Senate Introduces Bill to Kill Obamacare Dems Can't Stop

[WillReadmore]

How's government run healthcare working out for the vets?

Hundreds of veterans died waiting for care at Phoenix VA hospital, watchdog report finds

.

The VA is not a system that we all use.

It would be HUGELY different if we all used it, as our representatives and our president would be voted out of office on this issue without ANY question.

As a Disabled American Veteran I do.

Now you see what socialized hellcare is all about.

.

I don't agree with you on that - not even slightly.

Today, VA is a separate entity. As such, our legislature can just dump on it without affecting the vast majority of Americans. The VA just doesn't cover enough people to make it a political issue. Most people have NO CLUE about it.

If we all were restricted to VA health care, every politician in America would care.

If they didn't, they'd be a skid mark in history.

The problem is NOT that VA is a separate entity and that one cares about veterans.

The problem is that it is financed and operated by the government.

.

To believe that you have to believe that every other industrialized nation has a better government than does the USA.

After all, there is no such nation where health care is as abysmal as is our VA.

And, I just don't accept that premise.

 

[AntonToo]

I'm sorry, but "Nuh uh!" is not debunking something.

It's a fact. RomneyCare contained an individual mandate, and was the model on which Obamacare was based.

And for that, the GOP made Romney their 2012 candidate.

It all fits in with my theory the GOP has sold us all down the river to single payer healthcare.

A state providing their own kind of coverage and the federal government doing the same are two different things.

I see, so when you are mandated to buy insurance by State that is not unreasonable encroachment on freedom, but when it is on Federal level it is?

It is but the state has the right to do it.

You have way more control over your state politicians than you do the federal. Commie Care was passed and instituted against the will of the people. But when it comes to federal politics, you have an array of issues. Most people don't focus on just one or two like you do at the state level.

So ok to encroach on freedom, just do it on State level, is that your final answer?

To me this makes no sense. What is about healthcare needs in new York that is substantively different from healthcare needs of people in Texas. Why does the same wheel need to be invented 50 times?

Let me put it to you another way: Romney instituted state healthcare. DumBama instituted Commie Care

There you go again, very same healthcare plan on State level becomes communism on Federal? The thought process is just nonsensical unless viewed as simplistic politicking

 

[Weatherman2020]

A state providing their own kind of coverage and the federal government doing the same are two different things.

I see, so when you are mandated to buy insurance by State that is not unreasonable encroachment on freedom, but when it is on Federal level it is?

It is but the state has the right to do it.

You have way more control over your state politicians than you do the federal. Commie Care was passed and instituted against the will of the people. But when it comes to federal politics, you have an array of issues. Most people don't focus on just one or two like you do at the state level.

So ok to encroach on freedom, just do it on State level, is that your final answer?

To me this makes no sense. What is about healthcare needs in new York that is substantively different from healthcare needs of people in Texas. Why does the same wheel need to be invented 50 times?

Let me put it to you another way: Romney instituted state healthcare. DumBama instituted Commie Care

There you go again, very same healthcare plan on State level becomes communism on Federal? The thought process is just nonsensical unless viewed as simplistic politicking

The government should not tell me I can't buy insurance that other Americans buy.

 

[Contumacious]

Hundreds of veterans died waiting for care at Phoenix VA hospital, watchdog report finds

.

The VA is not a system that we all use.

It would be HUGELY different if we all used it, as our representatives and our president would be voted out of office on this issue without ANY question.

As a Disabled American Veteran I do.

Now you see what socialized hellcare is all about.

.

I don't agree with you on that - not even slightly.

Today, VA is a separate entity. As such, our legislature can just dump on it without affecting the vast majority of Americans. The VA just doesn't cover enough people to make it a political issue. Most people have NO CLUE about it.

If we all were restricted to VA health care, every politician in America would care.

If they didn't, they'd be a skid mark in history.

The problem is NOT that VA is a separate entity and that one cares about veterans.

The problem is that it is financed and operated by the government.

.

To believe that you have to believe that every other industrialized nation has a better government than does the USA.

After all, there is no such nation where health care is as abysmal as is our VA.

And, I just don't accept that premise.

