The glaring evidence that Obamacare is a catastrophic FAILURE continues to mount

[PMZ]

Says the man who can't hold a job so he wants communism so the government will force conservatives to pay for him...

Other way around numbnuts. I've worked since 12. I'm retired and spending my time preventing conservatives from tearing down all that we built. The difficulty is that conservatives are zombies. Unthinking destroyers of progress, set on making all of us the same.

Won't happen on my watch.

Hi PMZ I relate to you on this note.

I've been working two jobs since 2008, using my salary to pay on credit card debts I lent to nonprofits almost destroyed by Democrat corruption and abuses in two Black districts in Houston.

You can blame either the Democrats directly or the Republicans indirectly for why we're not getting help to solve these problems, and nonprofit volunteers are having to do all the work.

The Democrats pimp the community and churches for their votes and money to run for office, but won't go against developers gutting these communities at taxpayers expense. So they blame the poor for welfare when the tax money is actually going to the wealthy to take over the land.

So that is one lie.

The other is that it is the Democrat politicians who are selling out the poor to developers to run, get, and keep their offices.

So blaming this on Republicans is a lie.

Both sides only point out what is convenient for their arguments.

First it is the Democrats pimping their own people especially poor Blacks.
Secondly the Republicans who "claim" to support charter schools, vouchers, and independent business solutions taking back control from govt WON'T step in and help invest in solutions that would end this nightmare.

They only complain and blame Democrats for political points, but won't fix it.
Instead they pimp THAT problem to run for office also.

So it is like the days of slavery all over again.

The Blacks enslaved other Blacks first.
Then sold them to the Whites a second time.

Here, the Democrats pimp their own poor supporters for votes and money to campaign.
And then the Republicans pimp that problem to get their money and candidates in office.

In the meantime the volunteers working two jobs each like slaves to fix the problems caused by this govt and political abuse get no help because all the money is going into political campaigns blaming the other party.

PMZ I hope you see both sides and not just one.

We are being pimped twice, while the two pimps argue and blame the other.

House slaves vs. Field slaves = poor vs rich = pitting Democrats against Republicans

In the meantime we are all slaves to political hijacking of government as long as
we stay divided wasting resources "blaming the other party"

40% tax rate going to govt while we only keep 60%
means 2/5 slave and 3/5 free. so we are slaves to govt,
while the politics keeps us divided as house slave vs field slave
so we never unite and overthrow the corruption on both sides!

Well thought out and conducted research has been aimed at exactly the issues that you are very rightfully concerned about.

Intuitively, most people fix the blame for those problems on poverty. Conservatives fix the blame on lack of work ethic caused by welfare.

But research finds no correlation there, but, instead, with extreme wealth distribution. In other words poverty is quite tolerable when everybody suffers. What's intolerable is poverty in the midst of plenty. Most of the social ills that we see grow as the Gini Coefficient declines (a measure of more extreme wealth distribution).

That all says that the problem is hard to solve. The combination of welfare and progressive taxes is a step in the right direction but not a very effective step by observation of today's results.

Got any good ideas?

 

[Spoonman]

so this week already i have heard from 3 business associates who have had their healthcare cancelled. Two were never able to access the system and get information online. The on I spoke to this morning finally got his options via phone. his previous plan was $500 a month with a $5000 deductable. the best he could get now was $750 a month with a $6200 deductable. I'm sure glad we reformed the healthcare industry

 

[PMZ]

so this week already i have heard from 3 business associates who have had their healthcare cancelled. Two were never able to access the system and get information online. The on I spoke to this morning finally got his options via phone. his previous plan was $500 a month with a $5000 deductable. the best he could get now was $750 a month with a $6200 deductable. I'm sure glad we reformed the healthcare industry

How many years have you not had to "renew", in other words agree to a new policy? I never have not had to.

Keep in mind that insurance companies are businesses following the one rule of business. Make more money regardless of the cost to others.

 

[emilynghiem]

See [MENTION=22295]emilynghiem[/MENTION], as I said, bring up liberty and they claim you are arguing for lawlessness.

Hi PMZ and RKMBrown:
Wow! PMZ this sounds like when conservatives argue that the "prochoice" advocates want freedom with no responsibility!

Do you agree with that PMZ? That prochoice means not wanting responsibility?
Not caring if women get maimed abused or killed by botched abortionists?
So as long as WE GET WHAT WE WANT from the law, too bad if other people get hurt?

