Protests for $15-an-hour wages set to expand Wednesday

[Marxist]

15 bucks an hour to toss a burger? PAHLEASE.

Have you ever worked fast food. Those people bust their ass and deal with asshole customers. You can call the position inferior if you want, but it's non stop productivity for these restaurant and they get paid jack shit.

It's a job that can be done by a trained chimp. It is unskilled labor and pays appropriately.

You cons are painfully dumb. Just because it is entry level does not mean it isn't hard work. It is non stop productivity with asshole customers on top. They deserve decent pay.

You just don't get it, do you?

It doesn't matter. The value of labor, isn't determine by 'how hard it is'. Nor is the value of labor determined by how many years you have done it. Nor is it determined by the employer, or the employee.

If my CEO could simply 'decide' that my labor was worth a Million dollars an hour, he would. He would LOVE to charge the customers a million dollars an hour, to have me screw together a printer.

But my CEO has ZERO ability to determine that.

There is only ONE PERSON who determines how much labor is worth. The customer.

McDonalds would LOVE to charge $30 for a Big Mac, and pay the employees $25/hr. Just one problem... the customers wont' pay for it. At least not at the level they do in the US.

If you travel to Norway, you'll find out they pay employees at the McDonald, about $15/hr. Great! But.... the cost of a Big Mac, is... about $15. And by the way, Norway has no Minimum wage at all.

Well then clearly they still have stores, and customers are willing to pay that much in Norway! Well... not really. Most of the McDonald stores are in tourist areas. Norway, has about 1/10th the number of McDonald we have. Why? Because customers are NOT willing to pay for McDonald all the time when it's $15 for a big mac.

If you raise the prices of food at US McDonald, to be equal to that of Norway McDonald, thousands of McDonalds are going to close. The only places that will remain open, are in tourist areas, and high price areas, just like the only McDonald in Norway are in high price tourist areas.

The result will be exactly the same that we see in Norway. A fraction of the stores. Which means that all those people who have jobs right now, will be unemployed.

Again, what is my point? My point is that the wage is determined by the customers. If the customers are not willing to pay $15 for a big mac, then it doesn't matter what law you want to pass, the store can't pay the employee $15/hr.

Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers.

I've done that in my own life. I loved Chipotle. I still love Chipotle. When it was $4.75 for a burrito, I went there all the time. Now that it's $6.50, I honestly don't go there often. I typically go to Walmart and buy their $3.29 sub.

Now if you drive up the wages enough, you'll see fewer and fewer people going to those stores, and they will eventually close, the ones not in high priced areas. Obviously in New York, where prices are already much higher than the minimum wage, nothing much will change.

But in areas like Ohio, where a $5 burrito was normal... yeah customers are going to change their habits, and those employees will be laid off, earning zero, instead of the minimum wage.

This is how economics works. It doesn't really care about your political agenda.

If customers determined the price, everything would be virtually free, instead, prices are rising when wages are stagnant, people are having to cut back in the middle class...

 

[Marxist]

"Now if you drive up the wages enough, you'll see fewer and fewer people going to those stores, and they will eventually close, the ones not in high priced areas. Obviously in New York, where prices are already much higher than the minimum wage, nothing much will change."
When has this happened with the wage increases throughout american history.

 

[Marxist]

"Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers."
That's not how it works at all, and the higher wage balances this out. Fewer customers? We need to get rid of the minimum wage then, with your logic.

 

[Marxist]

"f the customers are not willing to pay $15 for a big mac,"
LOL, as if that would be the price.

 

[dblack]

"Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers."
That's not how it works at all, and the higher wage balances this out. Fewer customers? We need to get rid of the minimum wage then, with your logic.

I'm just surprised none of these greedy companies have figured this out. They must not have anyone as smart as you working for them.

 

[Marxist]

"Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers."
That's not how it works at all, and the higher wage balances this out. Fewer customers? We need to get rid of the minimum wage then, with your logic.

I'm just surprised none of these greedy companies have figured this out. They must not have anyone as smart as you working for them.

 

[Mac1958]

If someone doesn't understand that the market usually sets the price of a product or service, further conversation is most likely a waste of effort.

.

 

[Billy000]

15 bucks an hour to toss a burger? PAHLEASE.

Have you ever worked fast food. Those people bust their ass and deal with asshole customers. You can call the position inferior if you want, but it's non stop productivity for these restaurant and they get paid jack shit.

It's a job that can be done by a trained chimp. It is unskilled labor and pays appropriately.

You cons are painfully dumb. Just because it is entry level does not mean it isn't hard work. It is non stop productivity with asshole customers on top. They deserve decent pay.

You just don't get it, do you?

