Should Trump freeze prices to prevent coronavirus gouging?

[bripat9643]

Why wouldn't Trump freeze prices to prevent gouging?

It's unconstitutional.
It's stupid.

Is it unconstitutional?

Do you not remember this... “I am today ordering a freeze on all prices and wages throughout the United States.”

Aug. 15, 1971

Nixon

Who sued?...When was the case ruled on?

As far as I know, nobody...thus it has not been found unconstitutional...seems simple enough

Actually, the SC found it unconstitutional in the early days of the New Deal. It ruled the NRA to be unconstitutional, and it's primary function was to set and regulate prices.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Why wouldn't Trump freeze prices to prevent gouging?

It's unconstitutional.
It's stupid.

Is it unconstitutional?

Do you not remember this... “I am today ordering a freeze on all prices and wages throughout the United States.”

Aug. 15, 1971

Nixon

Who sued?...When was the case ruled on?

As far as I know, nobody...thus it has not been found unconstitutional...seems simple enough

Actually, the SC found it unconstitutional in the early days of the New Deal. It ruled the NRA to be unconstitutional, and it's primary function was to set and regulate prices.

And yet it has been done at least 3 times since then...weird.

 

[bripat9643]

It's unconstitutional.
It's stupid.

Is it unconstitutional?

Do you not remember this... “I am today ordering a freeze on all prices and wages throughout the United States.”

Aug. 15, 1971

Nixon

Who sued?...When was the case ruled on?

As far as I know, nobody...thus it has not been found unconstitutional...seems simple enough

Actually, the SC found it unconstitutional in the early days of the New Deal. It ruled the NRA to be unconstitutional, and it's primary function was to set and regulate prices.

And yet it has been done at least 3 times since then...weird.

When did Congress ever let the Constitution get in its way?

 

[Oddball]

Why wouldn't Trump freeze prices to prevent gouging?

It's unconstitutional.
It's stupid.

Is it unconstitutional?

Do you not remember this... “I am today ordering a freeze on all prices and wages throughout the United States.”

Aug. 15, 1971

Nixon

Who sued?...When was the case ruled on?

As far as I know, nobody...thus it has not been found unconstitutional...seems simple enough

IOW, nobody ever called a prez operating beyond his scope on it, so it's all perfectly kosher.

You're a worse libertarian than Bill Weld.

 

[Andylusion]

Why wouldn't Trump freeze prices to prevent gouging?

Why should he? How could he? He's not a dictator

It is funny how they scream that Trump is a dictator non-stop... and then spin right around, and demand he dictate how things work.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Here's the issue with price gauging. If you don't allow prices to fluctuate with the market, the result is there is no product.

When demand goes up, the cost goes up, which results in there being an incentive to bring products to market.

If you deny that system, then the result is there simply is not product.

I can think of dozens of examples of this.

After Hurricane Sandy, the mayor of New York sent out police to stop gas stations that were charging a higher price for gasoline.

The result after that, was that gas stations sold out of gas, and people simply.... didn't have any gas for their cars.

Before that, with higher prices, the gas stations were willing to pay gas suppliers a higher fee, to get gasoline shipped into the hurricane zone, which then allowed them to sell to customers, albeit at a higher price.

But with the government sending in police to shut down gas stations engaged in this, the result was no one was willing to pay a higher price for gas, so gas simply didn't show up, the gas stations ran out of gas, and everyone couldn't fill up their cars.

Similarly after Katrina, a hardware store owner contacted private trucking firms, to pick up gas generators, and truck them into the hurricane zone to his store. Of course doing that is horribly expensive, so the store owner sold the generators at a much higher price.... now interestingly, even at the higher price, he lost money on every generator sold.

Nevertheless, he was attacked and destroyed in the media for price gauging, and never had another generator trucked into New Orleans. He lamented that all the other hardware stores were not attacked for price gauging, even though all of them had no generators at all. And of course he closed his store, and provided no generators after that either.

Now as it relates specifically to this situation, I read a post from someone complaining about price gauging. They went to walmart or some other store, and found absolutely nothing. They went to a small independent shop, and found the shelves were full... but the prices were higher.

See, walmart and the other big stores, know that if they provide product at a higher price, that people will scream about gauging. And you know this is true.

So instead, when the product runs out... it just runs out. That's what you want. You'd rather have no product, than a product at higher price. So... no product.

