The myth of "far right Christian fundamentalism"

[Pogo]

My point, which is supported by the study I linked and quoted, and which I have re-iterated at least a couple of times for the dimwitted, is that the idea that the Republican Party has been taken over by religious fundamentalists is a complete lie.

That's kind of what I thought it was. Unfortunately for you that's not what your link is about.

Oh well.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Doublethink noted in red. Corollary to "ignorance is strength".

Of course what actually happened was that so-called "social conservatives" (i.e. those driven by social issues, gay marriage, abortion etc) crept into the RP (Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, John Hagee et al), injecting religion into politics (where it has no natural place), demagoguing a lot of religion hooey into Conservatism, which is as natural a relationship as fish an bicycles, in a naked lust for power.

A hijacking took place, and few in the RP have the balls to stand up to it. Goldwater was one who saw it coming...

“Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party and they’re sure trying to do so, it’s going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can’t and won’t compromise. I know, I’ve tried to deal with them.”
~ Barry Goldwater, as quoted in John Dean's book Conservatives Without Conscience

What's the connection with "Media" here?

Another person that doesn't pay attention to the real world, see my reply to TM.

Another poster who doesn't read posts not his own; your reply to TM has nothing to do with mine.

Your argument is that social conservatives, aka the Moral Majority, crept into politics and took over the party. Once again, if they had actually took over the party Pat Robertson, who you actually mentioned as part of the problem, would have won the nomination in 1988.

Can you explain, using all the small words you need, how my post pointing that out has nothing to do with your post?

 

[Pogo]

Another person that doesn't pay attention to the real world, see my reply to TM.

Another poster who doesn't read posts not his own; your reply to TM has nothing to do with mine.

Your argument is that social conservatives, aka the Moral Majority, crept into politics and took over the party. Once again, if they had actually took over the party Pat Robertson, who you actually mentioned as part of the problem, would have won the nomination in 1988.

Can you explain, using all the small words you need, how my post pointing that out has nothing to do with your post?

Are you like a novelist or something? You do a lot of this creativity thing.
Where does my post say they "took over"?

I'll wait. Actually I'll come back later considering your history of answering questions like this.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Another poster who doesn't read posts not his own; your reply to TM has nothing to do with mine.

Your argument is that social conservatives, aka the Moral Majority, crept into politics and took over the party. Once again, if they had actually took over the party Pat Robertson, who you actually mentioned as part of the problem, would have won the nomination in 1988.

Can you explain, using all the small words you need, how my post pointing that out has nothing to do with your post?

Are you like a novelist or something? You do a lot of this creativity thing.
Where does my post say they "took over"?

I'll wait. Actually I'll come back later considering your history of answering questions like this.

If I point out where it says it you will claim you are not responsible for the content of a quote because you just quote, you don't actually read, or use the quotes to make a point.

Don't worry though, the rest of the world knows what Goldwater actually meant, and how you quoting him in this context shows you agree with him.

 

[Ernie S.]

I keep hearing how this "fundamentalist" class leapt into existence in the 60s...and how the Republican party is "now" full of "fundies"...and how anyone who doesn't support abortion, gay marriage, the taxation of churches and sex counseling in schools is a "fundie".

It occurs to me that nothing exists in a vacuum. We are more liberal today than we have ever been...but the defamation of Christians began in the 60s with the rise of the radical left. The further left they pulled us, the more we heard the term "fundamentalism" applied to traditional, American, Christian values.

Essentially what has happened is this...we took an abrupt and severe left turn in the 60s, with the rise to power of pukes like Ayers, who infilterated the media and schools, and began to lament the "extremism" of the establishment.

They're the ones who blew people up...but suddenly, mainstream Americans became *fundies* and *extremists*.

Ironic, no?

What power does Ayers have?

Enough to launch a political career, just sayin....

 

[JakeStarkey]

Before going much further, since most of you have no clue about kg's topic, including kg, you might want to do a bit of reading:

History & Hope: Evangelicalism

You will find the material uneven on both edges of the discussion.

 

[Pogo]

Your argument is that social conservatives, aka the Moral Majority, crept into politics and took over the party. Once again, if they had actually took over the party Pat Robertson, who you actually mentioned as part of the problem, would have won the nomination in 1988.

Can you explain, using all the small words you need, how my post pointing that out has nothing to do with your post?