No, I don't think so. I am guessing if you are prochoice like me, that's not the same as wanting to push pro-abortion irreponsibly "just because we don't want govt to criminalize abortion". That's not the same, and I hope you are with me on this.

I think that if men, including priests, as minor stakeholders in this issue, got out of the way, women would unanimously decide pro choice.

I'd support their decision based on practical terms.

I agree with you that uniting the women will lead to solving this problem that will continue affecting women more than men until we fix it ourselves.

I also believe the same solutions will solve the conflicts over ACA which has become a bullying game between parties and men who don't want to back down.

Do you see the same solutions and unity solving one problem as the key to the other?

Wouldn't the same solutions of investing resources directly into better services, and preventing poverty/abuse/crime/disease to cut the costs to taxpayers overall, end up serving more of the population and provide better choices instead of trying to impose these politically?

 

[PMZ]

Hi PMZ and RKMBrown:
Wow! PMZ this sounds like when conservatives argue that the "prochoice" advocates want freedom with no responsibility!

Do you agree with that PMZ? That prochoice means not wanting responsibility?
Not caring if women get maimed abused or killed by botched abortionists?
So as long as WE GET WHAT WE WANT from the law, too bad if other people get hurt?

No, I don't think so. I am guessing if you are prochoice like me, that's not the same as wanting to push pro-abortion irreponsibly "just because we don't want govt to criminalize abortion". That's not the same, and I hope you are with me on this.

I think that if men, including priests, as minor stakeholders in this issue, got out of the way, women would unanimously decide pro choice.

I'd support their decision based on practical terms.

I agree with you that uniting the women will lead to solving this problem that will continue affecting women more than men until we fix it ourselves.

I also believe the same solutions will solve the conflicts over ACA which has become a bullying game between parties and men who don't want to back down.

Do you see the same solutions and unity solving one problem as the key to the other?

Wouldn't the same solutions of investing resources directly into better services, and preventing poverty/abuse/crime/disease to cut the costs to taxpayers overall, end up serving more of the population and provide better choices instead of trying to impose these politically?

According to the research, being poor among way more than plenty is the problem.

It's a business problem more than a government problem but very difficult nonetheless.

If there was a living wage job for everyone, the problems would go away in time.

Of course there always has been and always will be criminals but most people would take the security of a job rather than the insecurity of poverty.

Is full employment possible?

I don't know, given that we've moved to a global economy. It's certainly much harder to achieve now.

I see that what's going on here and now is probably about the best that we can practically do, but progress will be slow.

Over the next 100 years energy will become what limits progress. And AGW will become a very costly consequence of that slow progress. Much upcoming trauma could have been mitigated but we chose not to.

 

[emilynghiem]

Well thought out and conducted research has been aimed at exactly the issues that you are very rightfully concerned about.

Intuitively, most people fix the blame for those problems on poverty. Conservatives fix the blame on lack of work ethic caused by welfare.

But research finds no correlation there, but, instead, with extreme wealth distribution. In other words poverty is quite tolerable when everybody suffers. What's intolerable is poverty in the midst of plenty. Most of the social ills that we see grow as the Gini Coefficient declines (a measure of more extreme wealth distribution).

That all says that the problem is hard to solve. The combination of welfare and progressive taxes is a step in the right direction but not a very effective step by observation of today's results.

Got any good ideas?

Very well said! I admire and respect your ability to summarize a lot in precise points.

Yes. I have compiled the best solutions I found from different sources. And combined them in a "campus model" for breaking the cycle of poverty by teaching sustainable income and business skills.

A. the major difference in mentality between the "rich and poor" is the abundance mentality vs scarcity mentality. It makes the difference between owning property and investing in business to serve others vs. renting and depending on others for housing/jobs.

