Venezuela: What Is Trump To Do??

[dannyboys]

Exactly why should the U.S. get involved in Venezuela's internal affairs? ..

Because Russia would try to get a foothold there...and ya know...OIL

And we have always had a hard on for any socialist country anywhere, but especially in the western hemisphere. When america blathers on about fweedumb, we mean out fweedumb to decide the governments and economies of other nations.

If you Communists had your way the US by now would resemble every fucking Socialist shithole country in the world. MOVE to one of them if you think they are so great.
In every Socialist country how do you know when a woman is having her period?
She'll be wearing only one sock!

That's all ya got? "Commie"? Jeebus how empty.

Wrong asshole! I've got two more words: Permanent Ignore!

 

[McRocket]

And how exactly is ANYTHING that goes on in Venezuela (outside of major genocide/starvation) ANY of America's business?

Let's see, it impacts the world oil market, which impacts our interests, it gives places like China and Russia an opportunity to expand their influence in the region, which impacts our interests, it's destabilizing to other countries in the area, which impacts our interests.

Plus if it keeps getting worse we could see the same level of piracy seen off the coast of somalia, which impacts our interests.

I did not ask what your neocon goals were...they all fall under the 'well duh' category.

And that does not make it America's business. That just makes it America's interest. BIG difference.

I realize you have problems with these simple questions, but:

Does America have the right - under international law - to militarily intervene in Venezuela's internal affairs (when there is no mass starvation or genocide)?

Yes or no?

Please actually read my post. I have said we go in if invited by whatever government takes over after Maduro is deposed.

In that case, YES, we have the right and the responsibility to send aid and try to get them back on their feet again.

Juan Guaidó has won no election. He is NOT the legal leader of Venezuela (even though Trump says he is).

America has ZERO right under international law to send in troops to help him.

Show me a link to unbiased, factual proof that I am wrong.

You cannot.

and something being out interest MAKES it our business.

LOL...the neocon credo.

So ANYTHING that someone else is interested in - MAKES it their business?

Okay...so it's China's business everything America does? It's Iran's business everything America does.

And why stop at countries?

So if I am interested in my neighbor's wife - that automatically makes whatever she does my business?

Interesting arrogance you neocons have.

He is the rightful leader of the National Assembly, the legitimate legislative branch of the Venezuelan government that was suppressed by a sham "Constitutional Assembly" when Maduro's party lost power in said National Assembly. Of course the Maduro packed Supreme Court said it was all legal.

The only people supporting Maduro are leftists and authoritarians, good company you are keeping there.

Irrelevant.

It is not America's business to determine what is or is not a legitimate election. Period.

Let alone arbitrarily determine who they will support and park 1000+ troops off that countries shores -threatening to use them to militarily back the side they want.

This is about oil reserves and NOTHING else.

Neocon hypocrites. They don't want anyone messing with American elections. But they sure think it is their right to mess with other countries elections.


BTW - did you ever serve in the military (I did, BTW - the reserves). Neocons who ask troops to go all over the world and die for their neocon desires make me sick. But they especially disgust me if they never had the guts to serve themselves (like Bolton).

 

[martybegan]

Let's see, it impacts the world oil market, which impacts our interests, it gives places like China and Russia an opportunity to expand their influence in the region, which impacts our interests, it's destabilizing to other countries in the area, which impacts our interests.

Plus if it keeps getting worse we could see the same level of piracy seen off the coast of somalia, which impacts our interests.

I did not ask what your neocon goals were...they all fall under the 'well duh' category.

And that does not make it America's business. That just makes it America's interest. BIG difference.

I realize you have problems with these simple questions, but:

Does America have the right - under international law - to militarily intervene in Venezuela's internal affairs (when there is no mass starvation or genocide)?

Yes or no?

Please actually read my post. I have said we go in if invited by whatever government takes over after Maduro is deposed.

In that case, YES, we have the right and the responsibility to send aid and try to get them back on their feet again.

Juan Guaidó has won no election. He is NOT the legal leader of Venezuela (even though Trump says he is).

America has ZERO right under international law to send in troops to help him.

Show me a link to unbiased, factual proof that I am wrong.

You cannot.

and something being out interest MAKES it our business.

LOL...the neocon credo.

So ANYTHING that someone else is interested in - MAKES it their business?