Are you like a novelist or something? You do a lot of this creativity thing.
Where does my post say they "took over"?

I'll wait. Actually I'll come back later considering your history of answering questions like this.

If I point out where it says it you will claim you are not responsible for the content of a quote because you just quote, you don't actually read, or use the quotes to make a point.

Don't worry though, the rest of the world knows what Goldwater actually meant, and how you quoting him in this context shows you agree with him.

Sometimes I forget to dumb down for those who've enslaved themselves to the crutch that the poster of a quote, by posting it, becomes the originator in a kind of rhetorical transubstantiation thingy.

Actually I don't forget; I refuse to descend to it.

I don't edit verbatim quotes. Ever. But I do attribute them. Too bad you're too illiterate to read that far.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

If you don't believe that the Republican party was highjacked by the evangelists, you should read this. Well written and sourced. Sorry, but the Reps were totally highjacked - they needed the votes.

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/American-Theocracy-Politics-Religion-Borrowed/dp/0143038281]American Theocracy: The Peril and Politics of Radical Religion, Oil, and Borrowed Money in the 21st Century: Kevin Phillips: 9780143038283: Amazon.com: Books[/ame]

 

[Cecilie1200]

I keep hearing how this "fundamentalist" class leapt into existence in the 60s...and how the Republican party is "now" full of "fundies"...and how anyone who doesn't support abortion, gay marriage, the taxation of churches and sex counseling in schools is a "fundie".

It occurs to me that nothing exists in a vacuum. We are more liberal today than we have ever been...but the defamation of Christians began in the 60s with the rise of the radical left. The further left they pulled us, the more we heard the term "fundamentalism" applied to traditional, American, Christian values.

Essentially what has happened is this...we took an abrupt and severe left turn in the 60s, with the rise to power of pukes like Ayers, who infilterated the media and schools, and began to lament the "extremism" of the establishment.

They're the ones who blew people up...but suddenly, mainstream Americans became *fundies* and *extremists*.

Ironic, no?

CS Lewis talks about this phenomenon in "The Screwtape Letters". Screwtape the demon says that it is a triumph of evil to have gotten society to the point where it spends all its energies decrying the one thing it is least in danger of.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I keep hearing how this "fundamentalist" class leapt into existence in the 60s...and how the Republican party is "now" full of "fundies"...and how anyone who doesn't support abortion, gay marriage, the taxation of churches and sex counseling in schools is a "fundie".

It occurs to me that nothing exists in a vacuum. We are more liberal today than we have ever been...but the defamation of Christians began in the 60s with the rise of the radical left. The further left they pulled us, the more we heard the term "fundamentalism" applied to traditional, American, Christian values.

Essentially what has happened is this...we took an abrupt and severe left turn in the 60s, with the rise to power of pukes like Ayers, who infilterated the media and schools, and began to lament the "extremism" of the establishment.

They're the ones who blew people up...but suddenly, mainstream Americans became *fundies* and *extremists*.

Ironic, no?

CS Lewis talks about this phenomenon in "The Screwtape Letters". Screwtape the demon says that it is a triumph of evil to have gotten society to the point where it spends all its energies decrying the one thing it is least in danger of.

The Screwtape Letters - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

As a high Anglican, Lewis thought of evangelicals and fundamentalists probably as heretics yet believers.

 

[Bfgrn]

Invasion of the Party Snatchers

How the Holy-Rollers and the Neo-Cons Destroyed the GOP

By Victor Gold

Few political activists have a stronger Republican pedigree than Gold. A press aide for 1964 presidential nominee Barry Goldwater and later Vice President Spiro Agnew, Gold also was a speechwriter and adviser to President H.W. Bush. Gold coauthored the latter’s biography.

After four decades as a Republican insider, Victor Gold reveals how the holy-rollers and the Neo-Cons have destroyed the GOP. Now he's fighting to get his party back.

As a man who served as press aide to Barry Goldwater and speechwriter and senior advisor to George H. W. Bush (in addition to co-authoring his autobiography), Victor Gold is absolutely furious that the Neo-Cons and their strange bedfellows, the Evangelical Right, have stolen his party from him. Now he is bringing the fight to them.

