Victims' Families Want To Air New 9/11 Truth Ad

[Rationalist1016]

I would think the best people for a re-investigation would be people we haven't heard of. Scientists, engineers, physicists, metallurgists, etc.., that have not shown an interest in the case. They are likely to have the least bias. If you want a new investigation, you also want a new set of eyes on everything. Although it would be practically impossible to find people that know NOTHING about the case. I would go as far as suggesting that nobody participates in a new investigation that "volunteers" to do so. All participates are "selected". Of course, there has to be committee to select the participates. The committee needs would need to be balanced and least bias as possible. Also, the committee would have no participation in the investigation what so ever once the investigation team was selected.

With that said, I still believe a new investigation won't change anything. If the result of that investigation was to in anyway support the "official story" we have now, those that are convinced that the "official story" is all lies won't change their minds. The claims that the government affected the investigation would start immediately. Of course, SOME people that believe there was a conspiracy would change their minds. But not the ones that are out on the fringe. They KNOW there were bombs in those buildings planted by the government.

Draft Bill to Reinvestigate Collapse of World Trade Center: 2010

...This proposed bill would address those significant shortcomings by establishing an independent investigatory committee of renown national and international scientific and technical experts. It also would end the widespread and global suspicion that the official explanation was based on deliberate omission or misinformation. This Act would provide the most comprehensive, credible, and evidence-based investigation of the major theories provided in this bill relative to the seven WTC buildings. It also would make recommendations for legislative action——if necessary.

....The importance of this bill resides in the fact that the events surrounding the WTC destruction have been the engine driving nearly a decade of two endless wars and occupations in Iraq and Afghanistan costing trillions of dollars and the blood and property of millions——including more than 6,000 dead Americans and the nearly 3,000 who died at the World Trade Center. It has aroused hatred of our country around the globe, even from one-time allies, and spawned a new generation of terrorists abroad.

...If the WTC destruction——including the 47-story WTC 7, that was never hit by aircraft——has been the capstone of such tragic consequences, and if 62% of those polled in 2007 by Scripps-Howard still do not believe the Bush Administration’s explanation——two airliners hijacked by Arabs struck WTC 1 and 2——this proposed bill offers Congress a scientific and technological avenue by which to finally settle this issue.

Draft Bill to Reinvestigate Collapse of World Trade Center: 2010 « WTC RESEARCH ALLIANCE

That's sounds like a pretty reasonable request. I think the only thing that I would change, would be that NONE of the previous investigating bodies be involved. New eyes on all new research, new tests etc.. The least amount of reference to the previous research would be the preference. Obviously some information would have to be pulled from the original work. Like information gathered about the steel and debris that is no longer available for examination.
Also, I think that the decisions made would have to be unanimous. One hold out will leave enough doubt that the decision could then be further argued................regardless of the conclusion that it points to.

If this were to be the case, I would say a new investigation would be of value.

But, again, I'll say it. I don't think even THAT investigation, done in that matter, would quite the "truth movement", if it doesn't decide in their favor. At least the HARDCORE truth movement.

Now, on the other side of the coin, if a committee of 20 or so (not sure of the number) people where able to look at all the evidence, do all the tests & experiments needed, and interview everybody they can and unanimously told us that there is no doubt that something other than fires & aircraft impact damage caused those buildings to fall.................I would have to believe that.
Now if that were to be the case, a lot of people that are on the side of "no conspiracy" are going to claim FOUL on the investigation. So, either way, this thing is never going to be OVER.

 

[Mr. Jones]

I would think the best people for a re-investigation would be people we haven't heard of. Scientists, engineers, physicists, metallurgists, etc.., that have not shown an interest in the case. They are likely to have the least bias. If you want a new investigation, you also want a new set of eyes on everything. Although it would be practically impossible to find people that know NOTHING about the case. I would go as far as suggesting that nobody participates in a new investigation that "volunteers" to do so. All participates are "selected". Of course, there has to be committee to select the participates. The committee needs would need to be balanced and least bias as possible. Also, the committee would have no participation in the investigation what so ever once the investigation team was selected.

With that said, I still believe a new investigation won't change anything. If the result of that investigation was to in anyway support the "official story" we have now, those that are convinced that the "official story" is all lies won't change their minds. The claims that the government affected the investigation would start immediately. Of course, SOME people that believe there was a conspiracy would change their minds. But not the ones that are out on the fringe. They KNOW there were bombs in those buildings planted by the government.

Draft Bill to Reinvestigate Collapse of World Trade Center: 2010

...This proposed bill would address those significant shortcomings by establishing an independent investigatory committee of renown national and international scientific and technical experts. It also would end the widespread and global suspicion that the official explanation was based on deliberate omission or misinformation. This Act would provide the most comprehensive, credible, and evidence-based investigation of the major theories provided in this bill relative to the seven WTC buildings. It also would make recommendations for legislative action——if necessary.

