The Official Zimmerman Trial Verdict Thread

What are your Initial Thoughts on the Guilt or Innocence of George Zimmerman?


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Gee, Joe...I carry routinely...does THAT tell you that I'm out there to "hunt" someone? Because in over twenty years of concealed carry I've never drawn my weapon in anger...let alone shot someone with it. Your contention on that is as full of shit as the rest of your contentions.

As for why the Police told Zimmerman not to follow Martin? They were most likely concerned for Zimmerman's own safety not because they thought he was a racist "local asshole". In this case that concern appears to have been warranted because Martin did indeed attack the man that had been following him.

Guy, if you aren't a policeman, there's no good reason for you to be going out there with a gun... much less a concealed one.

As far as what was warranted. Who left the scene in a body bag again?
 
[
Gee, Joe...I carry routinely...does THAT tell you that I'm out there to "hunt" someone? Because in over twenty years of concealed carry I've never drawn my weapon in anger...let alone shot someone with it. Your contention on that is as full of shit as the rest of your contentions.

As for why the Police told Zimmerman not to follow Martin? They were most likely concerned for Zimmerman's own safety not because they thought he was a racist "local asshole". In this case that concern appears to have been warranted because Martin did indeed attack the man that had been following him.

Guy, if you aren't a policeman, there's no good reason for you to be going out there with a gun... much less a concealed one.

As far as what was warranted. Who left the scene in a body bag again?

So you rely on the Police to protect you and your loved ones, Joe? And if they aren't around what's your "fall back" plan? I carry a concealed weapon because I'm only too aware that the Police are incapable of protecting us from all the evil people running around out there and if one of them decides myself or the people I love are going to be their next victim...I'm going to use that gun to make sure that doesn't happen. You? You'll be going to the hospital or to a morgue to ID your loved ones because you didn't care enough about their safety to take precautions.
 
As for who left the scene in a body bag? I'm sorry Joe but I have a hard time feeling sorry for Trayvon Martin. Somewhere along the line he decided that physical violence was the way to get through the world we live in. As the old saying goes..."live by the sword...die by the sword". It's a waste of a young life.
 
[
Gee, Joe...I carry routinely...does THAT tell you that I'm out there to "hunt" someone? Because in over twenty years of concealed carry I've never drawn my weapon in anger...let alone shot someone with it. Your contention on that is as full of shit as the rest of your contentions.

As for why the Police told Zimmerman not to follow Martin? They were most likely concerned for Zimmerman's own safety not because they thought he was a racist "local asshole". In this case that concern appears to have been warranted because Martin did indeed attack the man that had been following him.

Guy, if you aren't a policeman, there's no good reason for you to be going out there with a gun... much less a concealed one.

As far as what was warranted. Who left the scene in a body bag again?

Protection of yourself and your loved ones is a good reason to carry a gun. I don't own a gun, have only shot a gun once in my life, I'm not comfortable with them, but that's clearly a valid reason.
 
As for who left the scene in a body bag? I'm sorry Joe but I have a hard time feeling sorry for Trayvon Martin. Somewhere along the line he decided that physical violence was the way to get through the world we live in. As the old saying goes..."live by the sword...die by the sword". It's a waste of a young life.

This sounds a little too much like saying anyone who starts a fight deserves to die. And I think the sword saying would be more appropriate if Martin had pulled a gun on Zimmerman and then been shot.
 
[

Having the right to be on the street is not having the right to give someone a beating for following you. George Zimmerman ALSO has the right to be on the street.

Zimmerman followed Martin...he didn't hunt him.

The police directive not to follow a suspect was given, I would assume, for George Zimmerman's safety not because Zimmerman was violating any law doing so. Why would the Police do that? Because you don't know what a suspect might do if he's cornered. He might become violent. He might punch you in the face. He might jump on top of you and pound your head into the ground. The Police caution against that because they're only too aware of what can happen on the street.