B. So the plan is to set up campuses to mentor people to grow from renting themselves, to owning to renting to others. This can include not only residential (from houses to apts) but also business management (from small business to larger complexes or conglomerates)

EX: Lifestyles Unlimited teaches and mentors individual investors in forming LLC groups to start with houses and move up to apt complexes so they generate their own income passively and can retire without depending on 401K or govt: Real Estate Investing Education and Mentoring | Lifestyles Unlimited

C. This can be tied to govt based on the model developed by residents of the public housing in the historic district of Freedmen's Town http://www.houstonprogressive.org/campus94.html

Also, by teaching this model to Vets, they can be mentored in teams to own and manage their own Vet housing and health programs WITHOUT depending on govt or charity:
Freedmen's Town Historic Churches and Vet Housing

D. Other things I added to this
1. Restitution for crimes or abuses by govt/corporations etc. to pay back taxpayers
using these models to reform immigration issues and prisons that are costing taxpayers,
and collecting restitution from wrongdoers to fund these programs to correct problems

Earned Amnesty

2. Since there is a time gap between jobs and reforms needed NOW, the taxes we already paid in the past, and the time it will take to collect restitution back from the wrongdoers,
using this model of independent currency to issue notes against debts and damages
to taxpayers, to microlend into financing solutions, and holding wrongdoers to pay off notes
Ithaca Hours - Local Currency - Ithaca, New York or Home
Paul Glover of the Greens who mentors communities to manage their own currency
already supports this idea of using it for govt restitution owed to taxpayers. We can
use that to fund health care reforms as well as other prison/immigration reforms,
just based on the corrupt war spending alone that was in the millions if not billions.

3. For the foreign debts owed to China we can translate those into credits toward development work that China needs to convert slave labor factories into schools/hospitals
so that medical care and other social services are provided through educational facilities, workstudy jobs or internships etc

music video for Sustainable Campus converting sweatshop labor to workstudy jobs

4. Government internships and training leaders for office or jobs

By investing CAMPAIGN funds directly into setting up such housing/business coops, then candidates or interns can gain work experience and/or educational credits for their resume. instead of paying for empty campaign promises and millions for media bashing,
that money can go directly into solutions and jobs for candidates to develop/demonstrate real life leadership skills in project management, govt/business administration, finance etc.

 

[emilynghiem]

RE: Is full employment possible?

Yes, if we quit wasting billions on prisons and use those resources and facilities to set up schools and teaching hospitals to serve the public at the same cost we already pay now in taxes.
Exception would be for ill or disabled people, but their care can be included in the training of medical or social service interns who earn their education by serving the poor and low income.

The above campus model can be applied to convert prisons and slave labor factories into schools
where workers can start with work-study wages at maybe 5 an hour or barter for room/board if they owe for past crimes and paying off restitution.
And they work themselves up depending on what course credits or work credits they have earned towards either restitution or their education etc.

If this is overseen by legitimate church and nonprofits and the security is done by govt/military, then the church/state can work together to
make sure there are no abuses of workers or prisoners.

So even if people are not at a skills or educational level of being independent,
they can be enrolled in some kind of school program while they work themselves up the scale.

In the meantime, if Vets have jobs patrolling areas such as around the border while they manage
teams of 10 houses with workers/students, then this is training the people to manage small business communities in a campus setting.
Even if groups of 10 or 20 students are dependent on being supervised while they live in dorms while working and training,
the people managing them are receiving training also, to set up and run their own business communities and replicate the model.

This can develop self-governing city-states along the border and replace high crime areas of poverty and abuse.
And training real community management will allow more people to run for office with hands on experience.
More minorities can access training and develop skills in self-government, rather than only candidates winning office who can collect millions of campaign money from corporate interests.

 

[Spoonman]

so this week already i have heard from 3 business associates who have had their healthcare cancelled. Two were never able to access the system and get information online. The on I spoke to this morning finally got his options via phone. his previous plan was $500 a month with a $5000 deductable. the best he could get now was $750 a month with a $6200 deductable. I'm sure glad we reformed the healthcare industry

How many years have you not had to "renew", in other words agree to a new policy? I never have not had to.

Keep in mind that insurance companies are businesses following the one rule of business. Make more money regardless of the cost to others.

all i do is elect participants in my plan. other then that i don't do anything else

 

[PMZ]

Well thought out and conducted research has been aimed at exactly the issues that you are very rightfully concerned about.

Intuitively, most people fix the blame for those problems on poverty. Conservatives fix the blame on lack of work ethic caused by welfare.

But research finds no correlation there, but, instead, with extreme wealth distribution. In other words poverty is quite tolerable when everybody suffers. What's intolerable is poverty in the midst of plenty. Most of the social ills that we see grow as the Gini Coefficient declines (a measure of more extreme wealth distribution).

That all says that the problem is hard to solve. The combination of welfare and progressive taxes is a step in the right direction but not a very effective step by observation of today's results.

Got any good ideas?

