Progressive Government Fails

[NYcarbineer]

wow that was quite the mini rant this morning

since when did any of those write the laws

Pointing out hypocrisy is not "ranting".

The powers-that-be on the right are just as elitist as those on the left.

As far as "writing laws" goes the lobbyists who are paid by the elitists dictate what ends up in those laws on both sides of the aisle.

That is reality today. You can pretend that it doesn't happen on your side if you want but it won't alter the facts.

not any of the three Koch bros, Glen Beck and Rush Limbaugh

mandated that i buy anything

So you were uninsured up until now, and now you're going to buy healthcare insurance against your will?

 

[Neotrotsky]

Well that would be great
but the US does not have true free markets
Has not for a long time

We do have crony/ corporate capitalism
Which is why one sees the friends/family of politicians become so rich

 

[Derideo_Te]

It should be noted that, when the enormous amount of funds and influence of the Soros empire was revealed the Left quickly sought a way to cloud the issue.

The found some conservative contributors, the Koch Brothers, and attempted to paint them as the same kind of evil on the Right as Soros is on the Left.


It couldn't be further from the truth.....but it does convince simpletons such as our friend Derideo_Te.



1. "Liberal group grants over 5x as much as Koch Brothers but goes largely unnoticed by the media
Consider these numbers, derived from multiple searches of foundation grant databases, IRS Form 990s and other public records:
Three Koch foundations made a total of 181 grants worth $25,405,525 in 2010 (most recent available records). The one Tides Foundation made a total of 2,627 grants worth $143,529,590 in 2010."
Liberal group grants over 5x as much as Koch Brothers but goes largely unnoticed by the media | Human Events

And that was only one Leftist snakes.



2. As of 2009, the financial assets of the 115 major tax-exempt foundations of the Left add up to $104.56 billlion. Not only is this total not less than the financial assets of the 75 foundations of the Right, it was more than ten times greater! [p. 8]

a. Bradley, Olin, Scaife, the “Big Three” conservative foundations, not one has assets exceeding $1 billion. (Olin has been defunct since 2005).

i. Scaife Foundation has assets totaling $244 million.
ii. Bradley Foundation, $623 million.

b. Fourteen progressive foundations exceed $1 billion, including Gates, Ford, Robert Wood Johnson, Hewlett, Kellogg, Packard, MacArthur, Mellon, Rockefeller, Casey, Carnegie, Simons, Heinz, and the Open Society Institute.

i. Ford alone has 16 times what Bradley has.
ii. Soros has claimed that he has donated over $7 billion to his Open Society organizations.
iii. The leading Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, $33 billion.

3. One part, called “America Votes” was referred to by one of its staffers as a “monster coalition” coordinating all of the left-wing grassroots groups including ACORN, Planned Parenthoood Action Fund, Sierra Club and the American Federation of Teachers and the SEIU. Soros contributed $23,700,000 in 2004.
“The New Leviathan,” David Horowitz and Jacob Laksin

So now I am a "simpleton", PC?

BTW thanks for the evidence that both sides are bought and paid for by elitists.

1. The proof of 'simpleton'?

That, in the face of the data that I provided, you still see an equivalence.




Here is more for you to ignore, or an opportunity to more out of the 'simpleton' category:



2. Soros money supported and catalyzed theMcCain-Feingold Act, which banned ‘soft money,’ stripping the two major parties of their financial base. This allowed Soros to create a “Shadow Party,” designed to funnel massive amounts of capital into organizations that would assume the role that the political parties traditionally played.

a. A 527 group is a private, tax-exempt political organization set up under Section 527 of the U.S. tax code. Such groups have been around for years but never took center stage until 2004, when they became major players. That's because McCain-Feingold shut the door on unlimited contributions (so-called "soft money") to political parties, so that many of the big-dollar donations began flowing to 527 groups instead. McCain-Feingold at Rest - Reason.com



3. The Shadow Party was born July 17, 2003, at Soros’s estate. It created the largest and most powerful juggernaut in American history.

