour, i should accept that fact that i will have to make it on 1/4th the wage because the company I work for wants to maximize profits?

Why of course he is.

The fact there are 2 men in the country with a combined wealth of over 80 billion dollars is no problem at all.

The rest of us should live like serfs.

See? Problem solved.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

so what you just said is that because american workers make higher wages business owners turn to cheap labor over seas, so in essence americans should demand lower wages cause then we'll have more jobs..

tax rates are at the lowest level in 60 years, so im definitely sure those super high tax rates are just killing jobs

we are not over taxed compared to the rest of the world:

12 Countries With The Highest & Lowest Tax Rates | Business Pundit
Corporate Tax Revenues Nearing Historic Lows As A Percentage Of GDP, Report Says

If youi want to be retarded that's what it sounds like.

Problem is we not only have a high standard of living but everything is becoming more and more expensive.

So companies that can afford to move do.

I'm sure 4 more years of Obama will lower our standard of living.

Not sure that will bring any jobs back because cost to run a business will continue to go up thanks to green energy requirements.

so again, what you are proposing that we pay the american workers less so that companies can continue their large profits....

so if were working in say manufacturing and was making $20 an hour, but a worker in say India or China makes $5 an hour, i should accept that fact that i will have to make it on 1/4th the wage because the company I work for wants to maximize profits?

Here's an idea... try a new area of work if all your worth is $5/hour.

 

[Skynet]

If youi want to be retarded that's what it sounds like.

Problem is we not only have a high standard of living but everything is becoming more and more expensive.

So companies that can afford to move do.

I'm sure 4 more years of Obama will lower our standard of living.

Not sure that will bring any jobs back because cost to run a business will continue to go up thanks to green energy requirements.

so again, what you are proposing that we pay the american workers less so that companies can continue their large profits....

so if were working in say manufacturing and was making $20 an hour, but a worker in say India or China makes $5 an hour, i should accept that fact that i will have to make it on 1/4th the wage because the company I work for wants to maximize profits?

Here's an idea... try a new area of work if all your worth is $5/hour.

it was an example of outsourcing. the same thing happens with IT. or maybe you dont understand how the global economy works.

Where does Apple make all of its technology? China
HP? China
Textiles? China
IT? India

and why do they do this? Cheap Labor.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

so again, what you are proposing that we pay the american workers less so that companies can continue their large profits....

so if were working in say manufacturing and was making $20 an hour, but a worker in say India or China makes $5 an hour, i should accept that fact that i will have to make it on 1/4th the wage because the company I work for wants to maximize profits?

Here's an idea... try a new area of work if all your worth is $5/hour.

it was an example of outsourcing. the same thing happens with IT. or maybe you dont understand how the global economy works.

Where does Apple make all of its technology? China
HP? China
Textiles? China
IT? India

and why do they do this? Cheap Labor.

I'm well aware, I'm a Microsoft Partner. More often t han not when I call MS for something like SQL support, I get some guy named "Jim" who has a thick Indian accent.

 

[Skynet]

Here's an idea... try a new area of work if all your worth is $5/hour.

it was an example of outsourcing. the same thing happens with IT. or maybe you dont understand how the global economy works.

Where does Apple make all of its technology? China
HP? China
Textiles? China
IT? India

and why do they do this? Cheap Labor.

I'm well aware, I'm a Microsoft Partner. More often t han not when I call MS for something like SQL support, I get some guy named "Jim" who has a thick Indian accent.

so what is your solution to solve outsourcing beside "lowering corporate taxes"?

 

[FA_Q2]

so what you just said is that because american workers make higher wages business owners turn to cheap labor over seas, so in essence americans should demand lower wages cause then we'll have more jobs..

tax rates are at the lowest level in 60 years, so im definitely sure those super high tax rates are just killing jobs

we are not over taxed compared to the rest of the world:

12 Countries With The Highest & Lowest Tax Rates | Business Pundit
Corporate Tax Revenues Nearing Historic Lows As A Percentage Of GDP, Report Says

If youi want to be retarded that's what it sounds like.