....The importance of this bill resides in the fact that the events surrounding the WTC destruction have been the engine driving nearly a decade of two endless wars and occupations in Iraq and Afghanistan costing trillions of dollars and the blood and property of millions——including more than 6,000 dead Americans and the nearly 3,000 who died at the World Trade Center. It has aroused hatred of our country around the globe, even from one-time allies, and spawned a new generation of terrorists abroad.

...If the WTC destruction——including the 47-story WTC 7, that was never hit by aircraft——has been the capstone of such tragic consequences, and if 62% of those polled in 2007 by Scripps-Howard still do not believe the Bush Administration’s explanation——two airliners hijacked by Arabs struck WTC 1 and 2——this proposed bill offers Congress a scientific and technological avenue by which to finally settle this issue.

Draft Bill to Reinvestigate Collapse of World Trade Center: 2010 « WTC RESEARCH ALLIANCE

That's sounds like a pretty reasonable request. I think the only thing that I would change, would be that NONE of the previous investigating bodies be involved. New eyes on all new research, new tests etc.. The least amount of reference to the previous research would be the preference. Obviously some information would have to be pulled from the original work. Like information gathered about the steel and debris that is no longer available for examination.
Also, I think that the decisions made would have to be unanimous. One hold out will leave enough doubt that the decision could then be further argued................regardless of the conclusion that it points to.

If this were to be the case, I would say a new investigation would be of value.

But, again, I'll say it. I don't think even THAT investigation, done in that matter, would quite the "truth movement", if it doesn't decide in their favor. At least the HARDCORE truth movement.

Now, on the other side of the coin, if a committee of 20 or so (not sure of the number) people where able to look at all the evidence, do all the tests & experiments needed, and interview everybody they can and unanimously told us that there is no doubt that something other than fires & aircraft impact damage caused those buildings to fall.................I would have to believe that.
Now if that were to be the case, a lot of people that are on the side of "no conspiracy" are going to claim FOUL on the investigation. So, either way, this thing is never going to be OVER.

I think that the very same people that made the claims how 9-11 happened the way it did, including the destruction of the complex, pentagon, flight 93, etc.., should have the right to go toe to toe with the folks that have any contrary views, proofs, and evidence.
The cases both sides present should be ruled as true or false by the panel.
However for the sake of simply determining whether the OCT is true and valid, they can just start with the destruction of the complex, obviously including WTC 7, because if it is determined that they way the buildings were destroyed are false, we can pretty much be assured that the rest of the story is not at all accurate either.
This is very serious as the future of the country is at stake.
The 9-11 attacks have changed America in so many ways, and the ones who benefited from the OCT being believed as it was told then, and who have used it when it effecting many different policy matters from then to the present day,
they will use all their resources and might, to continue to squash any new light onto the subject of 9-11, as they have done from day one.
The problem remains, who could be trusted to not allow the influence, by any means, including death, by the mighty and powerful
people who basically control all things 9-11 OCT?
Who can be trusted to not cave into to such corruptible power?

Can the safety of those that are willing to expose the criminals, traitors, and wrong doers be guaranteed?
The list of mysterious deaths, and "suicides" has grown, and a death squad to deal with potential hazards to the perps of the OCT, IMO is not a far fetched concern.
This thing has global implications, and reaches to other nations, primarily Israel, and Saudi Arabia among others.
The 9-11 attacks are tied to other people, events and policies, that with only establishing the conclusion that the WTC buildings were assisted in their destruction by other means, will severely effect.
This is why the cover up within the OCT is so important to the powerful who either assisted, allowed it, or had hands in it in some way or another.
That is way laws are being passed that deal with "homegrown terrorists" and are including in that definition, anyone who even speaks out against them/it, and has been rammed into the collective psyche
of Americans and the world.
It is a story that has had vast implications, and built like a huge house of cards, that can fall far and reach a wide range of people and countries.
But it has to be done, and the American public has to be brave enough to demand it, and willing to weather the storm of whatever any disclosures, or realities the truth will unleash, as our very foundation as a a nation, and the principals it was designed to exist under are increasingly threatened and face extinction altogether, if the cover up, and policies that were implicated as a result of 9-11 are allowed to remain in place.

 

[Rationalist1016]

Draft Bill to Reinvestigate Collapse of World Trade Center: 2010

...This proposed bill would address those significant shortcomings by establishing an independent investigatory committee of renown national and international scientific and technical experts. It also would end the widespread and global suspicion that the official explanation was based on deliberate omission or misinformation. This Act would provide the most comprehensive, credible, and evidence-based investigation of the major theories provided in this bill relative to the seven WTC buildings. It also would make recommendations for legislative action——if necessary.