Present were Madeleine Albright, John Podesta, John Pope (director of the Sierra Club), Andy Stern (SEIU), among others. The basic structure of the Shadow Party was a network of seven 527 organizations.

a. “… the network of nonprofit activist groups organized by George Soros and others to mobilize resources -- money, get-outthe-vote drives, campaign advertising and policy iniatives -- to elect Democratic candidates and guide the Democratic Party towards the left. The Internet fund-raising operation MoveOn.org is a key component.

The Shadow Party in this sense was conceived and organized principally by Soros, Hillary Clinton and Harold Ickes. Its efforts are amplified by, and coordinated with, key government unions and the activist groups associated with the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN). The key organizers of these groups are veterans of the Sixties left.”
http://www.churchmilitant.tv/cia/02fake/102.pdf


4. One part, called “America Votes” was referred to by one of its staffers as a “monster coalition” coordinating all of the left-wing grassroots groups including ACORN, Planned Parenthoood Action Fund, Sierra Club and the American Federation of Teachers and the SEIU. Soros contributed $23,700,000 in 2004.

a. As of 2004, an alphabetical list of Shadow Party groups included the following: Air America Radio; America Coming Together; America Votes; American Constitution Society; American Federation of Labor - Congress of Industrial Organizations; American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees; American Federation of Teachers; Anshell Media; Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now; Association of Trial Lawyers of America; Band of Progressives; Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence; Campaign for a Progressive Future; Campaign for America's Future; Center for American Progress; Clean Water Action; Communication Workers of America; The Constitution Project; DASH PAC; Defenders of Wildlife Action Fund; Democracy for America; Democratic Governors Associations; Democratic Legislative Campaign Committee; Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee; Dog Eat Dog Films; EMILY's List; Environment 2004; Gore/Lieberman Recount Committee; Hotel Employees & Restaurant Employees International Union; the Human Rights Campaign; INdTV; International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers; Joint Victory Campaign 2004; Laborers International Union of North American; League of Conservation Voters; New Democrat Network; The Media Fund; Media Matters for America; Million Mom March; Moving America Forward; MoveOn.org; Music for America; National Association for the Advancement of Colored People; NARAL Pro-Choice America; National Education Association; National Grassroots Alliance; National Jewish Democratic Council; National Treasury Employees Union; New American Optimists; New Democrat Network; Partnership for America's Families; People for the American Way; Phoenix Group; Planned Parenthood; Pro-Choice Vote; Service Employees International Union; Sheet Metal Workers International Association; Sierra Club; The Thunder Road Group; United Food & Commercial Workers Union; United Progressive Alliance; USAction; Vagina Votes; Voices for Working Families; Vote for Change; Young Voter Alliance; and 21st Century Democrats. http://www.churchmilitant.tv/cia/02fake/102.pdf See also FrontPage Magazine - The Shadow Party: Part II Continued 2

Equivalence does not mean exact equality!

equivalence - definition of equivalence by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

e•quiv•a•lence (ɪˈkwɪv ə ləns or, for 3, ˌi kwəˈveɪ ləns)

n.
1. the state or fact of being equivalent; equality in value, force, significance, etc.
2. an instance of this; an equivalent.
3. the state of having equal chemical valence.
4. Logic.
a. the relation between two propositions such that they are either both true or both false.
b. the relation between two propositions such that each logically implies the other.
adj.
5. (of a logical or mathematical relationship) reflexive, symmetrical, and transitive.

Capiche?

 

[PoliticalChic]

So now I am a "simpleton", PC?

BTW thanks for the evidence that both sides are bought and paid for by elitists.

1. The proof of 'simpleton'?

That, in the face of the data that I provided, you still see an equivalence.




Here is more for you to ignore, or an opportunity to more out of the 'simpleton' category:



2. Soros money supported and catalyzed theMcCain-Feingold Act, which banned ‘soft money,’ stripping the two major parties of their financial base. This allowed Soros to create a “Shadow Party,” designed to funnel massive amounts of capital into organizations that would assume the role that the political parties traditionally played.

a. A 527 group is a private, tax-exempt political organization set up under Section 527 of the U.S. tax code. Such groups have been around for years but never took center stage until 2004, when they became major players. That's because McCain-Feingold shut the door on unlimited contributions (so-called "soft money") to political parties, so that many of the big-dollar donations began flowing to 527 groups instead. McCain-Feingold at Rest - Reason.com



3. The Shadow Party was born July 17, 2003, at Soros’s estate. It created the largest and most powerful juggernaut in American history.