Invasion of the Party Snatchers is a blistering critique not only of the Bush-Cheney administration but also of the Republican Congress. Gold is ready to tell all about the war being waged for the soul of the GOP, including the elder Bush's opinion of his sons work domestically and abroad, the significance of the newly elected Congress, and how Goldwater would have reacted to it all. Gold reveals, among other explosive disclosures, how George W. has been manipulated by his vice president and secretary of defense to become, in Lenin's famous phrase, a "useful idiot" for Neo-Conservative warmongers and Theo-Conservative religious fanatics.

Although there have been other books by dissident Republicans attacking the Bush-Cheney administrations betrayal of conservative principles, none have been by an insider whose political credentials include inner-circle status with Barry Goldwater and George H. W. Bush.

Review:
"Make no mistake: author Gold, a former speechwriter for George H.W. Bush and aide to Barry Goldwater, is one disgusted Republican. The GOP of the 2006 midterm election, he writes, is 'a party of pork-barrel ear-markers like Dennis Hastert, of political hatchet men like Karl Rove, and of Bible-thumping hypocrites like Tom Delay.' Gold looks to Goldwater, 'a straight-talking, freethinking maverick,' as the yardstick by which to measure just how far the party of Lincoln has fallen.

He traces the beginning of the end to the 1980 Republican National Convention and the presence of 'a militant new element...personified by Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell.' The other half of the equation, the neoconservatives, are embodied by Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld, 'two cuts from the same Machiavellian cloth.' In efficient prose, Gold scrutinizes a significant swath of recent GOP history, in particular Newt Gingrich's 104th Congress and the Bush II White House, without losing momentum.

He also has choice words for 'the Coulterization of Republican rhetoric,' the revolving door between Capitol Hill and K Street, and 'sideshow' legislation like the Flag Protection Amendment. Gold sees a promising future for the Republican Party, but not until they lose some major elections and are able to keep down a slice of humble pie; for those disillusioned with the state of the GOP, this quick, uncompromising polemic provides substantial support, along with a large dose of cold comfort." Publishers Weekly (Starred Review) (Copyright Reed Business Information, Inc.)

Synopsis:
The last real Goldwater conservative in America attacks the current state of his movement and his party.
Powell's Books - Invasion of the Party Snatchers: How the Holy-Rollers and Neo-Cons Destroyed the GOP by Victor Gold

Victor Gold grew up in New Orleans, Louisiana, where he attended the public schools, and Tulane University. After working as a reporter-correspondent for the BIRMINGHAM (Alabama) NEWS, he earned his law degree (J.D.) from the University of Alabama. He served in the U.S. Army during the Korean War, 1950-52.


In 1958 he moved to Washington, D.C., and joined the public relations firm of Selvage & Lee. Six years later he became Deputy Press Secretary to Senator Barry Goldwater during the 1964 presidential campaign.


In 1965 Gold opened his own political public relations firm in Washington, listing among his clients then-Republican House leader Gerald Ford and Senator Bob Dole. At the Republican conventions of 1968 and 1976 he worked with press secretary Lyn Nofziger on behalf of the presidential candidacy of then-California Governor Ronald Reagan. During the Nixon administration he served as press secretary to Vice President Spiro T. Agnew until January, 1973.


In 1980 Gold joined the staff of Republican presidential candidate George H. W. Bush as a speechwriter and senior advisor, a position he held during the Reagan-Bush campaigns of '80 and '84. He served on the Bush vice-presidential staff in 1981, and as a Bush advisor in the campaigns of 1988 and 1992. In 1992 he received the Distinguished Achievement Award for Political Communication from his alma mater, the University of Alabama.


In 1989 Gold served as a member of President Bush's election-oversight delegation to the first free Romanian elections.


A frequent speaker on the national political and campus circuits, Gold has also appeared on numerous network television shows. His articles, covering politics and sports, have appeared in NEWSWEEK, HARPER'S, ATLANTIC MONTHLY, PLAYBOY, CONNOISSEUR, READERS' DIGEST, NATIONAL REVIEW, THE WEEKLY STANDARD, NEW REPUBLIC, THE NEW YORK TIMES, THE LOS ANGELES TIMES, and THE WASHINGTON POST.

 

[JakeStarkey]

An interesting read on Lewis and the evangelicals who adore him.

Ryan Harper: The American Evangelical Love Affair with C.S. Lewis: Why He's Important But Still Not Jesus

 

[Bfgrn]

American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America

By Chris Hedges - Pulitzer Prize author. Hedges holds a BA in English literature from Colgate University and a Master of Divinity degree from Harvard University.