Okay...so it's China's business everything America does? It's Iran's business everything America does.

And why stop at countries?

So if I am interested in my neighbor's wife - that automatically makes whatever she does my business?

Interesting arrogance you neocons have.

He is the rightful leader of the National Assembly, the legitimate legislative branch of the Venezuelan government that was suppressed by a sham "Constitutional Assembly" when Maduro's party lost power in said National Assembly. Of course the Maduro packed Supreme Court said it was all legal.

The only people supporting Maduro are leftists and authoritarians, good company you are keeping there.

Irrelevant.

It is not America's business to determine what is or is not a legitimate election. Period.

Let alone arbitrarily determine who they will support and park 1000+ troops off that countries shores -threatening to use them to militarily back the side they want.

This is about oil reserves and NOTHING else.

Neocon hypocrites. They don't want anyone messing with American elections. But they sure think it is their right to mess with other countries elections.


BTW - did you ever serve in the military (I did, BTW - the reserves). Neocons who ask troops to go all over the world and die for their neocon desires make me sick. But they especially disgust me if they never had the guts to serve themselves (like Bolton).

It's not just us, it's plenty of other countries saying the same thing.

Since our economy runs on oil, not being concerned about oil supply shows you are a moron.

And I didn't serve in the military, but considering we have civilian control as a cornerstone of our constitution, if you sign up, you sign up knowing that yes, you can be asked to fight for people who have never fought. I ask firefighters to fight fires knowing I don't have to fight them, this is the same thing.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Venezuela: What Is Trump To Do??

Why is he to do anything? Venezuelans made their bed. They can lie in it.

So you're good with Russia gaining control of all that oil on our doorstep.

Hmmm..I think Trump may ultimately be as well

And oh yea...we'll see a LOT of immigrants asking for asylum

Build the wall. Close the border.

 

[McRocket]

I did not ask what your neocon goals were...they all fall under the 'well duh' category.

And that does not make it America's business. That just makes it America's interest. BIG difference.

I realize you have problems with these simple questions, but:

Does America have the right - under international law - to militarily intervene in Venezuela's internal affairs (when there is no mass starvation or genocide)?

Yes or no?

Please actually read my post. I have said we go in if invited by whatever government takes over after Maduro is deposed.

In that case, YES, we have the right and the responsibility to send aid and try to get them back on their feet again.

Juan Guaidó has won no election. He is NOT the legal leader of Venezuela (even though Trump says he is).

America has ZERO right under international law to send in troops to help him.

Show me a link to unbiased, factual proof that I am wrong.

You cannot.

and something being out interest MAKES it our business.

LOL...the neocon credo.

So ANYTHING that someone else is interested in - MAKES it their business?

Okay...so it's China's business everything America does? It's Iran's business everything America does.

And why stop at countries?

So if I am interested in my neighbor's wife - that automatically makes whatever she does my business?

Interesting arrogance you neocons have.

He is the rightful leader of the National Assembly, the legitimate legislative branch of the Venezuelan government that was suppressed by a sham "Constitutional Assembly" when Maduro's party lost power in said National Assembly. Of course the Maduro packed Supreme Court said it was all legal.

The only people supporting Maduro are leftists and authoritarians, good company you are keeping there.

Irrelevant.

It is not America's business to determine what is or is not a legitimate election. Period.

Let alone arbitrarily determine who they will support and park 1000+ troops off that countries shores - threatening to use them to militarily back the side they want.

This is about oil reserves and NOTHING else.

Neocon hypocrites. They don't want anyone messing with American elections. But they sure think it is their right to mess with other countries elections.


BTW - did you ever serve in the military (I did, BTW - the reserves). Neocons who ask troops to go all over the world and die for their neocon desires make me sick. But they especially disgust me if they never had the guts to serve themselves (like Bolton).

It's not just us, it's plenty of other countries saying the same thing.

I don't give a shit how many other countries agree with Trump. Just makes them pathetic neocons as well.

Since our economy runs on oil, not being concerned about oil supply shows you are a moron.

I see your reading comprehension is not too good. I said nothing about not being concerned about oil supplies. I simply said this is about oil...which it is. BTW, Venezuela only provides about 6% of all US oil imports. So it is of little, direct interest.

