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/----/ All excellent points but the Gun Grabbers will ignore you and will keep banging the drum to repeal and confiscate.
View attachment 196163
True, they are more interested in creating paranoia and panic, thus votes, than to decrease the death toll. As has been demonstrated, confiscation, at best reduces the over all death count by only a few.
So I continue to ask, what is the problem we are looking to solve?
During the AR ban, the AR crime rate was drastically reduced. Right after it was allowed to run out, the school shootings came on with a "Bang" and the AR was the weapon of choice. You can't dispute that.
I don't want to ban the AR. I want to regulate them to the next level. Whether they are or are not "The Problem" the public percieves them as such. By moving them to FFL status, you still get to keep your AR but you will be required to get a FFL license. From what you say, you are already in compliance with the requirements so what's stopping you from obtaining the FFL license if it's required for you to have your ARs. The fact remains, not one single gun crime has been done by a person possessing a FFL license since the beginning of time of the FFL licensing history. Now, that's a selling point you can shout to the world and the world will believe you. But it's not always about what's real. It's oftentimes, about what is perceived. And this would be within the 2nd amendment. it's already been contested many times.
AR style rifles are used very rarely.
What do we solve with this?
If we can’t even define a public safety issue, one that requires new law, then what do we gain?
An AR can be used in criminal activity, sure, but as we saw in the Indiana shooting and in Texas, they can be simply substituted
It's the weapon of choice for Mass Shootings. Much like the Thompson was in it's day. It matters little that it's a semi auto or not. It's the cheapest, best and fastest in operation semi auto that has ever been made. When you compare it to the Mini-14, the Mini-14 is heavy, sluggish and hard to handle when you have to reload. You can go through 3 mags on the AR in the time it takes you to empty the Mini-14, change mags, hit the recharging lever and go. The Record goes to the AR hands down in body counts. It doesn't take 3 shooters for a high body count. It only takes one. A M-16-A-4 wouldn't do any better for exactly the same reasons. As long as it's the weapon of choice, it can be deemed a Public Safety Issue and can be Regulated. The only question is how to regulate it. I like my idea of making it FFL. That falls well within the 2nd amendment guidelines.
So what?
Ban it and then some other semiautomatic will be used.
The only way to prevent school shootings is to prevent people with guns from entering a school
There is no gun ban or gun law that will stop a person hell bent on murder
Now if you really want to talk about gun violence why do you focus so much on mass shootings? Mass shootings account for 1% of all murders where 70% of all murders are committed in very small very distinct urban areas that are well known.
Tell me why don't you ever talk about that?
An idea worthy of exploring./----/ All excellent points but the Gun Grabbers will ignore you and will keep banging the drum to repeal and confiscate.
View attachment 196163
True, they are more interested in creating paranoia and panic, thus votes, than to decrease the death toll. As has been demonstrated, confiscation, at best reduces the over all death count by only a few.
So I continue to ask, what is the problem we are looking to solve?
During the AR ban, the AR crime rate was drastically reduced. Right after it was allowed to run out, the school shootings came on with a "Bang" and the AR was the weapon of choice. You can't dispute that.
I don't want to ban the AR. I want to regulate them to the next level. Whether they are or are not "The Problem" the public percieves them as such. By moving them to FFL status, you still get to keep your AR but you will be required to get a FFL license. From what you say, you are already in compliance with the requirements so what's stopping you from obtaining the FFL license if it's required for you to have your ARs. The fact remains, not one single gun crime has been done by a person possessing a FFL license since the beginning of time of the FFL licensing history. Now, that's a selling point you can shout to the world and the world will believe you. But it's not always about what's real. It's oftentimes, about what is perceived. And this would be within the 2nd amendment. it's already been contested many times.
But rather than just ARs, instead afford citizens an FFL for any firearm, much like the FFL 03, except not limited to firearms over 50 years old or guns designated as C and R.
Advantages:
No more 4473s to fill out, no waiting periods, no background checks – go to your LGS, buy your gun, take it home.
And with an FFL, a citizen can buy a gun online and have it delivered to his home, no need to ship it to an FFL 01 for a transfer (and the transfer fee).
Last, the FFL would also serve as a concealed carry license valid in all 50 states and the District of Columbia, superseding all state and local concealed carry laws.
The background check would be conducted as part of the application process, the license would be valid for three years, with a $30 renewal fee.
Disadvantages:
No FFL, no guns – even if one is not otherwise a prohibited person
License holders must maintain a bound book and record all firearm transactions.
License holders must keep meticulous, comprehensive records.
Bound books and a transaction records would be subject to ATF review.
