The U.S. NOT founded upon Christianity

[AllieBaba]

Hey, but if it's not in the Constitution, they must have just been saying it to say it.

 

[Foxfyre]

Hey, but if it's not in the Constitution, they must have just been saying it to say it.

It isn't in the Constitution because they intended that nobody's version of Christianity be authorized to infringe on the unalienable right to believe what one wanted to believe including rejection of Christianity or religion if that is what they wanted. That did not in the least change their conviction that our nation would prosper and remain free only in the hands of moral and religious Christians.

There is a world of difference between 'being founded on the Christian religion" which it wasn't and being founded on Christian principles, which it was.

 

[AllieBaba]

I know that. You know that. The FF knew that. Every historian and scholar that has ever studied the US knows that.

But gadawg and Bod know BETTER.

 

[bodecea]

Hey, but if it's not in the Constitution, they must have just been saying it to say it.

Where is it in the Preamble? In Articles I-VII? In the first 10 Amendments?

 

[bodecea]

I know that. You know that. The FF knew that. Every historian and scholar that has ever studied the US knows that.

But gadawg and Bod know BETTER.

You mean that all historians and scholars say our nation was founded on Christian Principles?


Of course, feel free to answer that question right after you give us your definition of "founded".

 

[bodecea]

Hey, but if it's not in the Constitution, they must have just been saying it to say it.

It isn't in the Constitution because they intended that nobody's version of Christianity be authorized to infringe on the unalienable right to believe what one wanted to believe including rejection of Christianity or religion if that is what they wanted. That did not in the least change their conviction that our nation would prosper and remain free only in the hands of moral and religious Christians.

There is a world of difference between 'being founded on the Christian religion" which it wasn't and being founded on Christian principles, which it was.

It isn't in the Constitution because this is a secular nation with a secular government. Our founders were the first to codify that Christianity would take NO PART in government. Privately, knock yourself out. Governmentally? NO.

 

[AllieBaba]

Thank you for admitting we are founded upon Christian principle.

 

[bodecea]

Thank you for admitting we are founded upon Christian principle.

Where did I do that? Right after you defined "founded" for us?

 

[peach174]

What about the 1st continental congress opening prayer?

Reverend Jacob Duché
Rector of Christ Church of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
September 7, 1774, 9 o’clock a.m.

"O Lord our Heavenly Father, high and mighty King of
kings, and Lord of lords, who dost from thy throne behold
all the dwellers on earth and reignest with power supreme
and uncontrolled over all the Kingdoms, Empires and
Governments; look down in mercy, we beseech Thee, on
these our American States, who have fled to Thee from
the rod of the oppressor and thrown themselves on Thy
gracious protection, desiring to be henceforth dependent
only on Thee. To Thee have they appealed for the
righteousness of their cause; to Thee do they now look up
for that countenance and support, which Thou alone canst
give. Take them, therefore, Heavenly Father, under Thy
nurturing care; give them wisdom in Council and valor in
the field; defeat the malicious designs of our cruel
adversaries; convince them of the unrighteousness of their
Cause and if they persist in their sanguinary purposes, of
own unerring justice, sounding in their hearts, constrain
them to drop the weapons of war from their unnerved
hands in the day of battle!


"Be Thou present, O God of wisdom, and direct the
councils of this honorable assembly; enable them to settle
things on the best and surest foundation. That the scene
of blood may be speedily closed; that order, harmony and
peace may be effectually restored, and truth and justice,
religion and piety, prevail and flourish amongst the people.
Preserve the health of their bodies and vigor of their
minds; shower down on them and the millions they here
represent, such temporal blessings as Thou seest
expedient for them in this world and crown them with
everlasting glory in the world to come. All this we ask in
the name and through the merits of Jesus Christ, Thy Son
and our Savior.

"Amen."

And the painting of congress kneling in prayer?



seems to me that this is Christianity and continues to this day with opening prayer before start of each day in congress

 

[bodecea]

What about the 1st continental congress opening prayer?

Reverend Jacob Duché
Rector of Christ Church of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
September 7, 1774, 9 o’clock a.m.

"O Lord our Heavenly Father, high and mighty King of
kings, and Lord of lords, who dost from thy throne behold
all the dwellers on earth and reignest with power supreme
and uncontrolled over all the Kingdoms, Empires and
Governments; look down in mercy, we beseech Thee, on
these our American States, who have fled to Thee from
the rod of the oppressor and thrown themselves on Thy
gracious protection, desiring to be henceforth dependent
only on Thee. To Thee have they appealed for the
righteousness of their cause; to Thee do they now look up
for that countenance and support, which Thou alone canst
give. Take them, therefore, Heavenly Father, under Thy
nurturing care; give them wisdom in Council and valor in
the field; defeat the malicious designs of our cruel
adversaries; convince them of the unrighteousness of their
Cause and if they persist in their sanguinary purposes, of
own unerring justice, sounding in their hearts, constrain
them to drop the weapons of war from their unnerved
hands in the day of battle!