Very well said! I admire and respect your ability to summarize a lot in precise points.

Yes. I have compiled the best solutions I found from different sources. And combined them in a "campus model" for breaking the cycle of poverty by teaching sustainable income and business skills.

A. the major difference in mentality between the "rich and poor" is the abundance mentality vs scarcity mentality. It makes the difference between owning property and investing in business to serve others vs. renting and depending on others for housing/jobs.

B. So the plan is to set up campuses to mentor people to grow from renting themselves, to owning to renting to others. This can include not only residential (from houses to apts) but also business management (from small business to larger complexes or conglomerates)

EX: Lifestyles Unlimited teaches and mentors individual investors in forming LLC groups to start with houses and move up to apt complexes so they generate their own income passively and can retire without depending on 401K or govt: Real Estate Investing Education and Mentoring | Lifestyles Unlimited

C. This can be tied to govt based on the model developed by residents of the public housing in the historic district of Freedmen's Town http://www.houstonprogressive.org/campus94.html

Also, by teaching this model to Vets, they can be mentored in teams to own and manage their own Vet housing and health programs WITHOUT depending on govt or charity:
Freedmen's Town Historic Churches and Vet Housing

D. Other things I added to this
1. Restitution for crimes or abuses by govt/corporations etc. to pay back taxpayers
using these models to reform immigration issues and prisons that are costing taxpayers,
and collecting restitution from wrongdoers to fund these programs to correct problems

Earned Amnesty

2. Since there is a time gap between jobs and reforms needed NOW, the taxes we already paid in the past, and the time it will take to collect restitution back from the wrongdoers,
using this model of independent currency to issue notes against debts and damages
to taxpayers, to microlend into financing solutions, and holding wrongdoers to pay off notes
Ithaca Hours - Local Currency - Ithaca, New York or Home
Paul Glover of the Greens who mentors communities to manage their own currency
already supports this idea of using it for govt restitution owed to taxpayers. We can
use that to fund health care reforms as well as other prison/immigration reforms,
just based on the corrupt war spending alone that was in the millions if not billions.

3. For the foreign debts owed to China we can translate those into credits toward development work that China needs to convert slave labor factories into schools/hospitals
so that medical care and other social services are provided through educational facilities, workstudy jobs or internships etc

music video for Sustainable Campus converting sweatshop labor to workstudy jobs

4. Government internships and training leaders for office or jobs

By investing CAMPAIGN funds directly into setting up such housing/business coops, then candidates or interns can gain work experience and/or educational credits for their resume. instead of paying for empty campaign promises and millions for media bashing,
that money can go directly into solutions and jobs for candidates to develop/demonstrate real life leadership skills in project management, govt/business administration, finance etc.

Very ambitious and well thought out program.

I think that moving people from renting to owning their residence will be real progress in suburban and rural neighborhoods but cities right now are full of deteriorating multiple residential units. Moving up from renting one unit to owning a multiple unit building is quite a jump. Maybe some sort of cooperative ownership like condos.

I personally don't think that we need more business owners. I think that we need better business owners focused on growth that benefits everyone instead of looting the workers just because they can get away with it.

Our past is full of such people and we need to better our education system so that our future will be equally fortunate.

We also need to rethink business from the standpoint of global competition and global markets. There needs to be collaboration between countries in place of competition (either you or I win, not both). I think that organized religion is the biggest obstacle to this but hopefully that will continue to decline.

 

[Spoonman]

Well thought out and conducted research has been aimed at exactly the issues that you are very rightfully concerned about.

Intuitively, most people fix the blame for those problems on poverty. Conservatives fix the blame on lack of work ethic caused by welfare.

But research finds no correlation there, but, instead, with extreme wealth distribution. In other words poverty is quite tolerable when everybody suffers. What's intolerable is poverty in the midst of plenty. Most of the social ills that we see grow as the Gini Coefficient declines (a measure of more extreme wealth distribution).

That all says that the problem is hard to solve. The combination of welfare and progressive taxes is a step in the right direction but not a very effective step by observation of today's results.

Got any good ideas?

Very well said! I admire and respect your ability to summarize a lot in precise points.

Yes. I have compiled the best solutions I found from different sources. And combined them in a "campus model" for breaking the cycle of poverty by teaching sustainable income and business skills.

A. the major difference in mentality between the "rich and poor" is the abundance mentality vs scarcity mentality. It makes the difference between owning property and investing in business to serve others vs. renting and depending on others for housing/jobs.