Present were Madeleine Albright, John Podesta, John Pope (director of the Sierra Club), Andy Stern (SEIU), among others. The basic structure of the Shadow Party was a network of seven 527 organizations.

a. “… the network of nonprofit activist groups organized by George Soros and others to mobilize resources -- money, get-outthe-vote drives, campaign advertising and policy iniatives -- to elect Democratic candidates and guide the Democratic Party towards the left. The Internet fund-raising operation MoveOn.org is a key component.

The Shadow Party in this sense was conceived and organized principally by Soros, Hillary Clinton and Harold Ickes. Its efforts are amplified by, and coordinated with, key government unions and the activist groups associated with the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN). The key organizers of these groups are veterans of the Sixties left.”
http://www.churchmilitant.tv/cia/02fake/102.pdf


4. One part, called “America Votes” was referred to by one of its staffers as a “monster coalition” coordinating all of the left-wing grassroots groups including ACORN, Planned Parenthoood Action Fund, Sierra Club and the American Federation of Teachers and the SEIU. Soros contributed $23,700,000 in 2004.

a. As of 2004, an alphabetical list of Shadow Party groups included the following: Air America Radio; America Coming Together; America Votes; American Constitution Society; American Federation of Labor - Congress of Industrial Organizations; American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees; American Federation of Teachers; Anshell Media; Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now; Association of Trial Lawyers of America; Band of Progressives; Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence; Campaign for a Progressive Future; Campaign for America's Future; Center for American Progress; Clean Water Action; Communication Workers of America; The Constitution Project; DASH PAC; Defenders of Wildlife Action Fund; Democracy for America; Democratic Governors Associations; Democratic Legislative Campaign Committee; Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee; Dog Eat Dog Films; EMILY's List; Environment 2004; Gore/Lieberman Recount Committee; Hotel Employees & Restaurant Employees International Union; the Human Rights Campaign; INdTV; International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers; Joint Victory Campaign 2004; Laborers International Union of North American; League of Conservation Voters; New Democrat Network; The Media Fund; Media Matters for America; Million Mom March; Moving America Forward; MoveOn.org; Music for America; National Association for the Advancement of Colored People; NARAL Pro-Choice America; National Education Association; National Grassroots Alliance; National Jewish Democratic Council; National Treasury Employees Union; New American Optimists; New Democrat Network; Partnership for America's Families; People for the American Way; Phoenix Group; Planned Parenthood; Pro-Choice Vote; Service Employees International Union; Sheet Metal Workers International Association; Sierra Club; The Thunder Road Group; United Food & Commercial Workers Union; United Progressive Alliance; USAction; Vagina Votes; Voices for Working Families; Vote for Change; Young Voter Alliance; and 21st Century Democrats. http://www.churchmilitant.tv/cia/02fake/102.pdf See also FrontPage Magazine - The Shadow Party: Part II Continued 2

Equivalence does not mean exact equality!

equivalence - definition of equivalence by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

e•quiv•a•lence (ɪˈkwɪv ə ləns or, for 3, ˌi kwəˈveɪ ləns)

n.
1. the state or fact of being equivalent; equality in value, force, significance, etc.
2. an instance of this; an equivalent.
3. the state of having equal chemical valence.
4. Logic.
a. the relation between two propositions such that they are either both true or both false.
b. the relation between two propositions such that each logically implies the other.
adj.
5. (of a logical or mathematical relationship) reflexive, symmetrical, and transitive.

Capiche?

Kinda lost your argument right here: "equality in value,..."


Good to see you moving in the right (Right) direction.....

...keep going, and we'll have you out of that category.....

 

[TRFjr]

Just look at the lies, farrago, and missteps associated with the ObamaCare mess, and it is simple to connect same with the political philosophy responsible.

For those of us a bit slower on the uptake.....Daniel Henninger explains it.





1. " ...Obama is running out of human shields. With the father of ObamaCare unavailable to explain the greatest fiasco of his presidency to Congress, the American people had to settle Wednesday for his surrogate, Kathleen Sebelius.