One cannot get an FFL for solely personal gun purchases
Thinking About Getting Your Own FFL? - The Truth About Guns
Before going any further, it’s important to point out some of the stipulations the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (also known as ATF) puts on federal firearms licenses. First, you must plan to do transfers for others. It can’t be 100% all personal use. This means you can’t get a FFL simply to buy a whole bunch of guns for yourself.
You are blowing smoke. I wonder why you are doing this. Oh, I know. You are trying to defend against the AR from becoming a FFL licensed weapon. Here is a bit of fact.
FFL Dealer – Personal Gun Purchase
Sole proprietor FFL licensees not only enables you to be classed as a gun collector but as a dealer as well. You can buy and sell under the FFL license to anyone that has a FFL license and you can buy and sell to yourself for your own personal collection. You don't have to buy and sell to anyone outside of yourself if you don't want to. You are listed as a gun dealer but you don't have to deal to outside sources. You can only deal for yourself if you wish. When you purchase a firearm using your FFL, you are purchasing as a Dealer. Then, as a Dealer, you are selling to yourself and transferring ownership from your Dealer Self to your Private Self. Nothing forces you to sell to outside sources. Chances are, you will sell to outside sources though to others. You see, a FFL licensed dealer gets one hell of a big discount when he buys almost anything. This may make you the cats pajamas for your community.
True, they are more interested in creating paranoia and panic, thus votes, than to decrease the death toll. As has been demonstrated, confiscation, at best reduces the over all death count by only a few.
So I continue to ask, what is the problem we are looking to solve?
During the AR ban, the AR crime rate was drastically reduced. Right after it was allowed to run out, the school shootings came on with a "Bang" and the AR was the weapon of choice. You can't dispute that.
I don't want to ban the AR. I want to regulate them to the next level. Whether they are or are not "The Problem" the public percieves them as such. By moving them to FFL status, you still get to keep your AR but you will be required to get a FFL license. From what you say, you are already in compliance with the requirements so what's stopping you from obtaining the FFL license if it's required for you to have your ARs. The fact remains, not one single gun crime has been done by a person possessing a FFL license since the beginning of time of the FFL licensing history. Now, that's a selling point you can shout to the world and the world will believe you. But it's not always about what's real. It's oftentimes, about what is perceived. And this would be within the 2nd amendment. it's already been contested many times.
AR style rifles are used very rarely.
What do we solve with this?
If we can’t even define a public safety issue, one that requires new law, then what do we gain?
An AR can be used in criminal activity, sure, but as we saw in the Indiana shooting and in Texas, they can be simply substituted
It's the weapon of choice for Mass Shootings. Much like the Thompson was in it's day. It matters little that it's a semi auto or not. It's the cheapest, best and fastest in operation semi auto that has ever been made. When you compare it to the Mini-14, the Mini-14 is heavy, sluggish and hard to handle when you have to reload. You can go through 3 mags on the AR in the time it takes you to empty the Mini-14, change mags, hit the recharging lever and go. The Record goes to the AR hands down in body counts. It doesn't take 3 shooters for a high body count. It only takes one. A M-16-A-4 wouldn't do any better for exactly the same reasons. As long as it's the weapon of choice, it can be deemed a Public Safety Issue and can be Regulated. The only question is how to regulate it. I like my idea of making it FFL. That falls well within the 2nd amendment guidelines.
So what?
Ban it and then some other semiautomatic will be used.
The only way to prevent school shootings is to prevent people with guns from entering a school
There is no gun ban or gun law that will stop a person hell bent on murder
Now if you really want to talk about gun violence why do you focus so much on mass shootings? Mass shootings account for 1% of all murders where 70% of all murders are committed in very small very distinct urban areas that are well known.
Tell me why don't you ever talk about that?
You keep talking about banning. I didn't even bring that up. Is that what you want? If you can't get your way, do we just ban it? Or do we do it the way it's been constitutionally done in the past and regulate it. But if you want it banned if you can't get your way then that's okay too.
Agreed.I would be open to implementing the FFL as a way to conduct background checks. I absolutely believe that if the different ideologies could stand to be in a room together for a while, we have the capacity to create a system that minimizes how many firearms get into the hands of dangerous people, without unduly infringing the rights of the massive majority of law-abiding gun owners. It's just the arguing and tribalism that too often gets in the way.
[QU
You leave out the data that the highest body counts for mass shootings per shooting goes to the
AR-15. And that has become the weapon of choice in the last few years. Yes, you can go back and include 1992 through 1998 when the AR was regulated and was not to be had in such numbers. That messes up the totals. Or you can go from 1999 forward and get quite a cultural shock. Hand picking data is just plain lying.
