Remembering Robert E. Lee: American Patriot and Southern Hero

[bripat9643]

To the neo-confederate white supremacists inhabiting this thread:

All your democratic southern brethren who fought that war are dead now...I'm sure even some of them, from on high, are whispering, through the clouds: "Let it go."

I was born in Boston MA. Why should we let go of the truth?

 

[rightwinger]

We know Lee fought against the Union, thus fought for slavery.

stmike talking about history is similar to a hamster eating the pages of a history book.

The Civil War was not fought over slavery.

Of course not....it was fought over a states right to allow slavery

Oh God, not that crap again.

All one has to do is read the justifications for secession written by South Carolina, Mississippi, Georgia, and Texas. These were the direct words of the people who started the civil war, and the reasons they gave for doing that. Only a revisionist moron accepts contemporary spin about it.

Avalon Project - Confederate States of America - Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union

I have read those justifications as well as the Constitution of the Confederacy.......protecting slavery was prominent

Whatever the confederate states stated as their reason for seceding, the fact is that Lincoln invaded them, not the other way around, and his motive was to enforce the Morrill Tariff.

Lincoln can't invade his own country

It was the traitors taking up arms against their country

 

[JakeStarkey]

Wrong, he fought for his state, the CSA, and his property. The USA could not "invade" Virginia, for Virginia was a governmental entity indivisble from the USA.

Wrong. You're quoting the pledge of allegiance, which was written by some commie. Nothing in the Constitution says a state can't secede.

I am not quoting anything, merely using "indivisible" as an appropriate predicate nominative to describe the relationship of the nation and states. Since the Constitution is pro-active, not reactive, no specific language was required to prevent a state from seceding. The states did not have that inherent right.

 

[JakeStarkey]

We know Lee fought against the Union, thus fought for slavery.

stmike talking about history is similar to a hamster eating the pages of a history book.

The Civil War was not fought over slavery.

Of course not....it was fought over a states right to allow slavery

Oh God, not that crap again.

All one has to do is read the justifications for secession written by South Carolina, Mississippi, Georgia, and Texas. These were the direct words of the people who started the civil war, and the reasons they gave for doing that. Only a revisionist moron accepts contemporary spin about it.

Avalon Project - Confederate States of America - Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union

I have read those justifications as well as the Constitution of the Confederacy.......protecting slavery was prominent

Whatever the confederate states stated as their reason for seceding, the fact is that Lincoln invaded them, not the other way around, and his motive was to enforce the Morrill Tariff.

False.

 

[paperview]

South Carolina ceded all rights to Fort Sumter in 1836. It wasn't hers to just take.

Nor were the forts and military installations or the Mint filled with Gold they seized. Or the US Ships they fired on, and captured for their own use as Man of War vessels in January 1861.

You can't just go stealing federal government property and say: hey, it's ours now. Go fuck yourselves.

That property was bought and paid for by the entire United States.

 

[rightwinger]

The Civil War was not fought over slavery.

Of course not....it was fought over a states right to allow slavery

Oh God, not that crap again.

All one has to do is read he justifications for secession written by South Carolina, Mississippi, Georgia, and Texas. There were the direct words of the people who started the civil war, and the reasons they gave for doing that. Only a revisionist moron accepts contemporary spin about it.

Avalon Project - Confederate States of America - Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union

Lincoln started the Civil War, dumbshit. He invaded Virginia. It wasn't the other way around.

On April 12, 1861, General P.G.T. Beauregard, in command of the Confederate forces around Charleston Harbor, opened fire on the Union garrison holding Fort Sumter. At 2:30pm on April 13 Major Robert Anderson, garrison commander, surrendered the fort and was evacuated the next day.

Fort Sumter was South Carolina territory. Firing on your own territory isn't an act of war.

The Fort was federal territory......still is

 

[JakeStarkey]

Let it go, neo-confederates..

 

[paperview]

What union did he save? 11 states wanted to leave and he decided to kill them instead of letting them leave. The union would have gone on with or without those 11 states, so again, what union did he save?

There's a reason that those states seceded and it had everything to do with the economic oppression being exerted by Northern states by means of their population advantage. They passed hefty tariffs that devastated the agricultural economy of the South and were heedless of any protest to the damage they were doing. Fort Sumter is where these levies were collected and the reason it was fired upon when all peaceful measures were exhausted.

Tariffs had been declining prior to the Civil War, due primarily to Southern opposition. They went up when the South seceded.

For several decades prior to the Civil War, the North was forced to delay or compromise several of its national economic policy objectives due to Southern opposition and the strong position the Southern states held in the Senate. As soon as the Southern states seceded Congress began enacting this delayed agenda. The Morrill Tariff of 1861 raised rates to 20 percent on average, ending more than 30 years of declining tariffs.

Civil War and Industrial Expansion 1860 x2013 1897 Overview FREE Civil War and Industrial Expansion 1860 x2013 1897 Overview information Encyclopedia.com Find Civil War and Industrial Expansion 1860 x2013 1897 Overview research

The Morrill Tariff was passed before the Confederates states seceded. It was one of the highest tariffs ever passed by Congress.