....The importance of this bill resides in the fact that the events surrounding the WTC destruction have been the engine driving nearly a decade of two endless wars and occupations in Iraq and Afghanistan costing trillions of dollars and the blood and property of millions——including more than 6,000 dead Americans and the nearly 3,000 who died at the World Trade Center. It has aroused hatred of our country around the globe, even from one-time allies, and spawned a new generation of terrorists abroad.

...If the WTC destruction——including the 47-story WTC 7, that was never hit by aircraft——has been the capstone of such tragic consequences, and if 62% of those polled in 2007 by Scripps-Howard still do not believe the Bush Administration’s explanation——two airliners hijacked by Arabs struck WTC 1 and 2——this proposed bill offers Congress a scientific and technological avenue by which to finally settle this issue.

Draft Bill to Reinvestigate Collapse of World Trade Center: 2010 « WTC RESEARCH ALLIANCE

That's sounds like a pretty reasonable request. I think the only thing that I would change, would be that NONE of the previous investigating bodies be involved. New eyes on all new research, new tests etc.. The least amount of reference to the previous research would be the preference. Obviously some information would have to be pulled from the original work. Like information gathered about the steel and debris that is no longer available for examination.
Also, I think that the decisions made would have to be unanimous. One hold out will leave enough doubt that the decision could then be further argued................regardless of the conclusion that it points to.

If this were to be the case, I would say a new investigation would be of value.

But, again, I'll say it. I don't think even THAT investigation, done in that matter, would quite the "truth movement", if it doesn't decide in their favor. At least the HARDCORE truth movement.

Now, on the other side of the coin, if a committee of 20 or so (not sure of the number) people where able to look at all the evidence, do all the tests & experiments needed, and interview everybody they can and unanimously told us that there is no doubt that something other than fires & aircraft impact damage caused those buildings to fall.................I would have to believe that.
Now if that were to be the case, a lot of people that are on the side of "no conspiracy" are going to claim FOUL on the investigation. So, either way, this thing is never going to be OVER.

I think that the very same people that made the claims how 9-11 happened the way it did, including the destruction of the complex, pentagon, flight 93, etc.., should have the right to go toe to toe with the folks that have any contrary views, proofs, and evidence.
The cases both sides present should be ruled as true or false by the panel.
However for the sake of simply determining whether the OCT is true and valid, they can just start with the destruction of the complex, obviously including WTC 7, because if it is determined that they way the buildings were destroyed are false, we can pretty much be assured that the rest of the story is not at all accurate either.
This is very serious as the future of the country is at stake.
The 9-11 attacks have changed America in so many ways, and the ones who benefited from the OCT being believed as it was told then, and who have used it when it effecting many different policy matters from then to the present day,
they will use all their resources and might, to continue to squash any new light onto the subject of 9-11, as they have done from day one.
The problem remains, who could be trusted to not allow the influence, by any means, including death, by the mighty and powerful
people who basically control all things 9-11 OCT?
Who can be trusted to not cave into to such corruptible power?

Can the safety of those that are willing to expose the criminals, traitors, and wrong doers be guaranteed?
The list of mysterious deaths, and "suicides" has grown, and a death squad to deal with potential hazards to the perps of the OCT, IMO is not a far fetched concern.
This thing has global implications, and reaches to other nations, primarily Israel, and Saudi Arabia among others.
The 9-11 attacks are tied to other people, events and policies, that with only establishing the conclusion that the WTC buildings were assisted in their destruction by other means, will severely effect.
This is why the cover up within the OCT is so important to the powerful who either assisted, allowed it, or had hands in it in some way or another.
That is way laws are being passed that deal with "homegrown terrorists" and are including in that definition, anyone who even speaks out against them/it, and has been rammed into the collective psyche
of Americans and the world.
It is a story that has had vast implications, and built like a huge house of cards, that can fall far and reach a wide range of people and countries.
But it has to be done, and the American public has to be brave enough to demand it, and willing to weather the storm of whatever any disclosures, or realities the truth will unleash, as our very foundation as a a nation, and the principals it was designed to exist under are increasingly threatened and face extinction altogether, if the cover up, and policies that were implicated as a result of 9-11 are allowed to remain in place.

Well, I don't know if a new investigation is the right forum for a debate. An investigation is to be a fact finding mission, not two or more sides to present there sides and be judged a "winner". Investigators looking into a murder, don't round up people with different theories and have them present their evidence to them. They look at the evidence, and conclude what happened by that evidence.
If the investigation is handled like a debate, all that does is the leave the door open for the side that doesn't like the outcome, to make any claims that something or someone was influenced. And if your are saying that there is no way to ensure that the investigation can be handled fairly and uninfluenced, that also leaves the door open for claims to fly that it was influenced.
So, if I understand your position, you want the two sides to present their evidence to a committee? But you also feel that there is no way to insure that the committee will be fair and unbiased? I guess I don't understand what you feel a new investigation will accomplish then. If I misstated something, please correct me.