That is like saying the highest body count for terrorism goes to airplanes.
The number of people killed in a year with ARs is minuscule compared with the deaths in the big cities from handguns, mostly stolen or cheap.
You are confused about ARs being "regulated" between '92-'98. You could still go to any gun store in the US and buy an AR. The only difference is that if it wasn't a "preban" then it didn't have a bayonet lug or collapsible stock. Everything else was exactly the same. AR ownership soared during that time. By the way, the gun violence decreased after that silly ban was lifted. Slick Willy's AWB had no effect on gun violence at all. Gun crime was on the decline during the ban and continued after the ban.
The hard truth for Liberals is that White people that don't commit many crimes are the ones that own ARs and other expensive firearms. The crime that is committed with firearms are mostly among the Black and Brown drug and gang population with cheap handguns.
If you want to rob a 7-11 and shoot the clerk why go and buy a $900 AR that is not easily concealed when a cheap handgun will do the job?
Agreed.I would be open to implementing the FFL as a way to conduct background checks. I absolutely believe that if the different ideologies could stand to be in a room together for a while, we have the capacity to create a system that minimizes how many firearms get into the hands of dangerous people, without unduly infringing the rights of the massive majority of law-abiding gun owners. It's just the arguing and tribalism that too often gets in the way.
And with the understanding that there is no one solution that will comprehensively solve the problem, including an FFL program.
An important aspect of an FFL program is that if one decides to not renew his license, he’s also deciding to no longer be a gun owner, and intends to sell his firearms to a license holder.
[QU
You leave out the data that the highest body counts for mass shootings per shooting goes to the
AR-15. And that has become the weapon of choice in the last few years. Yes, you can go back and include 1992 through 1998 when the AR was regulated and was not to be had in such numbers. That messes up the totals. Or you can go from 1999 forward and get quite a cultural shock. Hand picking data is just plain lying.
That is like saying the highest body count for terrorism goes to airplanes.
The number of people killed in a year with ARs is minuscule compared with the deaths in the big cities from handguns, mostly stolen or cheap.
You are confused about ARs being "regulated" between '92-'98. You could still go to any gun store in the US and buy an AR. The only difference is that if it wasn't a "preban" then it didn't have a bayonet lug or collapsible stock. Everything else was exactly the same. AR ownership soared during that time. By the way, the gun violence decreased after that silly ban was lifted. Slick Willy's AWB had no effect on gun violence at all. Gun crime was on the decline during the ban and continued after the ban.
The hard truth for Liberals is that White people that don't commit many crimes are the ones that own ARs and other expensive firearms. The crime that is committed with firearms are mostly among the Black and Brown drug and gang population with cheap handguns.
If you want to rob a 7-11 and shoot the clerk why go and buy a $900 AR that is not easily concealed when a cheap handgun will do the job?
If my intention was to rob that 7-11 then the cheap hangun is the way to go. It's the weapon of choice. It's the right tool for the job. Now, if I am dead set in going for the highest body count then the AR is the right tool for the job. AFter the Oklahoma Bombing, they placed some controls on the substances to fill up that van with those chemicals. Same goes for the classes of explosives like Dynamite, Nitro, Symtecs, etc.. Only in the movies will you see those on the streets. Fully Automatic Weapons are just not to be had and modifying semi autos to full auto usually takes a Gunsmith with a Machine Shop and again, only in the movies. So you go with the AR. The Right tool for the Job.
Would I want to use a Mini-14 for the Job? Nope. AFter I empty the first mag, the changing of the mag is just too slow and prone to making mistakes. Chances are, when adrenilined up that high, you will drop at least one full mag on the ground before you get one into the slot. The Mag just doesn't just drop to the ground like the AR does. You have to pull it off in an arc. Then you have to take ahold of the new mag and put it back in in an arc. Then you have to rotate the rifle so you can access the charging lever on the right side of the gun to charge it. Then you have to rotate it back again and you are back in business. If you are in a school at least one soon to be hero is going to take advantage of the time that it takes for you to reload and take you down. And you won't see it coming since all your attention will be on reloading your gun. The wrong tool for the job.
During the AR ban, the AR crime rate was drastically reduced. Right after it was allowed to run out, the school shootings came on with a "Bang" and the AR was the weapon of choice. You can't dispute that.