It doesn't matter. The value of labor, isn't determine by 'how hard it is'. Nor is the value of labor determined by how many years you have done it. Nor is it determined by the employer, or the employee.

If my CEO could simply 'decide' that my labor was worth a Million dollars an hour, he would. He would LOVE to charge the customers a million dollars an hour, to have me screw together a printer.

But my CEO has ZERO ability to determine that.

There is only ONE PERSON who determines how much labor is worth. The customer.

McDonalds would LOVE to charge $30 for a Big Mac, and pay the employees $25/hr. Just one problem... the customers wont' pay for it. At least not at the level they do in the US.

If you travel to Norway, you'll find out they pay employees at the McDonald, about $15/hr. Great! But.... the cost of a Big Mac, is... about $15. And by the way, Norway has no Minimum wage at all.

Well then clearly they still have stores, and customers are willing to pay that much in Norway! Well... not really. Most of the McDonald stores are in tourist areas. Norway, has about 1/10th the number of McDonald we have. Why? Because customers are NOT willing to pay for McDonald all the time when it's $15 for a big mac.

If you raise the prices of food at US McDonald, to be equal to that of Norway McDonald, thousands of McDonalds are going to close. The only places that will remain open, are in tourist areas, and high price areas, just like the only McDonald in Norway are in high price tourist areas.

The result will be exactly the same that we see in Norway. A fraction of the stores. Which means that all those people who have jobs right now, will be unemployed.

Again, what is my point? My point is that the wage is determined by the customers. If the customers are not willing to pay $15 for a big mac, then it doesn't matter what law you want to pass, the store can't pay the employee $15/hr.

Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers.

I've done that in my own life. I loved Chipotle. I still love Chipotle. When it was $4.75 for a burrito, I went there all the time. Now that it's $6.50, I honestly don't go there often. I typically go to Walmart and buy their $3.29 sub.

Now if you drive up the wages enough, you'll see fewer and fewer people going to those stores, and they will eventually close, the ones not in high priced areas. Obviously in New York, where prices are already much higher than the minimum wage, nothing much will change.

But in areas like Ohio, where a $5 burrito was normal... yeah customers are going to change their habits, and those employees will be laid off, earning zero, instead of the minimum wage.

This is how economics works. It doesn't really care about your political agenda.

Ok as usual you cons have the hardest time with nuance. If you raised the minimum wage to $15, the price increase wouldn't even come close to offset the extra few hundred dollars a month an employee would then make. In fact, the extra consumer demand would bring prices down over time. The initial price increase at McDonald's for instance would only be a 20 cents or so on SOME items.

 

[dblack]

If someone doesn't understand that the market usually sets the price of a product or service, further conversation is most likely a waste of effort.

.

Depends on your goals. It can be sorta funny.

 

[Andylusion]

And how do they come to this conclusion exactly? Quantitatively.

By how much their customers are willing to spend. And how much the employees demand. That's pretty much it. "Deserve" doesn't enter into it.

If the minimum wage rose to $15:
From forbes. Doesn't seem like that much at all, and it isn't, considering that those same minimum wage workers would have more disposable income, etc..

It's not that much. But it's not nothing. Do you think it will result in more sales? Or less?

More sales, since more people would have disposable income.

Then they should totally crank on that idea. Have you contacted McDonald's headquarters?

They should crank on it, but short term profits are more important for the capitalist.

Not necessarily. Investors in established companies like McDonalds are usually looking at long term investments. With your insight, they could clean up.

First off, the concept that raising the minimum wage will cause an economic boost, is just wrong. It has NEVER played out that way.

By that logic, 2007 to 2009, should have been BOOM years. We should have had the biggest increase in our economy in decades, because that was the largest minimum wage boost in 30 years.

Instead.... we had a crash.

Greece also had a large minimum wage, and it was indexed to inflation. Greece should have had a booming economy, and instead had unemployment rate of 28%, and a near national economic collapse.

Singapore alternatively, has absolutely no minimum wage at all. The highest the unemployment rate in Singapore during the world wide recession, was 3.4%.

The UK and Ireland both have a minimum wage.

When the recession hit the UK, they actually CUT their minimum wage. As a result, unemployment topped out at 8% and began to fall.

Alternatively, Ireland raised their minimum wage even higher than the UK, and kept it steady. Their unemployment rate went all they way to 15%, and remained high all the way through 2012. Even today, 2015, the Ireland unemployment rate is STILL 10%.

This backward screw ball theory that raising the minimum wage will not harm the economy, but be a boost to the economy.... there is not one single example in all human history, and in any nation throughout the world, in which that has been the case. And plenty showing the reverse.