In American Fascists, Chris Hedges challenges the Christian Right's religious legitimacy and argues that at its core it is a mass movement fueled by unbridled nationalism and a hatred for the open society.

American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America | Books | Nation Institute

 

[koshergrl]

I keep hearing how this "fundamentalist" class leapt into existence in the 60s...and how the Republican party is "now" full of "fundies"...and how anyone who doesn't support abortion, gay marriage, the taxation of churches and sex counseling in schools is a "fundie".

It occurs to me that nothing exists in a vacuum. We are more liberal today than we have ever been...but the defamation of Christians began in the 60s with the rise of the radical left. The further left they pulled us, the more we heard the term "fundamentalism" applied to traditional, American, Christian values.

Essentially what has happened is this...we took an abrupt and severe left turn in the 60s, with the rise to power of pukes like Ayers, who infilterated the media and schools, and began to lament the "extremism" of the establishment.

They're the ones who blew people up...but suddenly, mainstream Americans became *fundies* and *extremists*.

Ironic, no?

CS Lewis talks about this phenomenon in "The Screwtape Letters". Screwtape the demon says that it is a triumph of evil to have gotten society to the point where it spends all its energies decrying the one thing it is least in danger of.

Also ironic...hollie, our #1 hysteric, that shrieking anti-christian harridan, declared a while back that Oxford research was "alleged" research, and the researchers "fundies". It was memorable.

 

[koshergrl]

American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America

By Chris Hedges - Pulitzer Prize author. Hedges holds a BA in English literature from Colgate University and a Master of Divinity degree from Harvard University.

In American Fascists, Chris Hedges challenges the Christian Right's religious legitimacy and argues that at its core it is a mass movement fueled by unbridled nationalism and a hatred for the open society.

American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America | Books | Nation Institute

Oh, well, if a JOURNALIST says it, it must be true.

Honestly, there's something wrong with you pukes.

Chris also said this:

"He states that war is the pornography of violence, a powerful narcotic that “…has a dark beauty, filled with the monstrous and the grotesque.” He goes on to explain, “War gives us a distorted sense of self. It gives us meaning. It creates a feeling of comradeship that obliterates our alienation and makes us feel, for perhaps the first time in our lives, that we belong.”

He's an elitist prig in love with the sound of his own voice. He's a fucking ghoul. He made a mint of money writing about the people he followed around, to watch die, without ever lifting a finger to help them.

Chris Hedges | Americans Who Tell The Truth

 

[Bfgrn]

American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America

By Chris Hedges - Pulitzer Prize author. Hedges holds a BA in English literature from Colgate University and a Master of Divinity degree from Harvard University.

In American Fascists, Chris Hedges challenges the Christian Right's religious legitimacy and argues that at its core it is a mass movement fueled by unbridled nationalism and a hatred for the open society.

American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America | Books | Nation Institute

Oh, well, if a JOURNALIST says it, it must be true.

Honestly, there's something wrong with you pukes.

Chris also said this:

"He states that war is the pornography of violence, a powerful narcotic that “…has a dark beauty, filled with the monstrous and the grotesque.” He goes on to explain, “War gives us a distorted sense of self. It gives us meaning. It creates a feeling of comradeship that obliterates our alienation and makes us feel, for perhaps the first time in our lives, that we belong.”

He's an elitist prig in love with the sound of his own voice. He's a fucking ghoul. He made a mint of money writing about the people he followed around, to watch die, without ever lifting a finger to help them.

Chris Hedges | Americans Who Tell The Truth

One that confounds good and evil is an enemy to good.
Edmund Burke


Americans Who Tell The Truth
Models of Courageous Citizenship

Chris Hedges
War Correspondent, Writer

Biography

Chris Hedges, the son of a Presbyterian minister, was born on September 18, 1956 in St. Johnsbury, Vermont. He graduated from Colgate University with a BA in English Literature and went on to receive a Master of Divinity from Harvard. He has an honorary doctorate from Starr King School for the Ministry in Berkeley, California.

Hedges spent nearly two decades as a foreign correspondent in Central America, the Middle East, Africa and the Balkans. He was an early and outspoken critic of the US plan to invade and occupy Iraq and called the press coverage at the time “shameful cheerleading.” In 2002, he was part of a team of reporters for The New York Times who won a Pulitzer Prize for the paper’s coverage of global terrorism. That same year he won an Amnesty International Global Award for Human Rights Journalism.

