serious question on core Jewish belief

[Indeependent]

The story of Abraham and his descendents is found in the book of Genesis. We first meet him in Genesis chapter 11, although at this stage his name is Abram. There is very little biographical detail about him apart from the fact that he was a shepherd and came from Ur in Mesopotamia - modern day Iraq - after which he and his family moved, with his father Terah, to Haran.

This is a polytheistic age, an age when people believed in and worshipped many gods. Yet within this atmosphere, Abram answers the call of God and it is because of this that he accepts and realises the reality of there being only one true God.

In the Jewish tradition called Midrash (a Hebrew word which means 'interpretation' and relates to the way readings or biblical verses are understood), there are a number of stories about Abraham smashing his father's idols when he realises that there can be only one God of heaven and earth. It doesn't matter whether the stories are true or not. They acknowledge that Abraham was the first person to recognise and worship the one God. And so, monotheism was born.

BBC - Religions - Judaism: Abraham

Abraham is regarded by Jews as the first Patriarch of the Jewish people. This article examines his life, times and significance.

www.bbc.co.uk

There was NO Ur of the Chaldeans in Abraham's time. He was from Urfa near Haran.

Ur of the Chaldeans

Do you know what this means?

Yep and it didn't exist during Abraham's time. See the geology. Further, the cities of the plain were long gone before Abraham and Lot.

Ur of the Chaldeans

To what does this refer?
Be precise.

 

[ding]

So then you think it's just a coincidence that the universe popped into existence being hardwired to produce intelligence

Who knows?

I'm going to put you in the it's just a coincidence camp.

Did you know that if the electron and proton were not exactly opposite in charge the universe could have been created exactly as it was but it would be impossible for life or intelligence to arise?

Now you are a physics guru. Ding you have no bounds.

Of course I have limits but I think this might be more chemistry related than physics but it would certainly impact physics. Because all the matter in the universe would be charged. Everything would either be positively charged or negatively charged. Since like charges repel one another, all the matter in the universe would repel all the other matter, and so the universe would expand, just as it is but it wouldn't do anything else. Even a slight difference in electric charge would be enough to overwhelm the forces of gravitation that bring matter together. There would be no planets, no stars, no galaxies -- and, worst of all, no you.

So are the electrical charges of electrons and protons just a coincidence too?

Creation is not important to me. It seems seems to be very important to you. It's as though your whole belief system is reliant on this dogma. You are like a dog with a bone.

Clearly it's not important to you. It seems that you would just as soon sweep it under the rug.

I think the answers to the origin questions are extremely important. Ancient man did too. That's why the Hebrews passed down their answers orally from generation to generation for thousands of years.

Personally I think the universe being created from nothing freaks the shit out of atheists.

So tell me about your out of body experience. Were you just BS'ing? Or did it actually happen?

Not exactly.. They borrowed myths from the old civilizations around them like Sumer, Egypt and the Canaanite pantheon.. Even Dilmun has thousands of clay tablets older than Genesis.

You mean from the practitioners of polytheism, right?

Yes.. They split off from the north coast Canaanites and initially worshipped Baal, El and Ashtoreh. Monotheism didn't happen overnight like some lightening strike.. That's why you have references to the Nephilim in Genesis.

My point is that it did happen and that there is a vast difference in monotheism and polytheism when it comes to God's involvement in the affairs of nature and man. A distinction which seems to be lost on you.

Don't be insulting. I know the difference. Why do you think over 4,000 clay statues to Ashtoreh have been found in Jerusalem? It didn't happen all at once and there was a lot of backsliding. Remember the Golden Calf or the Bronze Serpent?

There were two versions of Genesis one for Israel and one for Judah. They were combined sometime during the rule of the Omris.

How that insulting? I do believe that distinction has been lost on you because you keep saying they took their myth from others.

The point I am making is that there is a wide disparity - a crucial disparity - between the beliefs of polytheists and monotheists.

So clearly the meaning of those accounts is vastly different. Once you acknowledge that, then all will be fine.

 

[Indeependent]

The story of Abraham and his descendents is found in the book of Genesis. We first meet him in Genesis chapter 11, although at this stage his name is Abram. There is very little biographical detail about him apart from the fact that he was a shepherd and came from Ur in Mesopotamia - modern day Iraq - after which he and his family moved, with his father Terah, to Haran.