So about the Forbes article....

The forbes calculations are all bogus. The calculations assume that suppliers of McDonald's will not raise prices. Yet many of those suppliers also rely on low-wage labor. Thus the price of bread, beef, and other things, will go up.

Further, the Forbes article fails to grasp that wages throughout the store will also be forced up. When I was working at McDonald, my shift manager was paid only a dollar more. Well if my wages goes up $3, my shift manager is not going to do those duties earning the same amount as me. That person will have to be paid more. And the assistant manager, is not going to be paid the same as the shift manager. And the store manager is most certainly not going to be paid the same as the assistant manager.

On up the chain, the wages will have to rise. The Forbes article calculations, all assumed that only the minimum wage employees, those currently earning minimum wage, will be the only ones getting a wage increase, and that all the other employees, those who have been there for years, those who are full time over part time, those who are all in management and training positions... all of them will all just be content to have the same wage as the minimum wage employees...... Well of course not.

That's never going to happen. Wages across the board will have to rise.

Again, if the Forbes article is right, then in Norway where employees are paid $15/hr, the Big Mac should be only $6.66 in Norway. But it's not. It's $15. So clearly the article is completely wrong.

 

[Mac1958]

If someone doesn't understand that the market usually sets the price of a product or service, further conversation is most likely a waste of effort.

.

Depends on your goals. It can be sorta funny.

Okay, fair point there...

.

 

[Andylusion]

15 bucks an hour to toss a burger? PAHLEASE.

Have you ever worked fast food. Those people bust their ass and deal with asshole customers. You can call the position inferior if you want, but it's non stop productivity for these restaurant and they get paid jack shit.

It's a job that can be done by a trained chimp. It is unskilled labor and pays appropriately.

You cons are painfully dumb. Just because it is entry level does not mean it isn't hard work. It is non stop productivity with asshole customers on top. They deserve decent pay.

You just don't get it, do you?

It doesn't matter. The value of labor, isn't determine by 'how hard it is'. Nor is the value of labor determined by how many years you have done it. Nor is it determined by the employer, or the employee.

If my CEO could simply 'decide' that my labor was worth a Million dollars an hour, he would. He would LOVE to charge the customers a million dollars an hour, to have me screw together a printer.

But my CEO has ZERO ability to determine that.

There is only ONE PERSON who determines how much labor is worth. The customer.

McDonalds would LOVE to charge $30 for a Big Mac, and pay the employees $25/hr. Just one problem... the customers wont' pay for it. At least not at the level they do in the US.

If you travel to Norway, you'll find out they pay employees at the McDonald, about $15/hr. Great! But.... the cost of a Big Mac, is... about $15. And by the way, Norway has no Minimum wage at all.

Well then clearly they still have stores, and customers are willing to pay that much in Norway! Well... not really. Most of the McDonald stores are in tourist areas. Norway, has about 1/10th the number of McDonald we have. Why? Because customers are NOT willing to pay for McDonald all the time when it's $15 for a big mac.

If you raise the prices of food at US McDonald, to be equal to that of Norway McDonald, thousands of McDonalds are going to close. The only places that will remain open, are in tourist areas, and high price areas, just like the only McDonald in Norway are in high price tourist areas.

The result will be exactly the same that we see in Norway. A fraction of the stores. Which means that all those people who have jobs right now, will be unemployed.

Again, what is my point? My point is that the wage is determined by the customers. If the customers are not willing to pay $15 for a big mac, then it doesn't matter what law you want to pass, the store can't pay the employee $15/hr.

Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers.

I've done that in my own life. I loved Chipotle. I still love Chipotle. When it was $4.75 for a burrito, I went there all the time. Now that it's $6.50, I honestly don't go there often. I typically go to Walmart and buy their $3.29 sub.

Now if you drive up the wages enough, you'll see fewer and fewer people going to those stores, and they will eventually close, the ones not in high priced areas. Obviously in New York, where prices are already much higher than the minimum wage, nothing much will change.

But in areas like Ohio, where a $5 burrito was normal... yeah customers are going to change their habits, and those employees will be laid off, earning zero, instead of the minimum wage.

This is how economics works. It doesn't really care about your political agenda.

Ok as usual you cons have the hardest time with nuance. If you raised the minimum wage to $15, the price increase wouldn't even come close to offset the extra few hundred dollars a month an employee would then make. In fact, the extra consumer demand would bring prices down over time. The initial price increase at McDonald's for instance would only be a 20 cents or so on SOME items.

Then why is it in Norway and other countries where they pay $15/hr, the price is $15 for a big mac?

You keep making claims, but the facts don't support that.