The smaller shops are less likely to be mentioned on that national news, so they raise prices, which allows them to pay for more product, and thus they have product.

When you prevent product prices from adjusting, you result in Venezuela results. Price controls always.... ALWAYS result in shortage.

There's a reason why you can't even find coffee, in a country in the very center of a coffee bean growing region. Price controls.

So whether it is price controls on gas or power generators in a hurricane zone, or price controls on food in Venezuela, or if you control the price of hand sanitizer in the name of "price gouging", the result will always be shortages.

Seeing your post, followed immediately by an unimaginably ignorant remark from Chief Shitting Bull, that “This is a definite crisis where socialism should override capitalism!”, made me think of a story I'd heard. I first heard it, vaguely, a long time ago, probably about the time it happened. Some official from the Soviet Union was visiting our country,and not much impressed by a lot of the scientific, military, and whatever other stuff he was shown. But when his group stopped at a supermarket, to pick up some things,he was amazed by the supply of food and other goods that were easily available to common Americans.

The story came to light again, some time within the past few years, with more details, and more significance. It turns out that that Soviet official was Boris Yeltsin, who went on to become the first post-Soviet President of Russia. And a staunch Communist up to that point, this experience was life-changing for him, and had a profound effect on how he led Russia.

Yeltsin later wrote, of his experience…

“When I saw those shelves crammed with hundreds, thousands of cans, cartons and goods of every possible sort, for the first time I felt quite frankly sick with despair for the Soviet people,” Yeltsin later wrote in his autobiography, Against the Grain. “That such a potentially super-rich country as ours has been brought to a state of such poverty! It is terrible to think of it.”

·
·
·​

“Even the Politburo doesn't have this choice. Not even Mr. Gorbachev…”, he said.​

What a powerful lesson, for a lifelong Communist to learn. Too bad that their American counterparts lack the wisdom that Yeltsin turned out to have. Surrounded by abundance that those in Socialist shitholes cannot even imagine, we have ignorant folks like Lakhota who take this abundance for granted, and condemn the very system that makes it possible.

 

[Andylusion]

Should Trump freeze prices to prevent coronavirus gouging?

Freeze prices on what?

Hand Sanitizer. Although I am amused that people think hand sanitizer is going to stop an airborne virus that has a 1.8 meter radius. Unless you are groping someone's face with your hands while they are coughing, hand sanitizer isn't going to help you.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Why wouldn't Trump freeze prices to prevent gouging?

It's unconstitutional.
It's stupid.

Is it unconstitutional?

Do you not remember this... “I am today ordering a freeze on all prices and wages throughout the United States.”

Aug. 15, 1971

Nixon

Who sued?...When was the case ruled on?

As far as I know, nobody...thus it has not been found unconstitutional...seems simple enough

IOW, nobody ever called a prez operating beyond his scope on it, so it's all perfectly kosher.

You're a worse libertarian than Bill Weld.

Who said it was kosher? i said it happens and nobody gives a fucking shit based upon the fact we keep voting the same people back into office.

You really should spend more time working on your reading comprehension, you have the a dumb ass down pat already.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Is it unconstitutional?

Do you not remember this... “I am today ordering a freeze on all prices and wages throughout the United States.”

Aug. 15, 1971

Nixon

Who sued?...When was the case ruled on?

As far as I know, nobody...thus it has not been found unconstitutional...seems simple enough

Actually, the SC found it unconstitutional in the early days of the New Deal. It ruled the NRA to be unconstitutional, and it's primary function was to set and regulate prices.

And yet it has been done at least 3 times since then...weird.

When did Congress ever let the Constitution get in its way?

Right before the last time a president let the Constitution get in his way

 

[depotoo]

Consumers face coronavirus price-gouging

As fears over the coronavirus grow, people are frantically buying up supplies and leaving store shelves empty. Prices are also sky-rocketing online as demand grows, such as two large bottles of Purell hand sanitizer on sale for nearly $300 on Amazon. The same size normally sells for about $9 a bottle. An Amazon spokesperson says the company does not allow price gouging and it has "recently blocked or removed tens of thousands of offers." Anna Werner reports from a pharmacy in Manhattan on how coronavirus price gouging is affecting consumers.

How coronavirus price-gouging is hurting consumers

Have you experienced price gouging? I've heard several people say that they have. Since I don't do much shopping, I can't speak to any personal experiences - yet.