2. .... not merely the failure of a federal website or a software program or Ms. Sebelius's management skills. This is the failure of the very idea of progressive government. Not liberal government. Progressive government.

3. ....what is happening this week to ObamaCare and the political class that created it is historic. Forty years from now, the millennials who in 2008 and 2012 believed in and voted for the progressive ideal—limitless, mandated, state-led goodness—can tell their grandchildren they watched it fall apart in 2013.




4. ....the American left, ... rebranded itself in the U.S. as the "progressive movement." Teddy Roosevelt invokes cheerier memories than Leon Trotsky....American progressives saw their win with Mr. Obama as the overthrowing of the postwar Democratic liberalism that culminated with the Clintons, a liberalism willing most of the time to coexist with markets, property and private enterprise.

5. What made [ObamaCare] peculiarly progressive were the mandates. And not just the law's individual and business mandates to purchase their insurance. The essence of modern Democratic progressivism is: "You will participate in what we have created for you, and you will comply with the law's demands."

[The Soviet Union attempted to create the New Soviet Man with gulags, psychiatric hospitals, and firing squads for seventy years and succeeded only in producing a more corrupt culture.” Bork, “Slouching Toward Gomorrah,” p. 198]

a. If this White House and its progressive ecosystem have a political motto, it's this: Get over it..... politics by cramdown.

[And those with the slave mentality still support it.]

b. .... the 20,000 inner-city parents and students who marched across the Brooklyn Bridge to protest obliteration of their charter schools by New York's progressive mayoral candidate, Bill de Blasio.



6..... it has become impossible not to recognize that the Affordable Care Act is an offensive ideological exercise, not merely an entitlement program. By Mr. Obama's own admission, this law is the way he wants the world to work in the U.S.—whether in health, education, energy, infrastructure or finance.





7. Most Republican politicians aren't particularly comfortable doing ideology. But the left revels in it. Mr. Obama bellows it in every speech. And absent someone shouting that the progressive emperor suddenly isn't wearing any clothes, they will win with it again.

8. Barack Obama may have spent a lifetime failing up, but eventually it's just failure. He has presided over five years of sickly economic growth, inadequate job creation, a doubling of the food stamp population and now this—ObamaCare.

9. Progressive government has failed in the U.S

10. Most fascinating to behold will be whether the Democratic presidential candidate who follows this meltdown will embrace it, fake it or move on."
Daniel Henninger: Progressive Government Fails - WSJ.com



The American People Get the Government They Deserve
Tocqueville.

Speaking of "greatest fiasco" and "offensive ideological exercises" how did that government shutdown/debt ceiling freeze work out for you, PC?

what shut down? oh ya the shut down where the Tea Party republicans tried to save us from this train wreck of Obama care.
the voters are not going to remember the shut down that effected a handful a year from now and if they do remember they will remember it as Tea Party Republicans trying to save this country from the pain and suffering caused by Obama care
And you called Ted Cruz stupid he just handed the republicans the senate

 

[Derideo_Te]

1. The proof of 'simpleton'?

That, in the face of the data that I provided, you still see an equivalence.




Here is more for you to ignore, or an opportunity to more out of the 'simpleton' category:



2. Soros money supported and catalyzed theMcCain-Feingold Act, which banned ‘soft money,’ stripping the two major parties of their financial base. This allowed Soros to create a “Shadow Party,” designed to funnel massive amounts of capital into organizations that would assume the role that the political parties traditionally played.

a. A 527 group is a private, tax-exempt political organization set up under Section 527 of the U.S. tax code. Such groups have been around for years but never took center stage until 2004, when they became major players. That's because McCain-Feingold shut the door on unlimited contributions (so-called "soft money") to political parties, so that many of the big-dollar donations began flowing to 527 groups instead. McCain-Feingold at Rest - Reason.com



3. The Shadow Party was born July 17, 2003, at Soros’s estate. It created the largest and most powerful juggernaut in American history.

