Trump Wins YUGE in a Government Shutdown

[Harpy Eagle]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

The minority party does not have enough people to stop the spending bill. If the Govt shuts down this is 100% on the Repubs

 

[busybee01]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

Voters will agree with Democrats. They do not want the wall built and they will not stand for healthcare to be used as a political weapon.

 

[rightwinger]

Okay....

To remind you, this is what I wrote:

In consideration of a government shutdown, who the losers are is more important than who be the winners. Moreover, the notion that a government shutdown actually produces "winners" is utterly absurd, unless one is an anarchist. At best, any "win" is nothing more than a collateral impact, and no leader, more precisely no cogent thinker who finds themselves serving as a leader, aims not for genuine wins, but rather for collateral "damage/gains" and thereby chooses their course of action to achieve those ancillary outcomes. Not even the most risky and outlandish political strategists posit ideas forged upon the notion of "winning as a result of shutting down the government."​

What that paragraph means is that:

• In the context of evaluating the impacts of a government shutdown, who wins matters less than does who loses.
• It is specious and sophistic to classify as a "presidential win" the outcomes of a government shutdown.
• Policy makers, responsible presidents who care about their country, don't make their decisions based on ancillary outcomes and consequences of shutting down the government; they decide based on the primary, maybe secondary, outcomes and consequences, and the tertiary, quaternary, quinary, etc. ones just "are what they are." Responsible and sane leaders don't devise plans for governance, or political success, in which a part of the process for achieving that success is shutting down the government.

I realize that's not all that different that what I first wrote, but that's because with a paragraph as simple and straightforward as that which I initially posted, there's not much a writer can do to simplify it. On the other hand, readers can take a variety of actions to accurately comprehend such passages.

so the real losers is the american populace, correct? when a couple of parties can't stop spending what they don't have, the populace is hurt. Hurt. The populace demands things get corrected as a result. A responsible person does not spend more than they have. Period. You agree? let's start here for now.

A responsible person does not spend more than they have. Period. You agree?

Yes and no.

• Yes, at the most simplistic level of analysis, overextending oneself is never a good or responsible thing for anyone to do; however borrowing, in and of itself, does not constitute doing so.
• No because it is quite possible for individuals, businesses and other entities like governments to responsibly use credit to obtain money, thus the things they want or need to buy using that money. It's in nobody's interest not to maximize the return they can obtain from their assorted resources. Part of doing that involves using existing resources as a lever for obtaining additional ones. (Thus the financial industry's bastardization of the word "leverage.")
  
  I've purchased several things -- appreciating assets in each instance -- for which I didn't have the cash to buy without using credit to do so. I'm sure many people have. Some of those people's uses of credit are/were responsible, and others were not.
  
  It comes down to the borrower's ability to pay and the subjective and objective analysis of borrowing situation. Congress, the Executive Branch, well run businesses, banks, and others have units dedicated specifically to performing that analysis.
• Allegorically speaking, there are hugely material differences between an individual's borrowings and those of a government. If you're of a mind to go down that path, you'd do well to know what you need to address if you aim to do so both cogently and coherently. Don't go down that road with me and not, from a variety of angles, know inside-out what you're talking about. (Given the alluded to ideas, I suspect you are vaguely familiar with notions advocated by the Chicago School of thought.)
  • Private Debt vs. Government Debt
    
  • How Can Governments Borrow so Much?
    
  • Government Debt
  • Why We Should Never Pay Down the National Debt
    
  • Fiscal Stimulus, Fiscal Inflation, or Fiscal Fallacies?
    
  • THE IMPACT OF HIGH AND GROWING GOVERNMENT DEBT ON ECONOMIC GROWTH AN EMPIRICAL INVESTIGATION FOR THE EURO AREA
    
  • Perspectives on Recent Trends in Consumer Debt
    
  • Financial Crises: Explanations, Types, and Implications

I await your essay that connects cogently the thread topic "Trump winning by dint of the government shutting down" with the ideas you've introduced. We've gone about as far off-topic as I think it fair to do, unless you are the thread OP, in which case, fine, you can allow "whatever" to go on in your own thread.

