Should Churches be forced to accomodate for homosexual weddings?

[mdk]

Another day, another church not being forced to marry a gay couple. Maybe tomorrow will be different...

"Another day, another Christian not being herded into the gulags" . . . until the day came that they were.

Only a dumbfuck or a liar thinks that "Ignore the buildup because it's not the actual crisis" is a good plan.

How hysterically dramatic. lol

It's definitely convincing when you protest that our rights are not under attack . . . by using the exact same dismissals, word for word, that were used then.

The more you tell us you aren't a threat, the more like a threat you sound.

USSR anti-religious campaign 1921 28 - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

The elimination of all religion and its replacement with atheism supported with a materialist world view was a fundamental ideological goal of the state. To this end the state conducted anti-religious persecutions against believers that were meant to hurt and destroy religion. It was never made illegal to be a believer or to have religion, and so the activities of this campaign were often veiled under other pretexts (usually resistance to the regime) that the state invoked or invented in order to justify its activities.

The tenth party congress met in early 1921 and issued the resolution "On Glavpolitprosvet and the Agitation: Propaganda Problems of the Party". This resolution called for "widescale organization, leadership, and cooperation in the task of anti-religious agitation and propaganda among the broad masses of the workers, using the mass media, films, books, lectures, and other devices.

Tikhon produced an encyclical on political neutrality and disengagement of the Church from worldly politics, and the official propaganda depicted it as a form of camouflage to hide his real aim of support for autocratic bourgeois-aristocracy. Tikhon emphasized the freedom of the Church in the separation of Church and State and the duty of believers to be loyal to the state in civic matters, in as much as this did not contradict a Christian’s primary loyalty to God.

Faith had to be turned into a private affair and made as invisible as possible. The regime could not tolerate dynamic faith or popular religious leaders who could inspire and lead millions of people.

That was all just the FIRST ten-year program. The people who said the Bolshevik Revolution would lead to mass killings and imprisonment of Christians just for being Christian were "hysterical and overdramatic" . . . until it happened. The Nazis said they "just" wanted to move the Jews into ghettos, "just" make them wear the Star of David, "just" limit a few activities. Chairman Mao "just" wanted . . . Pol Pot "just" wanted . . . Tyranny doesn't start with mass murder and imprisonment. It starts with "just" wanting something small, and then something else, and it's just so silly and hysterical to expect that it will EVER go farther.

Those who will not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Those who lie about history and pretend it can't be repeated should be horsewhipped.

I don't believe gays having access to marriage and being covered in some states' public accommodation laws is going to lead to American versions of The Killing Fields and/or Kristallnacht. You sound exactly like the overly dramatic gays that says Christians are going to round them up and cart them off to camps or jail. Two peas in a hysterically dramatic pod.

Besides, I am totally down with scrapping PA laws in most instances. The free market will decide if these businesses that refuse to serve gays, Jews, Muslims, the disabled or whatever will remain open or not.

 

[mdk]

Can you name a single church that has been forced to marry any couple against their wishes?

Not yet. But I can imagine a lawsuit based on 'public accomodation' alleging that it is illegal to discriminate against gays.

Can you imagine that?

You clearly do not understand public accommodation laws. There hasn't been a single case of a public accommodation being used to force a church to marry anyone.

All depends on who interprets the laws then doesn't it, because right now gay's are interpreting the laws to mean that a Christian Cake Baker has to bake a customized wedding cake for a Gay couple, and you know what ? No one saw that one coming either. The feds and it's cronyism for whom run the feds, well if they are looking for constituencies for new voting blocks to draw from, then you will see many issues stretched beyond ones imagination in this nation because no one rides for free, and if you think that is a lie, then just take a look backwards and you will see what goes on in it all. People/huge groups are selling their votes to the feds, but it's all for something in return, and they know it, we know it, and everyone knows it now. Sil is right when she says "maybe not yet", but stay tuned.

The states where those bakers reside have PA laws that include gays. If you open a public business in one of those states you can't refuse service on that basis. The people that "didn't see this coming" we're ignorant of the law in their states. These laws need to be scrapped almost entirely in my opinion. The free market will decide if they should remain open or not if they refuse to serve X members of society.