Present were Madeleine Albright, John Podesta, John Pope (director of the Sierra Club), Andy Stern (SEIU), among others. The basic structure of the Shadow Party was a network of seven 527 organizations.

a. “… the network of nonprofit activist groups organized by George Soros and others to mobilize resources -- money, get-outthe-vote drives, campaign advertising and policy iniatives -- to elect Democratic candidates and guide the Democratic Party towards the left. The Internet fund-raising operation MoveOn.org is a key component.

The Shadow Party in this sense was conceived and organized principally by Soros, Hillary Clinton and Harold Ickes. Its efforts are amplified by, and coordinated with, key government unions and the activist groups associated with the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN). The key organizers of these groups are veterans of the Sixties left.”
http://www.churchmilitant.tv/cia/02fake/102.pdf


4. One part, called “America Votes” was referred to by one of its staffers as a “monster coalition” coordinating all of the left-wing grassroots groups including ACORN, Planned Parenthoood Action Fund, Sierra Club and the American Federation of Teachers and the SEIU. Soros contributed $23,700,000 in 2004.

a. As of 2004, an alphabetical list of Shadow Party groups included the following: Air America Radio; America Coming Together; America Votes; American Constitution Society; American Federation of Labor - Congress of Industrial Organizations; American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees; American Federation of Teachers; Anshell Media; Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now; Association of Trial Lawyers of America; Band of Progressives; Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence; Campaign for a Progressive Future; Campaign for America's Future; Center for American Progress; Clean Water Action; Communication Workers of America; The Constitution Project; DASH PAC; Defenders of Wildlife Action Fund; Democracy for America; Democratic Governors Associations; Democratic Legislative Campaign Committee; Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee; Dog Eat Dog Films; EMILY's List; Environment 2004; Gore/Lieberman Recount Committee; Hotel Employees & Restaurant Employees International Union; the Human Rights Campaign; INdTV; International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers; Joint Victory Campaign 2004; Laborers International Union of North American; League of Conservation Voters; New Democrat Network; The Media Fund; Media Matters for America; Million Mom March; Moving America Forward; MoveOn.org; Music for America; National Association for the Advancement of Colored People; NARAL Pro-Choice America; National Education Association; National Grassroots Alliance; National Jewish Democratic Council; National Treasury Employees Union; New American Optimists; New Democrat Network; Partnership for America's Families; People for the American Way; Phoenix Group; Planned Parenthood; Pro-Choice Vote; Service Employees International Union; Sheet Metal Workers International Association; Sierra Club; The Thunder Road Group; United Food & Commercial Workers Union; United Progressive Alliance; USAction; Vagina Votes; Voices for Working Families; Vote for Change; Young Voter Alliance; and 21st Century Democrats. http://www.churchmilitant.tv/cia/02fake/102.pdf See also FrontPage Magazine - The Shadow Party: Part II Continued 2

Equivalence does not mean exact equality!

equivalence - definition of equivalence by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

e•quiv•a•lence (ɪˈkwɪv ə ləns or, for 3, ˌi kwəˈveɪ ləns)

n.
1. the state or fact of being equivalent; equality in value, force, significance, etc.
2. an instance of this; an equivalent.
3. the state of having equal chemical valence.
4. Logic.
a. the relation between two propositions such that they are either both true or both false.
b. the relation between two propositions such that each logically implies the other.
adj.
5. (of a logical or mathematical relationship) reflexive, symmetrical, and transitive.

Capiche?

Kinda lost your argument right here: "equality in value,..."


Good to see you moving in the right (Right) direction.....

...keep going, and we'll have you out of that category.....

So you appreciate that the term "right" has more than one meaning but reject the concept when it comes to "equivalence"?

I doubt that I will ever make it to the far right because I am incapable of that kind of dissonance myself.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Just look at the lies, farrago, and missteps associated with the ObamaCare mess, and it is simple to connect same with the political philosophy responsible.

For those of us a bit slower on the uptake.....Daniel Henninger explains it.





1. " ...Obama is running out of human shields. With the father of ObamaCare unavailable to explain the greatest fiasco of his presidency to Congress, the American people had to settle Wednesday for his surrogate, Kathleen Sebelius.

2. .... not merely the failure of a federal website or a software program or Ms. Sebelius's management skills. This is the failure of the very idea of progressive government. Not liberal government. Progressive government.