I don't see Trump being hurt at all if the government shutdown. That in itself is a win.

And I do understand the difference between government debt and my own. Not sure what you wish to make out of this. And in that I say let it shut down. Nothing will happen. Money is still coming in. They need money they can make it.

Trump is forcing people to take sides on his wall

He will lose

Wrong. He will win. Only douche bags oppose the wall.

Sent from my SM-G935P using USMessageBoard.com mobile app

That is not how politics works
Trump had no clue
You have to build a coalition to support your view. Just chanting...build a wall does not work

Democrats hate it. Conservative budget wonks don't want to spend the money

Only the racists want the wall. Trump doesn't have the numbers

 

[rightwinger]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

Even Conservatives don't want to pay for a wall
only those idiots who thought Mexico would pay support it

 

[bripat9643]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

Voters will agree with Democrats. They do not want the wall built and they will not stand for healthcare to be used as a political weapon.

I didn't realize you are the spokesman for all voters. The fact the majority of Americans want illegal immigration controlled. Some of them may not be wild about the wall, but they aren't going to vote against Republicans who support it.

It takes incredible chutzpah for a snowflake like you to claim to whine about Trump " using healthcare as a political weapon." No one was done that more than Obama and the Dims. A majority of Americans hate Obama care. That's one of the main reasons they voted for Trump.

 

[easyt65]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

Even Conservatives don't want to pay for a wall
only those idiots who thought Mexico would pay support it

As per everything Democrats have said since Hillary lost the election, everything snowflakes say / claim is a PROVEN LIE...

 

[bripat9643]

so the real losers is the american populace, correct? when a couple of parties can't stop spending what they don't have, the populace is hurt. Hurt. The populace demands things get corrected as a result. A responsible person does not spend more than they have. Period. You agree? let's start here for now.

A responsible person does not spend more than they have. Period. You agree?

Yes and no.

• Yes, at the most simplistic level of analysis, overextending oneself is never a good or responsible thing for anyone to do; however borrowing, in and of itself, does not constitute doing so.
• No because it is quite possible for individuals, businesses and other entities like governments to responsibly use credit to obtain money, thus the things they want or need to buy using that money. It's in nobody's interest not to maximize the return they can obtain from their assorted resources. Part of doing that involves using existing resources as a lever for obtaining additional ones. (Thus the financial industry's bastardization of the word "leverage.")
  
  I've purchased several things -- appreciating assets in each instance -- for which I didn't have the cash to buy without using credit to do so. I'm sure many people have. Some of those people's uses of credit are/were responsible, and others were not.
  
  It comes down to the borrower's ability to pay and the subjective and objective analysis of borrowing situation. Congress, the Executive Branch, well run businesses, banks, and others have units dedicated specifically to performing that analysis.
• Allegorically speaking, there are hugely material differences between an individual's borrowings and those of a government. If you're of a mind to go down that path, you'd do well to know what you need to address if you aim to do so both cogently and coherently. Don't go down that road with me and not, from a variety of angles, know inside-out what you're talking about. (Given the alluded to ideas, I suspect you are vaguely familiar with notions advocated by the Chicago School of thought.)
  • Private Debt vs. Government Debt
    
  • How Can Governments Borrow so Much?
    
  • Government Debt
  • Why We Should Never Pay Down the National Debt
    
  • Fiscal Stimulus, Fiscal Inflation, or Fiscal Fallacies?
    
  • THE IMPACT OF HIGH AND GROWING GOVERNMENT DEBT ON ECONOMIC GROWTH AN EMPIRICAL INVESTIGATION FOR THE EURO AREA
    
  • Perspectives on Recent Trends in Consumer Debt
    
  • Financial Crises: Explanations, Types, and Implications

I await your essay that connects cogently the thread topic "Trump winning by dint of the government shutting down" with the ideas you've introduced. We've gone about as far off-topic as I think it fair to do, unless you are the thread OP, in which case, fine, you can allow "whatever" to go on in your own thread.

