Repeal the 2nd Amendment?

[westwall]

westwall is a troll. It was funny when they tried to "challenge" me in geology. They found the name of one random formation on the planet earth and then asked how much I knew about it. There are thousands upon thousands of formations in the US alone (and some of them change names across state lines!) and this tool thought he was going to "own" me on the topic by finding a random formation.

It was pathetic to say the least and it showed that westwall doesn't know anything about geology.

Westwall never once said anything technical about the topic (they can't) and when I did they decided that their troll game would be claiming I just googled stuff.

It's sad when people are so shallow and vile. I can see being snarky and brutal on a discussion forum from time to time but to just be a troll for the jollies is stupid.

Which is, of course, on-brand for westwall.

(Watch they'll come back on here claiming they destroyed me again...it's sad)

No, what is funny is you whining that I wasn't using "sciency" terminology. I purposely used non scientific language because then you couldn't simply Google it.

However, if you were a true geologist you would instantly know the answers.

You failed.

You couldn't even tell a formation that I named was a formation. Even though I DID use standard scientific language for that.

You clued me in that you were a fraud when you had to cut and paste the USGS page for the Yellowstone caldera.

In the time you were cutting and pasting, I described in detail in a PM to one of the other posters what was happening, how it was happening, and why there was no concern.

I also told her that you were cut and pasting the USGS website, WHILE YOU WERE DOING IT, which she confirmed for herself.

So yeah, you are a liar, and a fraud.

So piss off, loser.

 

[Hollie]

People tend to get really heated when their nation watches multiple school slaughters and does nothing.

Every modest proposal is shot down (pun intended), so obviously some people are going to get more aggressive about their rhetoric.

Which just scares the bejeezlies out of the gun worshippers who run out and buy more guns.

In the end the folks who love their guns so much have to admit that people WILL GET PISSED OFF if their kids are dying just because they went to school. At some point people will get SO PISSED you won't like the response.

Just a pro-tip. Maybe something to help you develop a strategy for the conversation.

To preserve your hobby.

Less than a week ago, a modest, proposed school safety bill was shot down by Chuck Schumer.

Parkland dad devastated after Schumer blocks GOP school safety bill named after son: 'It's heartbreaking’

Max Schachter, whose son was killed in the 2018 Parkland school shooting, speaks out after Sen. Chuck Schumer blocked a school safety bill named after his son.

news.yahoo.com

Leftists / Democrats are being obstructionist. I wonder why that is.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

No, what is funny is you whining that I wasn't using "sciency" terminology. I purposely used non scientific language because then you couldn't simply Google it.

However, if you were a true geologist you would instantly know the answers.

You failed.

You couldn't even tell a formation that I named was a formation. Even though I DID use standard scientific language for that.

You clued me in that you were a fraud when you had to cut and paste the USGS page for the Yellowstone caldera.

In the time you were cutting and pasting, I described in detail in a PM to one of the other posters what was happening, how it was happening, and why there was no concern.

I also told her that you were cut and pasting the USGS website, WHILE YOU WERE DOING IT, which she confirmed for herself.

So yeah, you are a liar, and a fraud.

So piss off, loser.

See C_Clayton_Jones ? I told you they would come back on here and claim victory again. Note there's no technical details or actual citations (he couldn't even point to the posts he's talking about). He won't even talk about the details of how he destroyed me.

It's pure trolling 101.

Pathetic. I don't understand people who get off on being a douche. But I guess it takes all kinds.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

No, what is funny is you whining that I wasn't using "sciency" terminology. I purposely used non scientific language because then you couldn't simply Google it.

However, if you were a true geologist you would instantly know the answers.

You failed.

You couldn't even tell a formation that I named was a formation. Even though I DID use standard scientific language for that.

You clued me in that you were a fraud when you had to cut and paste the USGS page for the Yellowstone caldera.

In the time you were cutting and pasting, I described in detail in a PM to one of the other posters what was happening, how it was happening, and why there was no concern.

I also told her that you were cut and pasting the USGS website, WHILE YOU WERE DOING IT, which she confirmed for herself.

So yeah, you are a liar, and a fraud.

So piss off, loser.

If the Second Amendment were to be repealed it would return to the states the authority to regulate firearms as they see fit.

Indeed, it was the original intent of the Framers that the Second Amendment safeguard the right of the states to form and regulate state militia.

Many state constitutions have provisions recognizing a right to bear arms.