I don't want to ban the AR. I want to regulate them to the next level. Whether they are or are not "The Problem" the public percieves them as such. By moving them to FFL status, you still get to keep your AR but you will be required to get a FFL license. From what you say, you are already in compliance with the requirements so what's stopping you from obtaining the FFL license if it's required for you to have your ARs. The fact remains, not one single gun crime has been done by a person possessing a FFL license since the beginning of time of the FFL licensing history. Now, that's a selling point you can shout to the world and the world will believe you. But it's not always about what's real. It's oftentimes, about what is perceived. And this would be within the 2nd amendment. it's already been contested many times.
AR style rifles are used very rarely.
What do we solve with this?
If we can’t even define a public safety issue, one that requires new law, then what do we gain?
An AR can be used in criminal activity, sure, but as we saw in the Indiana shooting and in Texas, they can be simply substituted
It's the weapon of choice for Mass Shootings. Much like the Thompson was in it's day. It matters little that it's a semi auto or not. It's the cheapest, best and fastest in operation semi auto that has ever been made. When you compare it to the Mini-14, the Mini-14 is heavy, sluggish and hard to handle when you have to reload. You can go through 3 mags on the AR in the time it takes you to empty the Mini-14, change mags, hit the recharging lever and go. The Record goes to the AR hands down in body counts. It doesn't take 3 shooters for a high body count. It only takes one. A M-16-A-4 wouldn't do any better for exactly the same reasons. As long as it's the weapon of choice, it can be deemed a Public Safety Issue and can be Regulated. The only question is how to regulate it. I like my idea of making it FFL. That falls well within the 2nd amendment guidelines.
So what?
Ban it and then some other semiautomatic will be used.
The only way to prevent school shootings is to prevent people with guns from entering a school
There is no gun ban or gun law that will stop a person hell bent on murder
Now if you really want to talk about gun violence why do you focus so much on mass shootings? Mass shootings account for 1% of all murders where 70% of all murders are committed in very small very distinct urban areas that are well known.
Tell me why don't you ever talk about that?
You keep talking about banning. I didn't even bring that up. Is that what you want? If you can't get your way, do we just ban it? Or do we do it the way it's been constitutionally done in the past and regulate it. But if you want it banned if you can't get your way then that's okay too.
So you want to "regulate" all semiautomatic rifles?
It's beyond stupid to "regulate" just one model of one caliber of semiautomatic rifle.
Correct.True, they are more interested in creating paranoia and panic, thus votes, than to decrease the death toll. As has been demonstrated, confiscation, at best reduces the over all death count by only a few.
So I continue to ask, what is the problem we are looking to solve?
During the AR ban, the AR crime rate was drastically reduced. Right after it was allowed to run out, the school shootings came on with a "Bang" and the AR was the weapon of choice. You can't dispute that.
I don't want to ban the AR. I want to regulate them to the next level. Whether they are or are not "The Problem" the public percieves them as such. By moving them to FFL status, you still get to keep your AR but you will be required to get a FFL license. From what you say, you are already in compliance with the requirements so what's stopping you from obtaining the FFL license if it's required for you to have your ARs. The fact remains, not one single gun crime has been done by a person possessing a FFL license since the beginning of time of the FFL licensing history. Now, that's a selling point you can shout to the world and the world will believe you. But it's not always about what's real. It's oftentimes, about what is perceived. And this would be within the 2nd amendment. it's already been contested many times.
AR style rifles are used very rarely.
What do we solve with this?
If we can’t even define a public safety issue, one that requires new law, then what do we gain?
An AR can be used in criminal activity, sure, but as we saw in the Indiana shooting and in Texas, they can be simply substituted
It's the weapon of choice for Mass Shootings. Much like the Thompson was in it's day. It matters little that it's a semi auto or not. It's the cheapest, best and fastest in operation semi auto that has ever been made. When you compare it to the Mini-14, the Mini-14 is heavy, sluggish and hard to handle when you have to reload. You can go through 3 mags on the AR in the time it takes you to empty the Mini-14, change mags, hit the recharging lever and go. The Record goes to the AR hands down in body counts. It doesn't take 3 shooters for a high body count. It only takes one. A M-16-A-4 wouldn't do any better for exactly the same reasons. As long as it's the weapon of choice, it can be deemed a Public Safety Issue and can be Regulated. The only question is how to regulate it. I like my idea of making it FFL. That falls well within the 2nd amendment guidelines.
So what?
Ban it and then some other semiautomatic will be used.
The only way to prevent school shootings is to prevent people with guns from entering a school
There is no gun ban or gun law that will stop a person hell bent on murder
Now if you really want to talk about gun violence why do you focus so much on mass shootings? Mass shootings account for 1% of all murders where 70% of all murders are committed in very small very distinct urban areas that are well known.
Tell me why don't you ever talk about that?