3. ....what is happening this week to ObamaCare and the political class that created it is historic. Forty years from now, the millennials who in 2008 and 2012 believed in and voted for the progressive ideal—limitless, mandated, state-led goodness—can tell their grandchildren they watched it fall apart in 2013.




4. ....the American left, ... rebranded itself in the U.S. as the "progressive movement." Teddy Roosevelt invokes cheerier memories than Leon Trotsky....American progressives saw their win with Mr. Obama as the overthrowing of the postwar Democratic liberalism that culminated with the Clintons, a liberalism willing most of the time to coexist with markets, property and private enterprise.

5. What made [ObamaCare] peculiarly progressive were the mandates. And not just the law's individual and business mandates to purchase their insurance. The essence of modern Democratic progressivism is: "You will participate in what we have created for you, and you will comply with the law's demands."

[The Soviet Union attempted to create the New Soviet Man with gulags, psychiatric hospitals, and firing squads for seventy years and succeeded only in producing a more corrupt culture.” Bork, “Slouching Toward Gomorrah,” p. 198]

a. If this White House and its progressive ecosystem have a political motto, it's this: Get over it..... politics by cramdown.

[And those with the slave mentality still support it.]

b. .... the 20,000 inner-city parents and students who marched across the Brooklyn Bridge to protest obliteration of their charter schools by New York's progressive mayoral candidate, Bill de Blasio.



6..... it has become impossible not to recognize that the Affordable Care Act is an offensive ideological exercise, not merely an entitlement program. By Mr. Obama's own admission, this law is the way he wants the world to work in the U.S.—whether in health, education, energy, infrastructure or finance.





7. Most Republican politicians aren't particularly comfortable doing ideology. But the left revels in it. Mr. Obama bellows it in every speech. And absent someone shouting that the progressive emperor suddenly isn't wearing any clothes, they will win with it again.

8. Barack Obama may have spent a lifetime failing up, but eventually it's just failure. He has presided over five years of sickly economic growth, inadequate job creation, a doubling of the food stamp population and now this—ObamaCare.

9. Progressive government has failed in the U.S

10. Most fascinating to behold will be whether the Democratic presidential candidate who follows this meltdown will embrace it, fake it or move on."
Daniel Henninger: Progressive Government Fails - WSJ.com



The American People Get the Government They Deserve
Tocqueville.

Speaking of "greatest fiasco" and "offensive ideological exercises" how did that government shutdown/debt ceiling freeze work out for you, PC?

what shut down? oh ya the shut down where the Tea Party republicans tried to save us from this train wreck of Obama care.
the voters are not going to remember the shut down that effected a handful a year from now and if they do remember they will remember it as Tea Party Republicans trying to save this country from the pain and suffering caused by Obama care
And you called Ted Cruz stupid he just handed the republicans the senate

If this was still the last century I would agree with you that voter's memories would not last until the elections in 2014. But we live in a different world today. Not only have our sources of information altered radically but the voting demographics are shifting too. There is no longer the expectation that 2014 will be a repeat of history.

 

[JakeStarkey]

We have had progressive government since 1903 and social market democracy since then as well.

We are the strongest country in the world.

OP fail.

 

[Neotrotsky]

The Left and Obama apologists just had another setback
for their radical leftist agenda:


DC appellate court rules against HHS contraception mandate, for religious liberty

The Obama administration said that the requirement is necessary to protect women’s health and abortion rights. The judges were unconvinced that forcing companies to violate their religious rights was appropriate.

Brown wrote that “it is clear the government has failed to demonstrate how such a right — whether described as noninterference, privacy, or autonomy — can extend to the compelled subsidization of a woman’s procreative practices.”