I don't see Trump being hurt at all if the government shutdown. That in itself is a win.

And I do understand the difference between government debt and my own. Not sure what you wish to make out of this. And in that I say let it shut down. Nothing will happen. Money is still coming in. They need money they can make it.

Trump is forcing people to take sides on his wall

He will lose

Wrong. He will win. Only douche bags oppose the wall.

Sent from my SM-G935P using USMessageBoard.com mobile app

That is not how politics works
Trump had no clue
You have to build a coalition to support your view. Just chanting...build a wall does not work

Democrats hate it. Conservative budget wonks don't want to spend the money

Only the racists want the wall. Trump doesn't have the numbers

Republican budget wonks don't give a crap about the wall. It's pocket change compared to the rest of the budget. That's how we know that most of what you post is a lie. Nothing could be more obviously untrue than that fatuous claim.

Calling everyone who wants to control illegal immigration a "racist" isn't going to win you any elections. The majority of Americans want an end to illegal immigration.

 

[bripat9643]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

Even Conservatives don't want to pay for a wall
only those idiots who thought Mexico would pay support it

Wrong again, douche bag. I never cared whether Mexico paid for it.

 

[oreo]

so goof ball, if trump can't shut down the government, then how can Trump shut down the government? did you read your own fking stupid post?

congress has the ability to shut down the government. Trump and his shity policies, shitty "leadership," and shitty negotiation skills will be the cause of government shutdown.

how you figure that? He hasn't put anything through congress?

he can't even get ACA repealed, he does not have the skill to unite the GOP, let alone the country.

so how is it his policies will shutdown the government. I'd say the lack of putting his policies in does that.

the shutdown is over funding for this wall if I am correct. Shitty idea, shitty execution thus far. It won't happen. It was never a realistic idea, just a silly slogan for his followers to choke on.

Agree 100%. If walls and fences worked we wouldn't have any illegals here in the first place. Here is a great video on this and at the end it will show the amount we've already spent.

Really the only way to secure the border is with high tech motion sensors and more border patrol stations. Anything they can see can and will always be compromised.



At any rate Trump doesn't have the authority to shut down the government. It's congress that holds the purse strings and this country, not him. He again is making a total idiot out of himself. These tactics just work on stupid people to send a tingley feeling up their legs.

 

[jc456]

congress has the ability to shut down the government. Trump and his shity policies, shitty "leadership," and shitty negotiation skills will be the cause of government shutdown.

how you figure that? He hasn't put anything through congress?

he can't even get ACA repealed, he does not have the skill to unite the GOP, let alone the country.

so how is it his policies will shutdown the government. I'd say the lack of putting his policies in does that.

the shutdown is over funding for this wall if I am correct. Shitty idea, shitty execution thus far. It won't happen. It was never a realistic idea, just a silly slogan for his followers to choke on.

Agree 100%. If walls and fences worked we wouldn't have any illegals here in the first place. Here is a great video on this and at the end it will show the amount we've already spent.

Really the only way to secure the border is with high tech motion sensors and more border patrol stations. Anything they can see can and will always be compromised.



At any rate Trump doesn't have the authority to shut down the government. It's congress that holds the purse strings and this country, not him. He again is making a total idiot out of himself. These tactics just work on stupid people to send a tingley feeling up their legs.

who ever said trump could shut down the government? you made that up fella.

More lefty lies to justify some hate on trump. How does it feel to be wrong all the time as a lefty?

 

[oreo]

how you figure that? He hasn't put anything through congress?

he can't even get ACA repealed, he does not have the skill to unite the GOP, let alone the country.

so how is it his policies will shutdown the government. I'd say the lack of putting his policies in does that.

the shutdown is over funding for this wall if I am correct. Shitty idea, shitty execution thus far. It won't happen. It was never a realistic idea, just a silly slogan for his followers to choke on.