You keep talking about banning. I didn't even bring that up. Is that what you want? If you can't get your way, do we just ban it? Or do we do it the way it's been constitutionally done in the past and regulate it. But if you want it banned if you can't get your way then that's okay too.
Agreed.I would be open to implementing the FFL as a way to conduct background checks. I absolutely believe that if the different ideologies could stand to be in a room together for a while, we have the capacity to create a system that minimizes how many firearms get into the hands of dangerous people, without unduly infringing the rights of the massive majority of law-abiding gun owners. It's just the arguing and tribalism that too often gets in the way.
And with the understanding that there is no one solution that will comprehensively solve the problem, including an FFL program.
An important aspect of an FFL program is that if one decides to not renew his license, he’s also deciding to no longer be a gun owner, and intends to sell his firearms to a license holder.
It makes no sense to force a person to pay for a dealers' license which is what an FFL is if he is not going to be selling firearms
[QU
You leave out the data that the highest body counts for mass shootings per shooting goes to the
AR-15. And that has become the weapon of choice in the last few years. Yes, you can go back and include 1992 through 1998 when the AR was regulated and was not to be had in such numbers. That messes up the totals. Or you can go from 1999 forward and get quite a cultural shock. Hand picking data is just plain lying.
That is like saying the highest body count for terrorism goes to airplanes.
The number of people killed in a year with ARs is minuscule compared with the deaths in the big cities from handguns, mostly stolen or cheap.
You are confused about ARs being "regulated" between '92-'98. You could still go to any gun store in the US and buy an AR. The only difference is that if it wasn't a "preban" then it didn't have a bayonet lug or collapsible stock. Everything else was exactly the same. AR ownership soared during that time. By the way, the gun violence decreased after that silly ban was lifted. Slick Willy's AWB had no effect on gun violence at all. Gun crime was on the decline during the ban and continued after the ban.
The hard truth for Liberals is that White people that don't commit many crimes are the ones that own ARs and other expensive firearms. The crime that is committed with firearms are mostly among the Black and Brown drug and gang population with cheap handguns.
If you want to rob a 7-11 and shoot the clerk why go and buy a $900 AR that is not easily concealed when a cheap handgun will do the job?
If my intention was to rob that 7-11 then the cheap hangun is the way to go. It's the weapon of choice. It's the right tool for the job. Now, if I am dead set in going for the highest body count then the AR is the right tool for the job. AFter the Oklahoma Bombing, they placed some controls on the substances to fill up that van with those chemicals. Same goes for the classes of explosives like Dynamite, Nitro, Symtecs, etc.. Only in the movies will you see those on the streets. Fully Automatic Weapons are just not to be had and modifying semi autos to full auto usually takes a Gunsmith with a Machine Shop and again, only in the movies. So you go with the AR. The Right tool for the Job.
Would I want to use a Mini-14 for the Job? Nope. AFter I empty the first mag, the changing of the mag is just too slow and prone to making mistakes. Chances are, when adrenilined up that high, you will drop at least one full mag on the ground before you get one into the slot. The Mag just doesn't just drop to the ground like the AR does. You have to pull it off in an arc. Then you have to take ahold of the new mag and put it back in in an arc. Then you have to rotate the rifle so you can access the charging lever on the right side of the gun to charge it. Then you have to rotate it back again and you are back in business. If you are in a school at least one soon to be hero is going to take advantage of the time that it takes for you to reload and take you down. And you won't see it coming since all your attention will be on reloading your gun. The wrong tool for the job.
[QU
You leave out the data that the highest body counts for mass shootings per shooting goes to the
AR-15. And that has become the weapon of choice in the last few years. Yes, you can go back and include 1992 through 1998 when the AR was regulated and was not to be had in such numbers. That messes up the totals. Or you can go from 1999 forward and get quite a cultural shock. Hand picking data is just plain lying.
That is like saying the highest body count for terrorism goes to airplanes.
The number of people killed in a year with ARs is minuscule compared with the deaths in the big cities from handguns, mostly stolen or cheap.
You are confused about ARs being "regulated" between '92-'98. You could still go to any gun store in the US and buy an AR. The only difference is that if it wasn't a "preban" then it didn't have a bayonet lug or collapsible stock. Everything else was exactly the same. AR ownership soared during that time. By the way, the gun violence decreased after that silly ban was lifted. Slick Willy's AWB had no effect on gun violence at all. Gun crime was on the decline during the ban and continued after the ban.
The hard truth for Liberals is that White people that don't commit many crimes are the ones that own ARs and other expensive firearms. The crime that is committed with firearms are mostly among the Black and Brown drug and gang population with cheap handguns.