ALL GOVERNMENT MANAGED PLANS ARE BANKRUPT

Feel free to show me one which is not.

.

 

[WillReadmore]

So tell us, what legislation has the great pandering Enzi put on the table to replace Obamacare?

The legislation that should be considered is the one abolishing Medicare, medicaid and state regulation of health care providers.

There are already several states that allow purchase of health care outside the state - the open insurance direction many Rs lobby for.

The catch is, insurance companies aren't choosing to take advantage of that.

As for me, if something goes wrong with my care, I don't want to be in a position where any legal action has to be carried out in some distant state.

Then support FREE MARKET HEALTHCARE.

GOVERNMENT's HANDS OFF HEALTHCARE>

.

We tried that. What happened was that we found that health care was not a commodity that leveraged the advantages of capitalism. For example, when people get sick, they need health care.

From there, we started creating legislation that attempted to align free market capitalism with the health care requirements of human beings.

Prior to the ACA, we had an extensive body of such legislation, but that was still a failure, as large numbers of people couldn't get coverage (for a variety of reasons). And, it was still the case that capitalist competition was not keeping costs in line, as noted by the spiraling health care costs of that time.

So, I really don't know why you want us to go back to that. It was NOT good.

 

[Lewdog]

Rand Paul said that the only way to repeal Obamacare is to replace it simultaneously. He is from Kentucky which has had a shit ton of previously uninsured people get coverage under the ACA... he is in no way going to vote himself out of office by voting to defund it. All it takes is all the Democrats, and 3 Republicans to vote No, and it doesn't pass.

 

[AntonToo]

Because there are other issues to deal with in the federal government. There is the debt, the deficit, terror attacks, border issues, the economy, a whole list of issues that many consider more important.

On a state level, state healthcare is the major issue. While states have other issues as well, it pales in comparison to something as huge as state healthcare.

Our long term national deficits are directly driven by healthcare costs of taking care of aging population that Feds pay a big chunk for, they are very closely knit.

National uninsured rates are also quite embarrassing for us as a developed country and red states where it is most rampant would not be the first to tackle this problem, they would be somewhere between last and never.

 

[ThoughtCrimes]

Let me buy insurance from anyone in America.

Health insurance cannot be sold across State lines. See the commerce clause in Article I, Section 8, cls. 3, the McCarran-Ferguson Act codified in 15 U.S.C. §§ 1011-1015 and SCOTUS United States v. South-Eastern Underwriters Ass'n. Health insurance companies have been given specific immunity from most anti-trust laws by not being involved in interstate commerce.

Right now you can only buy what is offered in the county you live in, and the rates depend on your home address. Many States offer only 1 choice.
Market will sort itself out.

Reason being is certain insurance outfits have driven down competition so only a few choices are left. That was the unfortunate result of the compromise derived back in the 1940's with the solution being the Act noted above to balance one evil against the other; monopolization and interstate commerce regulations! The surviving insurance companies like it that way.

 

[Contumacious]

So tell us, what legislation has the great pandering Enzi put on the table to replace Obamacare?

The legislation that should be considered is the one abolishing Medicare, medicaid and state regulation of health care providers.

There are already several states that allow purchase of health care outside the state - the open insurance direction many Rs lobby for.

The catch is, insurance companies aren't choosing to take advantage of that.

As for me, if something goes wrong with my care, I don't want to be in a position where any legal action has to be carried out in some distant state.

Then support FREE MARKET HEALTHCARE.

GOVERNMENT's HANDS OFF HEALTHCARE>

.

We tried that. What happened was that we found that health care was not a commodity that leveraged the advantages of capitalism. For example, when people get sick, they need health care.

From there, we started creating legislation that attempted to align free market capitalism with the health care requirements of human beings.

Prior to the ACA, we had an extensive body of such legislation, but that was still a failure, as large numbers of people couldn't get coverage (for a variety of reasons). And, it was still the case that capitalist competition was not keeping costs in line, as noted by the spiraling health care costs of that time.

So, I really don't know why you want us to go back to that. It was NOT good.

REPEATING

THERE HAS NOT BEEN FREE MARKET HEALTHCARE IN THE US SINCE 1840.


