Obamacare just got $111 BILLION more expensive..WTF???

[SFC Ollie]

Why? It's just full of the usual right-wing conservative whining.

Hahahaha.

prove the numbers wrong then, asshat.

I'm retired military, I don't give a fuck about the cost of your healthcare.

That's alright dumb fuck, yours is going up too, depending on your rank could go as high as an additional $2500 a year in the next four years..... Plus they will continue to increase co-pays........So keep on holding your ankles your butt buddy Obama is coming to see you........

 

[SFC Ollie]

Not trolling, just laughing at your helplessness and enjoying my $460 annual family healthcare premium.

You pay a premium ?

My company pays for all mine.

You are getting ripped off !

Nah, $460 is a pittance and I like Tricare Prime.

And you are still young enough to work? Haven't you been paying attention? Obama wants you off TRICARE. Keep on believing that you will have the benefits 5 years from now, the way things are going, you won't have shit.....

 

[GoneBezerk]

That Salt Jones is a liar, he never served a day in the military.

The pathetic thing about Obamination and his kind is that he is willing to cut military medical benefits while he is pushing for free healthcare for ghetto trash that did nothing for this country but eat, sleep and shit in it until they die from drugs, a murder or a heart attack.

 

[Oldstyle]

ObamaCare is "good, cost effective health care coverage"? Sorry, Deanie...but ObamaCare is one of the worst pieces of legislation ever written and passed by our great country. It doesn't address the costs of healthcare which was what the American people WANTED and it does add another massive unfunded entitlement program at a time when we're struggling to come up with ways to pay for the ones we already have on the books.

Another opportunity to point out the uncomfortable truth:

The ACA's got some of the right's favorite cost control ideas in it, including encouraging more use of higher-deductible plans and HSAs to give consumers more "skin in the game," as well as greater competition and consumer choice through allowing insurers to sell out-of-state or in multiple states. It even lifted the tort reform language from a Republican reform bill, Mike Enzi's 2008 "Ten Steps to Transform Health Care in America Act."

Of course, it has cost control strategies liberals wanted to see like payment reform (rewarding performance, not volume) to move away from inflationary fee-for-service models, greater care coordination and attention to the costs of chronic illness, and more highly integrated care with shared savings for providers who cut costs.

It even has things both sides enjoy, like prevention and wellness incentives, movement toward using health information technology, and the creation of marketplaces where insurers will compete on price and quality. There's also the big drag on health spending, the coming end of the limitless tax subsidy that employer-sponsored insurance plans currently enjoy.

The fact remains that they didn't get it right. They have not gotten it right from the start and this is just one line item. I just can't wait for them to show us what else they didn't get right.

I'm not trying to dispel your obviously deep-seated suspicion that the world is out to fool you. I'm simply pointing out that the premise (and title) of this thread is incorrect.

And people like you are willing to turn a blind eye.

I'm watching very closely, believe me. I'm no more fond of stupid flubs than you.

So are you telling me that ObamaCare was a carefully crafted piece of legislation that addresses the cost of health care like the American people asked? Or would you admit that it was an incredibly badly written piece of legislation that doesn't solve what's wrong with our health care system?

Sorry, Greenbeard...but ObamaCare didn't address tort reform...it didn't address the spiraling costs of health care...all it did was shift who was going to pay the out of control costs.

Since anyone with eyes (and since you're watching very closely...I'm sure you know this!) is very aware...Government involvement in practically ANYTHING means that the costs go up, not down...then the long range costs of this program are going to be staggering. This first "bump" in the estimated cost is just a taste of what's in store for us down the road.

 

[paulitician]

$16 Trillion and climbing. No way any of this can be paid for. What a mess.

 

[Greenbeard]

So are you telling me that ObamaCare was a carefully crafted piece of legislation that addresses the cost of health care like the American people asked?

I'm saying it's got nearly every cost control idea that's been put forth, including those advanced by the right.

Sorry, Greenbeard...but ObamaCare didn't address tort reform...

As I said, it adopted the tort reform provisions of Mike Enzi's (the ranking member, i.e. Republican, on the Senate HELP Committee) 2008 health reform bill. It doesn't federalize tort law, it provides incentive money to states to reform their own laws. This, by the way, is an approach that's been embraced by Republican frontrunner Mitt Romney in his health platform.

it didn't address the spiraling costs of health care...all it did was shift who was going to pay the out of control costs.

I'm sure you believe that and will continue to.