The term "in cold blood" is so completely wrong in this case it once again proves how clueless you are about this case. Shooting someone that has punched you in the face, has pinned you and is pounding your head against the ground is not shooting someone in "cold blood". If Zimmerman had walked up to Martin and shot him before Martin punched him THEN that would be a cold blooded murder. That didn't happen.

The fact Zimmerman was out there with a gun on his person tells me he has out there to hunt someone...

+.jpg

"Be vewy, vewy quiet, I'm hunting wascally coons... er... Punks."

Maybe the cops told him to stand down because they knew he was the local asshole who called the cops every time he saw a black kid skateboarding.

Gee, Joe...I carry routinely...does THAT tell you that I'm out there to "hunt" someone? Because in over twenty years of concealed carry I've never drawn my weapon in anger...let alone shot someone with it. Your contention on that is as full of shit as the rest of your contentions.

As for why the Police told Zimmerman not to follow Martin? They were most likely concerned for Zimmerman's own safety not because they thought he was a racist "local asshole". In this case that concern appears to have been warranted because Martin did indeed attack the man that had been following him.

technically they did not tell him not to follow

but rather we do not need you to do that
 
A medical report by George Zimmerman's family doctor, taken a day after the February 26 shooting, shows Zimmerman was diagnosed with a fractured nose, two black eyes and two lacerations on the back of his head.


He’s going to need to prove the use of deadly force was justified. A fractured nose, black eyes and some scrapes on the back of his head do not connote his life was in danger. “
When would the use of deadly force by a private citizen against another human be considered judicious, sensible, prudent, cautious, careful, justified, or well thought out? How can a private citizen be authorized to kill another human under his or her own summary judgment? The very simple answer is that deadly force is recognized as a last resort for when you need to use it to save your life. Here we are referring to the "doctrine of competing harms" and the "doctrine of necessity." Put very simply, you are allowed to break the law (in this instance: kill), in the rare circumstances where following the law (i.e. not killing) would cause more injury to you or other innocent humans than would breaking it. In reality, the answer is not so simple. Any time you
even draw your gun, you are walking on thin ice. If you are going to keep or carry a gun for self-defense, in addition to being well trained in marksmanship and tactics, you should be well educated about the circumstances under which the use of deadly force is warranted legally and morally, so that you can be judicious. If you own or carry a gun, you must be judicious.
Judicious Use Of Deadly Force

Black eyes, a fractured (NOT BROKEN) nose, and a couple of scrapes on the back of his head do not indicate a "last resort" situation where he needed to use deadly force. The videos of him right after the incident show he was hardly injured at all. His injuries were what anyone might get in a school yard fist fight, which was the only kind of fighting Trayvon was familair with.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Florida Statutes
776.012 Use of force in defense of person.—]A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:
(1) He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm
to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or
(2) Under those circumstances permitted pursuant to s. 776.013.
History.—s. 13, ch. 74-383; s. 1188, ch. 97-102; s. 2, ch. 2005-27.
776.013 Home protection; use of deadly force; presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm.—

I think Zimmerman is going to have a very hard time proving he had good reason to believe he was in imminent danger of losing his life. He was in what amounted to a school yard fight, with a school kid. There was no great bodily harm. There was no suggestion of imminent death.

In fact, it is Martin who was justified in using force, for he was the one who would feel he was in imminent danger by some unknown person who was following him and chasing after him. He ran and Zimmerman ran after him: we hear that and he admits to that on the 911 tape.

A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force
The shoe is completely on the other foot. It was Trayvon who would be in fear of being attacked, Trayvon who would be justified protecting himself if he believed, and he certainly had a right to, that someone was chasing him to do him harm. That is certainly what I would believe if I were out walking alone at night and someone was following me and began to run after me when I started to run away.

Also, Zimmerman knew the police were on the way. He knew his life was not in danger because the cops were going to be there any minute. He was in what amounted to a school yard fist fight with the cops on the way: deadly force was not justified.
 
