The Beginning of the End of Free Health Care For Illegal Aliens

[Mr Natural]

Those lawns are not going to mow themselves.

 

[Aba Incieni]

That is no justification for those who seek to circumvent our immigration laws. Sad that you guys look for any reason to encourage illegal immigration.

This is wrong. I'm not looking for reasons to justify circumventing laws. In fact, my view is that data like that provides a strong argument for changing the laws. It's the passage of laws like the IRCA in the 1980s that created the situation we have now. In fact there really are no options for immigrants from Latin America who wish to immigrate legally, it's essentially impossible unless you have existing relations who are citizens. Yet, not only are immigrants beneficial to the American economy, there are sectors of the economy which explicitly depend on immigrants to function. We've created an entirely irrational state of affairs because of the disconnect between the economic and legal realities. The fix for that isn't ignoring the law, it's changing it.

Of course there are options for Latin Americans to immigrate legally. Go to the US embassy in your home country and apply.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Those lawns are not going to mow themselves.

Our lawn care co doesn't have any working for them. College kids working their way through school and they do a fine job

 

[well named]

Of course there are options for Latin Americans to immigrate legally. Go to the US embassy in your home country and apply.

I meant no feasible options for immigrants who do not have existing relations who are US citizens, given the priority the system awards to family members. Limits on the numbers of legal immigrants from each country mean that the waiting period to immigrate legally can be up to 30 years, depending on the country of origin. The average wait for a Mexican citizen who attempts to immigrate legally is about 18 years. That is obviously intractable for someone looking to immigrate as a worker, and of course it also makes little sense for immigrants who wish to migrate seasonally for agricultural work.

This is entirely the point of saying there is an irrational disconnect between the economics of Latin American immigration and the existing legal framework. The waiting lists are so long, and the number of illegal immigrants so high, because the economics incentivize a much higher level of immigration than is legally allowed. Those economics are actually good for native-born citizens in general, which is the original claim I provided evidence for.

 

[Aba Incieni]

Of course there are options for Latin Americans to immigrate legally. Go to the US embassy in your home country and apply.

I meant no feasible options for immigrants who do not have existing relations who are US citizens, given the priority the system awards to family members. Limits on the numbers of legal immigrants from each country mean that the waiting period to immigrate legally can be up to 30 years, depending on the country of origin. The average wait for a Mexican citizen who attempts to immigrate legally is about 18 years. That is obviously intractable for someone looking to immigrate as a worker, and of course it also makes little sense for immigrants who wish to migrate seasonally for agricultural work.

This is entirely the point of saying there is an irrational disconnect between the economics of Latin American immigration and the existing legal framework. The waiting lists are so long, and the number of illegal immigrants so high, because the economics incentivize a much higher level of immigration than is legally allowed. Those economics are actually good for native-born citizens in general, which is the original claim I provided evidence for.

It depends on the stature of the applicant. One must show proof of employment, bank records, home ownership, family ties, birth certificate, etc.

Cheap, poor and uneducated labor is not needed, and they certainly have no "right" to enter illegally.

 

[Mr Natural]

Those tables are not going to bus themselves.

 

[well named]

Cheap, poor and uneducated labor is not needed

As I said before, all of the available economic data suggests that it is needed, and that we benefit from it. Many studies have investigated the impact of immigration on the wages of the native-born, and all of them acknowledge the fact that the Latin American immigrants in question are largely poor and relatively uneducated. That fact is important to the conclusion that they don't actually participate in the same labor markets as the native-born, which is why the impact on wages for the native-born is relatively low, whereas the impact of new immigration on the wages of former immigrants is relatively high. Here is one example from 2007:

"If U.S. States were independent countries, California would be the second largest receiving country for international migrants in the whole world (after Russia) with its 8.5 million foreign-born as of 2004. Moreover, its proximity to Mexico and a porous border generated extremely large flows of uneducated Mexican workers (documented and undocumented), at a growing rate, during the last three decades. With one third of its total labor force made up by immigrants, two thirds of its uneducated workers coming from abroad and a rapidly rising foreign-born population, that grew by 40% in the last 14 years, surely native Californians (particularly the unskilled ones) must have suffered the most from the negative effects of this ”immigration crisis” on their employment opportunities and wages.

The present study, that analyzes employment and wage data in California over the 1960-2004 period, seems to say otherwise. On one hand, immigrants do not seem to increase the tendency of natives with similar skills (education and experience) to migrate, or to otherwise change their likelihood of losing their jobs and dropping out of employment. On the other hand, the impact of immigration over the 1990-2004 period has been negative on the wages of previous immigrants and positive on the wages of U.S. natives, revealing a good degree of complementarity between U.S. and foreign-born workers that benefits (rather then harms) native workers’ productivity."​

 

[Tommy Tainant]

You right wing loons are so short sighted. No healthcare for immigrants ?

Lets hope that none of them have Ebola or some other nasty virus.

As a cost in protecting the public it probably ranks near to a Trump golf weekend.

I cant stress enough how stupid you all are.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

good
stop all that shit
stop them from coming up here
put out posters on the Inet/everywhere of dead illegals who tried to get in

You Republicans do enjoy death. Pathetic.