 

[Neotrotsky]

$16 Trillion and climbing. No way any of this can be paid for. What a mess.

Our country faces serious issues and
the Left wants to talk about contraception and condoms

Next they will want a "Cash for Condoms" program

 

[Conservative]

I am STILL WAITING for an intelligent liberal to explain to us how an $111 BILLION increase in the cost of Obamacare is a good thing.

No takers???

 

[Zander]

 

[Listening]

I am STILL WAITING for an intelligent liberal to explain to us how an $111 BILLION increase in the cost of Obamacare is a good thing.

No takers???

Why ?

In their world:

X + 111 = X (or close).

What's to explain ?

They just use a different starting point.

 

[Oldstyle]

So are you telling me that ObamaCare was a carefully crafted piece of legislation that addresses the cost of health care like the American people asked?

I'm saying it's got nearly every cost control idea that's been put forth, including those advanced by the right.

Sorry, Greenbeard...but ObamaCare didn't address tort reform...

As I said, it adopted the tort reform provisions of Mike Enzi's (the ranking member, i.e. Republican, on the Senate HELP Committee) 2008 health reform bill. It doesn't federalize tort law, it provides incentive money to states to reform their own laws. This, by the way, is an approach that's been embraced by Republican frontrunner Mitt Romney in his health platform.

it didn't address the spiraling costs of health care...all it did was shift who was going to pay the out of control costs.

I'm sure you believe that and will continue to.

What cost control ideas does ObamaCare have in it? What tort reforms? You're kidding yourself with this stuff, Greenie...you know as well as I do that ObamaCare was never about lowering the cost of health care. It was passed because the progressives couldn't get the Blue Dog Democrats to vote for a single payer plan and this mess was the best that they could salvage out of a rapidly deteriorating situation. "What" was passed was an awful piece of legislation because Scott Brown had won Teddy Kennedy's old Senate seat and Barry, Harry and Nancy couldn't send the bill back to be rewritten and improved because they knew it wouldn't pass. Those three thumbed their noses at the American people and voted ObamaCare through despite it's myriad flaws because they saw it as a first step towards what they wanted and couldn't get.

 

[Neotrotsky]

Indeed

Papa Obama Care is so bad the left runs from it
Papa Obama does not even talk about it, now
and

When the Left does, they try to drag Republicans
into it to diffuse the blame from themselves

Sad
must be why the Left wants to run on condoms now

 

[Greenbeard]

What cost control ideas does ObamaCare have in it? What tort reforms?

Doesn't anyone read the posts they've already responded to? It's just rude at this point.

 

[code1211]

hmmm faux news.....

seems legit

Hmmm...

Maybe you need to find a source that disproves it.

 

[code1211]

1.Obamacare will collect more than $500 billion in new taxes and take $575 billion from Medicare over the next ten years.
a. Two new entitlements, plus a big Medicaid expansion, are created to reduce the number of uninsured, at a cost of at least $2.3 trillion- that’s TRILLION- over the first ten years of full implementation.
2. With each passing year new taxes will be imposed. As disclosed on the attached chart from the
California Hospital Association:
• 2011: A 2.5% excise tax is imposed on pharmaceuticals. (This is part of the plan to pay for the
reform law.) This cost – which will be in the billions of dollars - will be passed on to health care
providers, primarily hospitals, who already operate with very thin margins, and will be under
great financial pressure to raise their rates to pay for it, with resulting price pressure on health
insurance premiums.
• 2012: That excise tax increases to 3%.
• 2013: A separate 2.9% excise tax on medical devices will begin. The same pass-through will take
place, creating the same pressures on providers and on insurance premiums.
• 2014: An $8 billion fee on health insurance premiums kicks in. Obviously consumers will bear
this tax and their premiums will rise.
Because of all these costs, Obamacare is generally unsustainable. Here is one study that addresses that
issue:
Obamacare: The Real Price Tag is a Moving Target

1/a.) You are being dishonest you only include spednign cuts and tax increase for the first 10 years of partial implementation but then you use the ten years of full implementation to gauge the costs. When you actually look at the total data Obamacare cuts the deficit and reduce total spending.
2) The tax on pharmaceuticals is a surtax that taxes companies a certain percent based on how much money they waste, meaning the tax provides pharm companies to better manage their funds

Link, please.

 

[Syphon]

hmmm faux news.....

seems legit

Hmmm...

Maybe you need to find a source that disproves it.

heres 2 separate links talking about cost controls. one from the washington post, and within the WP article is links to a kaiser page which breaks down the cost controls further.