 

[Marxist]

By how much their customers are willing to spend. And how much the employees demand. That's pretty much it. "Deserve" doesn't enter into it.

It's not that much. But it's not nothing. Do you think it will result in more sales? Or less?

More sales, since more people would have disposable income.

Then they should totally crank on that idea. Have you contacted McDonald's headquarters?

They should crank on it, but short term profits are more important for the capitalist.

Not necessarily. Investors in established companies like McDonalds are usually looking at long term investments. With your insight, they could clean up.

First off, the concept that raising the minimum wage will cause an economic boost, is just wrong. It has NEVER played out that way.

By that logic, 2007 to 2009, should have been BOOM years. We should have had the biggest increase in our economy in decades, because that was the largest minimum wage boost in 30 years.

Instead.... we had a crash.

Greece also had a large minimum wage, and it was indexed to inflation. Greece should have had a booming economy, and instead had unemployment rate of 28%, and a near national economic collapse.

Singapore alternatively, has absolutely no minimum wage at all. The highest the unemployment rate in Singapore during the world wide recession, was 3.4%.

The UK and Ireland both have a minimum wage.

When the recession hit the UK, they actually CUT their minimum wage. As a result, unemployment topped out at 8% and began to fall.

Alternatively, Ireland raised their minimum wage even higher than the UK, and kept it steady. Their unemployment rate went all they way to 15%, and remained high all the way through 2012. Even today, 2015, the Ireland unemployment rate is STILL 10%.

This backward screw ball theory that raising the minimum wage will not harm the economy, but be a boost to the economy.... there is not one single example in all human history, and in any nation throughout the world, in which that has been the case. And plenty showing the reverse.

So about the Forbes article....

The forbes calculations are all bogus. The calculations assume that suppliers of McDonald's will not raise prices. Yet many of those suppliers also rely on low-wage labor. Thus the price of bread, beef, and other things, will go up.

Further, the Forbes article fails to grasp that wages throughout the store will also be forced up. When I was working at McDonald, my shift manager was paid only a dollar more. Well if my wages goes up $3, my shift manager is not going to do those duties earning the same amount as me. That person will have to be paid more. And the assistant manager, is not going to be paid the same as the shift manager. And the store manager is most certainly not going to be paid the same as the assistant manager.

On up the chain, the wages will have to rise. The Forbes article calculations, all assumed that only the minimum wage employees, those currently earning minimum wage, will be the only ones getting a wage increase, and that all the other employees, those who have been there for years, those who are full time over part time, those who are all in management and training positions... all of them will all just be content to have the same wage as the minimum wage employees...... Well of course not.

That's never going to happen. Wages across the board will have to rise.

Again, if the Forbes article is right, then in Norway where employees are paid $15/hr, the Big Mac should be only $6.66 in Norway. But it's not. It's $15. So clearly the article is completely wrong.

Drawing hilarious connections? Check. Failing to understand inflation? Check. Claiming that managers won't be paid more? Check.
"This backward screw ball theory that raising the minimum wage will not harm the economy, but be a boost to the economy.... there is not one single example in all human history, and in any nation throughout the world, in which that has been the case. And plenty showing the reverse."
Utter bullshit, and what the fuck do you suggest, no minimum wage? That was doing fantastic, obviously, unless you want to be like: BUT FORRRDDDDD. Using singapore as a positive example is hilarious, considering it's a benevolent dictatorship, with a almost completely state controlled economy. LOL. Trying to blame the minimum wage on the crash is the high tone of your idiocy.

 

[Billy000]

Have you ever worked fast food. Those people bust their ass and deal with asshole customers. You can call the position inferior if you want, but it's non stop productivity for these restaurant and they get paid jack shit.

It's a job that can be done by a trained chimp. It is unskilled labor and pays appropriately.

You cons are painfully dumb. Just because it is entry level does not mean it isn't hard work. It is non stop productivity with asshole customers on top. They deserve decent pay.

You just don't get it, do you?

It doesn't matter. The value of labor, isn't determine by 'how hard it is'. Nor is the value of labor determined by how many years you have done it. Nor is it determined by the employer, or the employee.

If my CEO could simply 'decide' that my labor was worth a Million dollars an hour, he would. He would LOVE to charge the customers a million dollars an hour, to have me screw together a printer.

But my CEO has ZERO ability to determine that.

There is only ONE PERSON who determines how much labor is worth. The customer.

McDonalds would LOVE to charge $30 for a Big Mac, and pay the employees $25/hr. Just one problem... the customers wont' pay for it. At least not at the level they do in the US.

If you travel to Norway, you'll find out they pay employees at the McDonald, about $15/hr. Great! But.... the cost of a Big Mac, is... about $15. And by the way, Norway has no Minimum wage at all.