“The provision of these services — even without the contraceptive mandate — by and large fulfills the statutory command for insurers to provide gender-specific preventive care,” she wrote. “At the very least, the statutory scheme will not go to pieces.”​

The HHS mandate burdens their exercise of religion by pressuring them to approve and endorse the inclusion of objectionable coverage in their companies’ health plans. “They can either abide by the sacred tenets of their faith, pay a penalty of over $14 million, and cripple the companies they have spent a lifetime building, or they become complicit in a grave moral wrong.” (Slip op. at 20; see generally pp. 17-23.) The government’s supposedly compelling interest is nebulous (slip op. at 23-28), and even if it were compelling, the HHS mandate is not the least restrictive means of furthering that interest (slip op. at 28-32.)​

 

[Derideo_Te]

The Left and Obama apologists just had another setback
for their radical leftist agenda:


DC appellate court rules against HHS contraception mandate, for religious liberty

The Obama administration said that the requirement is necessary to protect women’s health and abortion rights. The judges were unconvinced that forcing companies to violate their religious rights was appropriate.

Brown wrote that “it is clear the government has failed to demonstrate how such a right — whether described as noninterference, privacy, or autonomy — can extend to the compelled subsidization of a woman’s procreative practices.”

“The provision of these services — even without the contraceptive mandate — by and large fulfills the statutory command for insurers to provide gender-specific preventive care,” she wrote. “At the very least, the statutory scheme will not go to pieces.”​

The HHS mandate burdens their exercise of religion by pressuring them to approve and endorse the inclusion of objectionable coverage in their companies’ health plans. “They can either abide by the sacred tenets of their faith, pay a penalty of over $14 million, and cripple the companies they have spent a lifetime building, or they become complicit in a grave moral wrong.” (Slip op. at 20; see generally pp. 17-23.) The government’s supposedly compelling interest is nebulous (slip op. at 23-28), and even if it were compelling, the HHS mandate is not the least restrictive means of furthering that interest (slip op. at 28-32.)​

"Religious Liberty" does not exist in commerce. Corporations are not people and do not have 1st Amendment rights to freedom of religion. Obviously this is just another attack on the 1st Amendment and given the current make up of the Supreme Court we might end up with yet another Citizens United travesty of justice. At least that is what this lawsuit is hoping will be the outcome. Should that occur the unintended consequences will be dire. Corporations will be allowed to fire people simply because they don't belong to a particular religion or believe in creation.

 

[Neotrotsky]

Religious liberty won today
that is the important thing

Only the radical left or Obama apologists would
think it is a bad thing

 

[Derideo_Te]

Religious liberty won today
that is the important thing

Actually it took a hit but not surprising that you don't understand the consequences of what you are trying to do.

Assume for the sake of argument that this case wins in the SCOTUS. They will have handed Congress the power to regulate religious liberties just as they can regulate corporations. Is that really what you want to happen to "religious liberty"? To have a bunch of bozos in Congress decide that corporations must provide chapels, mosques, prayer rooms, etc on their premises? How about a regulation requiring that corporations must provide paid time off to attend services for those who are working on holy days? How much are those regulations going to cost corporations? But under the Supreme Court ruling that you are seeking that could easily be the future.

 

[Neotrotsky]

Big assumptions
just like Papa Obama care is going to save money

Strange that you apparently are happy with a group of political elites in the Obama administration
regulating it



Obama lied
Healthcare plans and American trust died

 

[Derideo_Te]

Big assumptions
just like Papa Obama care is going to save money

Strange that you apparently are happy with a group of political elites in the Obama administration
regulating it



Obama lied
Healthcare plans and American trust died

Based upon past precedents. That saying about being careful what you wish for because you might just get it was based on this kind of scenario.

As far as "elitists" go both sides have elitists calling the shots. Blind partisanship like that is just another term for hypocrisy.

 

[Neotrotsky]

right now the left is using elitists with the power of the gov't
big difference

 

[Derideo_Te]

right now the left is using elitists with the power of the gov't
big difference

As opposed to having energy elitists with the power of government during the prior administration?

 

[Neotrotsky]

who respected the Constitution more than this one
sure

 

[Derideo_Te]

who respected the Constitution more than this one
sure

The prior administration came up with the Patriot Act that stomped all over the rights of Americans. They even violated the rights of citizens by denying them the right to Habeas Corpus and when it came to spying on Americans they pretty much ignored the FISA court entirely.

 

[Neotrotsky]

and Papa Obama has quadrupled warrant-less wiretaps

 

[Derideo_Te]

and Papa Obama has quadrupled warrant-less wiretaps