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I want marriage to not be a government function. So seriously, anything that is not a government function is denying people of it? They aren't married unless the government says they are? Expand your mind.
I'd like nothing better than to have heterosexuals have to jump through the legal hoops that gay couples have to in order to get a fraction of the protections and benefits that are automatically granted heterosexuals when they marry hours after meeting each other in Las Vegas, but that clearly is never going to happen. You will never get rid of "government involvement" with legal, civil marriage.
So, since your libertarian fantasy world is never going to come to pass, what compelling state reason can you provide for denying those benefits to non-familial, consenting adult gay and lesbian couples?
Do you think that could be, because even the bureaucrats know that there is nothing beneficial for "society" with "homosexual marriage"?
And your attitude reveals that you care nothing for history and lessons learned. That usually means repeating mistakes. Isn't that the definition of futility: doing the same thing and expecting different results?That attitude of yours clearly reveals you have no business teaching in schools, serving in government, or a myriad of other public activities. Shame on you!
Just show us where homosexuality "works". Where is it encouraged in families, communities, cultures, religions, countries where it is a cultural norm (not an entertainment moment)? Where can you demonstrate a trend that shows homosexuality improves the quality of life for the families involved? If it was a pillar of integrity, it would be held as a shining example for people to reach for, it has not been that, nor can it ever be that. It is based on deceit. Deceit over one's true identity and acceptence of who they are. Deceit for the families where the sexual predator stalks. Deceit for acceptance in 'straight' groups. etc, etc, etc.
Why do you say "shame on you"? This thread asked for input. When you don't like what is said, you want to bully others into silence thru name calling and humiliation. You do not present a valid argument without "re-defining" a word that has been used across the world with one meaning for thousands of years. Are you Bill Clinton: that depends on what is, is.
Most people do not have a problem with changing the legal system to accomodate a variety of "dependents". The homosexual extremists will not accept that. They want to "force" their view of the world onto every person that wants nothing to do with their way of life or the choices they have made. They say they are the same when we can take "traditionally married people" and same sex partners into a room and pull down our bottoms and physically see that it is not the same. It is not the same, physically, emotionally, or mentally. Men and women are not the SAME. We are very different with strengths and weaknesses that are pretty much typical to our sex.
If homosexuals want to "pretend" they are the same, the rest of us, do not have to play.
Homosexual unions are working now, have worked in the past, and will work in the future.
You project when you accuse others of bullying, which is what you have done from square one.
You have a right, no matter how wrong, to your view.
Your view is wrong, out of step with reality, and by all means, I encourage you to be a voice crying in the wilderness. The difference, of course, is you are not a prophet, and your words will drift away with the wind.
Well, New York has done the right thing. Which brings to mind a question.
Can any person here who is "opposed to gay marriage" come forward and justify their position on the basis of anything other than intolerance and bigotry? Seriously.
Please don't start with "the Bible does not condone same sex marriage." Perhaps it doesn't. So WHAT? Let's say the Bible contained a passage which said: "Marriage is only between a man and a woman. If thou shalt marry one of the same sex as yourself, thou shalt burn in the fiery pits of HELL!" So what? Isn't invoking the Bible just another way of shoving religion down the throats of other people? Yup. In other words, intolerance and bigotry.
No, my friends - we all know what is really involved here, don't we? I am wondering if there is anyone here who has the stones to come right out and tell it like it is: "I am opposed to same sex marriage because I hate gays everything they stand for. No other reason."
Intolerance and bigotry. There really does not seem to be any other reason.
I guess around half of all Americans (including democrats) are biggots
National (US) Poll * July 17, 2008 * American Voters Oppose Same-Se - Quinnipiac University Hamden, Connecticut
CNN poll: Generations disagree on same-sex marriage - CNN
Oh, I suspect the MAJORITY of Americans are bigots when it comes to this issue.
Thank God we live in a country whose laws and constitution protect minorities from the tyranny of the majority in matters of fundamental right.
I guess around half of all Americans (including democrats) are biggots
National (US) Poll * July 17, 2008 * American Voters Oppose Same-Se - Quinnipiac University Hamden, Connecticut
CNN poll: Generations disagree on same-sex marriage - CNN
Oh, I suspect the MAJORITY of Americans are bigots when it comes to this issue.
Thank God we live in a country whose laws and constitution protect minorities from the tyranny of the majority in matters of fundamental right.
I don't understand the sense of your use of the term bigot, here. I believe homosexuality is immoral. Does that make me a bigot, and if so, why?
I am for equal rights for gays but not Marriage. In your post you said do not quote the Bible. The problem with this as the Bible is a Christians Standard to live by. I do not ram it down ones throat but God told us to tell so we do. Now as for your question here are my personal beliefs.
1 Marriage was instituted by God with Adam and Eve. therefore not is to be followed the way he started it.
so that is why I am for a way for Gays to go to the court house and get a union paper just not Marry.
2. Will a Gay couple take a preacher to court to get him to Marry him even though it goes against his religious beliefs. note: when they passed same sex marriage in Sweden Some wanted at apart of the law to force Preachers to Marry them.