U.S. Total Crude Oil and Products Imports

And my government tested IQ is 125. That puts me in the 95'th percentile. No genius...but hardly a 'moron'.

IQ Percentile and Rarity Chart

And I didn't serve in the military, but considering we have civilian control as a cornerstone of our constitution, if you sign up, you sign up knowing that yes, you can be asked to fight for people who have never fought. I ask firefighters to fight fires knowing I don't have to fight them, this is the same thing.

LOL...what a ridiculous comparison. You are not asking firefighters to go to other countries and fight their fires.

But you are asking your own countrymen/women to go and die in the middle of nowhere to fight some battle that you have decided is worth it...even though you have NEVER had the guts to put your own neck on the line for your country.

I call that at the very least, hypocritical. At most, pathetic.

At least McCain and Graham - noted neocons - served their country. So they were/are not hypocrites on this.

You and Bolton are on this.

 

[Likkmee]

Do what Dubyada wooda dun. Bomb Chile !

 

[Likkmee]

Before you ask why

 

[candycorn]

Exactly why should the U.S. get involved in Venezuela's internal affairs? ..

Because Russia would try to get a foothold there...and ya know...OIL

Stupid assessment.

The thing about trying to conquer indigenous peoples is that it rarely works:

See VietNam and Afghanistan for references.

 

[candycorn]

Idk, but that regime-change crap never works.

Japan, Italy, Germany, all former parts of the former USSR....

Germany was part of the USSR? Italy was?

 

[martybegan]

Please actually read my post. I have said we go in if invited by whatever government takes over after Maduro is deposed.

In that case, YES, we have the right and the responsibility to send aid and try to get them back on their feet again.

Juan Guaidó has won no election. He is NOT the legal leader of Venezuela (even though Trump says he is).

America has ZERO right under international law to send in troops to help him.

Show me a link to unbiased, factual proof that I am wrong.

You cannot.

and something being out interest MAKES it our business.

LOL...the neocon credo.

So ANYTHING that someone else is interested in - MAKES it their business?

Okay...so it's China's business everything America does? It's Iran's business everything America does.

And why stop at countries?

So if I am interested in my neighbor's wife - that automatically makes whatever she does my business?

Interesting arrogance you neocons have.

He is the rightful leader of the National Assembly, the legitimate legislative branch of the Venezuelan government that was suppressed by a sham "Constitutional Assembly" when Maduro's party lost power in said National Assembly. Of course the Maduro packed Supreme Court said it was all legal.

The only people supporting Maduro are leftists and authoritarians, good company you are keeping there.

Irrelevant.

It is not America's business to determine what is or is not a legitimate election. Period.

Let alone arbitrarily determine who they will support and park 1000+ troops off that countries shores - threatening to use them to militarily back the side they want.

This is about oil reserves and NOTHING else.

Neocon hypocrites. They don't want anyone messing with American elections. But they sure think it is their right to mess with other countries elections.


BTW - did you ever serve in the military (I did, BTW - the reserves). Neocons who ask troops to go all over the world and die for their neocon desires make me sick. But they especially disgust me if they never had the guts to serve themselves (like Bolton).

It's not just us, it's plenty of other countries saying the same thing.

I don't give a shit how many other countries agree with Trump. Just makes them pathetic neocons as well.

Since our economy runs on oil, not being concerned about oil supply shows you are a moron.

I see your reading comprehension is not too good. I said nothing about not being concerned about oil supplies. I simply said this is about oil...which it is. BTW, Venezuela only provides about 6% of all US oil imports. So it is of little, direct interest.

U.S. Total Crude Oil and Products Imports

And my government tested IQ is 125. That puts me in the 95'th percentile. No genius...but hardly a 'moron'.

IQ Percentile and Rarity Chart

And I didn't serve in the military, but considering we have civilian control as a cornerstone of our constitution, if you sign up, you sign up knowing that yes, you can be asked to fight for people who have never fought. I ask firefighters to fight fires knowing I don't have to fight them, this is the same thing.

LOL...what a ridiculous comparison. You are not asking firefighters to go to other countries and fight their fires.

But you are asking your own countrymen/women to go and die in the middle of nowhere to fight some battle that you have decided is worth it...even though you have NEVER had the guts to put your own neck on the line for your country.