You think it’s a problem, let your governor know. That’s how it works. It’s a states issue.

 

[Markle]

Why wouldn't Trump freeze prices to prevent gouging?

Why? Major chains are not going to price gouge. It isn't worth the long term bad publicity.

Florida and other states have gouging laws in place for short term emergencies. It is effective.

There is a major problem with longer-term price freezes.

Prices of Purell are fixed at $10.00 a bottle, usually, $9.00. Lakhota goes to Costco with Markle and we each buy ten cases with 24 in each case and pay Costco $2,400.00 we each go home. The next day Costco is sold out, other folks have done the same. You and I both go to a street corner and put a cardboard sign saying $40.00 a bottle while our wives put them on eBay for $50.00 a bottle with FREE 2-DAY SHIPPING!

How are authorities going to put a dent in this when there are so many more important things for them to do?

 

[Bob Blaylock]

This is a definite crisis where socialism should override capitalism!

Socialism never solves nor mitigates a crisis. Never, in history, has it done anything but create and aggravate crises.

There is always, of course, that old cliché that defines insanity as doing what has been done before, and expecting a different result.

 

[Lakhota]

NY STATE OF EMERGENCY: Coronavirus Cases Jump to 76 In New York

Even New York Governor Cuomo's state of emergency addresses price gouging.

 

[Andylusion]

Here's the issue with price gauging. If you don't allow prices to fluctuate with the market, the result is there is no product.

When demand goes up, the cost goes up, which results in there being an incentive to bring products to market.

If you deny that system, then the result is there simply is not product.

I can think of dozens of examples of this.

After Hurricane Sandy, the mayor of New York sent out police to stop gas stations that were charging a higher price for gasoline.

The result after that, was that gas stations sold out of gas, and people simply.... didn't have any gas for their cars.

Before that, with higher prices, the gas stations were willing to pay gas suppliers a higher fee, to get gasoline shipped into the hurricane zone, which then allowed them to sell to customers, albeit at a higher price.

But with the government sending in police to shut down gas stations engaged in this, the result was no one was willing to pay a higher price for gas, so gas simply didn't show up, the gas stations ran out of gas, and everyone couldn't fill up their cars.

Similarly after Katrina, a hardware store owner contacted private trucking firms, to pick up gas generators, and truck them into the hurricane zone to his store. Of course doing that is horribly expensive, so the store owner sold the generators at a much higher price.... now interestingly, even at the higher price, he lost money on every generator sold.

Nevertheless, he was attacked and destroyed in the media for price gauging, and never had another generator trucked into New Orleans. He lamented that all the other hardware stores were not attacked for price gauging, even though all of them had no generators at all. And of course he closed his store, and provided no generators after that either.

Now as it relates specifically to this situation, I read a post from someone complaining about price gauging. They went to walmart or some other store, and found absolutely nothing. They went to a small independent shop, and found the shelves were full... but the prices were higher.

See, walmart and the other big stores, know that if they provide product at a higher price, that people will scream about gauging. And you know this is true.

So instead, when the product runs out... it just runs out. That's what you want. You'd rather have no product, than a product at higher price. So... no product.

The smaller shops are less likely to be mentioned on that national news, so they raise prices, which allows them to pay for more product, and thus they have product.

When you prevent product prices from adjusting, you result in Venezuela results. Price controls always.... ALWAYS result in shortage.

There's a reason why you can't even find coffee, in a country in the very center of a coffee bean growing region. Price controls.

So whether it is price controls on gas or power generators in a hurricane zone, or price controls on food in Venezuela, or if you control the price of hand sanitizer in the name of "price gouging", the result will always be shortages.

Seeing your post, followed immediately by an unimaginably ignorant remark from Chief Shitting Bull, that “This is a definite crisis where socialism should override capitalism!”, made me think of a story I'd heard. I first heard it, vaguely, a long time ago, probably about the time it happened. Some official from the Soviet Union was visiting our country,and not much impressed by a lot of the scientific, military, and whatever other stuff he was shown. But when his group stopped at a supermarket, to pick up some things,he was amazed by the supply of food and other goods that were easily available to common Americans.

The story came to light again, some time within the past few years, with more details, and more significance. It turns out that that Soviet official was Boris Yeltsin, who went on to become the first post-Soviet President of Russia. And a staunch Communist up to that point, this experience was life-changing for him, and had a profound effect on how he led Russia.