So the notion that absent the Second Amendment citizens would have their guns ‘taken’ or that guns would be ‘banned’ is as ridiculous as it is wrong.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

There are two ways to repeal an amendment. One way is for the proposed amendment to be passed by the House and the Senate with two-thirds majority votes. Then, the proposed amendment would have to be ratified by three-fourths of the states. The second way to repeal an amendment is to have a Constitutional Convention. It would take two-thirds of state legislatures to call for this convention and the states would draft amendments, which would have to be ratified by three-fourths of the states.

Considering the high threshold for making such a change to the Constitution, it's unlikely that the Second Amendment will be repealed. As Concerned American said, "I think a snowball in hell has a better chance of survival.".

Could we, should we, get rid of the 2nd Amendment?


Could we? NO. Not anytime soon anyway.

Should we? NO. I want the right to protect myself and my family in my own home. I should also have the right to go hunting if I want to or go to a Rod and Gun Club and hang with friends or associates there. And I should be able to carry a weapon in public to defend myself if necessary.

One thing to remember is that during the 1994 midterm elections, there was a very high correlation between members of Congress having supported Clinton's fraudulent “assault weapon” ban, and going on to lose their subsequent attempts to be reelected. Even Clinton himself admitted that his ban was likely responsible for the slaughter that his party took during that election. And that was just a temporary ban, on an arbitrarily-defined subset of arms. All the bullshit polls that have been put out, from before that time, onward, purporting to show public support for such infringements on the people's right to bear arms notwithstanding, in the poll that really mattered, the people made it clear that they do not support such abuses of power after all; and many politicians lost their jobs over it.

Now, you're talking about an effort to permanently alter the Constitution, to completely overturn the Second Amendment. Do you think you're ever going to see a solid supermajority of politicians willing to sacrifice their careers to accomplish this? You have to know that if they ever do ratify an Amendment to overturn the Second, or even make a serious effort to do so, that the vast majority of politicians who support it will lose their next elections, and never ever be able to be elected ever to another office ever again. And in the mean time, they'll surely be replaced by politicians who will make haste to ratify another amendment to restore the Second.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

Less than a week ago, a modest, proposed school safety bill was shot down by Chuck Schumer.

Parkland dad devastated after Schumer blocks GOP school safety bill named after son: 'It's heartbreaking’

Max Schachter, whose son was killed in the 2018 Parkland school shooting, speaks out after Sen. Chuck Schumer blocked a school safety bill named after his son.

news.yahoo.com

Leftists / Democrats are being obstructionist. I wonder why that is.

Hardening schools is what you guys have? Pushing this disaster off on the SCHOOLS? Yeah, you guys have your priorities a bit mixed up.

Deal with your guns. Or watch your kids die.

I don't have kids, don't have guns so in reality it's YOUR problem. YOU fix it.

 

[westwall]

See C_Clayton_Jones ? I told you they would come back on here and claim victory again. Note there's no technical details or actual citations (he couldn't even point to the posts he's talking about). He won't even talk about the details of how he destroyed me.

It's pure trolling 101.

Pathetic. I don't understand people who get off on being a douche. But I guess it takes all kinds.

Says the asshat who changed his name in shame.

 

[westwall]

If the Second Amendment were to be repealed it would return to the states the authority to regulate firearms as they see fit.

Indeed, it was the original intent of the Framers that the Second Amendment safeguard the right of the states to form and regulate state militia.

Many state constitutions have provisions recognizing a right to bear arms.

So the notion that absent the Second Amendment citizens would have their guns ‘taken’ or that guns would be ‘banned’ is as ridiculous as it is wrong.

No, it wasn't. The original intent of the Founders was to preserve the ability to eliminate an illegitimate government.

This is obvious when one reads the many letters between them that deal with the 2nd.

The militia is EVERYONE, that too is plain as day.

But only if you are honest.

Which you are not.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Wrong.

The OP is not advocating for repealing the Second Amendment.

Even if the Amendment were to be repealed – which no one supports – it doesn’t have anything to do with ‘taking’ guns from Americans.

Until 2010 the Second Amendment applied only to the Federal government, not states and local jurisdictions.

During those 219 years no state or local jurisdiction sought to ‘take’ anyone’s guns.

This is yet another reason why good-faith debate concerning the Second Amendment is impossible with the right: the comprehensive ignorance of conservatives about the topic.

So the professional liar is chiming in and responded strangely.
"Repeal the second amendment shrugs
Now how are you getting guns from the American subjects?"
I say repeal the second amendment shrugs and ask a question and the idiot says wrong and gives a long drawn out irrelevant response that I only read the first two lines.
How in the fuck is that wrong? If the second amendment is ever repealed what are you going to do with all the existing guns?

 

[westwall]

Does laughing lessen the sting?