If you want to rob a 7-11 and shoot the clerk why go and buy a $900 AR that is not easily concealed when a cheap handgun will do the job?
If my intention was to rob that 7-11 then the cheap hangun is the way to go. It's the weapon of choice. It's the right tool for the job. Now, if I am dead set in going for the highest body count then the AR is the right tool for the job. AFter the Oklahoma Bombing, they placed some controls on the substances to fill up that van with those chemicals. Same goes for the classes of explosives like Dynamite, Nitro, Symtecs, etc.. Only in the movies will you see those on the streets. Fully Automatic Weapons are just not to be had and modifying semi autos to full auto usually takes a Gunsmith with a Machine Shop and again, only in the movies. So you go with the AR. The Right tool for the Job.
Would I want to use a Mini-14 for the Job? Nope. AFter I empty the first mag, the changing of the mag is just too slow and prone to making mistakes. Chances are, when adrenilined up that high, you will drop at least one full mag on the ground before you get one into the slot. The Mag just doesn't just drop to the ground like the AR does. You have to pull it off in an arc. Then you have to take ahold of the new mag and put it back in in an arc. Then you have to rotate the rifle so you can access the charging lever on the right side of the gun to charge it. Then you have to rotate it back again and you are back in business. If you are in a school at least one soon to be hero is going to take advantage of the time that it takes for you to reload and take you down. And you won't see it coming since all your attention will be on reloading your gun. The wrong tool for the job.
Funny I don't have much trouble changing the mags on my mini 14
[QU
You leave out the data that the highest body counts for mass shootings per shooting goes to the
AR-15. And that has become the weapon of choice in the last few years. Yes, you can go back and include 1992 through 1998 when the AR was regulated and was not to be had in such numbers. That messes up the totals. Or you can go from 1999 forward and get quite a cultural shock. Hand picking data is just plain lying.
That is like saying the highest body count for terrorism goes to airplanes.
The number of people killed in a year with ARs is minuscule compared with the deaths in the big cities from handguns, mostly stolen or cheap.
You are confused about ARs being "regulated" between '92-'98. You could still go to any gun store in the US and buy an AR. The only difference is that if it wasn't a "preban" then it didn't have a bayonet lug or collapsible stock. Everything else was exactly the same. AR ownership soared during that time. By the way, the gun violence decreased after that silly ban was lifted. Slick Willy's AWB had no effect on gun violence at all. Gun crime was on the decline during the ban and continued after the ban.
The hard truth for Liberals is that White people that don't commit many crimes are the ones that own ARs and other expensive firearms. The crime that is committed with firearms are mostly among the Black and Brown drug and gang population with cheap handguns.
If you want to rob a 7-11 and shoot the clerk why go and buy a $900 AR that is not easily concealed when a cheap handgun will do the job?
If my intention was to rob that 7-11 then the cheap hangun is the way to go. It's the weapon of choice. It's the right tool for the job. Now, if I am dead set in going for the highest body count then the AR is the right tool for the job. AFter the Oklahoma Bombing, they placed some controls on the substances to fill up that van with those chemicals. Same goes for the classes of explosives like Dynamite, Nitro, Symtecs, etc.. Only in the movies will you see those on the streets. Fully Automatic Weapons are just not to be had and modifying semi autos to full auto usually takes a Gunsmith with a Machine Shop and again, only in the movies. So you go with the AR. The Right tool for the Job.
Would I want to use a Mini-14 for the Job? Nope. AFter I empty the first mag, the changing of the mag is just too slow and prone to making mistakes. Chances are, when adrenilined up that high, you will drop at least one full mag on the ground before you get one into the slot. The Mag just doesn't just drop to the ground like the AR does. You have to pull it off in an arc. Then you have to take ahold of the new mag and put it back in in an arc. Then you have to rotate the rifle so you can access the charging lever on the right side of the gun to charge it. Then you have to rotate it back again and you are back in business. If you are in a school at least one soon to be hero is going to take advantage of the time that it takes for you to reload and take you down. And you won't see it coming since all your attention will be on reloading your gun. The wrong tool for the job.
Most crimes are not committed with guns that require quick changing magazines. The average number of shots fired in most gun crimes is three.
On the streets of the big American Democrat controlled shithole cities (where most of the gun crime takes place) the weapon of choice is what you can steal or get cheaply.
Correct.During the AR ban, the AR crime rate was drastically reduced. Right after it was allowed to run out, the school shootings came on with a "Bang" and the AR was the weapon of choice. You can't dispute that.