B. So the plan is to set up campuses to mentor people to grow from renting themselves, to owning to renting to others. This can include not only residential (from houses to apts) but also business management (from small business to larger complexes or conglomerates)

EX: Lifestyles Unlimited teaches and mentors individual investors in forming LLC groups to start with houses and move up to apt complexes so they generate their own income passively and can retire without depending on 401K or govt: Real Estate Investing Education and Mentoring | Lifestyles Unlimited

C. This can be tied to govt based on the model developed by residents of the public housing in the historic district of Freedmen's Town http://www.houstonprogressive.org

Also, by teaching this model to Vets, they can be mentored in teams to own and manage their own Vet housing and health programs WITHOUT depending on govt or charity:
Freedmen's Town Historic Churches and Vet Housing

D. Other things I added to this
1. Restitution for crimes or abuses by govt/corporations etc. to pay back taxpayers
using these models to reform immigration issues and prisons that are costing taxpayers,
and collecting restitution from wrongdoers to fund these programs to correct problems

Earned Amnesty

2. Since there is a time gap between jobs and reforms needed NOW, the taxes we already paid in the past, and the time it will take to collect restitution back from the wrongdoers,
using this model of independent currency to issue notes against debts and damages
to taxpayers, to microlend into financing solutions, and holding wrongdoers to pay off notes
Ithaca Hours - Local Currency - Ithaca, New York or Home
Paul Glover of the Greens who mentors communities to manage their own currency
already supports this idea of using it for govt restitution owed to taxpayers. We can
use that to fund health care reforms as well as other prison/immigration reforms,
just based on the corrupt war spending alone that was in the millions if not billions.

3. For the foreign debts owed to China we can translate those into credits toward development work that China needs to convert slave labor factories into schools/hospitals
so that medical care and other social services are provided through educational facilities, workstudy jobs or internships etc

music video for Sustainable Campus converting sweatshop labor to workstudy jobs

4. Government internships and training leaders for office or jobs

By investing CAMPAIGN funds directly into setting up such housing/business coops, then candidates or interns can gain work experience and/or educational credits for their resume. instead of paying for empty campaign promises and millions for media bashing,
that money can go directly into solutions and jobs for candidates to develop/demonstrate real life leadership skills in project management, govt/business administration, finance etc.

Very ambitious and well thought out program.

I think that moving people from renting to owning their residence will be real progress in suburban and rural neighborhoods but cities right now are full of deteriorating multiple residential units. Moving up from renting one unit to owning a multiple unit building is quite a jump. Maybe some sort of cooperative ownership like condos.

I personally don't think that we need more business owners. I think that we need better business owners focused on growth that benefits everyone instead of looting the workers just because they can get away with it.

Our past is full of such people and we need to better our education system so that our future will be equally fortunate.

We also need to rethink business from the standpoint of global competition and global markets. There needs to be collaboration between countries in place of competition (either you or I win, not both). I think that organized religion is the biggest obstacle to this but hopefully that will continue to decline.

oh yea, religion is the problem the first things dictators do to gain total control is destroy organized religion, disarm the public, and turn neighbor against neighbor through a fear and rewards approach.

 

[PMZ]

RE: Is full employment possible?

Yes, if we quit wasting billions on prisons and use those resources and facilities to set up schools and teaching hospitals to serve the public at the same cost we already pay now in taxes.
Exception would be for ill or disabled people, but their care can be included in the training of medical or social service interns who earn their education by serving the poor and low income.

The above campus model can be applied to convert prisons and slave labor factories into schools
where workers can start with work-study wages at maybe 5 an hour or barter for room/board if they owe for past crimes and paying off restitution.
And they work themselves up depending on what course credits or work credits they have earned towards either restitution or their education etc.

If this is overseen by legitimate church and nonprofits and the security is done by govt/military, then the church/state can work together to
make sure there are no abuses of workers or prisoners.

So even if people are not at a skills or educational level of being independent,
they can be enrolled in some kind of school program while they work themselves up the scale.

In the meantime, if Vets have jobs patrolling areas such as around the border while they manage
teams of 10 houses with workers/students, then this is training the people to manage small business communities in a campus setting.
Even if groups of 10 or 20 students are dependent on being supervised while they live in dorms while working and training,
the people managing them are receiving training also, to set up and run their own business communities and replicate the model.