I call that at the very least, hypocritical. At most, pathetic.

At least McCain and Graham - noted neocons - served their country. So they were/are not hypocrites on this.

You and Bolton are on this.

Some of the smartest people I know are idiots. Intelligence and common sense, or any sense are not tied together. Think back to the Wisdom stat when playing D&D.

Your bold argument is a cop out, used by weak people to avoid debating the facts of the matter via emotional tribalism.

No, we just ask firefighters to run into burning buildings to save lives and property.

You argument would hold more water with a drafted military, but since we run on a volunteer system, you know what you signed up for.

 

[McRocket]

Juan Guaidó has won no election. He is NOT the legal leader of Venezuela (even though Trump says he is).

America has ZERO right under international law to send in troops to help him.

Show me a link to unbiased, factual proof that I am wrong.

You cannot.

LOL...the neocon credo.

So ANYTHING that someone else is interested in - MAKES it their business?

Okay...so it's China's business everything America does? It's Iran's business everything America does.

And why stop at countries?

So if I am interested in my neighbor's wife - that automatically makes whatever she does my business?

Interesting arrogance you neocons have.

He is the rightful leader of the National Assembly, the legitimate legislative branch of the Venezuelan government that was suppressed by a sham "Constitutional Assembly" when Maduro's party lost power in said National Assembly. Of course the Maduro packed Supreme Court said it was all legal.

The only people supporting Maduro are leftists and authoritarians, good company you are keeping there.

Irrelevant.

It is not America's business to determine what is or is not a legitimate election. Period.

Let alone arbitrarily determine who they will support and park 1000+ troops off that countries shores - threatening to use them to militarily back the side they want.

This is about oil reserves and NOTHING else.

Neocon hypocrites. They don't want anyone messing with American elections. But they sure think it is their right to mess with other countries elections.


BTW - did you ever serve in the military (I did, BTW - the reserves). Neocons who ask troops to go all over the world and die for their neocon desires make me sick. But they especially disgust me if they never had the guts to serve themselves (like Bolton).

It's not just us, it's plenty of other countries saying the same thing.

I don't give a shit how many other countries agree with Trump. Just makes them pathetic neocons as well.

Since our economy runs on oil, not being concerned about oil supply shows you are a moron.

I see your reading comprehension is not too good. I said nothing about not being concerned about oil supplies. I simply said this is about oil...which it is. BTW, Venezuela only provides about 6% of all US oil imports. So it is of little, direct interest.

U.S. Total Crude Oil and Products Imports

And my government tested IQ is 125. That puts me in the 95'th percentile. No genius...but hardly a 'moron'.

IQ Percentile and Rarity Chart

And I didn't serve in the military, but considering we have civilian control as a cornerstone of our constitution, if you sign up, you sign up knowing that yes, you can be asked to fight for people who have never fought. I ask firefighters to fight fires knowing I don't have to fight them, this is the same thing.

LOL...what a ridiculous comparison. You are not asking firefighters to go to other countries and fight their fires.

But you are asking your own countrymen/women to go and die in the middle of nowhere to fight some battle that you have decided is worth it...even though you have NEVER had the guts to put your own neck on the line for your country.

I call that at the very least, hypocritical. At most, pathetic.

At least McCain and Graham - noted neocons - served their country. So they were/are not hypocrites on this.

You and Bolton are on this.

Some of the smartest people I know are idiots. Intelligence and common sense, or any sense are not tied together. Think back to the Wisdom stat when playing D&D.

Your bold argument is a cop out, used by weak people to avoid debating the facts of the matter via emotional tribalism.

No, we just ask firefighters to run into burning buildings to save lives and property.

You argument would hold more water with a drafted military, but since we run on a volunteer system, you know what you signed up for.

Well, I see all the above is factless nonsense.

You provide ZERO, unbiased, factual proof to backup your claims...just uttered blather. The words of a coward with no moral ground to stand on.

You can justify it all you like.

But the fact remains it is against ALL international laws to meddle in a foreign countries affairs (unless major genocide or human catastrophe is ongoing). Either you are too ignorant to know that or - more likely - you know that and simply reject it because it does not suit your agenda.
Basically, your ethics go out the window when your desires are on the line.

As for your lack of military service.