But, with that said, I would like to see a debate between NIST, FEMA and/or Popular Mechanics (whoever you feel is "presenting" the official story) and the "truth movement" (whoever you feel is "presenting" the conspiracy story). I think it would make for some great debate and possibly show both sides some information that they may not be aware of. But that "debate" can't be confused with an "investigation".

 

[Mr. Jones]

That's sounds like a pretty reasonable request. I think the only thing that I would change, would be that NONE of the previous investigating bodies be involved. New eyes on all new research, new tests etc.. The least amount of reference to the previous research would be the preference. Obviously some information would have to be pulled from the original work. Like information gathered about the steel and debris that is no longer available for examination.
Also, I think that the decisions made would have to be unanimous. One hold out will leave enough doubt that the decision could then be further argued................regardless of the conclusion that it points to.

If this were to be the case, I would say a new investigation would be of value.

But, again, I'll say it. I don't think even THAT investigation, done in that matter, would quite the "truth movement", if it doesn't decide in their favor. At least the HARDCORE truth movement.

Now, on the other side of the coin, if a committee of 20 or so (not sure of the number) people where able to look at all the evidence, do all the tests & experiments needed, and interview everybody they can and unanimously told us that there is no doubt that something other than fires & aircraft impact damage caused those buildings to fall.................I would have to believe that.
Now if that were to be the case, a lot of people that are on the side of "no conspiracy" are going to claim FOUL on the investigation. So, either way, this thing is never going to be OVER.

I think that the very same people that made the claims how 9-11 happened the way it did, including the destruction of the complex, pentagon, flight 93, etc.., should have the right to go toe to toe with the folks that have any contrary views, proofs, and evidence.
The cases both sides present should be ruled as true or false by the panel.
However for the sake of simply determining whether the OCT is true and valid, they can just start with the destruction of the complex, obviously including WTC 7, because if it is determined that they way the buildings were destroyed are false, we can pretty much be assured that the rest of the story is not at all accurate either.
This is very serious as the future of the country is at stake.
The 9-11 attacks have changed America in so many ways, and the ones who benefited from the OCT being believed as it was told then, and who have used it when it effecting many different policy matters from then to the present day,
they will use all their resources and might, to continue to squash any new light onto the subject of 9-11, as they have done from day one.
The problem remains, who could be trusted to not allow the influence, by any means, including death, by the mighty and powerful
people who basically control all things 9-11 OCT?
Who can be trusted to not cave into to such corruptible power?

Can the safety of those that are willing to expose the criminals, traitors, and wrong doers be guaranteed?
The list of mysterious deaths, and "suicides" has grown, and a death squad to deal with potential hazards to the perps of the OCT, IMO is not a far fetched concern.
This thing has global implications, and reaches to other nations, primarily Israel, and Saudi Arabia among others.
The 9-11 attacks are tied to other people, events and policies, that with only establishing the conclusion that the WTC buildings were assisted in their destruction by other means, will severely effect.
This is why the cover up within the OCT is so important to the powerful who either assisted, allowed it, or had hands in it in some way or another.
That is way laws are being passed that deal with "homegrown terrorists" and are including in that definition, anyone who even speaks out against them/it, and has been rammed into the collective psyche
of Americans and the world.
It is a story that has had vast implications, and built like a huge house of cards, that can fall far and reach a wide range of people and countries.
But it has to be done, and the American public has to be brave enough to demand it, and willing to weather the storm of whatever any disclosures, or realities the truth will unleash, as our very foundation as a a nation, and the principals it was designed to exist under are increasingly threatened and face extinction altogether, if the cover up, and policies that were implicated as a result of 9-11 are allowed to remain in place.

Well, I don't know if a new investigation is the right forum for a debate. An investigation is to be a fact finding mission, not two or more sides to present there sides and be judged a "winner". Investigators looking into a murder, don't round up people with different theories and have them present their evidence to them. They look at the evidence, and conclude what happened by that evidence.
If the investigation is handled like a debate, all that does is the leave the door open for the side that doesn't like the outcome, to make any claims that something or someone was influenced. And if your are saying that there is no way to ensure that the investigation can be handled fairly and uninfluenced, that also leaves the door open for claims to fly that it was influenced.
So, if I understand your position, you want the two sides to present their evidence to a committee? But you also feel that there is no way to insure that the committee will be fair and unbiased? I guess I don't understand what you feel a new investigation will accomplish then. If I misstated something, please correct me.