This is a polytheistic age, an age when people believed in and worshipped many gods. Yet within this atmosphere, Abram answers the call of God and it is because of this that he accepts and realises the reality of there being only one true God.

In the Jewish tradition called Midrash (a Hebrew word which means 'interpretation' and relates to the way readings or biblical verses are understood), there are a number of stories about Abraham smashing his father's idols when he realises that there can be only one God of heaven and earth. It doesn't matter whether the stories are true or not. They acknowledge that Abraham was the first person to recognise and worship the one God. And so, monotheism was born.

BBC - Religions - Judaism: Abraham

Abraham is regarded by Jews as the first Patriarch of the Jewish people. This article examines his life, times and significance.

www.bbc.co.uk

There was NO Ur of the Chaldeans in Abraham's time. He was from Urfa near Haran.

Ur of the Chaldeans

Do you know what this means?

Yep and it didn't exist during Abraham's time. See the geology. Further, the cities of the plain were long gone before Abraham and Lot.

I just Googled it and you are, as usual, full of shit.

 

[ding]

The story of Abraham and his descendents is found in the book of Genesis. We first meet him in Genesis chapter 11, although at this stage his name is Abram. There is very little biographical detail about him apart from the fact that he was a shepherd and came from Ur in Mesopotamia - modern day Iraq - after which he and his family moved, with his father Terah, to Haran.

This is a polytheistic age, an age when people believed in and worshipped many gods. Yet within this atmosphere, Abram answers the call of God and it is because of this that he accepts and realises the reality of there being only one true God.

In the Jewish tradition called Midrash (a Hebrew word which means 'interpretation' and relates to the way readings or biblical verses are understood), there are a number of stories about Abraham smashing his father's idols when he realises that there can be only one God of heaven and earth. It doesn't matter whether the stories are true or not. They acknowledge that Abraham was the first person to recognise and worship the one God. And so, monotheism was born.

BBC - Religions - Judaism: Abraham

Abraham is regarded by Jews as the first Patriarch of the Jewish people. This article examines his life, times and significance.

www.bbc.co.uk

There was NO Ur of the Chaldeans in Abraham's time. He was from Urfa near Haran.

Ur of the Chaldeans

Do you know what this means?

Yep and it didn't exist during Abraham's time. See the geology. Further, the cities of the plain were long gone before Abraham and Lot.

I know something about geology and I seriously doubt geology has that kind of resolution. But I am open minded, show me how geology answers this question.

 

[.oldschool]

And if I do and still have the same observation, then what?

Nothing. It will just prove what a one track mind you have.

 

[ding]

And if I do and still have the same observation, then what?

Nothing. It will just prove what a one track mind you have.

That's a stupid conclusion. Can you at least give me a clue what I should be watching for?

 

[ding]

The story of Abraham and his descendents is found in the book of Genesis. We first meet him in Genesis chapter 11, although at this stage his name is Abram. There is very little biographical detail about him apart from the fact that he was a shepherd and came from Ur in Mesopotamia - modern day Iraq - after which he and his family moved, with his father Terah, to Haran.

This is a polytheistic age, an age when people believed in and worshipped many gods. Yet within this atmosphere, Abram answers the call of God and it is because of this that he accepts and realises the reality of there being only one true God.

In the Jewish tradition called Midrash (a Hebrew word which means 'interpretation' and relates to the way readings or biblical verses are understood), there are a number of stories about Abraham smashing his father's idols when he realises that there can be only one God of heaven and earth. It doesn't matter whether the stories are true or not. They acknowledge that Abraham was the first person to recognise and worship the one God. And so, monotheism was born.

BBC - Religions - Judaism: Abraham

Abraham is regarded by Jews as the first Patriarch of the Jewish people. This article examines his life, times and significance.

www.bbc.co.uk

There was NO Ur of the Chaldeans in Abraham's time. He was from Urfa near Haran.

Ur of the Chaldeans

Do you know what this means?

Not sure she does but she needs to contact the BBC and tell them what they publish is inaccurate

She gets her facts from FuckTheJews.org

I don't know about that. She seems to be all over the map on things. I certainly would not take anything she claims without finding a second source, that's for sure.

 

[.oldschool]

Can you at least give me a clue what I should be watching for?

Start at the beginning. Try reading the first paragraph.

 

[ding]

Can you at least give me a clue what I should be watching for?

Start at the beginning. Try reading the first paragraph.