Justify it all you want. The FACT remains that you are asking brave, young Americans to give their lives for whatever you feel is worth it...even when there is little/nothing in them that is a direct thread to American sovereignty.

That makes you a hypocrite and a coward.

You want others to do your dirty work and die all over the world for your little, childish, dishonorable games - yet you were too gutless to stick your own neck on the line for your country when you had the chance to do so.

You are the worst type of neocon. Weak, arrogant, spineless and hypocritical.


I try not to waste my time with cowards and hypocrites.

We are done here.

Have a nice day...hypocritical coward.

 

[martybegan]

He is the rightful leader of the National Assembly, the legitimate legislative branch of the Venezuelan government that was suppressed by a sham "Constitutional Assembly" when Maduro's party lost power in said National Assembly. Of course the Maduro packed Supreme Court said it was all legal.

The only people supporting Maduro are leftists and authoritarians, good company you are keeping there.

Irrelevant.

It is not America's business to determine what is or is not a legitimate election. Period.

Let alone arbitrarily determine who they will support and park 1000+ troops off that countries shores - threatening to use them to militarily back the side they want.

This is about oil reserves and NOTHING else.

Neocon hypocrites. They don't want anyone messing with American elections. But they sure think it is their right to mess with other countries elections.


BTW - did you ever serve in the military (I did, BTW - the reserves). Neocons who ask troops to go all over the world and die for their neocon desires make me sick. But they especially disgust me if they never had the guts to serve themselves (like Bolton).

It's not just us, it's plenty of other countries saying the same thing.

I don't give a shit how many other countries agree with Trump. Just makes them pathetic neocons as well.

Since our economy runs on oil, not being concerned about oil supply shows you are a moron.

I see your reading comprehension is not too good. I said nothing about not being concerned about oil supplies. I simply said this is about oil...which it is. BTW, Venezuela only provides about 6% of all US oil imports. So it is of little, direct interest.

U.S. Total Crude Oil and Products Imports

And my government tested IQ is 125. That puts me in the 95'th percentile. No genius...but hardly a 'moron'.

IQ Percentile and Rarity Chart

And I didn't serve in the military, but considering we have civilian control as a cornerstone of our constitution, if you sign up, you sign up knowing that yes, you can be asked to fight for people who have never fought. I ask firefighters to fight fires knowing I don't have to fight them, this is the same thing.

LOL...what a ridiculous comparison. You are not asking firefighters to go to other countries and fight their fires.

But you are asking your own countrymen/women to go and die in the middle of nowhere to fight some battle that you have decided is worth it...even though you have NEVER had the guts to put your own neck on the line for your country.

I call that at the very least, hypocritical. At most, pathetic.

At least McCain and Graham - noted neocons - served their country. So they were/are not hypocrites on this.

You and Bolton are on this.

Some of the smartest people I know are idiots. Intelligence and common sense, or any sense are not tied together. Think back to the Wisdom stat when playing D&D.

Your bold argument is a cop out, used by weak people to avoid debating the facts of the matter via emotional tribalism.

No, we just ask firefighters to run into burning buildings to save lives and property.

You argument would hold more water with a drafted military, but since we run on a volunteer system, you know what you signed up for.

Well, I see all the above is factless nonsense.

You provide ZERO, unbiased, factual proof to backup your claims...just uttered blather. The words of a coward with no moral ground to stand on.

You can justify it all you like.

But the fact remains it is against ALL international laws to meddle in a foreign countries affairs (unless major genocide or human catastrophe is ongoing). Either you are too ignorant to know that or - more likely - you know that and simply reject it because it does not suit your agenda.
Basically, your ethics go out the window when your needs are on the line.

As for your lack of military service.

Justify it all you want. The FACT remains that you are asking brave, young Americans to give their lives for whatever you feel is worth it...even when there is little/nothing in them that is a direct thread to American sovereignty.

That makes you a hypocrite and a coward.

You want others to do your dirty work and die all over the world for your little, childish, dishonorable games - yet you were too gutless to stick your own neck on the line for your country when you had the chance to do so.

You are the worst type of neocon. Weak, arrogant, spineless and hypocritical.


I try not to waste my time with cowards and hypocrites.

We are done here.

Have a nice day...hypocrite.

Wow you are done again, same as the last 20 fucking times.