I don't want to ban the AR. I want to regulate them to the next level. Whether they are or are not "The Problem" the public percieves them as such. By moving them to FFL status, you still get to keep your AR but you will be required to get a FFL license. From what you say, you are already in compliance with the requirements so what's stopping you from obtaining the FFL license if it's required for you to have your ARs. The fact remains, not one single gun crime has been done by a person possessing a FFL license since the beginning of time of the FFL licensing history. Now, that's a selling point you can shout to the world and the world will believe you. But it's not always about what's real. It's oftentimes, about what is perceived. And this would be within the 2nd amendment. it's already been contested many times.
AR style rifles are used very rarely.
What do we solve with this?
If we can’t even define a public safety issue, one that requires new law, then what do we gain?
An AR can be used in criminal activity, sure, but as we saw in the Indiana shooting and in Texas, they can be simply substituted
It's the weapon of choice for Mass Shootings. Much like the Thompson was in it's day. It matters little that it's a semi auto or not. It's the cheapest, best and fastest in operation semi auto that has ever been made. When you compare it to the Mini-14, the Mini-14 is heavy, sluggish and hard to handle when you have to reload. You can go through 3 mags on the AR in the time it takes you to empty the Mini-14, change mags, hit the recharging lever and go. The Record goes to the AR hands down in body counts. It doesn't take 3 shooters for a high body count. It only takes one. A M-16-A-4 wouldn't do any better for exactly the same reasons. As long as it's the weapon of choice, it can be deemed a Public Safety Issue and can be Regulated. The only question is how to regulate it. I like my idea of making it FFL. That falls well within the 2nd amendment guidelines.
So what?
Ban it and then some other semiautomatic will be used.
The only way to prevent school shootings is to prevent people with guns from entering a school
There is no gun ban or gun law that will stop a person hell bent on murder
Now if you really want to talk about gun violence why do you focus so much on mass shootings? Mass shootings account for 1% of all murders where 70% of all murders are committed in very small very distinct urban areas that are well known.
Tell me why don't you ever talk about that?
You keep talking about banning. I didn't even bring that up. Is that what you want? If you can't get your way, do we just ban it? Or do we do it the way it's been constitutionally done in the past and regulate it. But if you want it banned if you can't get your way then that's okay too.
No one is talking about ‘banning’ anything.
Indeed, we can explore ways to both address the issue of gun crime and violence and make gun ownership subject to fewer regulations.
AR style rifles are used very rarely.
What do we solve with this?
If we can’t even define a public safety issue, one that requires new law, then what do we gain?
An AR can be used in criminal activity, sure, but as we saw in the Indiana shooting and in Texas, they can be simply substituted
It's the weapon of choice for Mass Shootings. Much like the Thompson was in it's day. It matters little that it's a semi auto or not. It's the cheapest, best and fastest in operation semi auto that has ever been made. When you compare it to the Mini-14, the Mini-14 is heavy, sluggish and hard to handle when you have to reload. You can go through 3 mags on the AR in the time it takes you to empty the Mini-14, change mags, hit the recharging lever and go. The Record goes to the AR hands down in body counts. It doesn't take 3 shooters for a high body count. It only takes one. A M-16-A-4 wouldn't do any better for exactly the same reasons. As long as it's the weapon of choice, it can be deemed a Public Safety Issue and can be Regulated. The only question is how to regulate it. I like my idea of making it FFL. That falls well within the 2nd amendment guidelines.
So what?
Ban it and then some other semiautomatic will be used.
The only way to prevent school shootings is to prevent people with guns from entering a school
There is no gun ban or gun law that will stop a person hell bent on murder
Now if you really want to talk about gun violence why do you focus so much on mass shootings? Mass shootings account for 1% of all murders where 70% of all murders are committed in very small very distinct urban areas that are well known.
Tell me why don't you ever talk about that?
You keep talking about banning. I didn't even bring that up. Is that what you want? If you can't get your way, do we just ban it? Or do we do it the way it's been constitutionally done in the past and regulate it. But if you want it banned if you can't get your way then that's okay too.
So you want to "regulate" all semiautomatic rifles?
It's beyond stupid to "regulate" just one model of one caliber of semiautomatic rifle.
Is that what I said? Own up to it. Tell me where I ever said that. But I do want to handle the AR just like we do all other "Public Safety" items that pose a clear and present danger to society at large. I have already proven that a Mini-14 isn't the right tool for the job. It's too cumbersome to reload. But the brilliance of Stoner makes the AR the right tool for the job when you are needing 60 or more bullets to get the job done. Not just one caliber, just one gun. In 1934, they had the same discussion over the Thompson and not all 45 cals were regulated.