The Affordable Care Act holds Medicare’s cost growth to GDP plus one percentage point, which makes a lot more sense.

The law develops Accountable Care Organizations, in which Medicare pays one provider to coordinate all of your care successfully, rather than paying many doctors and providers to add to your care no matter the cost or outcome, as is the current practice.

The law also goes after bad and wasted care: It cuts payments to hospitals with high rates of re-admission, as that tends to signal care isn’t being delivered well, or isn’t being follow up on effectively. It cuts payments to hospitals for care related to infections caught in the hospitals. It develops new plans to help Medicare base its purchasing decisions on value, and new programs to help Medicaid move patients with chronic illnesses into systems that rely on the sort of maintenance-based care that’s been shown to successfully lower costs and improve outcomes.

The Democrats have a plan for controlling health-care costs. Paul Ryan doesn’t. - The Washington Post

cOst cOntaInMent
administrative simplification
• Simplify health insurance administration by adopting a single set of operating rules for eligibility verification and claims status (rules adopted July 1, 2011; effective January 1, 2013), electronic funds transfers and health care payment and remittance (rules adopted July 1, 2012; effective January 1, 2014), and health claims or equivalent encounter information, enrollment and disenrollment in a health plan, health plan premium payments, and referral certification and authorization (rules adopted July 1, 2014; effective January 1, 2016). Health plans must document compliance with these standards or face a penalty of no more than $1 per covered life. (Effective April 1, 2014)
Medicare
• Restructure payments to Medicare Advantage (MA) plans by setting payments to different percentages of Medicare fee-for-service (FFS) rates, with higher payments for areas with low FFS rates and lower payments (95% of FFS) for areas with high FFS rates. Phase-in revised payments over 3 years beginning in 2011, for plans in most areas, with payments phased-in over longer periods (4 years and 6 years) for plans in other areas. Provide bonuses to plans receiving 4 or more stars, based on the current 5-star quality rating system for Medicare Advantage plans, beginning in 2012; qualifying plans in qualifying areas receive double bonuses. Modify rebate system with rebates allocated based on a plan’s quality rating. Phase-in adjustments to plan payments for coding practices related to the health status of enrollees, with adjustments equaling 5.7% by 2019. Cap total payments, including bonuses, at current payment levels. Require Medicare Advantage plans to remit partial payments to the Secretary if the plan has a medical loss ratio of less than 85%, beginning 2014. Require the Secretary to suspend plan enrollment for 3 years if the medical loss ratio is less than 85% for 2 consecutive years and to terminate the plan contract if the medical loss ratio is less than 85% for 5 consecutive years.
• Reduce annual market basket updates for inpatient hospital, home health, skilled nursing facility, hospice and other Medicare providers, and adjust for productivity. (Effective dates vary)
• Freeze the threshold for income-related Medicare Part B premiums for 2011 through 2019, and reduce the Medicare Part D premium subsidy for those with incomes above $85,000/individual and $170,000/ couple. (Effective January 1, 2011)
• Establish an Independent Payment Advisory Board comprised of 15 members to submit legislative proposals containing recommendations to reduce the per capita rate of growth in Medicare spending if spending exceeds a target growth rate. Beginning April 2013, require the Chief Actuary of CMS to project whether Medicare per capita spending exceeds the average of CPI-U and CPI-M, based on a five year period ending that year. If so, beginning January 15, 2014, the Board will submit recommendations to achieve reductions in Medicare spending. Beginning January 2018, the target is modified such that the board submits recommendations if Medicare per capita spending exceeds GDP per capita plus one percent. The Board will submit proposals to the President and Congress for immediate consideration. The Board is prohibited from submitting proposals that would ration care, increase revenues or change benefits, eligibility or Medicare beneficiary cost sharing (including Parts A and B premiums), or would result in a change in the beneficiary premium percentage or low-income subsidies under Part D. Hospitals and hospices (through 2019) and clinical labs (for one year) will not be subject to cost reductions proposed by the Board. The Board must also submit recommendations every other year to slow the growth in national health expenditures while preserving quality of care by January 1, 2015.
• Reduce Medicare Disproportionate Share Hospital (DSH) payments initially by 75% and subsequently increase payments based on the percent of the population uninsured and the amount of uncompensated care provided (Effective fiscal year 2014)
• Eliminate the Medicare Improvement Fund. (Effective upon enactment) • Allow providers organized as accountable care organizations (ACOs) that voluntarily meet quality
thresholds to share in the cost savings they achieve for the Medicare program. To qualify as an ACO, organizations must agree to be accountable for the overall care of their Medicare beneficiaries, have adequate participation of primary care physicians, define processes to promote evidence-based medicine, report on quality and costs, and coordinate care. (Shared savings program established January 1, 2012)
• Create an Innovation Center within the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services to test, evaluate, and expand in Medicare, Medicaid, and CHIP different payment structures and methodologies to reduce program expenditures while maintaining or improving quality of care. Payment reform models that improve quality and reduce the rate of cost growth could be expanded throughout the Medicare, Medicaid, and CHIP programs. (Effective January 1, 2011)
• Reduce Medicare payments that would otherwise be made to hospitals by specified percentages to account for excess (preventable) hospital readmissions. (Effective October 1, 2012)
• Reduce Medicare payments to certain hospitals for hospital-acquired conditions by 1%. (Effective fiscal year 2015)
Medicaid
• Increase the Medicaid drug rebate percentage for brand name drugs to 23.1 (except the rebate for clotting factors and drugs approved exclusively for pediatric use increases to 17.1%); increase the Medicaid rebate for non-innovator, multiple source drugs to 13% of average manufacturer price. (Effective January 1, 2010) Extend the drug rebate to Medicaid managed care plans. (Effective upon enactment)
• Reduce aggregate Medicaid DSH allotments by $.5 billion in 2014, $.6 billion in 2015, $.6 billion in 2016, $1.8 billion in 2017, $5 billion in 2018, $5.6 billion in 2019, and $4 billion in 2020. Require the Secretary to develop a methodology to distribute the DSH reductions in a manner that imposes the largest reduction in DSH allotments for states with the lowest percentage of uninsured or those that do not target DSH payments, imposes smaller reductions for low-DSH states, and accounts for DSH allotments used for 1115 waivers. (Effective October 1, 2011)
• Prohibit federal payments to states for Medicaid services related to health care acquired conditions. (Effective July 1, 2011)
prescription drugs
• Authorize the Food and Drug Administration to approve generic versions of biologic drugs and grant biologics manufacturers 12 years of exclusive use before generics can be developed. (Effective upon enactment)
Waste, fraud, and abuse
• Reduce waste, fraud, and abuse in public programs by allowing provider screening, enhanced oversight periods for new providers and suppliers, including a 90-day period of enhanced oversight for initial claims of DME suppliers, and enrollment moratoria in areas identified as being at elevated risk of fraud in all public programs, and by requiring Medicare and Medicaid program providers and suppliers to establish compliance programs. Develop a database to capture and share data across federal and state programs, increase penalties for submitting false claims, strengthen standards for community mental health centers and increase funding for anti-fraud activities. (Effective dates vary)