But, with that said, I would like to see a debate between NIST, FEMA and/or Popular Mechanics (whoever you feel is "presenting" the official story) and the "truth movement" (whoever you feel is "presenting" the conspiracy story). I think it would make for some great debate and possibly show both sides some information that they may not be aware of. But that "debate" can't be confused with an "investigation".

What I meant was, since there are so many that think that a new investigation is not warranted, a panel to hear the counter evidence of the WTC collapses, and or the parts of the OCT that don't add up, should perhaps first be implemented, and this panel will be authorized to determine if indeed a new investigation is needed.

Many say that there is no proof, or evidence to support a fresh look, so that would be determined rather quickly with the evidence the researchers have, and put that to rest.
Then they could proceed with officially ordering the new 9-11 investigation, and let it be known that ALL evidence, old and new, is on the table for examination.
What I fear is what is always feared in hearings, or inquests, or trials.
That the accused or subjects, will use their influence to squash or silence anything or anybody against them.
Like someone that testifies against the Mafia...they had to be protected, and hidden before and after any proceedings.
After all, we are dealing with a group even more powerful then the mob here, and we could potentially see a rash of "suicides" or disappearances like never before.
Think of the consequences those responsible will face?

 

[Mr. Jones]

9-11 Commission Campaign | The campaign for a transparent citizens' 9-11 investigative commission.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Good grief! All of this hoopla. Hours of debate and people still believe you can have free fall acceleration coupled with resistance. WTC7 achieved free fall. The building fell near symmetrical. David Chandler even made videos that he dumbed down enough for my 13 year old nephew to grasp the concept.

:facepalm:

 

[Rationalist1016]

I think that the very same people that made the claims how 9-11 happened the way it did, including the destruction of the complex, pentagon, flight 93, etc.., should have the right to go toe to toe with the folks that have any contrary views, proofs, and evidence.
The cases both sides present should be ruled as true or false by the panel.
However for the sake of simply determining whether the OCT is true and valid, they can just start with the destruction of the complex, obviously including WTC 7, because if it is determined that they way the buildings were destroyed are false, we can pretty much be assured that the rest of the story is not at all accurate either.
This is very serious as the future of the country is at stake.
The 9-11 attacks have changed America in so many ways, and the ones who benefited from the OCT being believed as it was told then, and who have used it when it effecting many different policy matters from then to the present day,
they will use all their resources and might, to continue to squash any new light onto the subject of 9-11, as they have done from day one.
The problem remains, who could be trusted to not allow the influence, by any means, including death, by the mighty and powerful
people who basically control all things 9-11 OCT?
Who can be trusted to not cave into to such corruptible power?

Can the safety of those that are willing to expose the criminals, traitors, and wrong doers be guaranteed?
The list of mysterious deaths, and "suicides" has grown, and a death squad to deal with potential hazards to the perps of the OCT, IMO is not a far fetched concern.
This thing has global implications, and reaches to other nations, primarily Israel, and Saudi Arabia among others.
The 9-11 attacks are tied to other people, events and policies, that with only establishing the conclusion that the WTC buildings were assisted in their destruction by other means, will severely effect.
This is why the cover up within the OCT is so important to the powerful who either assisted, allowed it, or had hands in it in some way or another.
That is way laws are being passed that deal with "homegrown terrorists" and are including in that definition, anyone who even speaks out against them/it, and has been rammed into the collective psyche
of Americans and the world.
It is a story that has had vast implications, and built like a huge house of cards, that can fall far and reach a wide range of people and countries.
But it has to be done, and the American public has to be brave enough to demand it, and willing to weather the storm of whatever any disclosures, or realities the truth will unleash, as our very foundation as a a nation, and the principals it was designed to exist under are increasingly threatened and face extinction altogether, if the cover up, and policies that were implicated as a result of 9-11 are allowed to remain in place.

Well, I don't know if a new investigation is the right forum for a debate. An investigation is to be a fact finding mission, not two or more sides to present there sides and be judged a "winner". Investigators looking into a murder, don't round up people with different theories and have them present their evidence to them. They look at the evidence, and conclude what happened by that evidence.
If the investigation is handled like a debate, all that does is the leave the door open for the side that doesn't like the outcome, to make any claims that something or someone was influenced. And if your are saying that there is no way to ensure that the investigation can be handled fairly and uninfluenced, that also leaves the door open for claims to fly that it was influenced.
So, if I understand your position, you want the two sides to present their evidence to a committee? But you also feel that there is no way to insure that the committee will be fair and unbiased? I guess I don't understand what you feel a new investigation will accomplish then. If I misstated something, please correct me.

But, with that said, I would like to see a debate between NIST, FEMA and/or Popular Mechanics (whoever you feel is "presenting" the official story) and the "truth movement" (whoever you feel is "presenting" the conspiracy story). I think it would make for some great debate and possibly show both sides some information that they may not be aware of. But that "debate" can't be confused with an "investigation".

