Reason vs. Morality

[dilloduck]

What's the difference? Your legacy and how its impacted other human beings is determined by the way you act, thus, you should act accordingly if you care about your legacy and a second reason would be that it's innate at this point to want to be a good person (it comes natural to most).

Aside from those reasons and barring those reasons, go ahead and be a bad ass and a lawful society will deal with you.

Would it make any difference if I gave you food because I wanted to be a decent human as opposed to giving you food so I could go to heaven ?

Yes.

hell you got the food and you have no idea what my motive was.

 

[PratchettFan]

IE ----right and wrong is what we decide it to be unless we are religious in which case right and wrong has been spelled out in scripture and centuries of culture.

Right and wrong are what the writers of the scriptures decided them to be, also.

yet religious people adhere to the writers of the scripture and don't make up new morality for every situation.

Yes, they do. Constantly. I see it here all of the time. Scripture is not used as a basis for morality, it is used as a justification. That's what humans do.

 

[alang1216]

yet religious people adhere to the writers of the scripture and don't make up new morality for every situation.

The beauty of the Bible is that it is like a Rorschach picture. Whatever point you wish to make there is scripture to back up your point. There's "an eye for and eye" and "love your neighbor". Pick the right one and God is on your side.

 

[PratchettFan]

Would it make any difference if I gave you food because I wanted to be a decent human as opposed to giving you food so I could go to heaven ?

Yes.

hell you got the food and you have no idea what my motive was.

You know. Don't you count?

 

[dilloduck]

Yes.

hell you got the food and you have no idea what my motive was.

You know. Don't you count?

of course I do----I said YOU don't know----what difference does it make to you ?

 

[G.T.]

Moral being relative of course..

Sort of.

Of course it is. Abortion used to be wrong--now it is right.

Nah.

Only sort of.

 

[dilloduck]

yet religious people adhere to the writers of the scripture and don't make up new morality for every situation.

The beauty of the Bible is that it is like a Rorschach picture. Whatever point you wish to make there is scripture to back up your point. There's "an eye for and eye" and "love your neighbor". Pick the right one and God is on your side.

Old testament----New testament---and it's really a collection of several different peoples writings

 

[dilloduck]

Sort of.

Of course it is. Abortion used to be wrong--now it is right.

Nah.

Only sort of.

Abortion is sort of wrong ? How so ?

 

[G.T.]

No.

Morals are only sort of relative.

Some arent relative at all.

Having reasoned to the correct right and wrong or not doesnt change whether or not the reasoning is valid.

 

[dilloduck]

No.

Morals are only sort of relative.

Some arent relative at all.

Having reasoned to the correct right and wrong or not doesnt change whether or not the reasoning is valid.

how is valid reasoning determined ?

 

[PratchettFan]

hell you got the food and you have no idea what my motive was.

You know. Don't you count?

of course I do----I said YOU don't know----what difference does it make to you ?

You asked if it made a difference, it does to you. So long as all you did was give me food, then it does not matter to me. As long as I get my wallet back, the presence of the cop is immaterial. Morality is entirely personal. Nonetheless, you are a player in this interchange and you matter. So your motive matters.

 

[dilloduck]

You know. Don't you count?

of course I do----I said YOU don't know----what difference does it make to you ?

You asked if it made a difference, it does to you. So long as all you did was give me food, then it does not matter to me. As long as I get my wallet back, the presence of the cop is immaterial. Morality is entirely personal. Nonetheless, you are a player in this interchange and you matter. So your motive matters.

Morality is entirely personal? Why do we have laws defining it for everyone then?

 

[PratchettFan]

of course I do----I said YOU don't know----what difference does it make to you ?

You asked if it made a difference, it does to you. So long as all you did was give me food, then it does not matter to me. As long as I get my wallet back, the presence of the cop is immaterial. Morality is entirely personal. Nonetheless, you are a player in this interchange and you matter. So your motive matters.

Morality is entirely personal? Why do we have laws defining it for everyone then?

Morality is not defined. Behavior is defined. They are not the same thing. Remember the wallet?

 

[G.T.]

No.

Morals are only sort of relative.

Some arent relative at all.

Having reasoned to the correct right and wrong or not doesnt change whether or not the reasoning is valid.

how is valid reasoning determined ?

Its is determined through the engagement in the processes of falsifiability and intelligence.

 

[dilloduck]

No.

Morals are only sort of relative.

Some arent relative at all.

Having reasoned to the correct right and wrong or not doesnt change whether or not the reasoning is valid.

how is valid reasoning determined ?

Its is determined through the engagement in the processes of falsifiability and intelligence.

and who makes the final call ?

 

[dilloduck]

You asked if it made a difference, it does to you. So long as all you did was give me food, then it does not matter to me. As long as I get my wallet back, the presence of the cop is immaterial. Morality is entirely personal. Nonetheless, you are a player in this interchange and you matter. So your motive matters.

Morality is entirely personal? Why do we have laws defining it for everyone then?

Morality is not defined. Behavior is defined. They are not the same thing. Remember the wallet?

Immoral behavior is defined no matter what kind of cover you want to put on it. You don't think sodomy laws weren't based on morality ?

 

[G.T.]

how is valid reasoning determined ?

Its is determined through the engagement in the processes of falsifiability and intelligence.

and who makes the final call ?

There isnt a final call.

 

[dilloduck]

Its is determined through the engagement in the processes of falsifiability and intelligence.

and who makes the final call ?

There isnt a final call.

sure there is---someone is either guilty or not. Jailed or freed

 

[PratchettFan]

"Most liberals are religious."

Horsefeathers.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-and-justice-system/365044-liberal-attack-religion-again.html

Oh well, you are supporting your opinion by citing your opinion. Who can argue with that? No, come to think of it, I believe I will go with facts instead. Call me silly.

Read it, you idiot, and you'll see it is not my opinion....it is reality.

I did. I prefer real reality. But you carry on.

 

[PratchettFan]

Morality is entirely personal? Why do we have laws defining it for everyone then?

Morality is not defined. Behavior is defined. They are not the same thing. Remember the wallet?

Immoral behavior is defined no matter what kind of cover you want to put on it. You don't think sodomy laws weren't based on morality ?

No. Illegal behavior is defined. I can't say whether sodomy laws were based upon morality as I don't know the motive of the legislatures which put them into effect. I strongly suspect is was based upon politicians playing to the fears and prejudices of their constituencies. However, the laws did not demand people be moral, only that they behaved in a particular manner.