http://www.kff.org/healthreform/upload/8061.pdf

 

[Neotrotsky]

Hey

Sure the Great Society was to end poverty
and
the Post Office
What could go wrong


If think healthcare is expensive now
wait until it is "free"


In addition to "unexpected" cost increase in the op of 111 billion....

Don't forget with Papa Obama having to cancel the Long-Term Care Program component
of PapaObama Care, it lost another 84 billion in "savings" that was suppose to come from that as well

No one is buying this "bag of goods" called PapaObama Care

Perhaps you should stick with the subjects that
you confessed to be an expert on.......

 

[Listening]

All this adds up to what happened in AZ where the Mayo dumped medicare patients.

Look up any article and you'll see them telling how much they lost on medicare.

Other clinics are keeping an eye on this.

How stupid is it to think you can supress the market value and still maintain an equilibrium supply ?

 

[Syphon]

All this adds up to what happened in AZ where the Mayo dumped medicare patients.

Look up any article and you'll see them telling how much they lost on medicare.

Other clinics are keeping an eye on this.

How stupid is it to think you can supress the market value and still maintain an equilibrium supply ?

there is no law that says doctors must accept medicare patients. it is their choice. why is that a problem?

 

[Listening]

All this adds up to what happened in AZ where the Mayo dumped medicare patients.

Look up any article and you'll see them telling how much they lost on medicare.

Other clinics are keeping an eye on this.

How stupid is it to think you can supress the market value and still maintain an equilibrium supply ?

there is no law that says doctors must accept medicare patients. it is their choice. why is that a problem?

Oh, it isn't.

What is so funny is that the Mayo is what Obama held up as his cost model.

You morons talk about old people dying in the street and you are setting them up for just that.