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[
So you rely on the Police to protect you and your loved ones, Joe? And if they aren't around what's your "fall back" plan? I carry a concealed weapon because I'm only too aware that the Police are incapable of protecting us from all the evil people running around out there and if one of them decides myself or the people I love are going to be their next victim...I'm going to use that gun to make sure that doesn't happen. You? You'll be going to the hospital or to a morgue to ID your loved ones because you didn't care enough about their safety to take precautions.

Guy, a gun in your home is 43 times more likely to kill a member of the household than a bad guy.

Because you are a stupid, brain-dead rube that has bought into the NRA/Gun Industry propaganda is pretty much why I want you disarmed. You sound like the Zimmerman type who would plug an innocent kid because he was in the wrong place or had the wrong color skin tone.

This is why I want to make a shining example of Zimmerman. To let people like you know, there are limits.
 
[
Gee, Joe...I carry routinely...does THAT tell you that I'm out there to "hunt" someone? Because in over twenty years of concealed carry I've never drawn my weapon in anger...let alone shot someone with it. Your contention on that is as full of shit as the rest of your contentions.

As for why the Police told Zimmerman not to follow Martin? They were most likely concerned for Zimmerman's own safety not because they thought he was a racist "local asshole". In this case that concern appears to have been warranted because Martin did indeed attack the man that had been following him.

Guy, if you aren't a policeman, there's no good reason for you to be going out there with a gun... much less a concealed one.

As far as what was warranted. Who left the scene in a body bag again?

Protection of yourself and your loved ones is a good reason to carry a gun. I don't own a gun, have only shot a gun once in my life, I'm not comfortable with them, but that's clearly a valid reason.

I was in the Army for 11 years. I shot a lot of guns. I still see no good reason for most civilians to have them, or for people like DogStyle to be walking around toting heat because he's scared of the Darkies.
 
As for who left the scene in a body bag? I'm sorry Joe but I have a hard time feeling sorry for Trayvon Martin. Somewhere along the line he decided that physical violence was the way to get through the world we live in. As the old saying goes..."live by the sword...die by the sword". It's a waste of a young life.

Of course you don't feel bad for him. He wasn't respecting his "betters".

But Zimmerman's still going down. Deal with it.
 
A medical report by George Zimmerman's family doctor, taken a day after the February 26 shooting, shows Zimmerman was diagnosed with a fractured nose, two black eyes and two lacerations on the back of his head.


He’s going to need to prove the use of deadly force was justified. A fractured nose, black eyes and some scrapes on the back of his head do not connote his life was in danger. “
When would the use of deadly force by a private citizen against another human be considered judicious, sensible, prudent, cautious, careful, justified, or well thought out? How can a private citizen be authorized to kill another human under his or her own summary judgment? The very simple answer is that deadly force is recognized as a last resort for when you need to use it to save your life. Here we are referring to the "doctrine of competing harms" and the "doctrine of necessity." Put very simply, you are allowed to break the law (in this instance: kill), in the rare circumstances where following the law (i.e. not killing) would cause more injury to you or other innocent humans than would breaking it. In reality, the answer is not so simple. Any time you
even draw your gun, you are walking on thin ice. If you are going to keep or carry a gun for self-defense, in addition to being well trained in marksmanship and tactics, you should be well educated about the circumstances under which the use of deadly force is warranted legally and morally, so that you can be judicious. If you own or carry a gun, you must be judicious.
Judicious Use Of Deadly Force

Black eyes, a fractured (NOT BROKEN) nose, and a couple of scrapes on the back of his head do not indicate a "last resort" situation where he needed to use deadly force. The videos of him right after the incident show he was hardly injured at all. His injuries were what anyone might get in a school yard fist fight, which was the only kind of fighting Trayvon was familair with.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Florida Statutes
776.012 Use of force in defense of person.—]A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:
(1) He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm
to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or
(2) Under those circumstances permitted pursuant to s. 776.013.
History.—s. 13, ch. 74-383; s. 1188, ch. 97-102; s. 2, ch. 2005-27.
776.013 Home protection; use of deadly force; presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm.—

I think Zimmerman is going to have a very hard time proving he had good reason to believe he was in imminent danger of losing his life. He was in what amounted to a school yard fight, with a school kid. There was no great bodily harm. There was no suggestion of imminent death.