PV?

 

[Hollie]

Hardening schools is what you guys have? Pushing this disaster off on the SCHOOLS? Yeah, you guys have your priorities a bit mixed up.

Deal with your guns. Or watch your kids die.

I don't have kids, don't have guns so in reality it's YOUR problem. YOU fix it.

Your earlier comment included terms such as ''modest proposals'' and ''doing something''. Both those initiatives were put forth by republicans and Schumer blocked them. So, it seems that leftists / democrats are the ''do nothing'' bunch.

 

[task0778]

Now, you're talking about an effort to permanently alter the Constitution, to completely overturn the Second Amendment. Do you think you're ever going to see a solid supermajority of politicians willing to sacrifice their careers to accomplish this.

No, I do not believe we will ever see a repeal of the 2nd Amendment, I was only detailing what the process is to do that. It ain't going to happen. There is said to be a bipartisan effort to pass some kind of gun control legislation, but I have serious doubts even that will ever happen. IMHO, the extremes on both ends of the spectrum will never agree to any moderate position. More than likely it's just lip service to appear to be doing something that will never happen. (November is coming up fast.)

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

Your earlier comment included terms such as ''modest proposals'' and ''doing something''. Both those initiatives were put forth by republicans and Schumer blocked them. So, it seems that leftists / democrats are the ''do nothing'' bunch.

Invariably you guys always want to do anything EXCEPT address the guns. You are more than happy to see 3rd grade teachers have to go through gun training, rather than what experts say (reduce guns). You would rather ensure that doors are locked. You would rather have schools RE-DESIGNED to harden them (in the same country that ROUTINELY hates paying for public education).

And when you get done with turning schools and theaters into armed encampments you move on to "mental healthcare". You cry crocodile tears over the sad state of mental healthcare in the country but you probably all to a person voted to ensure that healthcare remain out of reach of most Americans. You use "mental health" as a way to distract people.

Otherwise you might be willing to pay a SURCHARGE on your gun and ammo purchases to support access to mental healthcare.

You guys have "solutions", but none of them ever CONSIDER that MAYBE you guys are part of the problem to begin with.

 

[westwall]

Invariably you guys always want to do anything EXCEPT address the guns. You are more than happy to see 3rd grade teachers have to go through gun training, rather than what experts say (reduce guns). You would rather ensure that doors are locked. You would rather have schools RE-DESIGNED to harden them (in the same country that ROUTINELY hates paying for public education).

And when you get done with turning schools and theaters into armed encampments you move on to "mental healthcare". You cry crocodile tears over the sad state of mental healthcare in the country but you probably all to a person voted to ensure that healthcare remain out of reach of most Americans. You use "mental health" as a way to distract people.

Otherwise you might be willing to pay a SURCHARGE on your gun and ammo purchases to support access to mental healthcare.

You guys have "solutions", but none of them ever CONSIDER that MAYBE you guys are part of the problem to begin with.

That's because we PROVABlY aren't. Government is.

 

[Captain Caveman]

Could we, should we, get rid of tbe 2nd Amendment?

This thread is not about me personally favoring, and advocating the banning all gun ownership. I have had a permit (recent), to carry concealed. Though banning all ownership of weapons or restricting ownership is part of the question(s). Constitutionally, don’t we have every right to repeal amendments?



Can you control yourselves and hold back the political and personal attacks on the OP?

Stevens, J., Dissenting: The Legacy of Heller

This article focuses on the late Justice Stevens's opinions and commentary on the Second Amendment, demonstrating his approach to law and judging.

judicature.duke.edu

It's the very start of the start to safer guns and safer gun culture. But results won't happen overnight and will take decades.

 

[Hollie]

Invariably you guys always want to do anything EXCEPT address the guns. You are more than happy to see 3rd grade teachers have to go through gun training, rather than what experts say (reduce guns). You would rather ensure that doors are locked. You would rather have schools RE-DESIGNED to harden them (in the same country that ROUTINELY hates paying for public education).

And when you get done with turning schools and theaters into armed encampments you move on to "mental healthcare". You cry crocodile tears over the sad state of mental healthcare in the country but you probably all to a person voted to ensure that healthcare remain out of reach of most Americans. You use "mental health" as a way to distract people.

Otherwise you might be willing to pay a SURCHARGE on your gun and ammo purchases to support access to mental healthcare.

You guys have "solutions", but none of them ever CONSIDER that MAYBE you guys are part of the problem to begin with.

Obviously, you would prefer there be no second amendment but that's a problem because what other parts of the Constitution do you find objectionable?

