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Well just fella, this chart only goes to 2008, the Democratic party took over in early 2007 so how do you arrive at your conclusions? I might add that the last 2 years of the Bush Presidency pretty well screwed him.
1.) The chart shows that the Dems hardly used the filibuster for the majority of Bush's time in office especially when compared to how frequently the GOP used in once in the minority.
2.) The number of filibusters skyrocketed from 2007 on and in case you missed is the filibuster has been the GOPs favorite tool for all of 2009.
You really can't sit there with a straight face and try to dispute that. The GOP is the party of NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
as a caveat to this...if you'll notice the Republicans were ALWAYS including the Democrats in most every bill that was passed while they were in the majority....the Democrats on the other hand have been saying "Fuck you, we won...deal with it." What sort of reaction did you expect from the Reps? Of course they were going to filibuster....when you have your voice and influence completely removed from the legislative process one must use the tools at hand to regain that say....the Reps only choice was the filibuster....and that's how Nancy Pelosi and Reid WANTED THE GAME PLAYED because it fell right in line with their strategy to take a filibuster proof Senate in 2008. Brilliant political warfare. They coined the term..."the party of no." and it was all planned out.
Avatar4321 said:We atleast have the decency to give Obama and the Democrats props when they do something correct. It's not our fault the occaision tends to be rare. We also criticize Republicans when they are wrong, which is much more frequently. I've never seen you once criticize a Democrat.
Whaaaaaaaaaaat???? Since when? Who? Which "props" were those? The only Republicans who ever have anything decent to say about Obama are some of the more moderate conservative pundits, like Joe Scarborough, David Brooks, David Frum to name a few. And why is that? Because they are extremely well-learned on the background concerning the issues and they KNOW that he doesn't deserve ALL of the intense criticism he is subjected to 24/7.
[I edited out the whining as I suspected that you might take it personally when it was meant for the congresscritters. I was right.]What is all this whining? One word - cloture. The Dems have all the power to use it. If they can't get their act together to use it, then they can blame themselves as they have the power.
What's with you and thinking everything is "whining?"
If you followed the flow of conversation you would see that all I did was refute Lumpy's statement that the Dems were the "party of no" back during the Bush administration.
Sheesh ...
And you can't get cloture without 60 votes which the Dem don't have.
Yes, the Dems have complete cloture power - 58 members and two independents who formally caucus with the Dems. So, the Dems DO have the power.
If they can't get their act together to use it, then only THEY are to blame.
1.) The chart shows that the Dems hardly used the filibuster for the majority of Bush's time in office especially when compared to how frequently the GOP used in once in the minority.
2.) The number of filibusters skyrocketed from 2007 on and in case you missed is the filibuster has been the GOPs favorite tool for all of 2009.
You really can't sit there with a straight face and try to dispute that. The GOP is the party of NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
as a caveat to this...if you'll notice the Republicans were ALWAYS including the Democrats in most every bill that was passed while they were in the majority....the Democrats on the other hand have been saying "Fuck you, we won...deal with it." What sort of reaction did you expect from the Reps? Of course they were going to filibuster....when you have your voice and influence completely removed from the legislative process one must use the tools at hand to regain that say....the Reps only choice was the filibuster....and that's how Nancy Pelosi and Reid WANTED THE GAME PLAYED because it fell right in line with their strategy to take a filibuster proof Senate in 2008. Brilliant political warfare. They coined the term..."the party of no." and it was all planned out.
Pelosi and Reid and morons. Filibustering for a reason I'm fine with, filibustering because of butthurt I'm not.
Shit man, we even had a GOP Senator come out yesterday and say the Reps will vote now in lock step against the Senate health care bill that made concessions by taking out the public option so even when the dems do give some they get "fuck you" thrown back in their faces.
So it seems like "fuck you" is pretty much the attitude both parties have taken towards each other.
Joe Lieberman formally caucuses with the Dems. That is a fact of record. The other independent is a socialist who also formally caucuses with the Dems - another fact of record.[I edited out the whining as I suspected that you might take it personally when it was meant for the congresscritters. I was right.]