In fact, it is Martin who was justified in using force, for he was the one who would feel he was in imminent danger by some unknown person who was following him and chasing after him. He ran and Zimmerman ran after him: we hear that and he admits to that on the 911 tape.

A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force
The shoe is completely on the other foot. It was Trayvon who would be in fear of being attacked, Trayvon who would be justified protecting himself if he believed, and he certainly had a right to, that someone was chasing him to do him harm. That is certainly what I would believe if I were out walking alone at night and someone was following me and began to run after me when I started to run away.

Also, Zimmerman knew the police were on the way. He knew his life was not in danger because the cops were going to be there any minute. He was in what amounted to a school yard fist fight with the cops on the way: deadly force was not justified.

it was revealed in court on friday

that there is a 2nd witness that saw martin

on top of zimmerman pounding zimmerman
 
A medical report by George Zimmerman's family doctor, taken a day after the February 26 shooting, shows Zimmerman was diagnosed with a fractured nose, two black eyes and two lacerations on the back of his head.


He’s going to need to prove the use of deadly force was justified. A fractured nose, black eyes and some scrapes on the back of his head do not connote his life was in danger. “
When would the use of deadly force by a private citizen against another human be considered judicious, sensible, prudent, cautious, careful, justified, or well thought out? How can a private citizen be authorized to kill another human under his or her own summary judgment? The very simple answer is that deadly force is recognized as a last resort for when you need to use it to save your life. Here we are referring to the "doctrine of competing harms" and the "doctrine of necessity." Put very simply, you are allowed to break the law (in this instance: kill), in the rare circumstances where following the law (i.e. not killing) would cause more injury to you or other innocent humans than would breaking it. In reality, the answer is not so simple. Any time you
even draw your gun, you are walking on thin ice. If you are going to keep or carry a gun for self-defense, in addition to being well trained in marksmanship and tactics, you should be well educated about the circumstances under which the use of deadly force is warranted legally and morally, so that you can be judicious. If you own or carry a gun, you must be judicious.
Judicious Use Of Deadly Force

Black eyes, a fractured (NOT BROKEN) nose, and a couple of scrapes on the back of his head do not indicate a "last resort" situation where he needed to use deadly force. The videos of him right after the incident show he was hardly injured at all. His injuries were what anyone might get in a school yard fist fight, which was the only kind of fighting Trayvon was familair with.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine



I think Zimmerman is going to have a very hard time proving he had good reason to believe he was in imminent danger of losing his life. He was in what amounted to a school yard fight, with a school kid. There was no great bodily harm. There was no suggestion of imminent death.

In fact, it is Martin who was justified in using force, for he was the one who would feel he was in imminent danger by some unknown person who was following him and chasing after him. He ran and Zimmerman ran after him: we hear that and he admits to that on the 911 tape.

A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and
The shoe is completely on the other foot. It was Trayvon who would be in fear of being attacked, Trayvon who would be justified protecting himself if he believed, and he certainly had a right to, that someone was chasing him to do him harm. That is certainly what I would believe if I were out walking alone at night and someone was following me and began to run after me when I started to run away.

Also, Zimmerman knew the police were on the way. He knew his life was not in danger because the cops were going to be there any minute. He was in what amounted to a school yard fist fight with the cops on the way: deadly force was not justified.

it was revealed in court on friday

that there is a 2nd witness that saw martin

on top of zimmerman pounding zimmerman

That changes nothing of what I posted. Imminent, life threatening, last resort situation. Doesn't qualify. It is Martin who had every right to confront someone he thought was going to attack him: "to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force..." As far as Martin would know Zimmerman might want to rape him or rob him. Martin would have no idea what was up. Zimmerman at no time in his report about that night says he told Martin he was with Neighborhood Watch and was just checking things out. Why didn't he do that? I imagine Trayvon was scared, scared something was going to happen to him: I know damn well I would be, terrified, and ready to defend myself against someone's 'imminent use of unlawful force" against me. Yep. Martin wasn't using deadly force. Zimmerman used deadly force. Martin would be justified in using force. Zimmerman was not justified in using deadly force.