In 2003, shortly after the war in Iraq began, Hedges was asked to give the commencement address at Rockford College in Rockford, Illinois. He told the graduating class “…we are embarking on an occupation that, if history is any guide, will be as damaging to our souls as it will be to our prestige, power and security.” He went on to say that “This is a war of liberation in Iraq, but it is a war of liberation by Iraqis from American occupation.” As he spoke, several hundred members of the audience began jeering and booing. His microphone was cut twice. Two young men rushed the stage to try to prevent him from speaking and Hedges had to cut short his address. He was escorted off campus by security officials before the diplomas were awarded. This event made national news and he became a lightning rod not only for right wing pundits and commentators, but also mainstream newspapers. The Wall Street Journal ran an editorial which denounced his anti-war stance and the The New York Times issued a formal reprimand, forbidding Hedges to speak about the war. The reprimand condemned his remarks as undermining the paper’s impartiality. Hedges resigned shortly thereafter and became a senior fellow at the Nation Institute.

Hedges’ is the author of the 2002 best seller, War is A Force That Gives Us Meaning, which is an examination of what war does to individuals and societies. He states that war is the pornography of violence, a powerful narcotic that “…has a dark beauty, filled with the monstrous and the grotesque.” He goes on to explain, “War gives us a distorted sense of self. It gives us meaning. It creates a feeling of comradeship that obliterates our alienation and makes us feel, for perhaps the first time in our lives, that we belong.” Of his own experience of war, living and working as a journalist in the war zones of Central America, the Balkans and the Middle East, he writes: “I have seen too much of violent death. I have tasted too much of my own fear. I have painful memories that lie buried and untouched most of the time. It is never easy when they surface.”

Some contend that his 2008 book, Collateral Damage, is his most courageous work. For it, he interviewed combat veterans of the Iraq war who have testified on the record about atrocities carried out by American soldiers and marines during the military occupation of Iraq. His book reveals in heartbreaking detail the devastating moral and physical consequences of the occupation.

 

[koshergrl]

Yes, I know. I read it. That's why I put the link up there.

Toddle off, I think it's nappy time.

 

[Pogo]

American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America

By Chris Hedges - Pulitzer Prize author. Hedges holds a BA in English literature from Colgate University and a Master of Divinity degree from Harvard University.

In American Fascists, Chris Hedges challenges the Christian Right's religious legitimacy and argues that at its core it is a mass movement fueled by unbridled nationalism and a hatred for the open society.

American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America | Books | Nation Institute

Oh, well, if a JOURNALIST says it, it must be true.

Honestly, there's something wrong with you pukes.

Chris also said this:

"He states that war is the pornography of violence, a powerful narcotic that “…has a dark beauty, filled with the monstrous and the grotesque.” He goes on to explain, “War gives us a distorted sense of self. It gives us meaning. It creates a feeling of comradeship that obliterates our alienation and makes us feel, for perhaps the first time in our lives, that we belong.”

He's an elitist prig in love with the sound of his own voice. He's a fucking ghoul. He made a mint of money writing about the people he followed around, to watch die, without ever lifting a finger to help them.

Chris Hedges | Americans Who Tell The Truth

"moron"...
"the dimwitted"...
"shrieking anti-christian [sic] harridan" (on a poster who isn't even here)...
"you pukes"...

Don't mind me, just keeping score. You're way "ahead".
Because nothing says "I'm making a rational point" like "you pukes".

Must suck inside your head.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Stinking mixture of alcohol and saw dust in her head.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Are you like a novelist or something? You do a lot of this creativity thing.
Where does my post say they "took over"?

I'll wait. Actually I'll come back later considering your history of answering questions like this.

If I point out where it says it you will claim you are not responsible for the content of a quote because you just quote, you don't actually read, or use the quotes to make a point.

Don't worry though, the rest of the world knows what Goldwater actually meant, and how you quoting him in this context shows you agree with him.

Sometimes I forget to dumb down for those who've enslaved themselves to the crutch that the poster of a quote, by posting it, becomes the originator in a kind of rhetorical transubstantiation thingy.

Actually I don't forget; I refuse to descend to it.

I don't edit verbatim quotes. Ever. But I do attribute them. Too bad you're too illiterate to read that far.

See what I mean?