 

[Syriusly]

Another day, another church not being forced to marry a gay couple. Maybe tomorrow will be different...

"Another day, another Christian not being herded into the gulags" . . . until the day came that they were.

Only a dumbfuck or a liar thinks that "Ignore the buildup because it's not the actual crisis" is a good plan.

How hysterically dramatic. lol

It's definitely convincing when you protest that our rights are not under attack . . . by using the exact same dismissals, word for word, that were used then.

The more you tell us you aren't a threat, the more like a threat you sound.

USSR anti-religious campaign 1921 28 - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

The elimination of all religion and its replacement with atheism supported with a materialist world view was a fundamental ideological goal of the state. To this end the state conducted anti-religious persecutions against believers that were meant to hurt and destroy religion. It was never made illegal to be a believer or to have religion, and so the activities of this campaign were often veiled under other pretexts (usually resistance to the regime) that the state invoked or invented in order to justify its activities.

The tenth party congress met in early 1921 and issued the resolution "On Glavpolitprosvet and the Agitation: Propaganda Problems of the Party". This resolution called for "widescale organization, leadership, and cooperation in the task of anti-religious agitation and propaganda among the broad masses of the workers, using the mass media, films, books, lectures, and other devices.

Tikhon produced an encyclical on political neutrality and disengagement of the Church from worldly politics, and the official propaganda depicted it as a form of camouflage to hide his real aim of support for autocratic bourgeois-aristocracy. Tikhon emphasized the freedom of the Church in the separation of Church and State and the duty of believers to be loyal to the state in civic matters, in as much as this did not contradict a Christian’s primary loyalty to God.

Faith had to be turned into a private affair and made as invisible as possible. The regime could not tolerate dynamic faith or popular religious leaders who could inspire and lead millions of people.

That was all just the FIRST ten-year program. The people who said the Bolshevik Revolution would lead to mass killings and imprisonment of Christians just for being Christian were "hysterical and overdramatic" . . . until it happened. The Nazis said they "just" wanted to move the Jews into ghettos, "just" make them wear the Star of David, "just" limit a few activities. Chairman Mao "just" wanted . . . Pol Pot "just" wanted . . . Tyranny doesn't start with mass murder and imprisonment. It starts with "just" wanting something small, and then something else, and it's just so silly and hysterical to expect that it will EVER go farther.

Those who will not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Those who lie about history and pretend it can't be repeated should be horsewhipped.

And that of course has nothing to do with the United States.

Here in the United States, we are all protected by the Constitution- and that includes churches and homosexuals.

I thought everything was progressive these days, otherwise always changing, so what's stopping anyone now ? Isn't their a saying "the enemy is now at the gates" ? Now everyone knows that the enemy doesn't have to be a person, but rather what the person or person's might want right ? Many issues have been highjacked by groups who seek to piggy back or ride in off of what was done for others upon specific issues, and it has been a progressive muddying of the waters ever since in this nation.

The only thing constant is change.

If you want to change the Constitution so that churches do not have the freedom to operate as they will, just change the Constitution.

Until then- no you can't force a church to marry blacks or Jews or homosexuals.

 

[Syriusly]

Can you name a single church that has been forced to marry any couple against their wishes?

Not yet. But I can imagine a lawsuit based on 'public accomodation' alleging that it is illegal to discriminate against gays.

Can you imagine that?

You clearly do not understand public accommodation laws. There hasn't been a single case of a public accommodation being used to force a church to marry anyone.

All depends on who interprets the laws then doesn't it, because right now gay's are interpreting the laws to mean that a Christian Cake Baker has to bake a customized wedding cake for a Gay couple, and you know what ?

The Christian Baker has the same legal option every gay couple who believed that the law was wrong.

He can either sue to change the law- as gay couples have done- or get the public behind changing the law and change it through vote or legislation- which has also been done when it comes to marriage rights.

But the law was put in place by voters who were opposed to business' discriminating against people based upon their sexual orientation. Hardly a case of no one could anticipate it would be used against a business who discriminated against someone based upon their sexual orientation.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Can you name a single church that has been forced to marry any couple against their wishes?

Not yet. But I can imagine a lawsuit based on 'public accomodation' alleging that it is illegal to discriminate against gays.