As has been noted: Zimmerman is going down.
 
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A medical report by George Zimmerman's family doctor, taken a day after the February 26 shooting, shows Zimmerman was diagnosed with a fractured nose, two black eyes and two lacerations on the back of his head.


He’s going to need to prove the use of deadly force was justified. A fractured nose, black eyes and some scrapes on the back of his head do not connote his life was in danger. “
Judicious Use Of Deadly Force

Black eyes, a fractured (NOT BROKEN) nose, and a couple of scrapes on the back of his head do not indicate a "last resort" situation where he needed to use deadly force. The videos of him right after the incident show he was hardly injured at all. His injuries were what anyone might get in a school yard fist fight, which was the only kind of fighting Trayvon was familair with.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine



I think Zimmerman is going to have a very hard time proving he had good reason to believe he was in imminent danger of losing his life. He was in what amounted to a school yard fight, with a school kid. There was no great bodily harm. There was no suggestion of imminent death.

In fact, it is Martin who was justified in using force, for he was the one who would feel he was in imminent danger by some unknown person who was following him and chasing after him. He ran and Zimmerman ran after him: we hear that and he admits to that on the 911 tape.

The shoe is completely on the other foot. It was Trayvon who would be in fear of being attacked, Trayvon who would be justified protecting himself if he believed, and he certainly had a right to, that someone was chasing him to do him harm. That is certainly what I would believe if I were out walking alone at night and someone was following me and began to run after me when I started to run away.

Also, Zimmerman knew the police were on the way. He knew his life was not in danger because the cops were going to be there any minute. He was in what amounted to a school yard fist fight with the cops on the way: deadly force was not justified.

it was revealed in court on friday

that there is a 2nd witness that saw martin

on top of zimmerman pounding zimmerman

That changes nothing of what I posted. Imminent, life threatening, last resort situation. Doesn't qualify. It is Martin who had every right to confront someone he thought was going to attack him: "to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force..." As far as Martin would know Zimmerman might want to rape him or rob him. Martin would have no idea what was up. Zimmerman at no time in his report about that night says he told Martin he was with Neighborhood Watch and was just checking things out. Why didn't he do that? I imagine Trayvon was scared, scared something was going to happen to him: I know damn well I would be, terrified, and ready to defend myself against someone's 'imminent use of unlawful force" against me. Yep. Martin wasn't using deadly force. Zimmerman used deadly force. Martin would be justified in using force. Zimmerman was not justified in using deadly force.

As has been noted: Zimmerman is going down.

Just because you might be afraid of something is not evidence that someone else is. Evidence is important.
Hands can be used as a deadly force.
 
it was revealed in court on friday

that there is a 2nd witness that saw martin

on top of zimmerman pounding zimmerman

That changes nothing of what I posted. Imminent, life threatening, last resort situation. Doesn't qualify. It is Martin who had every right to confront someone he thought was going to attack him: "to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force..." As far as Martin would know Zimmerman might want to rape him or rob him. Martin would have no idea what was up. Zimmerman at no time in his report about that night says he told Martin he was with Neighborhood Watch and was just checking things out. Why didn't he do that? I imagine Trayvon was scared, scared something was going to happen to him: I know damn well I would be, terrified, and ready to defend myself against someone's 'imminent use of unlawful force" against me. Yep. Martin wasn't using deadly force. Zimmerman used deadly force. Martin would be justified in using force. Zimmerman was not justified in using deadly force.

As has been noted: Zimmerman is going down.