I did. I watched every bit of the 4 minute and something seconds video. Can you be more specific?

 

[ding]

.oldschool I'm really more interested in your out of body experience that you "claimed" you had.

Was that just bullshit? Or did it really happen?

 

[surada]

The story of Abraham and his descendents is found in the book of Genesis. We first meet him in Genesis chapter 11, although at this stage his name is Abram. There is very little biographical detail about him apart from the fact that he was a shepherd and came from Ur in Mesopotamia - modern day Iraq - after which he and his family moved, with his father Terah, to Haran.

This is a polytheistic age, an age when people believed in and worshipped many gods. Yet within this atmosphere, Abram answers the call of God and it is because of this that he accepts and realises the reality of there being only one true God.

In the Jewish tradition called Midrash (a Hebrew word which means 'interpretation' and relates to the way readings or biblical verses are understood), there are a number of stories about Abraham smashing his father's idols when he realises that there can be only one God of heaven and earth. It doesn't matter whether the stories are true or not. They acknowledge that Abraham was the first person to recognise and worship the one God. And so, monotheism was born.

BBC - Religions - Judaism: Abraham

Abraham is regarded by Jews as the first Patriarch of the Jewish people. This article examines his life, times and significance.

www.bbc.co.uk

There was NO Ur of the Chaldeans in Abraham's time. He was from Urfa near Haran.

Ur of the Chaldeans

Do you know what this means?

Yep and it didn't exist during Abraham's time. See the geology. Further, the cities of the plain were long gone before Abraham and Lot.

I just Googled it and you are, as usual, full of shit.

Abraham was from the city of Ur according to Genesis 11:31 above. The problem is that there are several places called Ur. It is mostly translated as "Ur of the Chaldeans." The problem with "Chaldeans" is that it is a late word used in the Neo-Babylonian times. It is either anachronistic, or a poor translation.
Abraham's Ur - Accuracy in Genesis
www.accuracyingenesis.com/ur.html

 

[.oldschool]

.oldschool I'm really more interested in you out of body experience that you "claimed" you had.

Was that just bullshit? Or did it really happen?

You think this deserves a reply? Did they teach you to talk like a prick at Mass?

 

[Indeependent]

The story of Abraham and his descendents is found in the book of Genesis. We first meet him in Genesis chapter 11, although at this stage his name is Abram. There is very little biographical detail about him apart from the fact that he was a shepherd and came from Ur in Mesopotamia - modern day Iraq - after which he and his family moved, with his father Terah, to Haran.

This is a polytheistic age, an age when people believed in and worshipped many gods. Yet within this atmosphere, Abram answers the call of God and it is because of this that he accepts and realises the reality of there being only one true God.

In the Jewish tradition called Midrash (a Hebrew word which means 'interpretation' and relates to the way readings or biblical verses are understood), there are a number of stories about Abraham smashing his father's idols when he realises that there can be only one God of heaven and earth. It doesn't matter whether the stories are true or not. They acknowledge that Abraham was the first person to recognise and worship the one God. And so, monotheism was born.

BBC - Religions - Judaism: Abraham

Abraham is regarded by Jews as the first Patriarch of the Jewish people. This article examines his life, times and significance.

www.bbc.co.uk

There was NO Ur of the Chaldeans in Abraham's time. He was from Urfa near Haran.

Ur of the Chaldeans

Do you know what this means?

Yep and it didn't exist during Abraham's time. See the geology. Further, the cities of the plain were long gone before Abraham and Lot.

I just Googled it and you are, as usual, full of shit.

Abraham was from the city of Ur according to Genesis 11:31 above. The problem is that there are several places called Ur. It is mostly translated as "Ur of the Chaldeans." The problem with "Chaldeans" is that it is a late word used in the Neo-Babylonian times. It is either anachronistic, or a poor translation.
Abraham's Ur - Accuracy in Genesis
www.accuracyingenesis.com/ur.html

In your book everything that corresponds to the Torah is anachronistic, or a poor translation, even though self-hating Jewish archeologists are constantly confirming the verses.
You are one hateful bitch.

 

[ding]

.oldschool I'm really more interested in you out of body experience that you "claimed" you had.

Was that just bullshit? Or did it really happen?

You think this deserves a reply? Did they teach you to talk like a prick at Mass?

Yeah, I do think it deserves a reply. I never claimed to be a good Catholic. In fact, let me dispel all doubts. I am a bad Catholic.