"Be Thou present, O God of wisdom, and direct the
councils of this honorable assembly; enable them to settle
things on the best and surest foundation. That the scene
of blood may be speedily closed; that order, harmony and
peace may be effectually restored, and truth and justice,
religion and piety, prevail and flourish amongst the people.
Preserve the health of their bodies and vigor of their
minds; shower down on them and the millions they here
represent, such temporal blessings as Thou seest
expedient for them in this world and crown them with
everlasting glory in the world to come. All this we ask in
the name and through the merits of Jesus Christ, Thy Son
and our Savior.

"Amen."

And the painting of congress kneling in prayer?

View attachment 13333

That's very nice...but is it codified in law? Or is that men wanting to pray...while being wise enough to NOT put it into our Country's Framework?

(BTW...1st Continential Congress? STILL part of England at that time....not the U.S. yet)

 

[AllieBaba]

Hey, but if it's not in the Constitution, they must have just been saying it to say it.

It isn't in the Constitution because they intended that nobody's version of Christianity be authorized to infringe on the unalienable right to believe what one wanted to believe including rejection of Christianity or religion if that is what they wanted. That did not in the least change their conviction that our nation would prosper and remain free only in the hands of moral and religious Christians.

There is a world of difference between 'being founded on the Christian religion" which it wasn't and being founded on Christian principles, which it was.

It isn't in the Constitution because this is a secular nation with a secular government. Our founders were the first to codify that Christianity would take NO PART in government. Privately, knock yourself out. Governmentally? NO.

Idiot. The argument, for the 500th time, isn't that Christianity takes a part in government.

The argument (it's not even an argument, as it's an accepted, proven fact) is that the government was founded upon Christian principle.

Remember...

foundverb
Definition of FOUND

transitive verb
1
: to take the first steps in building

2
: to set or ground on something solid : base

3
: to establish (as an institution) often with provision for future maintenance

 

[AllieBaba]

What about the 1st continental congress opening prayer?

Reverend Jacob Duché
Rector of Christ Church of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
September 7, 1774, 9 o’clock a.m.

"O Lord our Heavenly Father, high and mighty King of
kings, and Lord of lords, who dost from thy throne behold
all the dwellers on earth and reignest with power supreme
and uncontrolled over all the Kingdoms, Empires and
Governments; look down in mercy, we beseech Thee, on
these our American States, who have fled to Thee from
the rod of the oppressor and thrown themselves on Thy
gracious protection, desiring to be henceforth dependent
only on Thee. To Thee have they appealed for the
righteousness of their cause; to Thee do they now look up
for that countenance and support, which Thou alone canst
give. Take them, therefore, Heavenly Father, under Thy
nurturing care; give them wisdom in Council and valor in
the field; defeat the malicious designs of our cruel
adversaries; convince them of the unrighteousness of their
Cause and if they persist in their sanguinary purposes, of
own unerring justice, sounding in their hearts, constrain
them to drop the weapons of war from their unnerved
hands in the day of battle!


"Be Thou present, O God of wisdom, and direct the
councils of this honorable assembly; enable them to settle
things on the best and surest foundation. That the scene
of blood may be speedily closed; that order, harmony and
peace may be effectually restored, and truth and justice,
religion and piety, prevail and flourish amongst the people.
Preserve the health of their bodies and vigor of their
minds; shower down on them and the millions they here
represent, such temporal blessings as Thou seest
expedient for them in this world and crown them with
everlasting glory in the world to come. All this we ask in
the name and through the merits of Jesus Christ, Thy Son
and our Savior.

"Amen."

And the painting of congress kneling in prayer?

View attachment 13333

That's very nice...but is it codified in law? Or is that men wanting to pray...while being wise enough to NOT put it into our Country's Framework?

(BTW...1st Continential Congress? STILL part of England at that time....not the U.S. yet)

Do you see the word "law" in the definition of FOUND, you brain dead moron?

 

[bodecea]

What about the 1st continental congress opening prayer?

Reverend Jacob Duché
Rector of Christ Church of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
September 7, 1774, 9 o’clock a.m.