Sent from my SM-J727VPP using Tapatalk

Some more than others (especially in your case).

 

[Sun Devil 92]

You right wing loons are so short sighted. No healthcare for immigrants ?

Lets hope that none of them have Ebola or some other nasty virus.

As a cost in protecting the public it probably ranks near to a Trump golf weekend.

I cant stress enough how stupid you all are.

No healthcare for illegal immigrants.

Get it right.

 

[Aba Incieni]

Cheap, poor and uneducated labor is not needed

As I said

Illegals cost the US $100 billion a year.

PS don't edit my posts.

 

[Aba Incieni]

You right wing loons are so short sighted. No healthcare for immigrants ?

Lets hope that none of them have Ebola or some other nasty virus.

As a cost in protecting the public it probably ranks near to a Trump golf weekend.

I cant stress enough how stupid you all are.

No free healthcare. They are welcome to buy their own, provided they are in the country legally.

 

[well named]

Illegals cost the US $100 billion a year.

PS don't edit my posts.

Repeating this unsubstantiated claim won't make it any truer.

Re: your PS: I selectively quoted, which the forum software supports explicitly via the standard user interface. I think it makes conversations more readable, for example by eliminating really long nested quotes that aren't relevant. My intent wasn't to misrepresent you, and I don't think I have. However, I'll try to remember to refrain from doing this in the future for your posts specifically. I almost always use this style of quoting, so you might have to excuse me if I suffer a lapse every so often.

 

[Aba Incieni]

Illegals cost the US $100 billion a year.

PS don't edit my posts.

I selectively quoted

Me too.

Argue with ABC News.

Expensive Aliens: How Much Do Illegal Immigrants Really Cost?

 

[Tommy Tainant]

You right wing loons are so short sighted. No healthcare for immigrants ?

Lets hope that none of them have Ebola or some other nasty virus.

As a cost in protecting the public it probably ranks near to a Trump golf weekend.

I cant stress enough how stupid you all are.

No free healthcare. They are welcome to buy their own, provided they are in the country legally.

So you want illegals to spread disease in the US and save a few dollars ?

Thats the dumbest right wing position I have ever heard.

 

[Aba Incieni]

You right wing loons are so short sighted. No healthcare for immigrants ?

Lets hope that none of them have Ebola or some other nasty virus.

As a cost in protecting the public it probably ranks near to a Trump golf weekend.

I cant stress enough how stupid you all are.

No free healthcare. They are welcome to buy their own, provided they are in the country legally.

So you want illegals to spread disease in the US and save a few dollars ?

Thats the dumbest right wing position I have ever heard.

I want to build a wall and deport illegals so they don't spread their diseases here. Instead they can fight for healthcare in their own countries.

 

[well named]

Illegals cost the US $100 billion a year.

PS don't edit my posts.

I selectively quoted

Me too.

Argue with ABC News.

Expensive Aliens: How Much Do Illegal Immigrants Really Cost?

On the one hand you have a conservative advocacy group (and not ABC, to be clear) which opposes immigration. On the other hand you have literally decades of academic research by economists and data about the costs of immigrants borne by public programs that was literally put together by Congress (in a year where both houses were controlled by Republicans, if noting that will head off an inevitable complaint).

I said before that there was a long-standing consensus among economists, and you can see that in data like this survey of economists performed by the University of Chicago:

 

[Tommy Tainant]

You right wing loons are so short sighted. No healthcare for immigrants ?

Lets hope that none of them have Ebola or some other nasty virus.

As a cost in protecting the public it probably ranks near to a Trump golf weekend.

I cant stress enough how stupid you all are.

No free healthcare. They are welcome to buy their own, provided they are in the country legally.

So you want illegals to spread disease in the US and save a few dollars ?

Thats the dumbest right wing position I have ever heard.

I want to build a wall and deport illegals so they don't spread their diseases here. Instead they can fight for healthcare in their own countries.

Dumb.

 

[Aba Incieni]

Illegals cost the US $100 billion a year.

PS don't edit my posts.

I selectively quoted

Me too.

Argue with ABC News.

Expensive Aliens: How Much Do Illegal Immigrants Really Cost?

On the one hand you have a conservative advocacy group (and not ABC, to be clear) which opposes immigration. On the other hand you have literally decades of academic research by economists and data about the costs of immigrants borne by public programs that was literally put together by Congress (in a year where both houses were controlled by Republicans, if noting that will head off an inevitable complaint).

I said before that there was a long-standing consensus among economists, and you can see that in data like this survey of economists performed by the University of Chicago:

Here are pages and pages for you to deny.

illegals cost US - Yahoo Search Results Yahoo Search Results

 

[Aba Incieni]

You right wing loons are so short sighted. No healthcare for immigrants ?

Lets hope that none of them have Ebola or some other nasty virus.

As a cost in protecting the public it probably ranks near to a Trump golf weekend.

I cant stress enough how stupid you all are.

No free healthcare. They are welcome to buy their own, provided they are in the country legally.

So you want illegals to spread disease in the US and save a few dollars ?

Thats the dumbest right wing position I have ever heard.

I want to build a wall and deport illegals so they don't spread their diseases here. Instead they can fight for healthcare in their own countries.

Dumb.

When homos talk, people laugh.