So, did it happen or did it happen? Cause I think you are just playing games cause you got your hat handed to you.

 

[.oldschool]

.oldschool I'm really more interested in you out of body experience that you "claimed" you had.

Was that just bullshit? Or did it really happen?

You think this deserves a reply? Did they teach you to talk like a prick at Mass?

Yeah, I do think it deserves a reply. I never claimed to be a good Catholic. In fact, let me dispel all doubts. I am a bad Catholic.

So, did it happen or did it happen? Cause I think you are just playing games cause you got your hat handed to you.

ding you are an egomaniac.

 

[ding]

.oldschool I'm really more interested in you out of body experience that you "claimed" you had.

Was that just bullshit? Or did it really happen?

You think this deserves a reply? Did they teach you to talk like a prick at Mass?

Yeah, I do think it deserves a reply. I never claimed to be a good Catholic. In fact, let me dispel all doubts. I am a bad Catholic.

So, did it happen or did it happen? Cause I think you are just playing games cause you got your hat handed to you.

ding you are an egomaniac.

Sometimes.

So that's a no. You made it up.

 

[irosie91]

The story of Abraham and his descendents is found in the book of Genesis. We first meet him in Genesis chapter 11, although at this stage his name is Abram. There is very little biographical detail about him apart from the fact that he was a shepherd and came from Ur in Mesopotamia - modern day Iraq - after which he and his family moved, with his father Terah, to Haran.

This is a polytheistic age, an age when people believed in and worshipped many gods. Yet within this atmosphere, Abram answers the call of God and it is because of this that he accepts and realises the reality of there being only one true God.

In the Jewish tradition called Midrash (a Hebrew word which means 'interpretation' and relates to the way readings or biblical verses are understood), there are a number of stories about Abraham smashing his father's idols when he realises that there can be only one God of heaven and earth. It doesn't matter whether the stories are true or not. They acknowledge that Abraham was the first person to recognise and worship the one God. And so, monotheism was born.

BBC - Religions - Judaism: Abraham

Abraham is regarded by Jews as the first Patriarch of the Jewish people. This article examines his life, times and significance.

www.bbc.co.uk

There was NO Ur of the Chaldeans in Abraham's time. He was from Urfa near Haran.

Ur of the Chaldeans

Do you know what this means?

Yep and it didn't exist during Abraham's time. See the geology. Further, the cities of the plain were long gone before Abraham and Lot.

I just Googled it and you are, as usual, full of shit.

Abraham was from the city of Ur according to Genesis 11:31 above. The problem is that there are several places called Ur. It is mostly translated as "Ur of the Chaldeans." The problem with "Chaldeans" is that it is a late word used in the Neo-Babylonian times. It is either anachronistic, or a poor translation.
Abraham's Ur - Accuracy in Genesis
www.accuracyingenesis.com/ur.html

In your book everything that corresponds to the Torah is anachronistic, or a poor translation, even though self-hating Jewish archeologists are constantly confirming the verses.
You are one hateful bitch.

can you be more specific?

 

[ding]

Personally I think it would be horrible if one thought he were a saint. That has dunning effect written all over it.

 

[surada]

The story of Abraham and his descendents is found in the book of Genesis. We first meet him in Genesis chapter 11, although at this stage his name is Abram. There is very little biographical detail about him apart from the fact that he was a shepherd and came from Ur in Mesopotamia - modern day Iraq - after which he and his family moved, with his father Terah, to Haran.

This is a polytheistic age, an age when people believed in and worshipped many gods. Yet within this atmosphere, Abram answers the call of God and it is because of this that he accepts and realises the reality of there being only one true God.

In the Jewish tradition called Midrash (a Hebrew word which means 'interpretation' and relates to the way readings or biblical verses are understood), there are a number of stories about Abraham smashing his father's idols when he realises that there can be only one God of heaven and earth. It doesn't matter whether the stories are true or not. They acknowledge that Abraham was the first person to recognise and worship the one God. And so, monotheism was born.

BBC - Religions - Judaism: Abraham

Abraham is regarded by Jews as the first Patriarch of the Jewish people. This article examines his life, times and significance.

www.bbc.co.uk

There was NO Ur of the Chaldeans in Abraham's time. He was from Urfa near Haran.

Ur of the Chaldeans

Do you know what this means?

Yep and it didn't exist during Abraham's time. See the geology. Further, the cities of the plain were long gone before Abraham and Lot.