"O Lord our Heavenly Father, high and mighty King of
kings, and Lord of lords, who dost from thy throne behold
all the dwellers on earth and reignest with power supreme
and uncontrolled over all the Kingdoms, Empires and
Governments; look down in mercy, we beseech Thee, on
these our American States, who have fled to Thee from
the rod of the oppressor and thrown themselves on Thy
gracious protection, desiring to be henceforth dependent
only on Thee. To Thee have they appealed for the
righteousness of their cause; to Thee do they now look up
for that countenance and support, which Thou alone canst
give. Take them, therefore, Heavenly Father, under Thy
nurturing care; give them wisdom in Council and valor in
the field; defeat the malicious designs of our cruel
adversaries; convince them of the unrighteousness of their
Cause and if they persist in their sanguinary purposes, of
own unerring justice, sounding in their hearts, constrain
them to drop the weapons of war from their unnerved
hands in the day of battle!


"Be Thou present, O God of wisdom, and direct the
councils of this honorable assembly; enable them to settle
things on the best and surest foundation. That the scene
of blood may be speedily closed; that order, harmony and
peace may be effectually restored, and truth and justice,
religion and piety, prevail and flourish amongst the people.
Preserve the health of their bodies and vigor of their
minds; shower down on them and the millions they here
represent, such temporal blessings as Thou seest
expedient for them in this world and crown them with
everlasting glory in the world to come. All this we ask in
the name and through the merits of Jesus Christ, Thy Son
and our Savior.

"Amen."

And the painting of congress kneling in prayer?

View attachment 13333

That's very nice...but is it codified in law? Or is that men wanting to pray...while being wise enough to NOT put it into our Country's Framework?

(BTW...1st Continential Congress? STILL part of England at that time....not the U.S. yet)

This brings up an interesting point. Do you think the Congress should start with a prayer? If so, what kind of prayer? Should it be codified by law?

 

[AllieBaba]

See this is what is patently dishonest about the left.

She knows very well that law has nothing whatsoever to do with this argument, and she is perfectly aware that she cannot intelligently claim that our country isn't founded on Christian principle.

So what she does, and has done from the beginning, is to PRETEND (read: Lie) that the assertion is something other than what it is....she is pretending that the argument is not whether or not the US was founded upon Christian principle, as she knows it was...she pretends instead that the question is whether or not his is a theocracy.

Which of COURSE it isn't. Nobody said it was a theocracy, that would be idiotic. Obviously, we aren't a theocracy, which is why that argument never came up.

But Bod is pretending that it did, because she is too dishonest to address her own stupidity in claiming we aren't founded upon Christian principle.

 

[bodecea]

What about the 1st continental congress opening prayer?

Reverend Jacob Duché
Rector of Christ Church of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
September 7, 1774, 9 o’clock a.m.

"O Lord our Heavenly Father, high and mighty King of
kings, and Lord of lords, who dost from thy throne behold
all the dwellers on earth and reignest with power supreme
and uncontrolled over all the Kingdoms, Empires and
Governments; look down in mercy, we beseech Thee, on
these our American States, who have fled to Thee from
the rod of the oppressor and thrown themselves on Thy
gracious protection, desiring to be henceforth dependent
only on Thee. To Thee have they appealed for the
righteousness of their cause; to Thee do they now look up
for that countenance and support, which Thou alone canst
give. Take them, therefore, Heavenly Father, under Thy
nurturing care; give them wisdom in Council and valor in
the field; defeat the malicious designs of our cruel
adversaries; convince them of the unrighteousness of their
Cause and if they persist in their sanguinary purposes, of
own unerring justice, sounding in their hearts, constrain
them to drop the weapons of war from their unnerved
hands in the day of battle!


"Be Thou present, O God of wisdom, and direct the
councils of this honorable assembly; enable them to settle
things on the best and surest foundation. That the scene
of blood may be speedily closed; that order, harmony and
peace may be effectually restored, and truth and justice,
religion and piety, prevail and flourish amongst the people.
Preserve the health of their bodies and vigor of their
minds; shower down on them and the millions they here
represent, such temporal blessings as Thou seest
expedient for them in this world and crown them with
everlasting glory in the world to come. All this we ask in
the name and through the merits of Jesus Christ, Thy Son
and our Savior.

"Amen."

And the painting of congress kneling in prayer?

View attachment 13333

That's very nice...but is it codified in law? Or is that men wanting to pray...while being wise enough to NOT put it into our Country's Framework?

(BTW...1st Continential Congress? STILL part of England at that time....not the U.S. yet)

Do you see the word "law" in the definition of FOUND, you brain dead moron?

What definition of "found" is that, Allie? The one I've asked you for and you have yet to define for us? That one?


And I appreciate you showcasing just how well you can debate the topic by calling rude names. THAT certainly wins debates....

 

[AllieBaba]

What about the 1st continental congress opening prayer?

Reverend Jacob Duché
Rector of Christ Church of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
September 7, 1774, 9 o’clock a.m.