In closing : I know gays believe marriage is a secular institution. I just do not believe this.
I always thought civil unions was a good answer till I found out Gays see marriage and civil unions the same thing. I just do not see it that way. What they do behind thier closed doors is none of my business
Give them equality with Taxes, Insurance ETC. without the right to marry.
Civil unions are not equal to marriage and even if they were...we've shown that separate but equal isn't.
Marriage is the sacred union of man with a woman, no one should redefine that to mean something that it really isn't.
I guess around half of all Americans (including democrats) are biggots
National (US) Poll * July 17, 2008 * American Voters Oppose Same-Se - Quinnipiac University Hamden, Connecticut
CNN poll: Generations disagree on same-sex marriage - CNN
Oh, I suspect the MAJORITY of Americans are bigots when it comes to this issue.
Thank God we live in a country whose laws and constitution protect minorities from the tyranny of the majority in matters of fundamental right.
I don't understand the sense of your use of the term bigot, here. I believe homosexuality is immoral. Does that make me a bigot, and if so, why?
Civil unions are not equal to marriage and even if they were...we've shown that separate but equal isn't.
Marriage is the sacred union of man with a woman, no one should redefine that to mean something that it really isn't.
Sacred? Then why are people in this country allowed to marry at the courthouse with no religious ceremony at all? Why are atheists allowed to marry......AND CALL IT MARRIAGE?
Marriage is the sacred union of man with a woman, no one should redefine that to mean something that it really isn't.
Sacred? Then why are people in this country allowed to marry at the courthouse with no religious ceremony at all? Why are atheists allowed to marry......AND CALL IT MARRIAGE?
Marriage was instituted by God as a sacred union between a man and a woman.
God does not change so that is how he intends for it to be now.
How is letting a Gay couple go to the Court House and get a Civil Union paper not satisfactory to Gays. Every thing I read says they think there is no Difference.
What is going to stop some gay couple from suing a preacher to get Married in his church?
I am all for giving them equal rights but as a christian just want to see Marriage stay as God intended.
How about we call what is performed in churches Marriage and give Preachers the final say as to what he performs in church But call what is done in the court house a civil union
but they would both give the couples the same rights. In other words take Marriage out of the hands of the government. I have a family member that is Gay. What he does behind closed doors is his business. He knows my feelings and everything is fine.
Man is taking marriage from what God intended and changing it. Christians just feel
we need to speak out about this.
You know I honestly think that some married couples have never given any thought about the benefits they gain with a marriage license. And I keep thinking if I can only somehow say the words right they will see the error of their ways. Obviously I am living in a dream world.
Most married couples that I know did not consider "benefits" by the gov't for a reason to marry. They married because they found a partner that they wanted to build a family with, not scam the system. The gov't encourages people to marry/stay married because it is beneficial to society.
Apparently, those homosexual activists that believe that they marry for the "EXACT" same reason heterosexuals have a whole different set of priorities.
Most "married" couples have traditions as protections for property, dating back thousands of years. It was all very practical. The gov't chose to keep those traditions (because it used to be a gov't by the people for the people), to make the society strong (there was some learning curve in those thousands of years). Now, suddenly, homosexual activists are saying: seriously, you can take my word, everything will be good if you just listen to me. Why should thousands of years have any bearing on a discussion we are having today? After all, times change (they forget, people and their tendencies do not change).
It is the same tired argument from communists, socialists, nazis, muslims, liberals, homosexual activists: this time it will work out different. Ignore all those times it became an ugly stain in the pages of history with millions of lives taken to gain power over others. Just let me explain it one more time, what's that, no I don't have one single example of where it worked, but I know it will, just sign over your liberties to ..... Really, you are such a bigot, can't you just look at this, ideally??? What does practicality have to do with anything? What do you mean it will destroy people's lives? Just concentrate on those (few) that will gain from this, don't you think they count? Are you just selfish, that you want to consider the life your children will have to lead because of this? Look, the "smartest" people say this will work. Well, no, none of them have ever lived like this before, but it will work, trust me. etc, etc, etc.
I am only going to address the part of your comment I've bolded.
Of course you and your spouse (and most other young couples) didn't consider the benefits. Why should you have? It is so ingrained in our culture that with marriage comes benefits there would be no reason to consider it. But let me tell you, that if those benefits were taken away you would at the head of the parade leading the fight to get them back.
Everything else in your post has been addressed earlier and you are starting to repeat yourself.
Apparently, those homosexual activists that believe that they marry for the "EXACT" same reason heterosexuals have a whole different set of priorities.
And your attitude reveals that you care nothing for history and lessons learned. That usually means repeating mistakes. Isn't that the definition of futility: doing the same thing and expecting different results?
Just show us where homosexuality "works". Where is it encouraged in families, communities, cultures, religions, countries where it is a cultural norm (not an entertainment moment)? Where can you demonstrate a trend that shows homosexuality improves the quality of life for the families involved? If it was a pillar of integrity, it would be held as a shining example for people to reach for, it has not been that, nor can it ever be that. It is based on deceit. Deceit over one's true identity and acceptence of who they are. Deceit for the families where the sexual predator stalks. Deceit for acceptance in 'straight' groups. etc, etc, etc.