When it was adopted, the Southern traitors had left by then and had already begun firing on ships and stealing Federal property.

 

[bripat9643]

The Civil War was not fought over slavery.

Of course not....it was fought over a states right to allow slavery

Oh God, not that crap again.

All one has to do is read the justifications for secession written by South Carolina, Mississippi, Georgia, and Texas. These were the direct words of the people who started the civil war, and the reasons they gave for doing that. Only a revisionist moron accepts contemporary spin about it.

Avalon Project - Confederate States of America - Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union

I have read those justifications as well as the Constitution of the Confederacy.......protecting slavery was prominent

Whatever the confederate states stated as their reason for seceding, the fact is that Lincoln invaded them, not the other way around, and his motive was to enforce the Morrill Tariff.

Lincoln can't invade his own country

It was the traitors taking up arms against their country

Virginia was not part of the United States after it seceded. If you insist that it was, then you are agreeing that Lincoln slaughtered hundreds of thousands of U.S. citizens. He ordered his troops to rape them, loot their property, burn their homes to the ground and execute them without a trial.

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

bad general. Left almost 40% of his soldiers in most of his berserker battles. And why he went to Gettysburg is a mystery


Good educator though.

I agree that he made a big mistake at Gettysburg. However, he was a lot better than all the union generals.

Which is saying what? Why don't you try to justify and glorify 600,000 people being killed by fucking folly? Grow up. Better yet, go back to the U.K.

 

[paperview]

Bripat longs for the days when "darkies" knew their place.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

South Carolina ceded all rights to Fort Sumter in 1836. It wasn't hers to just take.

Nor were the forts and military installations or the Mint filled with Gold they seized. Or the US Ships they fired on, and captured for their own use as Man of War vessels in January 1861.

You can't just go stealing federal government property and say: hey, it's ours now. Go fuck yourselves.

That property was bought and paid for by the entire United States.

It didn't quite happen that way. After announcing secession, SC and the confederates attempted a negotiation of the withdraw of the garrison at Sumpter. Lincoln flatly refused and sent them packing.

in other words, he made it perfectly clear that a secession was only going to happen in one fashion - the domination of the confederacy over the federal government. Lincoln even went so far as to call up 75k troops to squelch "the rebellion". Which wasn't a rebellion at all.

If no state ever had the right to secede from the union, it was never a union in the first place.

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

To the neo-confederate white supremacists inhabiting this thread:

All your democratic southern brethren who fought that war are dead now...I'm sure even some of them, from on high, are whispering, through the clouds: "Let it go."

I was born in Boston MA. Why should we let go of the truth?

Lots of people were. Does this make you special? And how the hell would you know the truth? They didn't have video and live coverage during the Civil War. Information was weeks old and passed by hand before it reached the newspapers in the northeast. Both sides started rumors of Lincoln's death a long time before he was assassinated. And the newspapers published it as fact.

 

[bripat9643]

What union did he save? 11 states wanted to leave and he decided to kill them instead of letting them leave. The union would have gone on with or without those 11 states, so again, what union did he save?

There's a reason that those states seceded and it had everything to do with the economic oppression being exerted by Northern states by means of their population advantage. They passed hefty tariffs that devastated the agricultural economy of the South and were heedless of any protest to the damage they were doing. Fort Sumter is where these levies were collected and the reason it was fired upon when all peaceful measures were exhausted.

Tariffs had been declining prior to the Civil War, due primarily to Southern opposition. They went up when the South seceded.

For several decades prior to the Civil War, the North was forced to delay or compromise several of its national economic policy objectives due to Southern opposition and the strong position the Southern states held in the Senate. As soon as the Southern states seceded Congress began enacting this delayed agenda. The Morrill Tariff of 1861 raised rates to 20 percent on average, ending more than 30 years of declining tariffs.

Civil War and Industrial Expansion 1860 x2013 1897 Overview FREE Civil War and Industrial Expansion 1860 x2013 1897 Overview information Encyclopedia.com Find Civil War and Industrial Expansion 1860 x2013 1897 Overview research

The Morrill Tariff was passed before the Confederates states seceded. It was one of the highest tariffs ever passed by Congress.

Fucking liar.

It was adopted on March 2, 1861.

All the Southern traitors had left by then and had already begun firing on ships and stealing Federal property.

More Lies About the Civil War 8211 LewRockwell.com

Morrill Tariff, which more than doubled the average tariff rate (from 15% to 32.6% initially), was passed by the U.S. House of Representatives during the 1859–60 session of Congress, and was the cornerstone of the Republican Party's economic policy. It then passed the U.S. Senate, and was signed into law by President James Buchanan on March 2, 1861, two days before Lincoln's inauguration, where he threatened war on any state that failed to collect the new tax. At the time, the tariff accounted for at least 90 percent of all federal tax revenues. The Morrill Tariff therefore represented a more than doubling of the rate of federal taxation!​

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

Bripat longs for the days when "darkies" knew their place.