All this text that boils down to "I don't like your opinion, but I am a worthless moron that thinks my opinions are somehow fact"

Asking people in the military to do what they signed up for is hypocritical?

 

[bripat9643]

Collapse is inevitable, but strong arm tactics can keep him in power for years.

The right thing for the US to do is let him be deposed by his own people, but have an MEU/ARG and hospital ships ready to move in when a new government takes over and asks for help.

Not us along, but as a part of a South/Central American effort to bring order back once the fighting is over.

And how exactly is ANYTHING that goes on in Venezuela (outside of major genocide/starvation) ANY of America's business?

Let's see, it impacts the world oil market, which impacts our interests, it gives places like China and Russia an opportunity to expand their influence in the region, which impacts our interests, it's destabilizing to other countries in the area, which impacts our interests.

Plus if it keeps getting worse we could see the same level of piracy seen off the coast of somalia, which impacts our interests.

I did not ask what your neocon goals were...they all fall under the 'well duh' category.

And that does not make it America's business. That just makes it America's interest. BIG difference.

I realize you have problems with these simple questions, but:

Does America have the right - under international law - to militarily intervene in Venezuela's internal affairs (when there is no mass starvation or genocide)?

Yes or no?

Please actually read my post. I have said we go in if invited by whatever government takes over after Maduro is deposed.

In that case, YES, we have the right and the responsibility to send aid and try to get them back on their feet again.

Juan Guaidó has won no election. He is NOT the legal leader of Venezuela (even though Trump says he is).

America has ZERO right under international law to send in troops to help him.

Show me a link to unbiased, factual proof that I am wrong.

You cannot.

and something being out interest MAKES it our business.

LOL...the neocon credo.

So ANYTHING that someone else is interested in - MAKES it their business?

Okay...so it's China's business everything America does? It's Iran's business everything America does.

And why stop at countries?

So if I am interested in my neighbor's wife - that automatically makes whatever she does my business?

Interesting arrogance you neocons have.

The election was a sham. The vote was obviously rigged. Maduro is not the legitimate leader of Venezuela.

 

[bripat9643]

Maduro can't trust his own guards to protect his life. That shows what a thriving democracy he presides over

Collapse is inevitable, but strong arm tactics can keep him in power for years.

The right thing for the US to do is let him be deposed by his own people, but have an MEU/ARG and hospital ships ready to move in when a new government takes over and asks for help.

Not us along, but as a part of a South/Central American effort to bring order back once the fighting is over.

And how exactly is ANYTHING that goes on in Venezuela (outside of major genocide/starvation) ANY of America's business?

Let's see, it impacts the world oil market, which impacts our interests, it gives places like China and Russia an opportunity to expand their influence in the region, which impacts our interests, it's destabilizing to other countries in the area, which impacts our interests.

Plus if it keeps getting worse we could see the same level of piracy seen off the coast of somalia, which impacts our interests.

I did not ask what your neocon goals were...they all fall under the 'well duh' category.

And that does not make it America's business. That just makes it America's interest. BIG difference.

I realize you have problems with these simple questions, but:

Does America have the right - under international law - to militarily intervene in Venezuela's internal affairs (when there is no mass starvation or genocide)?

Yes or no?

Please actually read my post. I have said we go in if invited by whatever government takes over after Maduro is deposed.

In that case, YES, we have the right and the responsibility to send aid and try to get them back on their feet again.

and something being out interest MAKES it our business. Sorry, it isn't the 1800's anymore when we can hide behind our Oceans and tell the rest of the world good luck.

Going in after Maduro is dethroned is pointless. He will remain so long as he has the loyalty of the army and the citizenry is unarmed.

 

[martybegan]

Collapse is inevitable, but strong arm tactics can keep him in power for years.

The right thing for the US to do is let him be deposed by his own people, but have an MEU/ARG and hospital ships ready to move in when a new government takes over and asks for help.

Not us along, but as a part of a South/Central American effort to bring order back once the fighting is over.

And how exactly is ANYTHING that goes on in Venezuela (outside of major genocide/starvation) ANY of America's business?

Let's see, it impacts the world oil market, which impacts our interests, it gives places like China and Russia an opportunity to expand their influence in the region, which impacts our interests, it's destabilizing to other countries in the area, which impacts our interests.

