Third Marysville Student dies.

[PredFan]

Molon Labe mother fucker.

 

[JoeB131]

Except that won't happen. You had a liberal in the white house and a super majority in congress, and not one piece of anti-gun legislation was passed. In fact, there were more states that went towards easing the restrictions on carry permits. You are losing.

Not really. The fact is, gun ownership is falling out of fashion. the Gun Industry is becoming much like the alcohol industry. they know that their money is coming from the addicts.

Much like the alcohol industry makes its money from the hard core drinkers, the Gun INdustry makes its money from the Nancy Lanzas who stock up guns like the Zombies are coming. They don't make any money from the gun owner who buys one gun, sticks it in closet and forgets about it until his five year old finds it and shoots himself with it.

 

[JoeB131]

Molon Labe mother fucker.

Happily. YOu work on the assumption 1) that you'd stand a chance against trained ATF agents or 2) I really care if you gun nuts get hurt when the ATF takes your toys.

 

[DigitalDrifter]

Anti-gunners like Joe lose all credibility when they start the nasty name calling, the penis jokes, the claims that we all get off when tragedies like this occur.

I have no problem with an honest respectful discussion, even when I vehemently disagree with anti-gunners.
People like Joe just cause his opposition to dig in their heels, instead of digesting their argument.

Guy, you gun nuts aren't rational, so there's no point having rational conversations with you.

You accept that 32,000 gun deaths a year are a perfectly acceptable price for your fetish.

Three times that many people die every year from alcohol. Do you drink alcohol Joe ?

 

[JoeB131]

Three times that many people die every year from alcohol. Do you drink alcohol Joe ?

Yes.

That said, alcohol causes death if you are a hard-core user who drinks a lot every day.

A gun only has to be used once to kill someone.

 

[DigitalDrifter]

Three times that many people die every year from alcohol. Do you drink alcohol Joe ?

Yes.

That said, alcohol causes death if you are a hard-core user who drinks a lot every day.

A gun only has to be used once to kill someone.

So you use a product fully well knowing the carnage it causes.

Many of the gun deaths you tout have alcohol at the root of the problem. Look at the tens of thousands that die every year from people whose health was destroyed by alcohol.

Look at the thousands who die every year in auto accidents that are directly due to alcohol.

Look at the families and relationships that have been destroyed by alcohol.

Yet you use the product fully well knowing the carnage.

 

[WinterBorn]

Not a single person on the threads you and I have argued on have celebrated the deaths of anyone (with the possible exception of criminals have murdered or raped). Yet you celebrate the deaths of two people (actually many more) that had committed no crimes. You, who haven't the balls to do anything yourself, celebrate someone else murdering them. So your claims to the high moral ground are laughable. You revel in the pain caused by someone else to someone else. You want to be a spectator though, and claim your hands are clean.

22,000 deaths by their own hand do not count. Your fantasies won't save them. Hundreds of thousands of lives saved by guns will not be lost to your bloodthirsty lust for control. The sad part is, you have even less control than those who were murdered. At least they were more than voyeurs.

Yes, I'm sorry that you are upset Nazis and Cultists get killed when they defy the man.

Guns don't save lives. They take them. the NRA lies to you, but you want to be lied to. you want the illusion of control, but in fact, much like the tobacco industry telling people they look cool when they smoke, the gunindustry tells you guns make you safer when in fact a gun in the home is 43 times more likely to kill a household member.

You cling to bogus facts for all you're worth, don't you?

The truth of my comments stand.

 

[WinterBorn]

Three times that many people die every year from alcohol. Do you drink alcohol Joe ?

Yes.

That said, alcohol causes death if you are a hard-core user who drinks a lot every day.

A gun only has to be used once to kill someone.

Bullshit. How many young people die every year when they do something stupid while drunk?

Actually, that is a good analogy, since many (or most?) of the accidental deaths from firearms start with someone doing something stupid.

 

[JoeB131]

So you use a product fully well knowing the carnage it causes.

Many of the gun deaths you tout have alcohol at the root of the problem. Look at the tens of thousands that die every year from people whose health was destroyed by alcohol.

Yes, they do. But you can have a gun killing without alcohol. You can't have a gun killing without a gun.

Get it?

Again, though, I think that there's a great comparison. Maybe we need to start a 12 step program for gun nutters.

Step one- admit you have a tiny penis.
Step two - admit guns don't make you any safer.

 

[JoeB131]

Bullshit. How many young people die every year when they do something stupid while drunk?

Actually, that is a good analogy, since many (or most?) of the accidental deaths from firearms start with someone doing something stupid.

That sounds like a good reason for strict licensing of guns. You know, like Germany has- where they do have 17 million guns but few gun murders or suicides because they don't let crazy people have them.

But the NRA wants crazy and stupid people to have guns. That's their market.

 

[JoeB131]

You cling to bogus facts for all you're worth, don't you?

Stomping your little feet and saying, "I don't want Kellerman to be true" isn't refuting much of anything, dood.

 

[WinterBorn]

So you use a product fully well knowing the carnage it causes.

Many of the gun deaths you tout have alcohol at the root of the problem. Look at the tens of thousands that die every year from people whose health was destroyed by alcohol.

Yes, they do. But you can have a gun killing without alcohol. You can't have a gun killing without a gun.

Get it?