What I meant was, since there are so many that think that a new investigation is not warranted, a panel to hear the counter evidence of the WTC collapses, and or the parts of the OCT that don't add up, should perhaps first be implemented, and this panel will be authorized to determine if indeed a new investigation is needed.

Many say that there is no proof, or evidence to support a fresh look, so that would be determined rather quickly with the evidence the researchers have, and put that to rest.
Then they could proceed with officially ordering the new 9-11 investigation, and let it be known that ALL evidence, old and new, is on the table for examination.
What I fear is what is always feared in hearings, or inquests, or trials.
That the accused or subjects, will use their influence to squash or silence anything or anybody against them.
Like someone that testifies against the Mafia...they had to be protected, and hidden before and after any proceedings.
After all, we are dealing with a group even more powerful then the mob here, and we could potentially see a rash of "suicides" or disappearances like never before.
Think of the consequences those responsible will face?

As for the committee, I would agree with that. To basically have a hearing to decide if a new investigation is warranted.

As for the "influence to squash or silence anything or anybody against them" statement, I think this is where we differ.
There is no doubt that people can, & have, been silenced in cases against a powerful person. Cannot disagree with that at all.
But I think the difference between you and I, is that I attribute those "powers" to the person. You cannot sue "the government". You sue the person with a government position. Now that person may have powers to silence someone, to keep them out of trouble. But I don't see that as "the government". The government doesn't operate as a single entity. It is made up of "people". People that are looking out for themselves. Now, a lot of those people have common interests, there is no doubt about that.
Also, any claims against "the government" are going to be mainly towards the Bush Administration for the 9/11 attacks correct? Many of these people, mainly Bush and Cheney, no longer hold public office. They are civilians, so they can be sued like anybody else. Obviously, they still have contacts and more power than the normal civilian. But I don't see "the government" sending in the black helicopters to silence someone that is going after Bush or Cheney.

Please note, this is JUST MY OPINION.

But on the overall subject, yes I think a new investigation, if done properly, would be a good thing. It could help quite some of the accusations out there that have no basis. But I sure don't think it is going to bring the two "sides" together.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Also, any claims against "the government" are going to be mainly towards the Bush Administration for the 9/11 attacks correct? Many of these people, mainly Bush and Cheney, no longer hold public office. They are civilians, so they can be sued like anybody else. Obviously, they still have contacts and more power than the normal civilian. But I don't see "the government" sending in the black helicopters to silence someone that is going after Bush or Cheney.

Bush and Cheney can and should still be impeached. That statement has absolutely nothing to do with 9/11 and everything to do with massive war crimes, executive branch unconstitutional power grabs (signing statements, manipulating the justice dept. etc...), torture and the geneva convention breaches.
The problem is no one is going to do it. Obama and his "look forward" theory on how to handle crime from the executive branch (crimes he himself is now guilty of)...

Bush and Cheney are beside the point of a new investigation. IF a new investigation, free of any white wash or stonewall, determined that the executive branch or any of its entities (the CIA, the military, etc...) had anything to do with what happened, even that of complacency, THEN they shoud be held accountable for what could be the biggest government scandal in US history.

 

[Rationalist1016]

Also, any claims against "the government" are going to be mainly towards the Bush Administration for the 9/11 attacks correct? Many of these people, mainly Bush and Cheney, no longer hold public office. They are civilians, so they can be sued like anybody else. Obviously, they still have contacts and more power than the normal civilian. But I don't see "the government" sending in the black helicopters to silence someone that is going after Bush or Cheney.

Bush and Cheney can and should still be impeached. That statement has absolutely nothing to do with 9/11 and everything to do with massive war crimes, executive branch unconstitutional power grabs (signing statements, manipulating the justice dept. etc...), torture and the geneva convention breaches.
The problem is no one is going to do it. Obama and his "look forward" theory on how to handle crime from the executive branch (crimes he himself is now guilty of)...

Bush and Cheney are beside the point of a new investigation. IF a new investigation, free of any white wash or stonewall, determined that the executive branch or any of its entities (the CIA, the military, etc...) had anything to do with what happened, even that of complacency, THEN they shoud be held accountable for what could be the biggest government scandal in US history.

My point with Bush & Cheney was just to clarify my point about going after the person/persons that may have committed a crime, not "the government".

As for your comment about the new investigation, I agree. If a new investigation was to take place, and members of our government where found to have something to do with it, I think they should be held accountable.
I feel like I have made myself clear on that point, but somehow still defending it to people with the same opinion.