Yeltsin later wrote, of his experience…

“When I saw those shelves crammed with hundreds, thousands of cans, cartons and goods of every possible sort, for the first time I felt quite frankly sick with despair for the Soviet people,” Yeltsin later wrote in his autobiography, Against the Grain. “That such a potentially super-rich country as ours has been brought to a state of such poverty! It is terrible to think of it.”

·
·
·​

“Even the Politburo doesn't have this choice. Not even Mr. Gorbachev…”, he said.​

What a powerful lesson, for a lifelong Communist to learn. Too bad that their American counterparts lack the wisdom that Yeltsin turned out to have. Surrounded by abundance that those in Socialist shitholes cannot even imagine, we have ignorant folks like Lakhota who take this abundance for granted, and condemn the very system that makes it possible.

I read two things about Soviets visiting Capitalist America.

One was about this, where people who were with Boris Yeltsin, believed that the stores must have been faked. They were so Brain-washed by left-wing socialist thinking, that when faced with the black and white truth, they simply denied it by claiming the US must have setup fake stores to show the Soviets.

Nothing has changed in the ideological mind-warping left-wing, because we hear the same thing today in relation to Venezuela. It must have been the US sanctions, not socialism, that is resulting in mass starvation in Venezuela. Whatever excuse they can grab onto to save their death causing ideology.

The second, was some Soviet, I want to say mikhail gorbachev, who said "Only in American can you find fat poor people.".

Regardless... these people never learn. Almost a 100 years of clear undeniable failure of their ideals, and they just keep finding more excuses for their failure.

 

[depotoo]

Why wouldn't Trump freeze prices to prevent gouging?

Why? Major chains are not going to price gouge. It isn't worth the long term bad publicity.

Florida and other states have gouging laws in place for short term emergencies. It is effective.

There is a major problem with longer-term price freezes.

Prices of Purell are fixed at $10.00 a bottle, usually, $9.00. Lakhota goes to Costco with Markle and we each buy ten cases with 24 in each case and pay Costco $2,400.00 we each go home. The next day Costco is sold out, other folks have done the same. You and I both go to a street corner and put a cardboard sign saying $40.00 a bottle while our wives put them on eBay for $50.00 a bottle with FREE 2-DAY SHIPPING!

How are authorities going to put a dent in this when there are so many more important things for them to do?

Exactly! A state’s issue.

 

[Andylusion]

NY STATE OF EMERGENCY: Coronavirus Cases Jump to 76 In New York

Even New York Governor Cuomo's state of emergency addresses price gouging.

It will result in shortages. Fewer people will have access to those things now. It's happened consistently, every single time they have taken these actions. Every time.

Unless NYC starts paying from the tax payers for it, which will be a huge boon for the wealthy... but you support that, no matter how much you claim otherwise.

Don't you? If the city government starts buying up hundreds of millions in sanitizer, at massive profits to the wealthy, and handing them out to public, you would support that, right? Be honest. You would.

 

[depotoo]

NY STATE OF EMERGENCY: Coronavirus Cases Jump to 76 In New York

Even New York Governor Cuomo's state of emergency addresses price gouging.

So why doesn’t your governor?

 

[Lakhota]

NY STATE OF EMERGENCY: Coronavirus Cases Jump to 76 In New York

Even New York Governor Cuomo's state of emergency addresses price gouging.

So why doesn’t your governor?

Not in my state - yet. But some gouging is already becoming noticeable.

 

[depotoo]

NY STATE OF EMERGENCY: Coronavirus Cases Jump to 76 In New York

Even New York Governor Cuomo's state of emergency addresses price gouging.

So why doesn’t your governor?

Not in my state - yet.

Well, if it does, then contact your governor if he doesn’t do anything, ‘kay? Hope yours remains coronavirus free.

 

[Markle]

Why wouldn't Trump freeze prices to prevent gouging?

It's unconstitutional.
It's stupid.

Is it unconstitutional?

Do you not remember this... “I am today ordering a freeze on all prices and wages throughout the United States.”

Aug. 15, 1971

Nixon

It was unconstitutional, and counterproductive, when Nixon did it.

It sure was. I was the manager of a large retail store so we were ground central. Picture frame #72 would be discontinued and picture frame #74 would be a new item, identical to #72 but 10% more expensive. It got to be a game and was totally ineffective.