Turning schools into "armed encampments" is a little frantic. There are much less extreme measures available but the leftist \ Democrat controlled senate has rejected the most recent proposal.

It seems it is you crying crocodile tears over your inability to understand that mental health issues were an obvious factor in the Texas and Buffalo Supermarket shootings. Ignoring the facts doesn't make the facts go away.

As knives are used in far more killings than firearms, would you propose an "assault knife" registration process? How about a surcharge on the set of steak knives I need to replace to address those who kill with knives?

 

[Bob Blaylock]

It's the very start of the start to safer guns and safer gun culture. But results won't happen overnight and will take decades.

I thought I just heard an echo of that idiot Joycelyn Elders, from almost thirty years ago, calling for “safer guns and safer bullets”.

 

[Ringtone]

Wrong.

The OP is not advocating for repealing the Second Amendment.

Even if the Amendment were to be repealed – which no one supports – it doesn’t have anything to do with ‘taking’ guns from Americans.

Until 2010 the Second Amendment applied only to the Federal government, not states and local jurisdictions.

During those 219 years no state or local jurisdiction sought to ‘take’ anyone’s guns.

This is yet another reason why good-faith debate concerning the Second Amendment is impossible with the right: the comprehensive ignorance of conservatives about the topic.

Again with this tripe! I debunked this crap on the other thread.

There is indeed confusion among some conservatives on this point, but it's precisely because the right to keep and bear arms is firstly a preexistent individual right per the imperatives of natural law—not one granted by the Constitution, by the several states or by Congress—that merely repealing the Second Amendment would not axiomatically constitute the end of the right.

In other words, some conservatives also wrongfully believe the right is granted by the Constitution. Some conservatives. Most conservatives understand that it's an inherent, preexistent right.

It's leftists, not conservatives, who mostly believe that simply repealing the Second would end the right, so shut the fuck up!

The Second Amendment was never meant to permit the several states to regulate firearms against the people as they bloody damn well pleased. Sans due process in the case of criminality and before the ratification of the Fourteenth Amendment, the several states never had any legitimate right to deprive any one of the people to keep and bear the general arms of the militia. It was the historical practice and understanding that the Second always applied to the states as well insofar as the general arms of the militia are concerned.

Notwithstanding, in the latter part of the 20th Century, blue states and municipalities began to encroach on the right in ways that would never be tolerated by the people in most of the other states.

Technically, all that McDonald v. City of Chicago (2010) did was formally specify in case law what had been formally reiterated for all citizens in 1868 with the ratification of the Fourteenth Amendment. The Court held that the right of an individual to keep and bear arms—as protected under the Second Amendment, dummy, not as protected under the Fourteenth—is incorporated by the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment like every other constitutional right. Hence, the right is enforceable against state and local governments via both the Second and Fourteenth Amendments.

In other words, the Court did not formally make this so in 2010. Rather, it formally compelled those states that had imposed the mythical collective-rights theory against original intent to back the hell off!

 

[Captain Caveman]

I thought I just heard an echo of that idiot Joycelyn Elders, from almost thirty years ago, calling for “safer guns and safer bullets”.

An empty head will hear echoes, so yes you did

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

Obviously, you would prefer there be no second amendment

If you had caught me about 20 years ago I'd probably seriously disagree. I grew up in a hunting family. Had my first gun before I had a drivers license. But any good tool that gets picked up and abused by overly enthusiastic people who don't know how serious the item is, it gets to the point where I think there's less and less reason to let a nation of crazy people have easy access to guns.

but that's a problem because what other parts of the Constitution do you find objectionable?

The Constitution has built-in options of repealing or amending itself. Why do you think otherwise?

It seems it is you crying crocodile tears over your inability to understand that mental health issues were an obvious factor in the Texas and Buffalo Supermarket shootings. Ignoring the facts doesn't make the facts go away.

I know more about the costs of mental health issues when they strike a family than most. So you might want to slow your roll on that one, Paco.

As knives are used in far more killings than firearms, would you propose an "assault knife" registration process? How about a surcharge on the set of steak knives I need to replace to address those who kill with knives?

Oh god, more "knives" talking points.

Let me know the next time there's a STRING of mass stabbings in schools that take out 20 little kids and do it so brutally and efficiently the POLICE are even scared of the guy. And then when the stabbing is so bad that the parents can't identify the kid without DNA.

And make sure to alert me when it becomes a nearly weekly thing here in the US.

Just. Make. This. Stop. YOU guys love your guns. Tell us what will make your favorite hobby stop being the PREFERRED METHOD OF KILLING KIDS.

What will it be?

YOU made the problem, YOU fix the problem.