Where I differ with some others on this board, is that I don't think the members of our government facilitated 9/11. I think there IS a cover-up and that is of those members that failed in doing their jobs, which is to protect us, one of our governments most basic duties. And I believe those people should be held accountable.
I just haven't seen the evidence that points to "the government" orchestrating 9/11. I think they are too incompetent as a group to pull that off.
But if a new investigation was to prove me wrong, I would gladly concede.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Fair enough.

The people in the executive branch, the evidence that has come to light regarding the plan to invade Iraq before 2001, looking at who profited considerably from the entire event, the New American Century neoconservative base surrounding the white house and a host of other eye brow raisers, is what really makes this one look like a false flag.

Especially the whole psuedo-science thing, to me, is what makes this look like a crime cover-up, verse a "we failed to do our job so we're gonna cover our ass with a massive stonewall, white wash and cover-up.

 

[Rationalist1016]

Fair enough.

The people in the executive branch, the evidence that has come to light regarding the plan to invade Iraq before 2001, looking at who profited considerably from the entire event, the New American Century neoconservative base surrounding the white house and a host of other eye brow raisers, is what really makes this one look like a false flag.

Especially the whole psuedo-science thing, to me, is what makes this look like a crime cover-up, verse a "we failed to do our job so we're gonna cover our ass with a massive stonewall, white wash and cover-up.

I agree, it doesn't look good. It definitely appears to be an awfully convenient event for an administration that was already chomping at the bit to go to war. But I am holding off judgement until some real evidence comes out. And if there is evidence of that, I believe it WILL come out. If it's there someone will find it..............now it may just be a waiting game.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

We'll have to disagree starting here. The hard evidence, as there is plenty of circumstantial available to begin building a solid case, will never come to light. It would be FAR too damning for too many.
if it ever comes to light, it will be 40-50 years down the road when Bush adn Cheney have retired, started shitting in their pants and can no longer be held to any accountablilty.

Like other declassifieds...the Tonkin Gulf incident comes to mind immediately.

I was hoping our current prez would take the reigns and actually put the fire under the last administrations actions for accountablilty. Instead, he proves himself just another puppet of the establishment and does a 180 the minute he took office........

 

[daws101]

Does an empty building collapsing during a major disaster,make a sound?

 

[Mr. Jones]

Fair enough.

The people in the executive branch, the evidence that has come to light regarding the plan to invade Iraq before 2001, looking at who profited considerably from the entire event, the New American Century neoconservative base surrounding the white house and a host of other eye brow raisers, is what really makes this one look like a false flag.

Especially the whole psuedo-science thing, to me, is what makes this look like a crime cover-up, verse a "we failed to do our job so we're gonna cover our ass with a massive stonewall, white wash and cover-up.

You beat me to what was going to say, mainly the PNAC dual citizen traitors that seem to have written the script for US policy years ago, and got themselves in position to implement their plans.
That is why I say the implications of new light on the 9-11 attacks would involve other nations, such as Israel.
I do not believe a cover up was initiated because "mistakes" were made, of course that is the fall back position one would obviously take, but history has shown that the people in the Bush administration have always had the agenda to wage war against the Muslim nations for Israels safety, and for the natural resources those country's possess.
It was no mistake or accident to have the US thrust into a "war on terror" instigated by a "new Pearl Harbor event."
As it is no mere coincidence those people were in positions of authority within the government to facilitate a LIHOP or MIHOP 9-11 attack.

I will state once more for Rationalist1016, that I do not consider the government as a whole responsible for 9-11, but certain rouge elements within it, who infiltrated sensitive positions and possibly recruited others to assist, by various means such as bribes; money (of which there was plenty missing to afford payoffs) career advancement (how many were PROMOTED vs DEMOTED for being held accountable for their "mistakes?")

I also say that by accusing certain members of this possibility, it is not to say that Al Qaeda is NOT responsible in some way, as FBI investigations that were in some way hindered, such as John O'Niel's and other whistle blowers have shown.

This thing potentially runs deep, and the web they weaved can trap many, and all it may take to achieve, is a closer re-examination of the WTC collapses...to start with.

I feel the awareness program that this thread was initially started over, is a good start. The hope is that the more people are aware of the freakish nature of collapse of the WTC7 building, and why it has been hidden from them, the more people can push law makers, and potential candidates for office to include a new investigation as part of their platform.

 

[daws101]

reexamination, "new independent investigation".
I've heard this gobbledygook for nearly a decade....
as to wtc7, there is no empirical evidence to reexamine...most of the remaining evidence for the towers and pentagon is in Hangar 17 at JFK airport.
you do understand what the word "independent" means?: (1) : not subject to control by others : self-governing (2) : not affiliated with a larger controlling unit (1) : not requiring or relying on something else : not contingent <an independent conclusion> (2) : not looking to others for one's opinions or for guidance in conduct (3) : not bound by or committed to a political party or group.

in this case that would mean both parties would have to be investigated (the gov & the twoofers)

 

[Rationalist1016]

I will state once more for Rationalist1016, that I do not consider the government as a whole responsible for 9-11, but certain rouge elements within it, who infiltrated sensitive positions and possibly recruited others to assist, by various means such as bribes; money (of which there was plenty missing to afford payoffs) career advancement (how many were PROMOTED vs DEMOTED for being held accountable for their "mistakes?")