.

 

[AntonToo]

So tell us, what legislation has the great pandering Enzi put on the table to replace Obamacare?

The legislation that should be considered is the one abolishing Medicare, medicaid and state regulation of health care providers.

There are already several states that allow purchase of health care outside the state - the open insurance direction many Rs lobby for.

The catch is, insurance companies aren't choosing to take advantage of that.

As for me, if something goes wrong with my care, I don't want to be in a position where any legal action has to be carried out in some distant state.

Then support FREE MARKET HEALTHCARE.

GOVERNMENT's HANDS OFF HEALTHCARE>

.

We tried that. What happened was that we found that health care was not a commodity that leveraged the advantages of capitalism. For example, when people get sick, they need health care.

From there, we started creating legislation that attempted to align free market capitalism with the health care requirements of human beings.

Prior to the ACA, we had an extensive body of such legislation, but that was still a failure, as large numbers of people couldn't get coverage (for a variety of reasons). And, it was still the case that capitalist competition was not keeping costs in line, as noted by the spiraling health care costs of that time.

So, I really don't know why you want us to go back to that. It was NOT good.

REPEATING

THERE HAS NOT BEEN FREE MARKET HEALTHCARE IN THE US SINCE 1840.
.

THERE IS A GOOD REASON

 

[Contumacious]

The legislation that should be considered is the one abolishing Medicare, medicaid and state regulation of health care providers.

There are already several states that allow purchase of health care outside the state - the open insurance direction many Rs lobby for.

The catch is, insurance companies aren't choosing to take advantage of that.

As for me, if something goes wrong with my care, I don't want to be in a position where any legal action has to be carried out in some distant state.

Then support FREE MARKET HEALTHCARE.

GOVERNMENT's HANDS OFF HEALTHCARE>

.

We tried that. What happened was that we found that health care was not a commodity that leveraged the advantages of capitalism. For example, when people get sick, they need health care.

From there, we started creating legislation that attempted to align free market capitalism with the health care requirements of human beings.

Prior to the ACA, we had an extensive body of such legislation, but that was still a failure, as large numbers of people couldn't get coverage (for a variety of reasons). And, it was still the case that capitalist competition was not keeping costs in line, as noted by the spiraling health care costs of that time.

So, I really don't know why you want us to go back to that. It was NOT good.

REPEATING

THERE HAS NOT BEEN FREE MARKET HEALTHCARE IN THE US SINCE 1840.
.

THERE IS A GOOD REASON

If you are a fascist , a socialist a government supremacist or a member of the AMA then there is a good reason

If you are a Capitalist or a free marketeer then there are no good reasons.


.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

So, I really don't know why you want us to go back to that. It was NOT good.

And neither is Commie Care.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

A state providing their own kind of coverage and the federal government doing the same are two different things.

I see, so when you are mandated to buy insurance by State that is not unreasonable encroachment on freedom, but when it is on Federal level it is?

It is but the state has the right to do it.

You have way more control over your state politicians than you do the federal. Commie Care was passed and instituted against the will of the people. But when it comes to federal politics, you have an array of issues. Most people don't focus on just one or two like you do at the state level.

So ok to encroach on freedom, just do it on State level, is that your final answer?

To me this makes no sense. What is about healthcare needs in new York that is substantively different from healthcare needs of people in Texas. Why does the same wheel need to be invented 50 times?

Let me put it to you another way: Romney instituted state healthcare. DumBama instituted Commie Care

There you go again, very same healthcare plan on State level becomes communism on Federal? The thought process is just nonsensical unless viewed as simplistic politicking

When the federal government forces you to buy anything that you may not want, need or can afford, yes, that's communism.

 

[rightwinger]

I'm sorry, but "Nuh uh!" is not debunking something.

It's a fact. RomneyCare contained an individual mandate, and was the model on which Obamacare was based.

And for that, the GOP made Romney their 2012 candidate.

It all fits in with my theory the GOP has sold us all down the river to single payer healthcare.

A state providing their own kind of coverage and the federal government doing the same are two different things.

How so?

How so? The federal government is guided by the US Constitution. In that Constitution, there is a list of things that the feds are to provide for the people; healthcare coverage is not in there.