Can you imagine that?

You clearly do not understand public accommodation laws. There hasn't been a single case of a public accommodation being used to force a church to marry anyone.

All depends on who interprets the laws then doesn't it, because right now gay's are interpreting the laws to mean that a Christian Cake Baker has to bake a customized wedding cake for a Gay couple, and you know what ? No one saw that one coming either. The feds and it's cronyism for whom run the feds, well if they are looking for constituencies for new voting blocks to draw from, then you will see many issues stretched beyond ones imagination in this nation because no one rides for free, and if you think that is a lie, then just take a look backwards and you will see what goes on in it all. People/huge groups are selling their votes to the feds, but it's all for something in return, and they know it, we know it, and everyone knows it now. Sil is right when she says "maybe not yet", but stay tuned.

The states where those bakers reside have PA laws that include gays. If you open a public business in one of those states you can't refuse service on that basis. The people that "didn't see this coming" we're ignorant of the law in their states. These laws need to be scrapped almost entirely in my opinion. The free market will decide if they should remain open or not if they refuse to serve X members of society.

Well, laws who provide for the equal treatment of people who are handicapped by their skin color, injury, physical malady, etc... are worthy, as they serve to sustain justice.

Sexual Abnormality is a direct consequences of intellectual perversion. And intellectual perversion is a threat to justice... rejecting the objectivity which the is essential to the very concept of justice itself.

What you're dealing with there is, quite simply, old fashion evil. It's a lie designed for no other purpose than to produce chaos, calamity and catastrophe.

 

[Syriusly]

Can you name a single church that has been forced to marry any couple against their wishes?

Not yet. But I can imagine a lawsuit based on 'public accomodation' alleging that it is illegal to discriminate against gays.

Can you imagine that?

You clearly do not understand public accommodation laws. There hasn't been a single case of a public accommodation being used to force a church to marry anyone.

All depends on who interprets the laws then doesn't it, because right now gay's are interpreting the laws to mean that a Christian Cake Baker has to bake a customized wedding cake for a Gay couple, and you know what ? No one saw that one coming either. The feds and it's cronyism for whom run the feds, well if they are looking for constituencies for new voting blocks to draw from, then you will see many issues stretched beyond ones imagination in this nation because no one rides for free, and if you think that is a lie, then just take a look backwards and you will see what goes on in it all. People/huge groups are selling their votes to the feds, but it's all for something in return, and they know it, we know it, and everyone knows it now. Sil is right when she says "maybe not yet", but stay tuned.

The states where those bakers reside have PA laws that include gays. If you open a public business in one of those states you can't refuse service on that basis. The people that "didn't see this coming" we're ignorant of the law in their states. These laws need to be scrapped almost entirely in my opinion. The free market will decide if they should remain open or not if they refuse to serve X members of society.

Well, laws who provide for the equal treatment of people who are handicapped by their skin color, injury, physical malady, etc... are worthy, as they serve to sustain justice..

'handicapped by their skin color'

The issue is not that someone is handicapped by their skin color- it is that bigots don't want to serve them because of their skin color- or race- or religion- or national origin- or gender- or sexual preference.

 

[Seawytch]

Can you name a single church that has been forced to marry any couple against their wishes?

Not yet. But I can imagine a lawsuit based on 'public accomodation' alleging that it is illegal to discriminate against gays.

Can you imagine that?

You clearly do not understand public accommodation laws. There hasn't been a single case of a public accommodation being used to force a church to marry anyone.

All depends on who interprets the laws then doesn't it, because right now gay's are interpreting the laws to mean that a Christian Cake Baker has to bake a customized wedding cake for a Gay couple, and you know what ? No one saw that one coming either. The feds and it's cronyism for whom run the feds, well if they are looking for constituencies for new voting blocks to draw from, then you will see many issues stretched beyond ones imagination in this nation because no one rides for free, and if you think that is a lie, then just take a look backwards and you will see what goes on in it all. People/huge groups are selling their votes to the feds, but it's all for something in return, and they know it, we know it, and everyone knows it now. Sil is right when she says "maybe not yet", but stay tuned.