Well then clearly they still have stores, and customers are willing to pay that much in Norway! Well... not really. Most of the McDonald stores are in tourist areas. Norway, has about 1/10th the number of McDonald we have. Why? Because customers are NOT willing to pay for McDonald all the time when it's $15 for a big mac.

If you raise the prices of food at US McDonald, to be equal to that of Norway McDonald, thousands of McDonalds are going to close. The only places that will remain open, are in tourist areas, and high price areas, just like the only McDonald in Norway are in high price tourist areas.

The result will be exactly the same that we see in Norway. A fraction of the stores. Which means that all those people who have jobs right now, will be unemployed.

Again, what is my point? My point is that the wage is determined by the customers. If the customers are not willing to pay $15 for a big mac, then it doesn't matter what law you want to pass, the store can't pay the employee $15/hr.

Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers.

I've done that in my own life. I loved Chipotle. I still love Chipotle. When it was $4.75 for a burrito, I went there all the time. Now that it's $6.50, I honestly don't go there often. I typically go to Walmart and buy their $3.29 sub.

Now if you drive up the wages enough, you'll see fewer and fewer people going to those stores, and they will eventually close, the ones not in high priced areas. Obviously in New York, where prices are already much higher than the minimum wage, nothing much will change.

But in areas like Ohio, where a $5 burrito was normal... yeah customers are going to change their habits, and those employees will be laid off, earning zero, instead of the minimum wage.

This is how economics works. It doesn't really care about your political agenda.

Ok as usual you cons have the hardest time with nuance. If you raised the minimum wage to $15, the price increase wouldn't even come close to offset the extra few hundred dollars a month an employee would then make. In fact, the extra consumer demand would bring prices down over time. The initial price increase at McDonald's for instance would only be a 20 cents or so on SOME items.

Then why is it in Norway and other countries where they pay $15/hr, the price is $15 for a big mac?

You keep making claims, but the facts don't support that.

Dude you're comparing a small European country to the US. Our economy is massive by comparison. Norway doesn't even come close to the demand power the US has.

Lol taxes and social security are taken out already, so yeah, a few extra hundred per month. This isn't rocket science.

 

[Marxist]

Have you ever worked fast food. Those people bust their ass and deal with asshole customers. You can call the position inferior if you want, but it's non stop productivity for these restaurant and they get paid jack shit.

It's a job that can be done by a trained chimp. It is unskilled labor and pays appropriately.

You cons are painfully dumb. Just because it is entry level does not mean it isn't hard work. It is non stop productivity with asshole customers on top. They deserve decent pay.

You just don't get it, do you?

It doesn't matter. The value of labor, isn't determine by 'how hard it is'. Nor is the value of labor determined by how many years you have done it. Nor is it determined by the employer, or the employee.

If my CEO could simply 'decide' that my labor was worth a Million dollars an hour, he would. He would LOVE to charge the customers a million dollars an hour, to have me screw together a printer.

But my CEO has ZERO ability to determine that.

There is only ONE PERSON who determines how much labor is worth. The customer.

McDonalds would LOVE to charge $30 for a Big Mac, and pay the employees $25/hr. Just one problem... the customers wont' pay for it. At least not at the level they do in the US.

If you travel to Norway, you'll find out they pay employees at the McDonald, about $15/hr. Great! But.... the cost of a Big Mac, is... about $15. And by the way, Norway has no Minimum wage at all.

Well then clearly they still have stores, and customers are willing to pay that much in Norway! Well... not really. Most of the McDonald stores are in tourist areas. Norway, has about 1/10th the number of McDonald we have. Why? Because customers are NOT willing to pay for McDonald all the time when it's $15 for a big mac.

If you raise the prices of food at US McDonald, to be equal to that of Norway McDonald, thousands of McDonalds are going to close. The only places that will remain open, are in tourist areas, and high price areas, just like the only McDonald in Norway are in high price tourist areas.

The result will be exactly the same that we see in Norway. A fraction of the stores. Which means that all those people who have jobs right now, will be unemployed.

Again, what is my point? My point is that the wage is determined by the customers. If the customers are not willing to pay $15 for a big mac, then it doesn't matter what law you want to pass, the store can't pay the employee $15/hr.

Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers.

I've done that in my own life. I loved Chipotle. I still love Chipotle. When it was $4.75 for a burrito, I went there all the time. Now that it's $6.50, I honestly don't go there often. I typically go to Walmart and buy their $3.29 sub.

Now if you drive up the wages enough, you'll see fewer and fewer people going to those stores, and they will eventually close, the ones not in high priced areas. Obviously in New York, where prices are already much higher than the minimum wage, nothing much will change.