I just Googled it and you are, as usual, full of shit.

Abraham was from the city of Ur according to Genesis 11:31 above. The problem is that there are several places called Ur. It is mostly translated as "Ur of the Chaldeans." The problem with "Chaldeans" is that it is a late word used in the Neo-Babylonian times. It is either anachronistic, or a poor translation.
Abraham's Ur - Accuracy in Genesis
www.accuracyingenesis.com/ur.html

The story of Abraham and his descendents is found in the book of Genesis. We first meet him in Genesis chapter 11, although at this stage his name is Abram. There is very little biographical detail about him apart from the fact that he was a shepherd and came from Ur in Mesopotamia - modern day Iraq - after which he and his family moved, with his father Terah, to Haran.

This is a polytheistic age, an age when people believed in and worshipped many gods. Yet within this atmosphere, Abram answers the call of God and it is because of this that he accepts and realises the reality of there being only one true God.

In the Jewish tradition called Midrash (a Hebrew word which means 'interpretation' and relates to the way readings or biblical verses are understood), there are a number of stories about Abraham smashing his father's idols when he realises that there can be only one God of heaven and earth. It doesn't matter whether the stories are true or not. They acknowledge that Abraham was the first person to recognise and worship the one God. And so, monotheism was born.

BBC - Religions - Judaism: Abraham

Abraham is regarded by Jews as the first Patriarch of the Jewish people. This article examines his life, times and significance.

www.bbc.co.uk

There was NO Ur of the Chaldeans in Abraham's time. He was from Urfa near Haran.

Ur of the Chaldeans

Do you know what this means?

Yep and it didn't exist during Abraham's time. See the geology. Further, the cities of the plain were long gone before Abraham and Lot.

I just Googled it and you are, as usual, full of shit.

Abraham was from the city of Ur according to Genesis 11:31 above. The problem is that there are several places called Ur. It is mostly translated as "Ur of the Chaldeans." The problem with "Chaldeans" is that it is a late word used in the Neo-Babylonian times. It is either anachronistic, or a poor translation.
Abraham's Ur - Accuracy in Genesis
www.accuracyingenesis.com/ur.html

In your book everything that corresponds to the Torah is anachronistic, or a poor translation, even though self-hating Jewish archeologists are constantly confirming the verses.
You are one hateful bitch.

Excerpt:

Josephus and Rabbi Maimonides believed that Ur Kasdim was in Northern Mesopotamia, in what is today Syria or Turkey.

There is no debate over where Haran is located, 10 miles north of the Syrian border in Turkey along the Balikh River, a tributary of the Euphrates River. Haran is an important Hurrian center, mentioned in the Nuzi tablets. The moon god, Sin was worshiped here.

There are two cities not far from Haran; Ura and Urfa. Local tradition says that Abraham was born in Urfa. Northern Ur is mentioned in tablets at Ugarit, Nuzi, and Ebla, which refers to Ur, URA, and Urau (See BAR January 2000, page 16).

The names of several of Abraham's relatives like Peleg, Serug, Nahor and Terah, appear as names of cities in the region of Haran (Harper's Bible Dictionary, page 373). Abraham sent his servant back to the region of Haran to find a wife for Isaac (Genesis 24:10).

Gen 24:4 You must go back to the country where I was born (nativity) and get a wife for my son Isaac from among my relatives."

Gen 24:10 The servant, who was in charge of Abraham's property, took ten of his master's camels and went to the city where Nahor had lived in northern Mesopotamia (Aram Naharaim) . (GNB)

After working for Laban, Jacob fled across the Euphrates River back to Canaan (Genesis 31:21). If Ur were the one in Southern Mesopotamia, then Jacob would not need to cross the Euphrates. Laban is said to live in Paddan-Aram, which is in the region of Haran (Genesis 28:5-7), which seems to be the same area as Aram-Naharaim, Abraham's homeland (Genesis 24:10).

All this evidence taken together seems to indicate that the Ur of Abraham was in the same region as Haran in Northern Mesopotamia, and NOT the famous Ur in Southern Mesopotamia.

Abraham's Ur

Where was Abraham's Ur ?

www.accuracyingenesis.com

 

[.oldschool]

Personally I think it would be horrible if one thought he were a saint. That has dunning effect written all over it.

Being civil does not require one to be a saint. Now that avatar of yours makes sense jackass.