This can develop self-governing city-states along the border and replace high crime areas of poverty and abuse.
And training real community management will allow more people to run for office with hands on experience.
More minorities can access training and develop skills in self-government, rather than only candidates winning office who can collect millions of campaign money from corporate interests.

Just curious. Are your ideas modeled after Israel?

I've never been there but it seems like a similar culture to your vision.

 

[PMZ]

Very well said! I admire and respect your ability to summarize a lot in precise points.

Yes. I have compiled the best solutions I found from different sources. And combined them in a "campus model" for breaking the cycle of poverty by teaching sustainable income and business skills.

A. the major difference in mentality between the "rich and poor" is the abundance mentality vs scarcity mentality. It makes the difference between owning property and investing in business to serve others vs. renting and depending on others for housing/jobs.

B. So the plan is to set up campuses to mentor people to grow from renting themselves, to owning to renting to others. This can include not only residential (from houses to apts) but also business management (from small business to larger complexes or conglomerates)

EX: Lifestyles Unlimited teaches and mentors individual investors in forming LLC groups to start with houses and move up to apt complexes so they generate their own income passively and can retire without depending on 401K or govt: Real Estate Investing Education and Mentoring | Lifestyles Unlimited

C. This can be tied to govt based on the model developed by residents of the public housing in the historic district of Freedmen's Town http://www.houstonprogressive.org

Also, by teaching this model to Vets, they can be mentored in teams to own and manage their own Vet housing and health programs WITHOUT depending on govt or charity:
Freedmen's Town Historic Churches and Vet Housing

D. Other things I added to this
1. Restitution for crimes or abuses by govt/corporations etc. to pay back taxpayers
using these models to reform immigration issues and prisons that are costing taxpayers,
and collecting restitution from wrongdoers to fund these programs to correct problems

Earned Amnesty

2. Since there is a time gap between jobs and reforms needed NOW, the taxes we already paid in the past, and the time it will take to collect restitution back from the wrongdoers,
using this model of independent currency to issue notes against debts and damages
to taxpayers, to microlend into financing solutions, and holding wrongdoers to pay off notes
Ithaca Hours - Local Currency - Ithaca, New York or Home
Paul Glover of the Greens who mentors communities to manage their own currency
already supports this idea of using it for govt restitution owed to taxpayers. We can
use that to fund health care reforms as well as other prison/immigration reforms,
just based on the corrupt war spending alone that was in the millions if not billions.

3. For the foreign debts owed to China we can translate those into credits toward development work that China needs to convert slave labor factories into schools/hospitals
so that medical care and other social services are provided through educational facilities, workstudy jobs or internships etc

music video for Sustainable Campus converting sweatshop labor to workstudy jobs

4. Government internships and training leaders for office or jobs

By investing CAMPAIGN funds directly into setting up such housing/business coops, then candidates or interns can gain work experience and/or educational credits for their resume. instead of paying for empty campaign promises and millions for media bashing,
that money can go directly into solutions and jobs for candidates to develop/demonstrate real life leadership skills in project management, govt/business administration, finance etc.

Very ambitious and well thought out program.

I think that moving people from renting to owning their residence will be real progress in suburban and rural neighborhoods but cities right now are full of deteriorating multiple residential units. Moving up from renting one unit to owning a multiple unit building is quite a jump. Maybe some sort of cooperative ownership like condos.

I personally don't think that we need more business owners. I think that we need better business owners focused on growth that benefits everyone instead of looting the workers just because they can get away with it.

Our past is full of such people and we need to better our education system so that our future will be equally fortunate.

We also need to rethink business from the standpoint of global competition and global markets. There needs to be collaboration between countries in place of competition (either you or I win, not both). I think that organized religion is the biggest obstacle to this but hopefully that will continue to decline.

oh yea, religion is the problem the first things dictators do to gain total control is destroy organized religion, disarm the public, and turn neighbor against neighbor through a fear and rewards approach.

There is only a few dictatorships left in the world, the biggest being the Catholic Church.

Actually what most fledgling dictatorships do is to arm their supporters.

Fox News is the best current best example of propaganda aimed at "turn neighbor against neighbor through a fear and rewards approach."

 

[PMZ]

Very ambitious and well thought out program.

I think that moving people from renting to owning their residence will be real progress in suburban and rural neighborhoods but cities right now are full of deteriorating multiple residential units. Moving up from renting one unit to owning a multiple unit building is quite a jump. Maybe some sort of cooperative ownership like condos.