I don't own an AR because I have a perfectly good rifle chambered for 5.56 NATO rounds and I can drop and swap a magazine with no difficulty.Agreed.I would be open to implementing the FFL as a way to conduct background checks. I absolutely believe that if the different ideologies could stand to be in a room together for a while, we have the capacity to create a system that minimizes how many firearms get into the hands of dangerous people, without unduly infringing the rights of the massive majority of law-abiding gun owners. It's just the arguing and tribalism that too often gets in the way.
And with the understanding that there is no one solution that will comprehensively solve the problem, including an FFL program.
An important aspect of an FFL program is that if one decides to not renew his license, he’s also deciding to no longer be a gun owner, and intends to sell his firearms to a license holder.
It makes no sense to force a person to pay for a dealers' license which is what an FFL is if he is not going to be selling firearms
Then figure out a way to prevent the use of the AR in the Mass School Shootings instead of all this other BS. It sounds like it's in your hands now. Either help find a solution, lose your AR, or become a FFL licensed dealer. Those are your 3 options. Leaving like it is is NOT an option.
It's the weapon of choice for Mass Shootings. Much like the Thompson was in it's day. It matters little that it's a semi auto or not. It's the cheapest, best and fastest in operation semi auto that has ever been made. When you compare it to the Mini-14, the Mini-14 is heavy, sluggish and hard to handle when you have to reload. You can go through 3 mags on the AR in the time it takes you to empty the Mini-14, change mags, hit the recharging lever and go. The Record goes to the AR hands down in body counts. It doesn't take 3 shooters for a high body count. It only takes one. A M-16-A-4 wouldn't do any better for exactly the same reasons. As long as it's the weapon of choice, it can be deemed a Public Safety Issue and can be Regulated. The only question is how to regulate it. I like my idea of making it FFL. That falls well within the 2nd amendment guidelines.
So what?
Ban it and then some other semiautomatic will be used.
The only way to prevent school shootings is to prevent people with guns from entering a school
There is no gun ban or gun law that will stop a person hell bent on murder
Now if you really want to talk about gun violence why do you focus so much on mass shootings? Mass shootings account for 1% of all murders where 70% of all murders are committed in very small very distinct urban areas that are well known.
Tell me why don't you ever talk about that?
You keep talking about banning. I didn't even bring that up. Is that what you want? If you can't get your way, do we just ban it? Or do we do it the way it's been constitutionally done in the past and regulate it. But if you want it banned if you can't get your way then that's okay too.
So you want to "regulate" all semiautomatic rifles?
It's beyond stupid to "regulate" just one model of one caliber of semiautomatic rifle.
Is that what I said? Own up to it. Tell me where I ever said that. But I do want to handle the AR just like we do all other "Public Safety" items that pose a clear and present danger to society at large. I have already proven that a Mini-14 isn't the right tool for the job. It's too cumbersome to reload. But the brilliance of Stoner makes the AR the right tool for the job when you are needing 60 or more bullets to get the job done. Not just one caliber, just one gun. In 1934, they had the same discussion over the Thompson and not all 45 cals were regulated.
The AR is no different from any other semiauto rifle chambered for 5.56 NATO rounds
So you don't ban the AR chambered for 5.56 NATO you just make it harder to get right?
What's to stop anyone from buying a different semiauto rifle chambered for 5.56 NATO or an even more powerful round and going on a shooting spree??
Now do you see why "regulating just one model of one caliber semiautomatic rifle is beyond stupid?
And I won't even get into pistol caliber carbines
I don't own an AR because I have a perfectly good rifle chambered for 5.56 NATO rounds and I can drop and swap a magazine with no difficulty.Agreed.I would be open to implementing the FFL as a way to conduct background checks. I absolutely believe that if the different ideologies could stand to be in a room together for a while, we have the capacity to create a system that minimizes how many firearms get into the hands of dangerous people, without unduly infringing the rights of the massive majority of law-abiding gun owners. It's just the arguing and tribalism that too often gets in the way.
And with the understanding that there is no one solution that will comprehensively solve the problem, including an FFL program.
An important aspect of an FFL program is that if one decides to not renew his license, he’s also deciding to no longer be a gun owner, and intends to sell his firearms to a license holder.
It makes no sense to force a person to pay for a dealers' license which is what an FFL is if he is not going to be selling firearms
Then figure out a way to prevent the use of the AR in the Mass School Shootings instead of all this other BS. It sounds like it's in your hands now. Either help find a solution, lose your AR, or become a FFL licensed dealer. Those are your 3 options. Leaving like it is is NOT an option.
And like I said the only way to prevent school shootings is to prevent people from just waltzing into a school with firearms of any kind no gun regulation will stop them.