But in areas like Ohio, where a $5 burrito was normal... yeah customers are going to change their habits, and those employees will be laid off, earning zero, instead of the minimum wage.

This is how economics works. It doesn't really care about your political agenda.

Ok as usual you cons have the hardest time with nuance. If you raised the minimum wage to $15, the price increase wouldn't even come close to offset the extra few hundred dollars a month an employee would then make. In fact, the extra consumer demand would bring prices down over time. The initial price increase at McDonald's for instance would only be a 20 cents or so on SOME items.

Then why is it in Norway and other countries where they pay $15/hr, the price is $15 for a big mac?

You keep making claims, but the facts don't support that.

Keep spewing bullshit. Big Mac index 2015 Statistic

 

[Marxist]

It's a job that can be done by a trained chimp. It is unskilled labor and pays appropriately.

You cons are painfully dumb. Just because it is entry level does not mean it isn't hard work. It is non stop productivity with asshole customers on top. They deserve decent pay.

You just don't get it, do you?

It doesn't matter. The value of labor, isn't determine by 'how hard it is'. Nor is the value of labor determined by how many years you have done it. Nor is it determined by the employer, or the employee.

If my CEO could simply 'decide' that my labor was worth a Million dollars an hour, he would. He would LOVE to charge the customers a million dollars an hour, to have me screw together a printer.

But my CEO has ZERO ability to determine that.

There is only ONE PERSON who determines how much labor is worth. The customer.

McDonalds would LOVE to charge $30 for a Big Mac, and pay the employees $25/hr. Just one problem... the customers wont' pay for it. At least not at the level they do in the US.

If you travel to Norway, you'll find out they pay employees at the McDonald, about $15/hr. Great! But.... the cost of a Big Mac, is... about $15. And by the way, Norway has no Minimum wage at all.

Well then clearly they still have stores, and customers are willing to pay that much in Norway! Well... not really. Most of the McDonald stores are in tourist areas. Norway, has about 1/10th the number of McDonald we have. Why? Because customers are NOT willing to pay for McDonald all the time when it's $15 for a big mac.

If you raise the prices of food at US McDonald, to be equal to that of Norway McDonald, thousands of McDonalds are going to close. The only places that will remain open, are in tourist areas, and high price areas, just like the only McDonald in Norway are in high price tourist areas.

The result will be exactly the same that we see in Norway. A fraction of the stores. Which means that all those people who have jobs right now, will be unemployed.

Again, what is my point? My point is that the wage is determined by the customers. If the customers are not willing to pay $15 for a big mac, then it doesn't matter what law you want to pass, the store can't pay the employee $15/hr.

Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers.

I've done that in my own life. I loved Chipotle. I still love Chipotle. When it was $4.75 for a burrito, I went there all the time. Now that it's $6.50, I honestly don't go there often. I typically go to Walmart and buy their $3.29 sub.

Now if you drive up the wages enough, you'll see fewer and fewer people going to those stores, and they will eventually close, the ones not in high priced areas. Obviously in New York, where prices are already much higher than the minimum wage, nothing much will change.

But in areas like Ohio, where a $5 burrito was normal... yeah customers are going to change their habits, and those employees will be laid off, earning zero, instead of the minimum wage.

This is how economics works. It doesn't really care about your political agenda.

Ok as usual you cons have the hardest time with nuance. If you raised the minimum wage to $15, the price increase wouldn't even come close to offset the extra few hundred dollars a month an employee would then make. In fact, the extra consumer demand would bring prices down over time. The initial price increase at McDonald's for instance would only be a 20 cents or so on SOME items.

Then why is it in Norway and other countries where they pay $15/hr, the price is $15 for a big mac?

You keep making claims, but the facts don't support that.

Dude you're comparing a small European country to the US. Our economy is massive by comparison. Norway doesn't even come close to the demand power the US has.

Lol taxes and social security are taken out already, so yeah, a few extra hundred per month. This isn't rocket science.

He lied about the price as well.
Big Mac index 2015 Statistic
OH, AND LOOK, FINLAND IS BELOW US. LOL

 

[Andylusion]

15 bucks an hour to toss a burger? PAHLEASE.

Have you ever worked fast food. Those people bust their ass and deal with asshole customers. You can call the position inferior if you want, but it's non stop productivity for these restaurant and they get paid jack shit.

It's a job that can be done by a trained chimp. It is unskilled labor and pays appropriately.

You cons are painfully dumb. Just because it is entry level does not mean it isn't hard work. It is non stop productivity with asshole customers on top. They deserve decent pay.

You just don't get it, do you?