Yes, the Dems have complete cloture power - 58 members and two independents who formally caucus with the Dems. So, the Dems DO have the power.
If they can't get their act together to use it, then only THEY are to blame.
No, they don't. Joe Lieberman has made it very clear that he isn't loyal to the Dems and that he will support GOP filibusters.
Pelosi and Reid and morons. Filibustering for a reason I'm fine with, filibustering because of butthurt I'm not.
Shit man, we even had a GOP Senator come out yesterday and say the Reps will vote now in lock step against the Senate health care bill that made concessions by taking out the public option so even when the dems do give some they get "fuck you" thrown back in their faces.
So it seems like "fuck you" is pretty much the attitude both parties have taken towards each other.
There were Dem votes of no if there was a public option in the healthcare bill...remember..all we've been hearing the last few days is "secret meetings behind closed doors with DEMOCRAT Senators who aren't in lockstep with reid and Pelosi...but you are in fact correct about this one thing....
So it seems like "fuck you" is pretty much the attitude both parties have taken towards each other
and that's a sad testament to what our government has become when the leftwing loon moonbats and the right wing neocon nutters take over the reins of power.
Harry Reid losing his seat and somebody like Jim Webb becoming majority leader in the Senate is one of the best things that can happen to this country in the 2010 elections.
And where were you guys during Bushs first year?
Bush OWNS 911 then fellas
There is no American at fault for the attacks of 9-11-01.
LOL that's not what the right said when they tried to blame clinton for every terrorist attack or event that happened during, before, or after his presidency. For years the right blamed clinton for ruby ridge when the event took place BEFORE he was even president. Then they blamed clinton for every attack/event that occured on his watch and even tried to blame clinton for 9/11 despite the fact that it happened on W's watch.
Furthermore, as recent as a last week many on the right were trying to blame obama for hasan as they tried to claim it was a terrorist attack so they could argue that obama hasn't kept us safe.
Which reminds me of another hypocrisy of the right when they argued that attacks on our embassies counted as US soil therefore clinton didn't keep the US safe and yet when our embassies were attacked on W's watch the right refused to apply that same standard to W as they tried to claim he kept us safe by fighting them over there so we could be safe over here.
Joe Lieberman formally caucuses with the Dems. That is a fact of record. The other independent is a socialist who also formally caucuses with the Dems - another fact of record.No, they don't. Joe Lieberman has made it very clear that he isn't loyal to the Dems and that he will support GOP filibusters.
Nice spin but that doesn't change the FACT that the DEMS only have 58 votes and therefore cannot bring about cloture on their own. From what I heard leiberman is trying to cater to the right in hopes of gaining more of their votes in order to get re-elected so I would hardly consider him a dem despite the fact that he caucuses with them in an attempt to retain his support from dems in his state.
It's simple math really, 60 votes is required dems only have 58. You can try to spin it all you want but the fact remains that the dems as a party are still two votes short of bringing about cloture on their own.
No he didnt. there was never a surplus to begin with.
Bush sure thought there was.
Bush Speech to Congress: 27 Feb 2001
Yeah, which of course was before they actually had time to examine the books and realized the Clinton administration was completely inaccurate with the numbers. It was also before the full effects of the recession was realized.
I dont know why its difficult to understand that just because something is projected to happen, doesnt mean it actually happens.
Oh and honestly, I dont care what Bush did or didnt believe. I care about reality. There was no surplus.
Avatar4321 said:We atleast have the decency to give Obama and the Democrats props when they do something correct. It's not our fault the occaision tends to be rare. We also criticize Republicans when they are wrong, which is much more frequently. I've never seen you once criticize a Democrat.
Whaaaaaaaaaaat???? Since when? Who? Which "props" were those? The only Republicans who ever have anything decent to say about Obama are some of the more moderate conservative pundits, like Joe Scarborough, David Brooks, David Frum to name a few. And why is that? Because they are extremely well-learned on the background concerning the issues and they KNOW that he doesn't deserve ALL of the intense criticism he is subjected to 24/7.