States on the other hand can make any kind of program or regulation they desire as long as it doesn't violate the Constitution.

Nice try

Congress has had broad discretion for two hundred years

Where does it say they could make the Louisiana Purchase?

Let's try this again: Provide for the Citizens.

Lets try this again...

Congress has broad discretion in what it provides We the People

Don't like it? Take it to court

 

[rightwinger]

I'm all for repealing Obamacare, but not one pseudocon has EVER answered the question, "AND THEN WHAT?"

And I've been asking for over six years.

Any jackass can be against something and criticize it, but it takes intelligence and guts to propose what must be done.

Easy.
Let me buy insurance from anyone in America.
Right now you can only buy what is offered in the county you live in, and the rates depend on your home address. Many States offer only 1 choice.
Market will sort itself out.

Actually, the market already has

States define what services are required. An insurance company in Buttfuck Mississippi cannot just start offering services in California. They must develop a network of doctors and pharmacies and establish a rate structure in each state

 

[Weatherman2020]

I'm all for repealing Obamacare, but not one pseudocon has EVER answered the question, "AND THEN WHAT?"

And I've been asking for over six years.

Any jackass can be against something and criticize it, but it takes intelligence and guts to propose what must be done.

Easy.
Let me buy insurance from anyone in America.
Right now you can only buy what is offered in the county you live in, and the rates depend on your home address. Many States offer only 1 choice.
Market will sort itself out.

Actually, the market already has

States define what services are required. An insurance company in Buttfuck Mississippi cannot just start offering services in California. They must develop a network of doctors and pharmacies and establish a rate structure in each state

Market has brought down prices? Most States only offer one provider, dufus. People have ONE place to get insurance.

You morons had no intention of reducing costs, so you kept Americans from being able to buy cheap insurance.

 

[Weatherman2020]

A state providing their own kind of coverage and the federal government doing the same are two different things.

How so?

How so? The federal government is guided by the US Constitution. In that Constitution, there is a list of things that the feds are to provide for the people; healthcare coverage is not in there.

States on the other hand can make any kind of program or regulation they desire as long as it doesn't violate the Constitution.

Nice try

Congress has had broad discretion for two hundred years

Where does it say they could make the Louisiana Purchase?

Let's try this again: Provide for the Citizens.

Lets try this again...

Congress has broad discretion in what it provides We the People

Don't like it? Take it to court

Hopeycare is a tax.
And Congress is now repealing the tax.

 

[danielpalos]

I'm all for repealing Obamacare, but not one pseudocon has EVER answered the question, "AND THEN WHAT?"

And I've been asking for over six years.

No you have been backing Obamacare for six years, like you voted for Hilary!

And you far left drones do not realize that the repeal can take years and not be immediate..

it is the right having, nothing but repeal, instead of better solutions at lower cost, that seems to be the problem, for some on the left.

 

[rightwinger]

How so?

How so? The federal government is guided by the US Constitution. In that Constitution, there is a list of things that the feds are to provide for the people; healthcare coverage is not in there.

States on the other hand can make any kind of program or regulation they desire as long as it doesn't violate the Constitution.

Nice try

Congress has had broad discretion for two hundred years

Where does it say they could make the Louisiana Purchase?

Let's try this again: Provide for the Citizens.

Why yes, let us provide for Citizens. A Universal Single Payer Health Care System. Like the rest of the first world nations have.

How's government run healthcare working out for the vets?

I don't see many vets wanting out

 

[rightwinger]

How so?

How so? The federal government is guided by the US Constitution. In that Constitution, there is a list of things that the feds are to provide for the people; healthcare coverage is not in there.

States on the other hand can make any kind of program or regulation they desire as long as it doesn't violate the Constitution.

Nice try

Congress has had broad discretion for two hundred years

Where does it say they could make the Louisiana Purchase?

Let's try this again: Provide for the Citizens.

Lets try this again...

Congress has broad discretion in what it provides We the People

Don't like it? Take it to court

Hopeycare is a tax.
And Congress is now repealing the tax.

Republicans will defund it and throw millions of low wage workers to the wolves
Let them explain why you can no longer afford insurance