It doesn't matter. The value of labor, isn't determine by 'how hard it is'. Nor is the value of labor determined by how many years you have done it. Nor is it determined by the employer, or the employee.

If my CEO could simply 'decide' that my labor was worth a Million dollars an hour, he would. He would LOVE to charge the customers a million dollars an hour, to have me screw together a printer.

But my CEO has ZERO ability to determine that.

There is only ONE PERSON who determines how much labor is worth. The customer.

McDonalds would LOVE to charge $30 for a Big Mac, and pay the employees $25/hr. Just one problem... the customers wont' pay for it. At least not at the level they do in the US.

If you travel to Norway, you'll find out they pay employees at the McDonald, about $15/hr. Great! But.... the cost of a Big Mac, is... about $15. And by the way, Norway has no Minimum wage at all.

Well then clearly they still have stores, and customers are willing to pay that much in Norway! Well... not really. Most of the McDonald stores are in tourist areas. Norway, has about 1/10th the number of McDonald we have. Why? Because customers are NOT willing to pay for McDonald all the time when it's $15 for a big mac.

If you raise the prices of food at US McDonald, to be equal to that of Norway McDonald, thousands of McDonalds are going to close. The only places that will remain open, are in tourist areas, and high price areas, just like the only McDonald in Norway are in high price tourist areas.

The result will be exactly the same that we see in Norway. A fraction of the stores. Which means that all those people who have jobs right now, will be unemployed.

Again, what is my point? My point is that the wage is determined by the customers. If the customers are not willing to pay $15 for a big mac, then it doesn't matter what law you want to pass, the store can't pay the employee $15/hr.

Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers.

I've done that in my own life. I loved Chipotle. I still love Chipotle. When it was $4.75 for a burrito, I went there all the time. Now that it's $6.50, I honestly don't go there often. I typically go to Walmart and buy their $3.29 sub.

Now if you drive up the wages enough, you'll see fewer and fewer people going to those stores, and they will eventually close, the ones not in high priced areas. Obviously in New York, where prices are already much higher than the minimum wage, nothing much will change.

But in areas like Ohio, where a $5 burrito was normal... yeah customers are going to change their habits, and those employees will be laid off, earning zero, instead of the minimum wage.

This is how economics works. It doesn't really care about your political agenda.

Ok as usual you cons have the hardest time with nuance. If you raised the minimum wage to $15, the price increase wouldn't even come close to offset the extra few hundred dollars a month an employee would then make. In fact, the extra consumer demand would bring prices down over time. The initial price increase at McDonald's for instance would only be a 20 cents or so on SOME items.

By the way... it's not a few hundred dollars extra. Don't be ridiculous. An employee earning $8/hr now, going to $15/hr, would be $1,150 a month... plus taxes would be an additional $100, (unemployment comp, Social Security and Medicare employer side tax, plus benefit).

Even at the low wage level, taxes and benefits make a significant increase in cost to employe people.

The you multiply that additional $1,250 in wages, by a dozen employees, that's easily $15,000 a month in higher labor costs.

 

[Marxist]

Have you ever worked fast food. Those people bust their ass and deal with asshole customers. You can call the position inferior if you want, but it's non stop productivity for these restaurant and they get paid jack shit.

It's a job that can be done by a trained chimp. It is unskilled labor and pays appropriately.

You cons are painfully dumb. Just because it is entry level does not mean it isn't hard work. It is non stop productivity with asshole customers on top. They deserve decent pay.

You just don't get it, do you?

It doesn't matter. The value of labor, isn't determine by 'how hard it is'. Nor is the value of labor determined by how many years you have done it. Nor is it determined by the employer, or the employee.

If my CEO could simply 'decide' that my labor was worth a Million dollars an hour, he would. He would LOVE to charge the customers a million dollars an hour, to have me screw together a printer.

But my CEO has ZERO ability to determine that.

There is only ONE PERSON who determines how much labor is worth. The customer.

McDonalds would LOVE to charge $30 for a Big Mac, and pay the employees $25/hr. Just one problem... the customers wont' pay for it. At least not at the level they do in the US.

If you travel to Norway, you'll find out they pay employees at the McDonald, about $15/hr. Great! But.... the cost of a Big Mac, is... about $15. And by the way, Norway has no Minimum wage at all.

Well then clearly they still have stores, and customers are willing to pay that much in Norway! Well... not really. Most of the McDonald stores are in tourist areas. Norway, has about 1/10th the number of McDonald we have. Why? Because customers are NOT willing to pay for McDonald all the time when it's $15 for a big mac.

If you raise the prices of food at US McDonald, to be equal to that of Norway McDonald, thousands of McDonalds are going to close. The only places that will remain open, are in tourist areas, and high price areas, just like the only McDonald in Norway are in high price tourist areas.