Agree 100%. If walls and fences worked we wouldn't have any illegals here in the first place. Here is a great video on this and at the end it will show the amount we've already spent.

Really the only way to secure the border is with high tech motion sensors and more border patrol stations. Anything they can see can and will always be compromised.



At any rate Trump doesn't have the authority to shut down the government. It's congress that holds the purse strings and this country, not him. He again is making a total idiot out of himself. These tactics just work on stupid people to send a tingley feeling up their legs.

who ever said trump could shut down the government? you made that up fella.

More lefty lies to justify some hate on trump. How does it feel to be wrong all the time as a lefty?

Da--Duh--did you miss the title of this thread--LOL

 

[jc456]

he can't even get ACA repealed, he does not have the skill to unite the GOP, let alone the country.

so how is it his policies will shutdown the government. I'd say the lack of putting his policies in does that.

the shutdown is over funding for this wall if I am correct. Shitty idea, shitty execution thus far. It won't happen. It was never a realistic idea, just a silly slogan for his followers to choke on.

Agree 100%. If walls and fences worked we wouldn't have any illegals here in the first place. Here is a great video on this and at the end it will show the amount we've already spent.

Really the only way to secure the border is with high tech motion sensors and more border patrol stations. Anything they can see can and will always be compromised.



At any rate Trump doesn't have the authority to shut down the government. It's congress that holds the purse strings and this country, not him. He again is making a total idiot out of himself. These tactics just work on stupid people to send a tingley feeling up their legs.

who ever said trump could shut down the government? you made that up fella.

More lefty lies to justify some hate on trump. How does it feel to be wrong all the time as a lefty?

Da--Duh--did you miss the title of this thread--LOL

maybe you should read the title. LOL derp

 

[The Original Tree]

The one thing they need to change about shutdowns is eliminating back pay for federal employees who technically are getting a free vacation out of something like this.

 

[busybee01]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

Voters will agree with Democrats. They do not want the wall built and they will not stand for healthcare to be used as a political weapon.

I didn't realize you are the spokesman for all voters. The fact the majority of Americans want illegal immigration controlled. Some of them may not be wild about the wall, but they aren't going to vote against Republicans who support it.

It takes incredible chutzpah for a snowflake like you to claim to whine about Trump " using healthcare as a political weapon." No one was done that more than Obama and the Dims. A majority of Americans hate Obama care. That's one of the main reasons they voted for Trump.

Actually that is no longer true. Obamacare gets around 50% approval and a majority want it fixed and not repealed. Also Trumpcare got a approval rating in the teens. Some partisans may have voted for Trump because of Obamacare but voters who gave Trump a majority in the electoral college did not.

 

[bripat9643]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

Voters will agree with Democrats. They do not want the wall built and they will not stand for healthcare to be used as a political weapon.

I didn't realize you are the spokesman for all voters. The fact the majority of Americans want illegal immigration controlled. Some of them may not be wild about the wall, but they aren't going to vote against Republicans who support it.

It takes incredible chutzpah for a snowflake like you to claim to whine about Trump " using healthcare as a political weapon." No one was done that more than Obama and the Dims. A majority of Americans hate Obama care. That's one of the main reasons they voted for Trump.

Actually that is no longer true. Obamacare gets around 50% approval and a majority want it fixed and not repealed. Also Trumpcare got a approval rating in the teens. Some partisans may have voted for Trump because of Obamacare but voters who gave Trump a majority in the electoral college did not.

You're relying on a poll that was demonstrated to be fake.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

Voters will agree with Democrats. They do not want the wall built and they will not stand for healthcare to be used as a political weapon.

I didn't realize you are the spokesman for all voters. The fact the majority of Americans want illegal immigration controlled. Some of them may not be wild about the wall, but they aren't going to vote against Republicans who support it.