I personally don't think that we need more business owners. I think that we need better business owners focused on growth that benefits everyone instead of looting the workers just because they can get away with it.

Our past is full of such people and we need to better our education system so that our future will be equally fortunate.

We also need to rethink business from the standpoint of global competition and global markets. There needs to be collaboration between countries in place of competition (either you or I win, not both). I think that organized religion is the biggest obstacle to this but hopefully that will continue to decline.

oh yea, religion is the problem the first things dictators do to gain total control is destroy organized religion, disarm the public, and turn neighbor against neighbor through a fear and rewards approach.

There are only a few dictatorships left in the world, the biggest being the Catholic Church.

Actually what most fledgling dictatorships do is to arm their supporters.

Fox News is the best current best example of propaganda aimed at "turn neighbor against neighbor through a fear and rewards approach."

 

[Spoonman]

oh yea, religion is the problem the first things dictators do to gain total control is destroy organized religion, disarm the public, and turn neighbor against neighbor through a fear and rewards approach.

There are only a few dictatorships left in the world, the biggest being the Catholic Church.

Actually what most fledgling dictatorships do is to arm their supporters.

Fox News is the best current best example of propaganda aimed at "turn neighbor against neighbor through a fear and rewards approach."

remind me what country the catholic church is currently running

 

[PMZ]

There are only a few dictatorships left in the world, the biggest being the Catholic Church.

Actually what most fledgling dictatorships do is to arm their supporters.

Fox News is the best current best example of propaganda aimed at "turn neighbor against neighbor through a fear and rewards approach."

remind me what country the catholic church is currently running

The Catholic Church.

 

[PMZ]

remind me what country the catholic church is currently running

The Catholic Church.

From the country of Vatican City.

 

[emilynghiem]

A.
If you choose a behavior that interferes with my freedom by stealing my stuff, killing me on purpose or by accident, just as extreme examples, society imposes on you unpleasant consequences. Just like responsible parents teach children.

There are millions of those laws because people are very creative in thinking of ways to prey on their fellow humans.

One way that people in the past preyed on others is to avoid responsibility for the cost of their own health care. They discovered that we as a society are adverse to them dying in the street so would pay for their health care when they needed.

B.
A way that insurance companies preyed on people is to not do their job, spreading risk, by avoiding insuring anyone with a risk. A pre existing condition.

Another predatory action is to employ someone full time without paying them a wage sufficient to live on.

In service to democracy, the ACA strives to eliminate these and other behaviors that deprive the majority of their right to the pursuit of happiness.

And it enhances competition in the health care insurance marketplace.
As I said, I had trouble understanding clearly enough your question.

Does this help?

OK let me try to address A and B

A1. If the point is to hold people responsible for paying for their health care,
--> why not let them do so in the manner they choose instead of insurance only.

A2. Since dictating that insurance/govt only is "taking away" their freedom without any proof they committed a crime (ie collective punishment, punishing those who WERE paying for themselves and others as well, by assuming ALL people needed this penalty/mandate)
Then isn't the resulting OUTCRY the "unpleasant consequence" of violating rights and freedoms of lawabiding citizens without due process by removing their freedom by govt?

B. If the "insurance companies" are the ones at fault
then why punish the citizens by making us buy into and pay into this system?

this reminds me of when I was arguing about collective punishment and war.

The war against Iraq govt and terrorists ended up hurting the lawabiding citizens
and victims of these corrupt and abusive militants who hijacked their govt from them.

I don't believe in collective punishment, but holding the actual wrongdoers responsible NOT punishing the victims!
(ie by taking rights/freedoms away from the individuals due to the abuses of the wrongdoers)

Otherwise, it causes the protests and disruptions as in A. Because it is assuming and punishing citizens who did not commit the offenses along with the ones who did; and all people have the right to "due process" BEFORE having rights/freedoms taken away by govt.

Instead of allowing and rewarding other choices for "people to pay for their own health care" the only choices enforced were either (a). buy private insurance which isn't guaranteed to cover ALL costs or ALL people yet it is mandated by govt (b). pay fines/penalty to govt (c). belong to a qualifying religious organization since 1999

Because imposing this mandate violated the rights of citizens who did not consent to this "private business contract with insurance companies" forced by govt under penalty of law,
that is why we are seeing the outcries.