Ive been clear when Ive agreed with Obama. Its not my fault that he hasnt been correct on more than Kanye West being an ass and a few other minor issues.
Idiot. Read the thread. The two independents formally caucus with the Dems. Moron.One word - cloture. The Dems have all the power to use it. If they can't get their act together to use it, then they can blame themselves as they have the power.1.) The chart shows that the Dems hardly used the filibuster for the majority of Bush's time in office especially when compared to how frequently the GOP used in once in the minority.
2.) The number of filibusters skyrocketed from 2007 on and in case you missed is the filibuster has been the GOPs favorite tool for all of 2009.
You really can't sit there with a straight face and try to dispute that. The GOP is the party of NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
Actually si that is NOT true. The dems onlty have 58 votes. There are two independents that have to vote with the dems in order to bring about cloture. However, nice spin attempt on your part.
Idiot.Joe Lieberman formally caucuses with the Dems. That is a fact of record. The other independent is a socialist who also formally caucuses with the Dems - another fact of record.
Nice spin but that doesn't change the FACT that the DEMS only have 58 votes and therefore cannot bring about cloture on their own. From what I heard leiberman is trying to cater to the right in hopes of gaining more of their votes in order to get re-elected so I would hardly consider him a dem despite the fact that he caucuses with them in an attempt to retain his support from dems in his state.
It's simple math really, 60 votes is required dems only have 58. You can try to spin it all you want but the fact remains that the dems as a party are still two votes short of bringing about cloture on their own.
I don't think they even have 58. I count 50, max, maybe even less. The midterms are less than a year away, and those Dems up for reelection (19) won't vote for a health care bill unless they live in an extremely depressed region. Well, except the for-sures like Harry Reid.
Exactly.there are 58 dems, two independents who virtually always vote dem, and only 40 republicans....
sheesh, even with this super majority, the dems still make excuses
Yup. Get this: In , my first encounter with that moron, he tried to claim that I never provide supporting information for my claims and I always tell folks to look it up themselves. I told him to prove that allegation. He spent a good amount of time (searching, I guess), but he came back with a post of mine where I told someone to look up a word's definition. I kid you not. LMAO.Notice how the troll drsmith pops up like a prairie dog...throws a few bombs and then runs away....too funny.
Honestly, I dont think the polls mean jack squat... I think were on the same page but lets face it, the average American people are stupid! and the media is brainwashing the masses...
Sue me, I'm a tad optimistic.......... stranger.. ...(welcome and Hello)
Hey there! haha... I think alot of Americans like Obama, for what reason, I don't know... I mean I think he's a nice guy... and one thing I do believe he's the most popular president on a global scale since John F. Kennedy.... Now with that said I think he's doing a piss poor job as president, especially when it comes to economics, I think we are going to go into a double recession because of him...
What happend to the "Taft Republicans"?
Idiot. Read the thread. The two independents formally caucus with the Dems. Moron.One word - cloture. The Dems have all the power to use it. If they can't get their act together to use it, then they can blame themselves as they have the power.
Actually si that is NOT true. The dems onlty have 58 votes. There are two independents that have to vote with the dems in order to bring about cloture. However, nice spin attempt on your part.
One would think that before they open their mouth (or hit their keyboard) they would have even the basics down.
Not the morons, though.
Idiot.
Idiot.Nice spin but that doesn't change the FACT that the DEMS only have 58 votes and therefore cannot bring about cloture on their own. From what I heard leiberman is trying to cater to the right in hopes of gaining more of their votes in order to get re-elected so I would hardly consider him a dem despite the fact that he caucuses with them in an attempt to retain his support from dems in his state.
It's simple math really, 60 votes is required dems only have 58. You can try to spin it all you want but the fact remains that the dems as a party are still two votes short of bringing about cloture on their own.
I don't think they even have 58. I count 50, max, maybe even less. The midterms are less than a year away, and those Dems up for reelection (19) won't vote for a health care bill unless they live in an extremely depressed region. Well, except the for-sures like Harry Reid.