Plus if it keeps getting worse we could see the same level of piracy seen off the coast of somalia, which impacts our interests.

I did not ask what your neocon goals were...they all fall under the 'well duh' category.

And that does not make it America's business. That just makes it America's interest. BIG difference.

I realize you have problems with these simple questions, but:

Does America have the right - under international law - to militarily intervene in Venezuela's internal affairs (when there is no mass starvation or genocide)?

Yes or no?

Please actually read my post. I have said we go in if invited by whatever government takes over after Maduro is deposed.

In that case, YES, we have the right and the responsibility to send aid and try to get them back on their feet again.

and something being out interest MAKES it our business. Sorry, it isn't the 1800's anymore when we can hide behind our Oceans and tell the rest of the world good luck.

Going in after Maduro is dethroned is pointless. He will remain so long as he has the loyalty of the army and the citizenry is unarmed.

Going in before (at least un-covertly) just gives him a boogeyman to rail against, and may bring in the Russkies.

I'm hoping the CIA is at least somewhere there trying to help the opposition. It's too early for special forces "alpha teams" to be there because there is no real organized resistance fighting yet.

 

[bripat9643]

And how exactly is ANYTHING that goes on in Venezuela (outside of major genocide/starvation) ANY of America's business?

Let's see, it impacts the world oil market, which impacts our interests, it gives places like China and Russia an opportunity to expand their influence in the region, which impacts our interests, it's destabilizing to other countries in the area, which impacts our interests.

Plus if it keeps getting worse we could see the same level of piracy seen off the coast of somalia, which impacts our interests.

I did not ask what your neocon goals were...they all fall under the 'well duh' category.

And that does not make it America's business. That just makes it America's interest. BIG difference.

I realize you have problems with these simple questions, but:

Does America have the right - under international law - to militarily intervene in Venezuela's internal affairs (when there is no mass starvation or genocide)?

Yes or no?

Please actually read my post. I have said we go in if invited by whatever government takes over after Maduro is deposed.

In that case, YES, we have the right and the responsibility to send aid and try to get them back on their feet again.

and something being out interest MAKES it our business. Sorry, it isn't the 1800's anymore when we can hide behind our Oceans and tell the rest of the world good luck.

Going in after Maduro is dethroned is pointless. He will remain so long as he has the loyalty of the army and the citizenry is unarmed.

Going in before (at least un-covertly) just gives him a boogeyman to rail against, and may bring in the Russkies.

I'm hoping the CIA is at least somewhere there trying to help the opposition. It's too early for special forces "alpha teams" to be there because there is no real organized resistance fighting yet.

They are totally unarmed, so what are they going to fight with? You oppose the use of the military, but you support sending in the CIA? What are they going to do?

 

[martybegan]

Let's see, it impacts the world oil market, which impacts our interests, it gives places like China and Russia an opportunity to expand their influence in the region, which impacts our interests, it's destabilizing to other countries in the area, which impacts our interests.

Plus if it keeps getting worse we could see the same level of piracy seen off the coast of somalia, which impacts our interests.

I did not ask what your neocon goals were...they all fall under the 'well duh' category.

And that does not make it America's business. That just makes it America's interest. BIG difference.

I realize you have problems with these simple questions, but:

Does America have the right - under international law - to militarily intervene in Venezuela's internal affairs (when there is no mass starvation or genocide)?

Yes or no?

Please actually read my post. I have said we go in if invited by whatever government takes over after Maduro is deposed.

In that case, YES, we have the right and the responsibility to send aid and try to get them back on their feet again.

and something being out interest MAKES it our business. Sorry, it isn't the 1800's anymore when we can hide behind our Oceans and tell the rest of the world good luck.

Going in after Maduro is dethroned is pointless. He will remain so long as he has the loyalty of the army and the citizenry is unarmed.

Going in before (at least un-covertly) just gives him a boogeyman to rail against, and may bring in the Russkies.

I'm hoping the CIA is at least somewhere there trying to help the opposition. It's too early for special forces "alpha teams" to be there because there is no real organized resistance fighting yet.

They are totally unarmed, so what are they going to fight with? You oppose the use of the military, but you support sending in the CIA? What are they going to do?

There are always guns somewhere. What they need to do is start co-opting local garrisons, and I'm sure the CIA has people that can help them do that.