Problem is we not only have a high standard of living but everything is becoming more and more expensive.

So companies that can afford to move do.

I'm sure 4 more years of Obama will lower our standard of living.

Not sure that will bring any jobs back because cost to run a business will continue to go up thanks to green energy requirements.

so again, what you are proposing that we pay the american workers less so that companies can continue their large profits....

so if were working in say manufacturing and was making $20 an hour, but a worker in say India or China makes $5 an hour, i should accept that fact that i will have to make it on 1/4th the wage because the company I work for wants to maximize profits?

There is, of course, a better answer; basic tariffs on imports for countries that have veritable slave labor. There is the point as well that the average American worker is worth more than the slave labor of other countries as well. Much of what is outsourced is assembly line work.

 

[Skynet]

If youi want to be retarded that's what it sounds like.

Problem is we not only have a high standard of living but everything is becoming more and more expensive.

So companies that can afford to move do.

I'm sure 4 more years of Obama will lower our standard of living.

Not sure that will bring any jobs back because cost to run a business will continue to go up thanks to green energy requirements.

so again, what you are proposing that we pay the american workers less so that companies can continue their large profits....

so if were working in say manufacturing and was making $20 an hour, but a worker in say India or China makes $5 an hour, i should accept that fact that i will have to make it on 1/4th the wage because the company I work for wants to maximize profits?

There is, of course, a better answer; basic tariffs on imports for countries that have veritable slave labor. There is the point as well that the average American worker is worth more than the slave labor of other countries as well. Much of what is outsourced is assembly line work.

so raise taxes on the corporations? because its not foreign corporations that are profiting as much from the cheap labor. its american companies who are benefiting from cheap labor and outsourcing jobs.

so if you tax a good that is manufactured in China by an American company, isnt that raising the taxes on american companies, and thus one of the things Republicans refuse to do?

 

[BlindBoo]

Seriously You need links to see how Obama is ruining America???
Click on DRUDGE.com. You will find links to most major news sources...Click on any one of them. You will find a multitued of articles as to how & why Obama is ruining America. Are you new to reading the news or just haven't had a chance to catch up with what's happening in the world these days.

Do you own a home??

Yes.

Pretty excellent. It's worth about 8 times as much as it did when we bought it. Even so, how is that Obama's fault?
Well, no. I do have a job, I'm self employed. I make a decent amount of money. Also, how is this Obama's fault?
I don't drive. Also, how is this Obama's fault?
Yeah, that's not true.

I do love how now that the President is a Democrat, Conservatives have become pacifists, but according to the War Powers Act, Obama had to send a letter to Congress, and now it's on Congress to vote on it. They haven't yet...You mean the one that has more border guards, and more arrests than it did when Bush was President? Yes, I do. I bet you don't, though. Not really, no. Pretty much the same prices I've been paying for the last decade.


I think his point was no one seems to be able to explain why all of these problems are Obama's fault.

Price at your local soup kitchen has not changed much...free right?

"Wholesale prices up 1.6 pct. on steep rise in food" Link



Sounds like the house you own is in Fantasyland. Home prices have continued to fall for the third straight month.



Picking up aluminium cans on the side of the road is not really a job.

I don't drive. Also, how is this Obama's fault?

Anyone want to bet this loser lost his licence to a DUI?

Yeah, that's not true

Yes, it is true stupid

"On a recent trip to Brazil, Obama congratulated the country's president on the huge offshore oil reserves Brazil recently discovered, and assured them "when you're ready to start selling, we want to be one of your best customers." Granted, Brazil as an energy source would be preferable to many Middle Eastern countries. But make no mistake; Obama is subsidizing oil production in other countries while choking it in the U.S. because he's bowing to America's green lobby. Brazil's oil exploration was funded, in part, by U.S. taxpayer-supported loan programs".

From The Detroit News: Editorials | Bashing oil industry is counterproductive | The Detroit News

Mistakes/Lies in red

snopes.com: Obama Lends $2 Billion to Brazilian Oil Company