"O Lord our Heavenly Father, high and mighty King of
kings, and Lord of lords, who dost from thy throne behold
all the dwellers on earth and reignest with power supreme
and uncontrolled over all the Kingdoms, Empires and
Governments; look down in mercy, we beseech Thee, on
these our American States, who have fled to Thee from
the rod of the oppressor and thrown themselves on Thy
gracious protection, desiring to be henceforth dependent
only on Thee. To Thee have they appealed for the
righteousness of their cause; to Thee do they now look up
for that countenance and support, which Thou alone canst
give. Take them, therefore, Heavenly Father, under Thy
nurturing care; give them wisdom in Council and valor in
the field; defeat the malicious designs of our cruel
adversaries; convince them of the unrighteousness of their
Cause and if they persist in their sanguinary purposes, of
own unerring justice, sounding in their hearts, constrain
them to drop the weapons of war from their unnerved
hands in the day of battle!


"Be Thou present, O God of wisdom, and direct the
councils of this honorable assembly; enable them to settle
things on the best and surest foundation. That the scene
of blood may be speedily closed; that order, harmony and
peace may be effectually restored, and truth and justice,
religion and piety, prevail and flourish amongst the people.
Preserve the health of their bodies and vigor of their
minds; shower down on them and the millions they here
represent, such temporal blessings as Thou seest
expedient for them in this world and crown them with
everlasting glory in the world to come. All this we ask in
the name and through the merits of Jesus Christ, Thy Son
and our Savior.

"Amen."

And the painting of congress kneling in prayer?

View attachment 13333

That's very nice...but is it codified in law? Or is that men wanting to pray...while being wise enough to NOT put it into our Country's Framework?

(BTW...1st Continential Congress? STILL part of England at that time....not the U.S. yet)

This brings up an interesting point. Do you think the Congress should start with a prayer? If so, what kind of prayer? Should it be codified by law?

Why in God's name are you asking yourself a question?

 

[peach174]

Hey, but if it's not in the Constitution, they must have just been saying it to say it.

It isn't in the Constitution because they intended that nobody's version of Christianity be authorized to infringe on the unalienable right to believe what one wanted to believe including rejection of Christianity or religion if that is what they wanted. That did not in the least change their conviction that our nation would prosper and remain free only in the hands of moral and religious Christians.

There is a world of difference between 'being founded on the Christian religion" which it wasn't and being founded on Christian principles, which it was.

It isn't in the Constitution because this is a secular nation with a secular government. Our founders were the first to codify that Christianity would take NO PART in government. Privately, knock yourself out. Governmentally? NO.

Your the one who said our founders were the 1st that Christianity would take no part in government, they did and they still do.
Do you think this stopped when we won the revolutionary war no it did not.
and you dropped that part where I said that congress has opening prayer everyday before they start business. It has been that way from the beginning to this very day.
Do you every watch C-Span? They open with prayer every day.

 

[AllieBaba]

That's very nice...but is it codified in law? Or is that men wanting to pray...while being wise enough to NOT put it into our Country's Framework?

(BTW...1st Continential Congress? STILL part of England at that time....not the U.S. yet)

Do you see the word "law" in the definition of FOUND, you brain dead moron?

What definition of "found" is that, Allie? The one I've asked you for and you have yet to define for us? That one?


And I appreciate you showcasing just how well you can debate the topic by calling rude names. THAT certainly wins debates....

What the fuck are you talking about, you lying twat? I've posted the definition of found TWO TIMES. Are you saying I'm supposed to find a DIFFERENT definition, one that meets your own weird understanding?

What an idiot. This debate ceased to be a debate the minute you joined, becasue there is no argument. It has been established and is recognized on a global scale, that the US was founded upon christian principle. All that we're debating now is whether or not you lie intentionally, or accidentally by virtue of your intense stupidity.

 

[bodecea]

See this is what is patently dishonest about the left.

She knows very well that law has nothing whatsoever to do with this argument, and she is perfectly aware that she cannot intelligently claim that our country isn't founded on Christian principle.

So what she does, and has done from the beginning, is to PRETEND (read: Lie) that the assertion is something other than what it is....she is pretending that the argument is not whether or not the US was founded upon Christian principle, as she knows it was...she pretends instead that the question is whether or not his is a theocracy.

Which of COURSE it isn't. Nobody said it was a theocracy, that would be idiotic. Obviously, we aren't a theocracy, which is why that argument never came up.

But Bod is pretending that it did, because she is too dishonest to address her own stupidity in claiming we aren't founded upon Christian principle.

Where is your definition of "Found", Allie?


And who here said we were a theocracy, Allie?

Where did I pretend that someone said we were a theocracy, Allie?


When will you stop making up stuff and actually prove your accusations, Allie?

 

[AllieBaba]

Oh. My. God.