It takes incredible chutzpah for a snowflake like you to claim to whine about Trump " using healthcare as a political weapon." No one was done that more than Obama and the Dims. A majority of Americans hate Obama care. That's one of the main reasons they voted for Trump.

Actually that is no longer true. Obamacare gets around 50% approval and a majority want it fixed and not repealed. Also Trumpcare got a approval rating in the teens. Some partisans may have voted for Trump because of Obamacare but voters who gave Trump a majority in the electoral college did not.

You're relying on a poll that was demonstrated to be fake.

You know the poll is accurate, and you hate get caught you falsifying yet again.

 

[bendog]

Considering that the minority OBSTRUCTIONIST Party is threatening to shut down the govt if the GOP does not agree to take the Wall out of the budget and agree to fully fund the disastrous ACA, Trump and his administration is in a good position to sit back and watch the Snowflakes lose ANOTHER 1,000 political elections / positions and at LEAST another 2 historic, revord-setting elections.

This is why 67% of the nation acknowledges that the Democrats have lost touch with reality / the American people.

Voters will agree with Democrats. They do not want the wall built and they will not stand for healthcare to be used as a political weapon.

I didn't realize you are the spokesman for all voters. The fact the majority of Americans want illegal immigration controlled. Some of them may not be wild about the wall, but they aren't going to vote against Republicans who support it.

It takes incredible chutzpah for a snowflake like you to claim to whine about Trump " using healthcare as a political weapon." No one was done that more than Obama and the Dims. A majority of Americans hate Obama care. That's one of the main reasons they voted for Trump.

Actually that is no longer true. Obamacare gets around 50% approval and a majority want it fixed and not repealed. Also Trumpcare got a approval rating in the teens. Some partisans may have voted for Trump because of Obamacare but voters who gave Trump a majority in the electoral college did not.

You're relying on a poll that was demonstrated to be fake.

You know the poll is accurate, and you hate get caught you falsifying yet again.

She doesn't CARE if the poll is accurate.

 

[danielpalos]

congress has the ability to shut down the government. Trump and his shity policies, shitty "leadership," and shitty negotiation skills will be the cause of government shutdown.

how you figure that? He hasn't put anything through congress?

he can't even get ACA repealed, he does not have the skill to unite the GOP, let alone the country.

so how is it his policies will shutdown the government. I'd say the lack of putting his policies in does that.

the shutdown is over funding for this wall if I am correct. Shitty idea, shitty execution thus far. It won't happen. It was never a realistic idea, just a silly slogan for his followers to choke on.

Agree 100%. If walls and fences worked we wouldn't have any illegals here in the first place. Here is a great video on this and at the end it will show the amount we've already spent.

Really the only way to secure the border is with high tech motion sensors and more border patrol stations. Anything they can see can and will always be compromised.



At any rate Trump doesn't have the authority to shut down the government. It's congress that holds the purse strings and this country, not him. He again is making a total idiot out of himself. These tactics just work on stupid people to send a tingley feeling up their legs.

Escalating costs, even without ladders, is all any right wing, prohibitionist policy will provide. How much of our GDP should we spend on this socialist folly?

Laissez-fair, all the way, right wingers.

 

[bodecea]

So....the so-called president blinked again.

 

[bripat9643]

Trump Wins YUGE in a Government Shutdown

In consideration of a government shutdown, who the losers are is more important than who be the winners. Moreover, the notion that a government shutdown actually produces "winners" is utterly absurd, unless one is an anarchist. At best, any "win" is nothing more than a collateral impact, and no leader, more precisely no cogent thinker who finds themselves serving as a leader, aims not for genuine wins, but rather for collateral "damage/gains" and thereby chooses their course of action to achieve those ancillary outcomes. Not even the most risky and outlandish political strategists posit ideas forged upon the notion of "winning as a result of shutting down the government."

Horseshit. Lot's of people benefit from a government shutdown. Everyone benefits when the government can no longer loot and regulate us.