Zone1 Religion is not needed if a "golden rule" is valued

[ding]

I am not attacking you I am criticizing organized religion

How many times does that have to be repeated before you understand?

And by association attacking me for having that faith. How many times do I have to tell you that before you will understand?

 

[ding]

I'm not aggressive and words are not violence.

And once again I am criticizing the institutions of organized religion not individual people

Your aggression is the same as Hobelim, Breezewood and FtFunIndiana.

And once again by association you are attacking people of faith for having that faith.

 

[Blues Man]

My observation that you are not at peace is based upon your attacks of other people's faith. It's pretty much all you do in this subforum. It seems you want to criticize the faith of other people but you don't want the people whose faith you are attacking to do the same thing to you.

Criticizing an institution is not a an attack on any person.

You have a persecution complex.

 

[Blues Man]

And by association attacking me for having that faith. How many times do I have to tell you that before you will understand?

Wrong again, Donkey.

If I criticize a bank and you have money there am I attacking you?

Organized religion is nothing but big business and is worthy of any criticism it earns

 

[Blues Man]

Your aggression is the same as Hobelim, Breezewood and FtFunIndiana.

And once again by association you are attacking people of faith for having that faith.

And once again you are wrong.

 

[ding]

Criticizing an institution is not a an attack on any person.

You have a persecution complex.

That isn't what you are doing. You called it a blight upon humanity; a detriment to humanity. It's an attack on every Christian. It's really the only religion you target.

 

[ding]

And once again you are wrong.

You are exactly like them.

 

[ding]

and would do awful things if you were not afraid of some divine authority

be honest and quote the entire post

Incorrect. People are more complex than that.

 

[Blues Man]

That isn't what you are doing. You called it a blight upon humanity; a detriment to humanity. It's an attack on every Christian. It's really the only religion you target.

No it isn't.

The institution is not the customer.

Organized religion is big business. it's run like a business, it has tax liabilities , it has employees and revenues.

If any other business that was not a religion was partaking in a global scheme of aiding and abetting pedophiles that business would have been torn apart and its leaders in jail for life. But you say the religion cannot be held to that standard because of faith.

But you also say you would abolish a faith if it hurt children.

you are a hypocrite.

 

[Blues Man]

Incorrect. People are more complex than that.

Not really.

 

[ViewFromAbove]

If you are not more than matter, then satisfaction of material needs is all you have.

Material needs? Does that include my need to respect innocent people, be fair with everyone who is also fair, and my enjoyment of feeling empathy?

 

[ViewFromAbove]

Everything was created ~14 billion years ago. It's just science.

You are sure "everything" was created ~ 14 billion years ago?
That is a scientific hypothesis, and there is data/evidence supporting that ... OUR universe, as we know it SO FAR, was started with a "big bang" about 14 billion years ago, but ... us agnostic scientists don't go beyond that claim. We really don't know!!!

 

[ViewFromAbove]

That would be incorrect. Modern science began in the Catholic Church. The father of modern genetics was a Catholic priest. The scientist who discovered the big bang was a Catholic priest. The paleontologist who studied Peking Man was a Catholic priest.

Apparently, you don't understand scientific claims. Modern science uses "scientific methods" to discover knowledge about objective facts. NO ASSumptions about reality without objective evidence.
Yes, priests can apply scientific methods when being objective, but claims about supernatural stuff are not scientific.

 

[ViewFromAbove]

From the atheist's vantage point religion exist because of evolutionary forces. But the reality is that even that argument confirms that spirituality offers a functional advantage over materialism. According to natural selection there are two main components; functional advantage and transfer of functional advantage to the next generation. So even natural selection confirms that spirituality is a behavior which leads to success. Otherwise, according to natural selection, it would have been abandoned long ago. As mankind has gained more and more knowledge of his natural surroundings his desire for spirituality has not diminished. In fact, the more materialistic we became the less satisfied we became.

"Spirituality" means different things to different people. Cultural conformity is a separate variable in evolutionary thinking that Darwin was not concerned with in his research on animal species.

 

[ViewFromAbove]

IOW, if everyone agreed on a morality that superseded individual or even tribal wants and desires. You know, like a morality created by and imposed on man by a creator.

Wishful fantasy? Why not multiple creators who compete? Then again, let's go further; where did the "creator" come from? Imagine that!

 

[hadit]

Wishful fantasy? Why not multiple creators who compete? Then again, let's go further; where did the "creator" come from? Imagine that!

That's only a problem if you don't understand that the creator is outside of time and space as we know it. He created time, therefore, there is no need for Him to have a beginning. He simply always was, and is, and is to come.

 

[BreezeWood]

That's only a problem if you don't understand that the creator is outside of time and space as we know it. He created time, therefore, there is no need for Him to have a beginning. He simply always was, and is, and is to come.

sorry, that is not a creation that requires a creator just someone that puts a stick in the ground.

 

[Blues Man]

That's only a problem if you don't understand that the creator is outside of time and space as we know it. He created time, therefore, there is no need for Him to have a beginning. He simply always was, and is, and is to come.

Or it could simply be that there is no creator and what spawned our universe was just an anomaly of the quantum field where our ideas of time and space don;t work and the emergence of a collapsing wave function

 

[ding]

Material needs? Does that include my need to respect innocent people, be fair with everyone who is also fair, and my enjoyment of feeling empathy?

No, it only includes your material needs. If those innocent people stood in your way of satisfying your material needs, you'd do whatever you needed to do to survive.

 

[ding]

You are sure "everything" was created ~ 14 billion years ago?
That is a scientific hypothesis, and there is data/evidence supporting that ... OUR universe, as we know it SO FAR, was started with a "big bang" about 14 billion years ago, but ... us agnostic scientists don't go beyond that claim. We really don't know!!!

Every single atom that exists today had it's beginning ~14 billion years ago. Since that time it has only changed form. The atoms in your body are ~14 billion years old. As that is the claim of the big bang.

"Did you know that the matter in your body is billions of years old?​

​

According to most astrophysicists, all the matter found in the universe today -- including the matter in people, plants, animals, the earth, stars, and galaxies -- was created at the very first moment of time, thought to be about 13 billion years ago.​

​

The universe began, scientists believe, with every speck of its energy jammed into a very tiny point. This extremely dense point exploded with unimaginable force, creating matter and propelling it outward to make the billions of galaxies of our vast universe. Astrophysicists dubbed this titanic explosion the Big Bang..."​

Origins: CERN: Ideas: The Big Bang | Exploratorium

annex.exploratorium.edu