The states where those bakers reside have PA laws that include gays. If you open a public business in one of those states you can't refuse service on that basis. The people that "didn't see this coming" we're ignorant of the law in their states. These laws need to be scrapped almost entirely in my opinion. The free market will decide if they should remain open or not if they refuse to serve X members of society.

It's easy for people to say "let the free market decide" when they live in an area with an actual market. There is one Septic Service that operates in my area. What if he chooses not to do business with me? There is one store within 20 miles of my house, a small local market. If I need formula for my baby, am I supposed to drive 60 miles in the middle of the night because they won't sell me food? Maybe gays can just grow their own food like this guy suggests...

Washington State Staffer: Gay People Should 'Just Grow Their Own Food' To Deal With Discrimination

 

[Silhouette]

What you're dealing with there is, quite simply, old fashion evil. It's a lie designed for no other purpose than to produce chaos, calamity and catastrophe.

Actually, there's a purpose. Civil unions affording all the same access to dying spouse stuff, inheritance of assets etc. weren't good enough for the LGBT cult. That's because there was one "benefit" that was still being denied them in marriage. Access to rights to adopt vulnerable orphans.

I won't say more about that here except to direct the reader to my signature line and to post this picture of the Harvey Milk stamp here:

Want some drugs little "waif"?...

 

[Jarlaxle]

Yes yes, Silly...your absolute OBSESSION with Harvey Milk is hardly news. Have you seen a shrink to deal with your obsession yet?

 

[hazlnut]

What you're dealing with there is, quite simply, old fashion evil. It's a lie designed for no other purpose than to produce chaos, calamity and catastrophe.

Actually, there's a purpose. Civil unions affording all the same access to dying spouse stuff, inheritance of assets etc. weren't good enough for the LGBT cult. That's because there was one "benefit" that was still being denied them in marriage. Access to rights to adopt vulnerable orphans.

I won't say more about that here except to direct the reader to my signature line and to post this picture of the Harvey Milk stamp here:

Want some drugs little "waif"?...

You're a vile homophobe.

You know the dumb redneck asshole character in the films about the 60's civil rights struggle? That's how you'll be portrayed in future movies about the marriage equality days.

And you know how it was always the most racist dickhole who secretly lusted after black women -- guess how that common truth about bigots will apply to you?

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

What you're dealing with there is, quite simply, old fashion evil. It's a lie designed for no other purpose than to produce chaos, calamity and catastrophe.

Actually, there's a purpose. Civil unions affording all the same access to dying spouse stuff, inheritance of assets etc. weren't good enough for the LGBT cult. That's because there was one "benefit" that was still being denied them in marriage. Access to rights to adopt vulnerable orphans.

I won't say more about that here except to direct the reader to my signature line and to post this picture of the Harvey Milk stamp here:

Want some drugs little "waif"?...

You're a vile homophobe.

ROFLMNAO!

There's literally no such thing as a 'homophobe'.

But how cool is it that you're insufficiently bright to figure that out?

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

What you're dealing with there is, quite simply, old fashion evil. It's a lie designed for no other purpose than to produce chaos, calamity and catastrophe.

Actually, there's a purpose. Civil unions affording all the same access to dying spouse stuff, inheritance of assets etc. weren't good enough for the LGBT cult. That's because there was one "benefit" that was still being denied them in marriage. Access to rights to adopt vulnerable orphans.

I won't say more about that here except to direct the reader to my signature line and to post this picture of the Harvey Milk stamp here:

Want some drugs little "waif"?...

Yes... Civil Unions merely provided legal privilege and not the Legitimacy inherent in Marriage.

And it is Legitimacy which sexual abnormality precludes... and it is THAT which the sexually abnormal crave MOST.

Just not enough to turn from the behavior which precludes it.

 

[Silhouette]

Yes yes, Silly...your absolute OBSESSION with Harvey Milk is hardly news. Have you seen a shrink to deal with your obsession yet?

Jar Jar, I wasn't the one who chose a child predator as my "sexuality icon". The LGBT cult did. Who and what a person or group of people or cult choose to worship says worlds about the base mores of that person, group or people or cult. Harvey isn't worshipped by the LGBT cult for his skills in badmitten or inventing new forms of energy or a patented device or musical skill etc. Harvey is worshipped by the LGBT cult specifically for his sexual behavior. That behavior as described by his fundamentally-honest gay biographer and friend was a "...a penchant for young waifs with substance abuse problems". Putting it more simply, Harvey liked to drug rape teen homeless boys.