You can say that these people still have the right to petition and change the law.
But that is after the fact. It is still being imposed in the meantime. So we do not have equal rights or protections under the law. The people who consent to the contract have their interests represented; while the ones who do not are now forced to go through legal or legislative measures to "get their freedoms back". So this is not equal.

What would be equal is putting the ACA on hold until all sides agree, and are represented.

The main argument against this is that ALL laws should be done that way.
And yes, they should.

Only if people AGREE to majority rule making something law should that stand by consent.

If they did NOT agree but wanted to resolve conflicts first before passing a law,
then the law should not be enforced without first resolving those conflicts/objections first.

that WOULD be more consistent with equal protection of the laws / equal representation.
we have not been following the laws but were bypassing consent by majority rule.
And it has been escalating and escalating. Roe v Wade and gay marriage is another such issue that has never been resolved. Immigration and the death penalty. Now the ACA.

It doesn't make it right just because we violated the consent of the governed in the past.

We are down to admitting we need to stop drowning people as witches as a test of guilt, just because we did all the others that way.

 

[Spoonman]

The Catholic Church.

From the country of Vatican City.

i knew you were a hack. next

 

[RKMBrown]

I have no idea what you're saying.

What's my solution? Who do I owe? What shared solution? What am I dodging?

You're pretending ACA enforces responsibility, that it ensures that we pay what we owe. How, exactly? It doesn't do anything to require that we pay our bills. It just forces us to buy insurance from government appointed vendors. Insurance is not health care. it's not responsbility. it is the opposite. Responsibility is accepting the consequences of your decisions. Insurance is avoiding the consequences of your decisions, paying for the privilege of having no responsibility.

When you pay your health care premiums how many people's treatments were covered? You have no idea. Yours certainly. But how about the 25 year old who was so convinced he was immortal until the car accident. The hospital didn't turn him away, they fixed him and added his cost to yours.

Personal responsibility advocates would say it would be better if the 25 year old took responsibility for his health care costs.

And what's this "government appointed vendors"?

"Insurance is not health care. it's not responsbility. it is the opposite. Responsibility is accepting the consequences of your decisions."

WTF? When you pay insurance premiums the entire point is that the insurance company is being paid to spread risk. You are paying a fixed premium that covers your costs be they lower, average, or unaffordable by you.

It's the most responsible thing.

By your analogy if I don't have an insurance policy for my car and I crash it, the responsible thing is for me to get insurance after the fact so I can get my car repaired by the money other policy holders provide for me, thus only costing me pennies on the dollar to get my repair done. You think that might piss other the other policy holders who thus end up having to pay twice as much for insurance so they can cover jerks that are uninsured and for whom the law forces the insurance companies to cover after the fact?

Hmm... I'd say that's one helluva effed up system you got there. Sort of like having a system where everyone gets the same grade no matter what they do in life, you get an F. Why F? Why can't I have an A? Easy... (0+100)/2 = 50. All we need is half of the people (democrats) to sit on their ass and do nothing thus forcing the people rowing to fail along with them.

 

[emilynghiem]

I am partisan in favor of progress for our country. My experience is that the Republican Party has abandoned that, simply because their inept performance has put them in survival mode, and they've abandoned even the pretext of serving the country over serving the party. I see the evidence of that as overwhelming.

I am a Republican. They historically have had a very useful and functional perspective that was a great balance with the Democrat useful and functional perspective.

That was abandoned when the dixiecrats, who have always been dysfunctional and anti-American, left the Democratic Party over the issue of equal rights for everyone, and joined the GOP. That’s when they left useful politics behind, and became anti-American.

That’s is not blind bias but observable fact for those unbiased.

There are many parties whose foundation leads them to be against American interests. Communist for example.

I see no reason for those interested in our success to support either Communism or Republicanism.

PMZ this is wonderful! Part of the reform plans, to set up vet housing with home health interns, was written by another community leader I volunteer with who is a Republican. she would certainly appreciate more support to get her plans to national attention.

Can you please help? Please see pdf file for Vet Housing authored by Gladys House
Freedmen's Town Historic Churches and Vet Housing

May I email you or contact you about how we could work together?
And propose alternatives to ACA that opponents can fund voluntarily without conflict?

Thanks! Gladys could sure use help from fellow Republicans who understand the
issues in depth as you do. This is amazing, thank you for sharing in detail.