I appreciate the clarification.
As for the rest of your comment.................again, I can't disagree. I think all of that is a possibility. I just don't think we have seen any hard evidence of it. If that evidence was to come out, I will be ON YOUR SIDE.
I especially agree with the last part of your comment. The "promoted vs. demoted". That is one of the actions that leaves me thinking "something stinks here!"

 

[Obamerican]

I don't get this "mystery" about WTC7. If the downing of both WTC1 AND WTC2 were enough to get us into a war with the Muslim nations "for the benefit of Israel" then why risk the entire plan and bring down WTC7?

 

[Mr. Jones]

you do understand what the word "independent" means?: (1) : not subject to control by others : self-governing (2) : not affiliated with a larger controlling unit (1) : not requiring or relying on something else : not contingent <an independent conclusion> (2) : not looking to others for one's opinions or for guidance in conduct (3) : not bound by or committed to a political party or group.

in this case that would mean both parties would have to be investigated (the gov & the twoofers)

Well according to your insightful posting of the definition of independent, it certainly does not describe the original "investigation" does it?
The new investigation should mostly exclude from authority, the bastages who steered it to their political advantages.

What political goals or agendas do you think a legitimate truth movement has up their sleeve in your opinion?
Do you still think they are trying to instill dissent or treason?
Do you still think they are "trying to take over the government?" ALA agent Parrot911??

FWIW, I subscribe to a version that would, in the end, return the government to its rightful owners, the people of the nation, and away from the treasonous scum that has infiltrated it.

 

[Mr. Jones]

I don't get this "mystery" about WTC7. If the downing of both WTC1 AND WTC2 were enough to get us into a war with the Muslim nations "for the benefit of Israel" then why risk the entire plan and bring down WTC7?

Good question, and many theories, primarily insurance fraud, WTC 7 perhaps being the headquarters with a beacon signal for the remote guidance systems of the planes, and there is the one about WTC 7 perhaps being the flight 93 target that went wrong somehow? According to sources, there was seemingly irreplaceable documents.

At the time of its destruction, Building 7 housed documents relating to numerous SEC investigations. The files for approximately three to four thousand cases were destroyed, according to the Los Angeles Times. Among the destroyed documents were ones that may have demonstrated the relationship between Citigroup and the WorldCom bankruptcy.
9-11 Research: 7 World Trade Center

SEC: No Records Whatsoever Regarding Destroyed WTC 7 Investigation Files
http://911blogger.com/node/19242

The OEM was destroyed without putting up much of a struggle, despite the renovations.
The 23rd floor of Building 7 had received 15 million dollars' worth of renovations to create an emergency command center for then-Mayor Rudolf Giuliani. The features of the command center include:

* Bullet- and bomb-resistant windows
* An independent, secure air and water supply
* The ability to withstand winds of 200 mph
Of course the structure that held it up fell like noodles, so not sure what could have been expected of the OEM.

And of course the shock and awe aspect of the attack, the responses from the public were pure "terror".
I personally think the planes allowed to smash into the WTC was enough to instigate what they wanted to, the rest was pure cover up, and theatrics.
It should be no great surprise that many people still don't know about 7, as the controlled media has done a good job of lying by omission, and we know who has control of the media right?

 

[daws101]

you do understand what the word "independent" means?: (1) : not subject to control by others : self-governing (2) : not affiliated with a larger controlling unit (1) : not requiring or relying on something else : not contingent <an independent conclusion> (2) : not looking to others for one's opinions or for guidance in conduct (3) : not bound by or committed to a political party or group.

in this case that would mean both parties would have to be investigated (the gov & the twoofers)

Well according to your insightful posting of the definition of independent, it certainly does not describe the original "investigation" does it?
The new investigation should mostly exclude from authority, the bastages who steered it to their political advantages.

What political goals or agendas do you think a legitimate truth movement has up their sleeve in your opinion?
Do you still think they are trying to instill dissent or treason?
Do you still think they are "trying to take over the government?" ALA agent Parrot911??

FWIW, I subscribe to a version that would, in the end, return the government to its rightful owners, the people of the nation, and away from the treasonous scum that has infiltrated it.

Nice dodge! you must be a devotee of the if you can't dazzle um with brilliance baffle um with bullshit school.
btw, the twoof movement is not legit, no amount of rhetoric will make it so!