Oh, there you go. I knew there had to be a simple answer.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

What union did he save? 11 states wanted to leave and he decided to kill them instead of letting them leave. The union would have gone on with or without those 11 states, so again, what union did he save?

There's a reason that those states seceded and it had everything to do with the economic oppression being exerted by Northern states by means of their population advantage. They passed hefty tariffs that devastated the agricultural economy of the South and were heedless of any protest to the damage they were doing. Fort Sumter is where these levies were collected and the reason it was fired upon when all peaceful measures were exhausted.

Tariffs had been declining prior to the Civil War, due primarily to Southern opposition. They went up when the South seceded.

For several decades prior to the Civil War, the North was forced to delay or compromise several of its national economic policy objectives due to Southern opposition and the strong position the Southern states held in the Senate. As soon as the Southern states seceded Congress began enacting this delayed agenda. The Morrill Tariff of 1861 raised rates to 20 percent on average, ending more than 30 years of declining tariffs.

Civil War and Industrial Expansion 1860 x2013 1897 Overview FREE Civil War and Industrial Expansion 1860 x2013 1897 Overview information Encyclopedia.com Find Civil War and Industrial Expansion 1860 x2013 1897 Overview research

The Morrill Tariff was passed before the Confederates states seceded. It was one of the highest tariffs ever passed by Congress.

Fucking liar.

It was adopted on March 2, 1861.

All the Southern traitors had left by then and had already begun firing on ships and stealing Federal property.

More Lies About the Civil War 8211 LewRockwell.com

Morrill Tariff, which more than doubled the average tariff rate (from 15% to 32.6% initially), was passed by the U.S. House of Representatives during the 1859–60 session of Congress, and was the cornerstone of the Republican Party's economic policy. It then passed the U.S. Senate, and was signed into law by President James Buchanan on March 2, 1861, two days before Lincoln's inauguration, where he threatened war on any state that failed to collect the new tax. At the time, the tariff accounted for at least 90 percent of all federal tax revenues. The Morrill Tariff therefore represented a more than doubling of the rate of federal taxation!​

And because of the republican presidential win and the notion of destroying the southern economy, they tried to leave. That wasn't going to be allowed. It wasn't allowed.

 

[bripat9643]

Of course not....it was fought over a states right to allow slavery

Oh God, not that crap again.

All one has to do is read he justifications for secession written by South Carolina, Mississippi, Georgia, and Texas. There were the direct words of the people who started the civil war, and the reasons they gave for doing that. Only a revisionist moron accepts contemporary spin about it.

Avalon Project - Confederate States of America - Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union

Lincoln started the Civil War, dumbshit. He invaded Virginia. It wasn't the other way around.

On April 12, 1861, General P.G.T. Beauregard, in command of the Confederate forces around Charleston Harbor, opened fire on the Union garrison holding Fort Sumter. At 2:30pm on April 13 Major Robert Anderson, garrison commander, surrendered the fort and was evacuated the next day.

Fort Sumter was South Carolina territory. Firing on your own territory isn't an act of war.

The Fort was federal territory......still is

Wrong, it was South Carolina territory. Is Subic Bay U.S. territory? Guantanamo?

 

[Kondor3]

bad general. Left almost 40% of his soldiers in most of his berserker battles. And why he went to Gettysburg is a mystery


Good educator though.

I agree that he made a big mistake at Gettysburg. However, he was a lot better than all the union generals.

Generally speaking, it seems that Lee was, indeed, better than most Union generals.

Ol' Abe burned through several Top Generals before he settled upon US Grant, who turned-in far higher casualties than Lee did, if memory serves correctly, to the point where ol' US Grant was styled 'Grant the Butcher' - whereas Bobby Lee was one of the most revered and beloved and respected generals in all of American history.

 

[bripat9643]

South Carolina ceded all rights to Fort Sumter in 1836. It wasn't hers to just take.

Nor were the forts and military installations or the Mint filled with Gold they seized. Or the US Ships they fired on, and captured for their own use as Man of War vessels in January 1861.

You can't just go stealing federal government property and say: hey, it's ours now. Go fuck yourselves.

That property was bought and paid for by the entire United States.

Yes, actually, you can. South Carolina ceded all property rights. That doesn't mean it ceded territorial rights. If the U.S. government decides to expropriate foreign owned property within our borders, it is free to do so. The same goes for any sovereign state, like the sovereign state of South Carolina. It can do the same. There is no principle of international law that requires it to allow a foreign power to station troops within its borders.

 

[paperview]

To the neo-confederate white supremacists inhabiting this thread:

All your democratic southern brethren who fought that war are dead now...I'm sure even some of them, from on high, are whispering, through the clouds: "Let it go."

I was born in Boston MA. Why should we let go of the truth?

Lots of people were. Does this make you special? And how the hell would you know the truth? They didn't have video and live coverage during the Civil War. Information was weeks old and passed by hand before it reached the newspapers in the northeast. Both sides started rumors of Lincoln's death a long time before he was assassinated. And the newspapers published it as fact.

That's not true. The telegraph had been invented and news was passed very quickly.