That was his sexuality.

His sexuality is why LGBTs admire him. Do you want me to do the logical "If...Then.." equation for you or can you and the readers just fill in the blanks?

 

[Jarlaxle]

No, everyone except you filled in the blanks a long time ago. You REALLY should get professional psychiatric help to deal with your obsession .

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

What you're dealing with there is, quite simply, old fashion evil. It's a lie designed for no other purpose than to produce chaos, calamity and catastrophe.

Actually, there's a purpose. Civil unions affording all the same access to dying spouse stuff, inheritance of assets etc. weren't good enough for the LGBT cult. That's because there was one "benefit" that was still being denied them in marriage. Access to rights to adopt vulnerable orphans.

I won't say more about that here except to direct the reader to my signature line and to post this picture of the Harvey Milk stamp here:

Want some drugs little "waif"?...

Yes... Civil Unions merely provided legal privilege and not the Legitimacy inherent in Marriage.

And it is Legitimacy which sexual abnormality precludes... and it is THAT which the sexually abnormal crave MOST.

Just not enough to turn from the behavior which precludes it.

Incorrect.

'Civil unions' are un-Constitutional because they're predicated on the illegal doctrine of 'separate but equal,' repugnant to the 14th Amendment.

Same-sex couples are eligible to enter into the same marriage contracts as opposite-sex couples, where state measures seeking to deny them that access lack a rational basis, are devoid of objective, documented evidence in support, and fail to pursue a proper legislative end – such measures exist solely to make gay Americans different from everyone else, which the states cannot do. Indeed, the fear, ignorance, and hate you and others have exhibited in this thread with regard to gay Americans alone is proof of that.

Gay Americans seeking their comprehensive civil rights is not 'evil,' and that you subjectively perceive homosexuality as a 'sexual abnormality' is legally and Constitutionally irrelevant, as animus toward gay Americans alone is not justification to deny them their civil liberties.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

'Civil unions' are un-Constitutional ...

ROFLMNAO! You simply cannot hide the idiots.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Yes yes, Silly...your absolute OBSESSION with Harvey Milk is hardly news. Have you seen a shrink to deal with your obsession yet?

Jar Jar, I wasn't the one who chose a child predator as my "sexuality icon". The LGBT cult did. Who and what a person or group of people or cult choose to worship says worlds about the base mores of that person, group or people or cult. Harvey isn't worshipped by the LGBT cult for his skills in badmitten or inventing new forms of energy or a patented device or musical skill etc. Harvey is worshipped by the LGBT cult specifically for his sexual behavior. That behavior as described by his fundamentally-honest gay biographer and friend was a "...a penchant for young waifs with substance abuse problems". Putting it more simply, Harvey liked to drug rape teen homeless boys.

That was his sexuality.

His sexuality is why LGBTs admire him. Do you want me to do the logical "If...Then.." equation for you or can you and the readers just fill in the blanks?

Such is the nature of evil.

 

[Neil N. Blowme]

Why am I not surprised?

Christian Man Asks Thirteen Gay Bakeries To Bake Him Pro-Traditional Marriage Cake And Is Denied Service By All Of Them WATCH THE SHOCKING VIDEO - Walid Shoebat

 

[Seawytch]

Why am I not surprised?

Christian Man Asks Thirteen Gay Bakeries To Bake Him Pro-Traditional Marriage Cake And Is Denied Service By All Of Them WATCH THE SHOCKING VIDEO - Walid Shoebat

A special order is completely different than simply being asked to bake a cake out of a catalog. In none of the Public Accommodation cases did the gay couples ask for a service or item not already provided by the business.

 

[Neil N. Blowme]

Why am I not surprised?

Christian Man Asks Thirteen Gay Bakeries To Bake Him Pro-Traditional Marriage Cake And Is Denied Service By All Of Them WATCH THE SHOCKING VIDEO - Walid Shoebat

A special order is completely different than simply being asked to bake a cake out of a catalog. In none of the Public Accommodation cases did the gay couples ask for a service or item not already provided by the business.

You're making up shit.