Just because you might be afraid of something is not evidence that someone else is. Evidence is important.
Hands can be used as a deadly force.

yes it will be important testimony

since the witness claims it was zimmerman

screaming for help
 
That changes nothing of what I posted. Imminent, life threatening, last resort situation. Doesn't qualify. It is Martin who had every right to confront someone he thought was going to attack him: "to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force..." As far as Martin would know Zimmerman might want to rape him or rob him. Martin would have no idea what was up. Zimmerman at no time in his report about that night says he told Martin he was with Neighborhood Watch and was just checking things out. Why didn't he do that? I imagine Trayvon was scared, scared something was going to happen to him: I know damn well I would be, terrified, and ready to defend myself against someone's 'imminent use of unlawful force" against me. Yep. Martin wasn't using deadly force. Zimmerman used deadly force. Martin would be justified in using force. Zimmerman was not justified in using deadly force.

As has been noted: Zimmerman is going down.

Just because you might be afraid of something is not evidence that someone else is. Evidence is important.
Hands can be used as a deadly force.

yes it will be important testimony

since the witness claims it was zimmerman

screaming for help

There isn't any evidence that proves Martin was afraid that his life was being threatened although people love to project their own fears onto him.
 
Just because you might be afraid of something is not evidence that someone else is. Evidence is important.
Hands can be used as a deadly force.

yes it will be important testimony

since the witness claims it was zimmerman

screaming for help

There isn't any evidence that proves Martin was afraid that his life was being threatened although people love to project their own fears onto him.

yes i am aware of that
 
They want to paint the victim in a poor light, it's like what they do in rape cases. In this case it doesn't matter, he wasn't found with a gun or drugs on him, and he wasn't committing a crime.
Personally, I wonder why so many think that Zimmerman can use self defense, but not Martin. Someone following you could be considered a threat, and make one fear for their safety. So yeah, I never understood why some dont see that part of the situation. Is it because he is black? A teenager? Or not a legal gun owner?

You are a racist! Trayvon was not attacked or injured prior to being shot. He did not have a mark on his body other than the gunshot. Had no justifiable fear for his life.

Except that he was being stalked by an armed bigot.
 
They want to paint the victim in a poor light, it's like what they do in rape cases. In this case it doesn't matter, he wasn't found with a gun or drugs on him, and he wasn't committing a crime.
Personally, I wonder why so many think that Zimmerman can use self defense, but not Martin. Someone following you could be considered a threat, and make one fear for their safety. So yeah, I never understood why some dont see that part of the situation. Is it because he is black? A teenager? Or not a legal gun owner?

You are a racist! Trayvon was not attacked or injured prior to being shot. He did not have a mark on his body other than the gunshot. Had no justifiable fear for his life.

Except that he was being stalked by an armed bigot.

According to Florida law, if you are in fear that someone is going to commit an unlawful attack on you, you do have the right to use force. Trayvon had every right to think Zimmerman was going to attack him. Why else would he be following him? Trayvon didn't know Zimmerman was with Neighborhood Watch. Zimmerman never told him that. Trayvon had, according to Florida law the right to use force on someone before that force was used on him. Not deadly force, like a knife or gun, but force. However, Zimmerman's life was not in immediate danger; he had no right to use deadly force.
 
Just because you might be afraid of something is not evidence that someone else is. Evidence is important.
Hands can be used as a deadly force.

yes it will be important testimony

since the witness claims it was zimmerman

screaming for help

There isn't any evidence that proves Martin was afraid that his life was being threatened although people love to project their own fears onto him.

Yea, right. Maybe they will think Trayvon just thought, oh la de da, some crazy guy is following me in the dark and when I start to run, he chases after me. No biggie. Nothing to fear. Sure, that's what anyone would think if they were being stalked and chased by some complete stranger, at night, when they are alone in a place where there is no one else about. Perfectly safe and comfy. Nothing to worry about.

The jury will not think that. They will most likely be fairly normal people who will realize anyone in that situation would be worried and feel threatened.
 
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