The result will be exactly the same that we see in Norway. A fraction of the stores. Which means that all those people who have jobs right now, will be unemployed.

Again, what is my point? My point is that the wage is determined by the customers. If the customers are not willing to pay $15 for a big mac, then it doesn't matter what law you want to pass, the store can't pay the employee $15/hr.

Every single penny that a store has to pay an employee, comes from the customer. So every penny you increase the minimum wage, is a penny increase in price you put on the customer. As the price goes up, there will be fewer customers.

I've done that in my own life. I loved Chipotle. I still love Chipotle. When it was $4.75 for a burrito, I went there all the time. Now that it's $6.50, I honestly don't go there often. I typically go to Walmart and buy their $3.29 sub.

Now if you drive up the wages enough, you'll see fewer and fewer people going to those stores, and they will eventually close, the ones not in high priced areas. Obviously in New York, where prices are already much higher than the minimum wage, nothing much will change.

But in areas like Ohio, where a $5 burrito was normal... yeah customers are going to change their habits, and those employees will be laid off, earning zero, instead of the minimum wage.

This is how economics works. It doesn't really care about your political agenda.

Ok as usual you cons have the hardest time with nuance. If you raised the minimum wage to $15, the price increase wouldn't even come close to offset the extra few hundred dollars a month an employee would then make. In fact, the extra consumer demand would bring prices down over time. The initial price increase at McDonald's for instance would only be a 20 cents or so on SOME items.

By the way... it's not a few hundred dollars extra. Don't be ridiculous. An employee earning $8/hr now, going to $15/hr, would be $1,150 a month... plus taxes would be an additional $100, (unemployment comp, Social Security and Medicare employer side tax, plus benefit).

Even at the low wage level, taxes and benefits make a significant increase in cost to employe people.

The you multiply that additional $1,250 in wages, by a dozen employees, that's easily $15,000 a month in higher labor costs.

You need to address your bullshit.
Big Mac index 2015 Statistic
Ok? Wages have been stagnant, people are struggling, capitalists don't give a fuck, news is news.

 

[Gracie]

You have a widget on ebay. The post office is charging you 49 bucks just to ship the damn thing. You paid 20 bucks for the widget. It is worth twice that. So the item is listed at 40 bucks. Shipping and widget is now 89 bucks. Most won't bother unless you offer free shipping. So you are eating the 49 bucks and to compensate, you start the bidding at 69 bucks. You are only getting your money back since ebay takes a cut, plus the palpal fees. What do you do? List the widget for even more to compensate. Either someone will bid on it, or they won't. But the money has to come from somewhere. Ebayers aren't there to sell and make a 2 buck profit. Same with any business.

Take Pawn Stars for example. Schmuck wants 5000 for his item. Pawn Stars gets expert in there. Expert says yeah it is worth 5k. PS says he will give the guy 2000. Guy says "but your expert said it is worth 5k so that is what I want". PS says "so, I am to give you 5k, sell it for 5k IF and WHEN it sells? Where is MY profit?". Guy has deer in headlights look.

Buy and sell. Profit. Fast food is the same thing. PROFIT. Raise their pay, who have to have a register to tell them how much change to give the customer, and the money to stay in business has to come from somewhere. Which means FOOD PRICES.

Common sense, people.

 

[Marxist]

You have a widget on ebay. The post office is charging you 49 bucks just to ship the damn thing. You paid 20 bucks for the widget. It is worth twice that. So the item is listed at 40 bucks. Shipping and widget is now 89 bucks. Most won't bother unless you offer free shipping. So you are eating the 49 bucks and to compensate, you start the bidding at 69 bucks. You are only getting your money back since ebay takes a cut, plus the palpal fees. What do you do? List the widget for even more to compensate. Either someone will bid on it, or they won't. But the money has to come from somewhere. Ebayers aren't there to sell and make a 2 buck profit. Same with any business.

Take Pawn Stars for example. Schmuck wants 5000 for his item. Pawn Stars gets expert in there. Expert says yeah it is worth 5k. PS says he will give the guy 2000. Guy says "but your expert said it is worth 5k so that is what I want". PS says "so, I am to give you 5k, sell it for 5k IF and WHEN it sells? Where is MY profit?". Guy has deer in headlights look.

Buy and sell. Profit. Fast food is the same thing. PROFIT. Raise their pay, who have to have a register to tell them how much change to give the customer, and the money to stay in business has to come from somewhere. Which means FOOD PRICES.

Common sense, people.

Big Mac index 2015 Statistic
The price increase wouldn't really affect people.