Why do you say "shame on you"? This thread asked for input. When you don't like what is said, you want to bully others into silence thru name calling and humiliation. You do not present a valid argument without "re-defining" a word that has been used across the world with one meaning for thousands of years. Are you Bill Clinton: that depends on what is, is.
Most people do not have a problem with changing the legal system to accomodate a variety of "dependents". The homosexual extremists will not accept that. They want to "force" their view of the world onto every person that wants nothing to do with their way of life or the choices they have made. They say they are the same when we can take "traditionally married people" and same sex partners into a room and pull down our bottoms and physically see that it is not the same. It is not the same, physically, emotionally, or mentally. Men and women are not the SAME. We are very different with strengths and weaknesses that are pretty much typical to our sex.
If homosexuals want to "pretend" they are the same, the rest of us, do not have to play.
All of which is legally and constitutionally irrelevant.
Americans are not required to demonstrate or prove that the use of their rights will or will not benefit society. That hatred and exclusion were traditionally and historically accepted by society to separate homosexuals from their civil rights is not justification that the discriminatory practices continue. No one is forcing anything on anyone, no laws are being changed. Indeed, same-sex couples are merely requesting access to the same laws other couples have access to, unchanged.
Marriage is a simple matter of handing some cash to some asshole to recieve a fucking piece of paper , and drastically reduce your capital gains taxes.Civil unions are not equal to marriage and even if they were...we've shown that separate but equal isn't.
Marriage is the sacred union of man with a woman, no one should redefine that to mean something that it really isn't.
The Bill of Rights states the rights that are given to us, by the "Creator"...
And your attitude reveals that you care nothing for history and lessons learned. That usually means repeating mistakes. Isn't that the definition of futility: doing the same thing and expecting different results?That attitude of yours clearly reveals you have no business teaching in schools, serving in government, or a myriad of other public activities. Shame on you!
Just show us where homosexuality "works". Where is it encouraged in families, communities, cultures, religions, countries where it is a cultural norm (not an entertainment moment)? Where can you demonstrate a trend that shows homosexuality improves the quality of life for the families involved? If it was a pillar of integrity, it would be held as a shining example for people to reach for, it has not been that, nor can it ever be that. It is based on deceit. Deceit over one's true identity and acceptence of who they are. Deceit for the families where the sexual predator stalks. Deceit for acceptance in 'straight' groups. etc, etc, etc.
Why do you say "shame on you"? This thread asked for input. When you don't like what is said, you want to bully others into silence thru name calling and humiliation. You do not present a valid argument without "re-defining" a word that has been used across the world with one meaning for thousands of years. Are you Bill Clinton: that depends on what is, is.
Most people do not have a problem with changing the legal system to accomodate a variety of "dependents". The homosexual extremists will not accept that. They want to "force" their view of the world onto every person that wants nothing to do with their way of life or the choices they have made. They say they are the same when we can take "traditionally married people" and same sex partners into a room and pull down our bottoms and physically see that it is not the same. It is not the same, physically, emotionally, or mentally. Men and women are not the SAME. We are very different with strengths and weaknesses that are pretty much typical to our sex.
If homosexuals want to "pretend" they are the same, the rest of us, do not have to play.
Homosexual unions are working now, have worked in the past, and will work in the future.
You project when you accuse others of bullying, which is what you have done from square one.
You have a right, no matter how wrong, to your view.
Your view is wrong, out of step with reality, and by all means, I encourage you to be a voice crying in the wilderness. The difference, of course, is you are not a prophet, and your words will drift away with the wind.
I guess around half of all Americans (including democrats) are biggots
National (US) Poll * July 17, 2008 * American Voters Oppose Same-Se - Quinnipiac University Hamden, Connecticut
CNN poll: Generations disagree on same-sex marriage - CNN
Oh, I suspect the MAJORITY of Americans are bigots when it comes to this issue.
Thank God we live in a country whose laws and constitution protect minorities from the tyranny of the majority in matters of fundamental right.
I don't understand the sense of your use of the term bigot, here. I believe homosexuality is immoral. Does that make me a bigot, and if so, why?
To any conservative who claims to love liberty......how does denying a gay couple to get married uphold the value liberty you cherish?
You are taking away another family's opportunity for a legacy thru blood (children).
You are taking away "your" parents opportunity for a legacy.
The Bill of Rights states the rights that are given to us, by the "Creator"...
Psst - I hate to be the bearer of bad news but the Bill of Rights says nothing about the "Creator".
>>>>
Because homosexual extremists disagree with you and are trying to silence your voice. It is what they do.
So do you have a link with one tiny scintilla of factual evidence to substantiate that paranoid myth that homosexual extremists "are trying to silence your voice"?
I have not, in my long lifetime, seen any evidence to support such a myth.
Give us an example, based upon facts and evidence, won't you? Or is this just your paranoid fantasy? The gays are out to put tape over your mouth and trash your computer?
How are they scheming to silence YOUR voice? Or anyone else's?