Again, though, I think that there's a great comparison. Maybe we need to start a 12 step program for gun nutters.

Step one- admit you have a tiny penis.
Step two - admit guns don't make you any safer.

You can also have an alcohol related death without a gun and without being a hardcore drinker.

Or don't be stupid. That would save more lives with both.

 

[WinterBorn]

You cling to bogus facts for all you're worth, don't you?

Stomping your little feet and saying, "I don't want Kellerman to be true" isn't refuting much of anything, dood.

And the claim that a gun is 43 times more likely to kill a homeowner than a criminal is still bogus.

 

[WinterBorn]

Bullshit. How many young people die every year when they do something stupid while drunk?

Actually, that is a good analogy, since many (or most?) of the accidental deaths from firearms start with someone doing something stupid.

That sounds like a good reason for strict licensing of guns. You know, like Germany has- where they do have 17 million guns but few gun murders or suicides because they don't let crazy people have them.

But the NRA wants crazy and stupid people to have guns. That's their market.

You defend the mental health professionals when they do not report the crazies to the system, and yet you stomp your feet and demand we not sell guns to crazies. Can't have it both ways.

And the NRA does not want the crazies to have guns. That is simply another bullshit claim of yours.

 

[WinterBorn]

You cling to bogus facts for all you're worth, don't you?

Stomping your little feet and saying, "I don't want Kellerman to be true" isn't refuting much of anything, dood.

from:

"The "43 times" claim was based upon a small-scale study of firearms deaths in King County, Washington (Seattle and Bellevue) covering the period 1978-83. The authors state,

"Mortality studies such as ours do not include cases in which burglars or intruders are wounded or frightened away by the use or display of a firearm. Cases in which would-be intruders may have purposely avoided a house known to be armed are also not identified…A complete determination of firearm risks versus benefits would require that these figures be known."

Having said this, these authors proceed anyway to exclude those same instances where a potential criminal was not killed but was thwarted.

How many successful self-defense events do not result in death of the criminal? An analysis by Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz (Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology, v. 86 n.1 [Fall 1995]) of successful defensive uses of firearms against criminal attack concluded that the criminal is killed in only one case in approximately every one thousand attacks. If this same ratio is applied to defensive uses in the home, then Kellermann's "43 times" is off by a factor of a thousand and should be at least as small as 0.043, not 43. Any evaluation of the effectiveness of firearms as defense against criminal assault should incorporate every event where a crime is either thwarted or mitigated; thus Kellermann's conclusion omits 999 non-lethal favorable outcomes from criminal attack and counts only the one event in which the criminal is killed. With woeful disregard for this vital point, recognized by these authors but then ignored, they conclude,

"The advisability of keeping firearms in the home for protection must be questioned."

In making this statement the authors have demonstrated an inexcusable non-scientific bias against the effectiveness of firearms ownership for self defense. This is junk science at its worst."
​

 

[JoeB131]

You cling to bogus facts for all you're worth, don't you?

Stomping your little feet and saying, "I don't want Kellerman to be true" isn't refuting much of anything, dood.

And the claim that a gun is 43 times more likely to kill a homeowner than a criminal is still bogus.

Household member. And frankly, I know of three people killed with a gun someone brought into a house for protection.

I don't know of ANYONE who ever chased off a bad guy with a gun.

 

[JoeB131]

You defend the mental health professionals when they do not report the crazies to the system, and yet you stomp your feet and demand we not sell guns to crazies. Can't have it both ways.

And the NRA does not want the crazies to have guns. That is simply another bullshit claim of yours.

Of course they do. The NRA has fought EVERY SENSIBLE gun law suggested in the last 30 years. From teflon coated cop killer bullets to 100 round magazines to a bunch of other stuff that has no business in civilian hands, the NRA is totally for people wanting this.

And if you are going to cite Kleck, you really have no business dissing Kellerman. Kleck was a quack.

 

[WinterBorn]

You cling to bogus facts for all you're worth, don't you?

Stomping your little feet and saying, "I don't want Kellerman to be true" isn't refuting much of anything, dood.

And the claim that a gun is 43 times more likely to kill a homeowner than a criminal is still bogus.

Household member. And frankly, I know of three people killed with a gun someone brought into a house for protection.

I don't know of ANYONE who ever chased off a bad guy with a gun.

And since you don't know anyone who did it, it cannot possibly have happened. Of course. We get that. lol

And how many of the 3 were suicides?

 

[WinterBorn]

You defend the mental health professionals when they do not report the crazies to the system, and yet you stomp your feet and demand we not sell guns to crazies. Can't have it both ways.

And the NRA does not want the crazies to have guns. That is simply another bullshit claim of yours.

Of course they do. The NRA has fought EVERY SENSIBLE gun law suggested in the last 30 years. From teflon coated cop killer bullets to 100 round magazines to a bunch of other stuff that has no business in civilian hands, the NRA is totally for people wanting this.

And if you are going to cite Kleck, you really have no business dissing Kellerman. Kleck was a quack.

And Kellerman ignored evidence and excluded information from his studies. He didn't do research to find answers. He did research to prove what he wanted to be true.

 

[JoeB131]

And since you don't know anyone who did it, it cannot possibly have happened. Of course. We get that. lol

And how many of the 3 were suicides?

2 were suicides, one was a murder. I mean, you hang on every other word I say, I thought you'd get that by now.