It wouldn't even have to be CIA officers, foreign agents can be hired to do that work.

 

[McRocket]

Juan Guaidó has won no election. He is NOT the legal leader of Venezuela (even though Trump says he is).

America has ZERO right under international law to send in troops to help him.

Show me a link to unbiased, factual proof that I am wrong.

You cannot.

LOL...the neocon credo.

So ANYTHING that someone else is interested in - MAKES it their business?

Okay...so it's China's business everything America does? It's Iran's business everything America does.

And why stop at countries?

So if I am interested in my neighbor's wife - that automatically makes whatever she does my business?

Interesting arrogance you neocons have.

He is the rightful leader of the National Assembly, the legitimate legislative branch of the Venezuelan government that was suppressed by a sham "Constitutional Assembly" when Maduro's party lost power in said National Assembly. Of course the Maduro packed Supreme Court said it was all legal.

The only people supporting Maduro are leftists and authoritarians, good company you are keeping there.

Irrelevant.

It is not America's business to determine what is or is not a legitimate election. Period.

Let alone arbitrarily determine who they will support and park 1000+ troops off that countries shores - threatening to use them to militarily back the side they want.

This is about oil reserves and NOTHING else.

Neocon hypocrites. They don't want anyone messing with American elections. But they sure think it is their right to mess with other countries elections.


BTW - did you ever serve in the military (I did, BTW - the reserves). Neocons who ask troops to go all over the world and die for their neocon desires make me sick. But they especially disgust me if they never had the guts to serve themselves (like Bolton).

It's not just us, it's plenty of other countries saying the same thing.

I don't give a shit how many other countries agree with Trump. Just makes them pathetic neocons as well.

Since our economy runs on oil, not being concerned about oil supply shows you are a moron.

I see your reading comprehension is not too good. I said nothing about not being concerned about oil supplies. I simply said this is about oil...which it is. BTW, Venezuela only provides about 6% of all US oil imports. So it is of little, direct interest.

U.S. Total Crude Oil and Products Imports

And my government tested IQ is 125. That puts me in the 95'th percentile. No genius...but hardly a 'moron'.

IQ Percentile and Rarity Chart

And I didn't serve in the military, but considering we have civilian control as a cornerstone of our constitution, if you sign up, you sign up knowing that yes, you can be asked to fight for people who have never fought. I ask firefighters to fight fires knowing I don't have to fight them, this is the same thing.

LOL...what a ridiculous comparison. You are not asking firefighters to go to other countries and fight their fires.

But you are asking your own countrymen/women to go and die in the middle of nowhere to fight some battle that you have decided is worth it...even though you have NEVER had the guts to put your own neck on the line for your country.

I call that at the very least, hypocritical. At most, pathetic.

At least McCain and Graham - noted neocons - served their country. So they were/are not hypocrites on this.

You and Bolton are on this.

Some of the smartest people I know are idiots. Intelligence and common sense, or any sense are not tied together. Think back to the Wisdom stat when playing D&D.

Your bold argument is a cop out, used by weak people to avoid debating the facts of the matter via emotional tribalism.

No, we just ask firefighters to run into burning buildings to save lives and property.

You argument would hold more water with a drafted military, but since we run on a volunteer system, you know what you signed up for.

Oh..and BTW, you hypocrite...in case you haven't noticed.

Almost every, single time America involves itself in other countries affairs that are NONE of her business...it almost always ends up a disaster for America and/or makes thing FAR worse.

Iraq, Afghanistan and on and on...one mess after another. Costing thousands of American lives, trillions of dollars and the Middle East is more of a mess now than it was.

That's why neocons do far, FAR more harm to America then all the terrorists in the world could ever realistically dream of.

And on top of everything, you don't even have the courage to serve yourself. But you sure are DYING to send others to do your dirty work for you.

You are a weak man.


Ta ta.

 

[Markle]

Germany was part of the USSR? Italy was?

If you'll note, there are COMMAS between the stated countries. I bet you have trouble understanding the Second Amendment too!

 

[H B Lowrie]

Exactly why should the U.S. get involved in Venezuela's internal affairs? ..

For US corporate interests.

So, only when R's are in power huh? Lol.

Oh no darling it's utterly bapirtisan.